Lexus ES 300/ES 330

akw3 · April 2004

I had my 2002 ES300 cracked windshield replaced with a non-Lexus windshield and my rain sensor along with my intermitent wiper stop working all together. I was told by the Dealer that it may be because of the different thickness or reflection of the new windshield which affected the rain senser's operation. And the only way to fix it is to replace it with a factory windshield. Right now I only have 2 fast speed on my wiper, not even the manual intermitent is working.

Any owners have similar problem or suggestion?

gambiaman · April 2004

I bought an interior AC filter for both my RX and 02 ES from Irontoad. I found and replaced the one in the RX with no problem but couldn't figure out how to replace the filter in the ES300. Is it behind the glovebox and if so how do I get access to the filter? Or is it elsewhere?
Thanks

neuroguy · April 2004

Yes, the cabin AC filter is behind the glove box in the '02 ES300. Instructions for accessing it are in the owners manual, section 2-1 under "Air Conditioning", pp 169-70. If you do not have an owners manual...
1. Open the glove box
2. Use a Phillips-head screwdriver to remove the screw on the right side of the glove box
3. On the upper inside of the glove box, there are two black plastic pins. Turn them counter-clockwise and pull to remove them.
4. Then lower the glove box out of the way
5. The filter will be in a tray, upper left. Pull out the tray and remove the filter from the tray

The owners manual, with pictures of the above is available online at the Lexus Owners site:
https://auth.owners.lexus.com/lexusowners/auth/ssl/OwnersLogin
If you have not registered there, you'll need your vehicle's VIN number.

sbarntho · April 2004

I have a '04 ES330 that I purchased last December. I've been really pleased with the car. I've noticed a peculiar sound from the steering wheel/dash area. The sound reminds me of the sound a ball makes when it rolls around. The sound is noticeable when I turn the steering wheel. Has anyone experienced this?

igiban · April 2004

Was in service the other day and used that chance to check out the new Nav DVD with supposedly lots more POI. I am in Bay Area and it finds the closest Walmart in Bakerfield, Costco 25 miles away (when there's one in 5 miles), Safeway for 20 miles (yes there are plenty in 5-10 miles), and top choice of MacD in Inglewood (long berger I guess). It's not much better based on that test. Want $200+ for the DVD, passed.

bjk2001 · April 2004

igiban:
Is it worth to get a Nav at all? Looking to buy ES330 debate w or w/out NAV.
bjk

igiban · April 2004

Depends on how you and your family use the car. How often do you use the car to go to unfamiliar places, when Nav can be very helpful and give you a peace of mind everywhere you go. Plus, to get the super nice ML audio (if you like music in car) you've to get Nav, tho it'd be too pricy if you mainly just want ML.

solara00 · April 2004

I think the NAV system in the Camry XLE is similar to the Lexus ES system. The Lexus may be slightly better, but overall, I think they are pretty close. I've heard the LS 430 system accepts voice commands and may be even more advanced than the ES or Camry systems. But here's what I can tell you about the Toyota DVD Navigation after 800 new miles and I think the ES 330 info would match most of this, except for price:

1. Toyota NAV added about $1000 to the cost of the car.
2. It works very well in my area (Midwest).
3. It sometimes states I've arrived at my location even though the location still may be up to 300 feet away. That's only happened a few times, but it has happened. I have always been able to see my final destination from that point. The INFO button gives you a lot of information about your destination, including a phone number if you need it.
4. You can use "North up" orientation (like looking at a map), or you can use "Heads up" orientation that always shows the direction you are traveling. I like Heads Up better because it always shows the roads I'm coming to, but not all in my family agree. But with the push of a button you can switch either way.
5. The Toyota NAV manual is 125 pages. You should read them all. Most have to do with using NAV, but you also have other features like the Calendar that allows you to schedule oil changes and other maintenance, dental appointments, write notes to yourself, etc.
6. Would I spend the $1000 again based upon what I know now even though the system is not yet perfect? Definitely yes. The display along with the voice guidance is a big help when you are in areas unfamiliar to you. Could Mapquest give you the same thing? Somewhat. But Mapquest can't tell you when your turn is coming up, whether to be in the right or left lane, and written directions aren't much good when you are trying to decide which lane to be in at 65 mph. Knowing that my exit is 2 miles on the left can make a big difference if I'm in the far-right lane and need to get over to the left lane.
7. You can choose from these routing options: Quickest, Shortest and I forget the other one! I like the "route preview", which allows you to see a video of your entire route from start to finish, no matter how far away it is. If I see the route takes I-270 around a city instead of I-70 through the city, I can alter my routing preference.
8. If you miss a designated turn, the system will either tell you to take a legal U-turn or it will simply re-route you -- whichever makes the most sense. In some cases, if there is no U-turn, it will just recalculate a new route for you to the final destination.

