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Lexus ES 300/ES 330
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Comments
As for the chrome wheels, I think they are an expensive option that can be passed on. I had them on my '97 ES and they were a nightmare to keep looking good ... they pit very easily.
and my name is Stephen
What has everyone done? Also do you use anything on the door handles?
I never heard of Zaino before reading about it here, so I have a lot of questions. Thanks again. And thanks sddlw for your last post.
Sticker price with those options: $34,930
Invoice: $30,790
Thanks.
As far as other noise goes, I have Toyo tires, and I basically think what noise there is is attributable to seat belts, vibrating front seats and articles I am carrying in the car.
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2002 Lexus ES300 4 Door Sedan equipped as follows
Premium Package:
Leather interior trim with Drivers Seat Memory/Outside
Mirrors and Home Link system
Power tilt/slide moon roof
In Dash 6 CD Changer
All Season Tires
Wood and Leather Steering Wheel
High Intensity Headlamps
Vehicle Skid Control
Heated front seats
Cargo mat
Wheel locks
Cargo Net
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All for $33,320.00 plus $299.00 document fee (except tax and plate).
Would those of you experts comment if this is a good deal? Thanks.
The ES with all the options you listed has MSRP $36,380, and invoice price $31,950, so the price they quoted was reasonable. The doc fee is too high though, I paid only $45 for my 02 ES.
Transmission? Have their been problems with the 5-speed auto transmission? I thought I heard something about that, plus I believe Consumer Reports noted it as well. Any problems with it? Has it been corrected?
Thanks.
As far as the sludge issue goes, just make sure you follow the advertised maintenance schedule and you should not have the problem.
35MPH Frontal:
Driver: 5 Stars
Pass: 5 Stars
Side Impact:
DRIVER: 5 stars
DRIVER SIDE REAR PASSENGER: 4 stars
Not too shabby, but nothing less than I would expect from vehicle with a $40K MSRP.
~alpha
By the way, I have found that if you wanted the wood steering wheel, you have to purchase about $4000 worth of other option as well. I was really interested in the MBenz C-320, but the comfort and quietness of the Lexus is unbeatable.
I, too, did not need the nav but got it. I absoultely love it. It is very accurate in helping find restaurants, etc. Also, it provides some piece of mind to know I always know where I am and where I'm going.
It does not interfere with the CD as far as I'm concerned. The 6-disk CD changer is in the center console, and when playing the nav shows which CD of the six is playing, the time into the CD, etc. When playing the single CD the screen shows just that CD. You can choose between having it switch back to the nav, or having it stay on the CD mode.
I really enjoy the nav and would say get it.
I was going to insist that my dealer let me test drive another ES300 to compare to mine, but so many on this board have "squawked"the problem that I feel fairly certain that ANY ES300 will do the same thing. I feel confident that you could repeat the problem in a test drive to see what it is like.
I predict that Nav systems will be in all cars one day, and will replace the need for maps. It warns you ahead of time which lane you need to be in, which I found very useful in LA. No more missing exits or stressing out at the last minute. If you take a wrong turn, the Nav system automatically adjusts the route.
The downside - it does not work in a detailed manner in non metropolitan areas, so you might want to check the documentation to see if it will be useful to you.
I purchased the Nav in order to get the other goodies that come packaged in the deal. The Mark Levinson stereo is wonderful and I like the AVS, etc.
I plan to keep my car for a long time, so I wanted a navigation system.
By the way, the auto reviews in consumer reports do not mention that you have manual control of the audio on buttons outside of the computer control. I don't find the audio control awkward at all; just a little tricky to learn.
thanks
Do you have skid and traction control, and, if so, did you have to buy virtually every other option to get it?
One called Premium, which seems to be well documented on various web sites, lexus.com and carsdirect.com. Had I selected this option it would have cost me about $34,500 (Sam's Club price is a no-haggle price). This package has leather interior, regular sound system and other options that you can look up on the web sites. This option does not have a CD changer, Nav, Mark Levinson sound upgrade, AVS, or Power Sun Shade. I am not sure whether it has heated seats, VSC or HID. I am fairly certain it has the wood/leather steering wheel and other basic interior options like the more loaded trim package.