It's not perfected yet and you still have to use common sense. But if I only had a choice between a moonroof, or a CD changer, or leather vs. the NAV, I'd go for the Nav.

Of course, if you never drive outside of your local area, you would probably never use it.

I apologize for the excessive information, but i kinda bought this blind (because I do a lot of business travel) and maybe my experience can help you avoid that. I've used the HERTZ Neverlost system many times. It's very, very good. But the Toyota DVD system does everything the Hertz system does, does it better and easier, and does quite a lot more.

designergirl · April 2004

HELP! I am buying an ES330 on Sunday from my best friends ex-boyfriend (so things are very different). I really want a black garnet pearl w/ ivory and navigation. He says he doesn't have it on the lot and that navigation is only good for real estate agents and people in sales. The dealer only orders about 10% with NAV. He doesn't think that NAV is important. He does have a black pearl with ivory without/nav and he thinks this is a better deal. It is kinda hard since he is my friends ex to negotiate. Do I want the NAV since I am not in sales. Will it be useful for a 30 something that is at work most of the time? Please adivise.

solara00 · April 2004

Wow, that is so hard to answer without knowing how close you are to a major city and other factors.

But I had to go to St. Louis today which is about 150 miles from my home. I know the city okay, but nothing specific. Once I got my business done, I wanted to find an REI (outdoor recreation store) in St. Louis. I just punched in REI and it located the store address and phone number for me and routed me there with no problems. Then I needed to find an Office Depot or Office Max. Punched in Office Depot and it gave me the address, phone number and the route. If I had wanted to stop at an Italian or Chinese restaurant, the system would find those for me, too. But, I needed to get home, so I hit the memory button which stores 6 locations and punched in my home address. The system gave me 3 route choices, I selected the route I wanted and off I went. In 8 hours today, the system never gave me a wrong turn or any incorrect information.

It's definitely a lot of money. But I travel to Chicago and St. Louis quite often and if I had the money, I would always choose the navigation. My daughter will be taking a job in Chicago and she is very bad at directions and orienting herself and she would be the first to admit that. Living in a city that size and not knowing how to get to a client would take some learning. The NAV would probably be a big help to her. As I mentioned previously, it's hard to read a map and drive at the same time. It's nice to have the voice tell you that your turn is coming up.

Now if you never drive more than 25 miles from your home and you don't live in a metropolitan city, then I can't see a great benefit. I do think in 10 or 15 years NAV systems will be very common on most cars.

If you live in a Texas border town, then I'd say pass. If you live in a metro area, I think the NAV might be beneficial. Just my opinion. But I sure like mine and I haven't second-guessed the money part of it since I first used it.

I would ask the dealer to test drive any car with NAV first, if they have one on the lot. I drove a Highlander because the car I wanted didn't have it. Or you could rent a Hertz car for a day that has Navigation. If you like that system, you will like the LEXUS system even more. The Hertz system uses a joystick to pick letters for a street address, while the Lexus system simply uses a touch screen.

Good luck.

By the way, I won't demean this salesman. But I wonder what if he only had your color WITH navigation? He'd might be telling you never to leave home without it! Basically, they want to sell you whatever is on the lot and I don't blame them for that. Having to order you one, means you could look and buy elsewhere.

One week a dealer only had a Red V6 I wanted and, of course, that was the most popular color. Two weeks later, he only had a Silver V6 on the lot and, of course, that was now the most popular color. So buy what you want and if you have to go somewhere else to get it, so be it. You'll have to live with it for awhile. Again, good luck.

solara00 · April 2004

I just realized how easy it is to spend someone else's money!! Sorry about that. I feel like the government.

Anyway, if you have any specific questions about the NAV, I'd be glad to try to answer them before Sunday. The car I bought I plan on keeping for 7 or 8 years, so dividing the price by that many years didn't seem like a lot. But if you are not familiar with the area you are in, it really makes finding a car dealership, hotel, restaurant, a Home Depot, Lowes, Sears store, etc. very easy. You just punch in Sears and it will give you a list of every Sears stores within so many miles. It will tell you how far each is away, the direction from your current location and then a route to the store.

atoews · April 2004

It sounds as though your dealer really wants to sell a car in a hurry. I think it is nonsense to say that only sales people can use a NAV.

NAVs are not "important" in the sense that a rear view mirror or steering wheel is. It is whether or not you value a NAV. If you travel out of town more than a couple of times per year, a NAV would be very useful. If you live in a large metropolitan area and like to explore different areas, a NAV is very worthwhile.

On the other hand, if you travel the same routes all the time, and seldom venture to unfamiliar areas, then NAV will probably not be worthwhile. If you live in a small to medium area, one that is outside the area that NAV advertises to work in, and you never venture out of that area, then NAV would be a complete waste of money.

If you think you want a NAV, and you plan to keep the car for more than three years, I'd hold out for a NAV. If you don't plan to keep the car for three years or so, then you can always comfort yourself that your next vehicle can have a NAV if you want one at that time.

Regarding your dealer's ability to find the car with the options that you like - I believe that it depends on the region you live in. In Southern California, for example, it is easy for dealers to swap cars with one another.

I think it is dangerous to be rushed regardless of your situation. You are ripe for being taken advantage of regardless of whose ex-boyfriend he is. You are sure not to get a good deal if you rush.

designergirl · April 2004

thanks for all your imput. I live in Orange County (southern california - 20 million people) and I am moving to a new area San Diego. My husband says that maybe we should just find a new salesman since he doesn't seem responsive to my needs. I don't dive alot, but (you kmow, life if short and if you what a new toy (nav) you should treat yourself). If any of you think it is a good option I would value your imput. Thanks.

solara00 · April 2004

I have spent many years traveling all of California. Living in San Diego OR Orange County....well, I wouldn't think twice about getting it. I've used the Hertz system in the Bay area, Sacramento, and all of southern California. It has been immensely helpful. I think the Lexus system would serve you well.

Atoews point about how long you would keep the car is definitely something to consider.

designergirl · April 2004

I usually drive my cars for 5 to 7 years. Do you think the sales agent was being honest with navigation not being helpful?
Do you think it was just too much trouble finding me a black garnet pearl color?

atoews · April 2004

You are in southern california and the NAV will serve you well there. I love my NAV and I can't even use mine all the time because I live in Ridgecrest, Ca. But it's great when I travel to So Cal. From your description of yourself, it sounds as though you really ought to insist on the NAV. It sounds as though you will keep your car for awhile and might kick yourself for not getting the NAV later. You don't sound strapped for cash. You are moving to a new area, and the NAV would definitely help you get "acclimated".

There are SO many large dealerships in southern california that it is inconceivable to me that you would not be able to locate the car you want (with the exception of Starlight Pearl, a color I have only seen in Texas).

If your dealer won't do it for you, then call the Riverside dealer, the San Bernardino dealer and the Cerritos dealer. They are huge and have huge inventories. You should not have to do this. Your dealer should do it for you, in my opinion. In fact, each dealer receives a list of cars delivered in their regions from toyota.