The other package, which cost me $37,775, includes everything except chrome wheels. When you visit the web sites, you have to build this option. It has single CD player like the premium, but with a 6 CD changer in the console. I have HID, Nav, Mark Levinson upgrade, sun shade, heated seats AVS, in console CD changer. My MSRP was $39,963. I paid $2500 over invoice because the car is in demand. When going through Sam's Club, they send you to a fleet manager (as opposed to a regular salesman) and they just quote you an amount over invoice.
Whenever I have something like a purse on the seat or items in the console, the noise from these items is louder than that coming from the road or from the chassis of the vehicle.
The transmission is kind of an irritant, but I traded in a Camry LE and the ES300 was so superior to that, that the transmission did not bother me at all at first. I guess life is rough when expectations are high.
Apparently, some folks have a 2002 version of the DVD. I have a 2001 version, even though I've only had my car for a month.
Owners on the "Lexus LS" page complain that dealers promised free upgrades for a period of time, only to have the dealers back out.Upgrades cost anywhere from $300 - $500, which everyone pretty much agrees is outrageous. One of the posts referred to subscribing to LLink, but I don't know what that is.
As far as tranny, I guess I just miss my 99 honda accord ex v6 coupe - in my opinion has a smoother transmission and stronger acceleration. I always believed Toyota built better transmissions than Honda but Lexus proved me wrong.
I guess I expected much more from a 36K vehicle. After all, shouldn't a 36K vehicle be better at EVERYTHING compared to a 25K vehicle in a lower class? Apparently not.
Well, such is life - can't win 'em all, nothing's perfect. Life goes on. Lessons have been learned. There are far more important things than worrying about the car I am driving. I should just be thankful I HAVE a car. And it's a Lexus to boot. I'm done whining.
I'm going to check with local dealer and see whether I can order an ES300 with a different array of options than the two you mentioned. I don't want the Levinson, NAV, or the wood steering wheel, but do want xenons and skid control.
Thanks for your help.
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"....It was obviously not a simple defect, but a basic design problem. I’ve been driving the car for 18 months and 30,000 miles, all along hoping I would get used to this quirk, but that hasn’t happened. An avid reader of Car & Driver and Road & Track, I read each issue hoping to find a reference to this problem, anywhere, with regard to any vehicle. There was never any mention of it in regard to LS 400s, but there were two references to it, about other vehicles.
The problem? What the technical people refer to as “throttle tip-in.” I noticed almost from the beginning that it is impossible to drive my
LS400 both quickly and smoothly. I had to choose one or the other. Quick means quick, not fast. When you push the accelerator pedal the car lunges. Only by pushing very gently can you avoid the lunge, and the few seconds, or even tenths of a second lost inthat way deprives the vehicle of quickness.
Example: You get a brief chance to jump into an adjacent lane while moving in slow, jammed freeway traffic. You hit the pedal
hurriedly to take advantage of the brief opportunity before the car behind closes the gap. The LS400 lunges forward awkwardly into the lane, and then you have to hit the brake with a jolt to avoid hitting the car in front. Instead of a smooth zip zip operation, it’s a
lunge-jolt maneuver. You look and feel clumsy.
Example: You’re driving in heavy but steadily moving traffic on the freeway when you notice that there’s a jerk in an adjacent lane who is thinking about jumping in front of you, even though you have left less than a minimum safe distance between you and the car in front. If he succeeds in doing this, you will be forced to apply the brake. (I consider being forced to apply my brake to accomodate a lane changer as being “cut off,” because I devoutly believe that one should only make a lane change when he/she can do sowithout affecting the forward progress of the car you are pulling in front of). So you hit the accelerator to close the gap even further in an attempt to deter the jerk. The LS 400 lunges forward and then you have to brake because you got too close, to quickly to the car in front. If the attempt to gain speed quickly results in a throttle downshift, then there is a hesitation, a roar, and a lunge, which is even worse.
Let me note in fairness to the LS 400 that in the vacinity of 50-60 mph and faster there is usually enough torque in 5th or 4th gear so
that the car will gain speed smoothly and quickly without having to experience the lunging, which usually occurs at lower speeds.
Now I know that this lunging doesn’t have to be. I previously owned an ES300 which was both smooth and quick. The maneuvers I described above could be accomplished with that car with ease. The ES300 lacked high-end poop, but that’s another story."
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On the downside my sunroof rattles and the dealership doesn't know how to fix it. They think they will have to replace the whole thing. A Lexus engineer will be in sometime next month to look at it. The ground noise is annoying. I've seen some really stupid posts on this board about their cars being so quiet that they are noisy. Sorry, that's the biggest oxymoron I've ever heard. The quietness is above average at best, but definitely not exceptional like noted in Consumer Reports. I drove a loaner for a bit and found it to be the same. My test drive was on very smooth concrete, so I wouldn't have noticed. Also, there seems to be a rattle in my right passenger door, but I can't seem to identify it. The wood trim scratches easily and Lexus has no way to remove the scratches. A carwash brushed the vacuum hose across my console wood and scratched it. Lexus said sorry. That'll be $900 to replace it. I'm taking it up with the carwash.
The transmission is a piece of crap. About one in five times, when I need accelleration, I can give it the gas and nothing happens for a couple of seconds. The RPM's jump to nearly redline and then the car begins to accelerate as the RPM's fall. That's just the opposite of how it should happen. Nearly caused me to get rear ended when I tried to change from a lane that wasn't moving to a lane that was. Also, it downshifts at times. When I accelerate for a bit and release the foot feed after a couple of seconds the car suddenly slows as the transmission downshifts. I can watch the RPM's jump as it does this.
To say the least, I'm very frustrated. The dealership told me that Lexus recognizes the problem with the transmission but they don't know how to fix it. At least that's what they say. Lexus is monitoring the problem, and with enough complaints, will hopefully do something about it. Not all cars have this problem and the loaner they gave me shifted fine.
Please loudly complain to your dealership about the transmission. I think it's actually a dangerous issue. The more we complain, hopefully, Lexus will take some action.
I disagree that the Camry handles better. I tested the Camry VLE and SE several times before I opted for the ES300, and even considering the transmission issue, I prefer the ES300. My boyfriend, who is very picky, drove my car for a whole weekend, and even though we both noticed the transmission problem, it did not bother us. Both of us, however, are "smooth" drivers. If you like to "dart" around, don't get the ES300.
I do NOT like the ride of the Camry V6 XLE at all, and the SE, although it handles better than the XLE, is too rough for me to enjoy on a day-to-day basis. Had I not opted for the Lexus, I would probably have bought the Camry V6 SE.
Another note on the Camry - my boyfriend, who owns a 1994 Camry V6 XLE, pointed out that although they made the new Camry bigger, they did not increase the power on the engine to match.
I did not test an LE, but I understand they did upgrade the 4 cylinder engine, and it is quite peppy.
I did notice another problem in my car though. When I accelerate from a full stop, I sometimes hear a short clicking noise from the back of the car. This happens only when there's a full tank of gas. When I asked the service rep to check it out, he said it's probably due to gas lushing in the tank, which I find a bit odd. Another gripe I posted earlier about his car is the brake pedal making noice every time you step off it. Well I'm almost used to it now, and it's not getting on my nerve that much.
My experience with this car has been mostly positive. I like the new exterior design a lot more now than before. The head light looks quite good, especially against a lighter color (mine is millenium silver). The best thing is there are still relatively few new ES300 on the road, compared to the like of BMW or Acura, which are everywhere you look.
The reason to close the gap is not to save time or "stay ahead" of the other guy. It's to discourage the dangerous behavior he's engaged in. Pointless weaving in and out of steady traffic is dangerous---every lane change raises the possibility of an accident. What if the guy in front of me hits the brakes just as the jerk cuts in?
So from my perspective, either I close the gap and tailgate (not exactly safe, but...) or I let the guy cut me off, which now means now I'm tailgating anyway *and* have had a dangerous maneuver performed directly in front of me. I'd rather pick the "one evil" rather than the "two evil" alternative.
Just IMHO...
The dealer examined the cupholders and said there were no problems. Is anyone else experiencing this problem or has developed a solution?