When I purchased my car, the dealer did not have the car I wanted and I had to wait a couple of weeks for them to locate one. You have to decide whether the wait would be worth it for your color.

Any dealer is going to want to make a sale in the smallest amount of time possible. If I were you, I'd tell the salesman the car I wanted, and make him find it for you.

Definitely try carsdirect.com or even the lexus site to get multiple dealers to give you a quote and see if they can come up with your car.

Another note. If I were faced with having to make a choice between my first choice color with no NAV, and my second choice color with NAV, I'd sacrifice my preferred color for the NAV.

igiban · April 2004

Wow 20 mil people in OC now? You got to have more Lexus dealers to choose your ideal car from. I got a feeling that you may not really need Nav much but you still want one. Nothing wrong woth that but it's really just a tool for certain purposes. Ask yourself: you have not used a car with a Nav for so long, have you thought often "would it be nice that I can have a Nav now to find a way to...."? Or do you hate printing maps in Yahoo..... It's really not that hard to figure out. Having a Nav in a car does give you peace of mind whenever you go, even if you don't really use it very often.

bjk2001 · April 2004

Hi designergirl: Guess I asked about whether its worth it to get the NAV or not a few posts back. I live in LA and went to SD, Dana point 2 weeks ago. I peeked your profile says you live in Dana point. I have some friend they own Odyssey Nav, Acura TL Nav. They all like it. TL guy said he won't get another one without it, it helped him a few times on golf trip. I did have an Earthmate GPS hooked up to my Laptop I put in my Odyssey. It is pretty handy. I had to go to Wilshire district to take care some business today. I wasn't to sure where I was going so I turned it on it guided me pretty good. It also helped us while we were in SD two weeks ago. My GPS hooks up to my laptop so I could type in the address stuffs. Never used any NAV without a keyboard so not sure how easy it is to input address and stuffs. If you get a really good deal from your friend's friend, another option is to get aftermarket NAV system. Carmin Street pilot 2610 and Megellan Roadmate are two of the new ones on the market. I think I am going to get NAV when I purchase my ES330. Got to have new toy in a near luxury car.
Good luck!
bjk

maxhonda99 · May 2004

Designergirl,

You need to ask yourself some questions relative to the NAV system:

WHat do primarily do with your car? By that I mean do you basically use your car for work purposes, errands, shopping, visits to friends etc.
If it's primarily for these reasons, why spend $2K on a NAV system? It would be kind of a waste of money.

Do you go alot of new places where you need directions to get to or a map? Such as on vacations with your car or travel for work.

If so, the NAV may be for you.

Remember the NAV is quite expensive for basically a electronic Map. Don't forget the updates get expensive also.

The salesman is kinda right, NAV systems are very useful for people like traveling salesman and real estate agents. And I'm sure they are usful for people in other professions also or for people that travel alot by driving.

k124 · May 2004

sand mica?
My DH has the avalon desert sand mica and I am buying a es330, and was thinking about the mystic gold, but is it the exact same gold as the avalon?

Anyone know?

gambiaman · May 2004

Thanks for the info. I changed it today and it was very dirty, like most things easy to do once you know how.

piera · May 2004

I'm gonna buy a 330 soon and have been doing a lot of research. As of NAV, here are some thoughts ( any comments are welcome)
I 'm planning to buy either "Garmin iQue 3600"(GPS integrated in Palm) or "Mitac Mio 168" (GPS integrated in Pocket PC) instead of Lexus NAV. (anyone interested in them just Google them, I can not put a link here)

Pros:
1,it covers almost all the functionality (including voice guidence) as an electronic map.
2,They are much cheaper than Lexus NAV.
3,They are much easier to be upgraded (for new data) and with a much cheaper price when necessary than Lexus NAV.
4,You can use it without driving your car, i.e. travel by air to another city.
5,When you are driving, others (even in the backseat) can help you to use it if necessary.
6, They work as a personal organizer as well.

Cons:
1,it's not intergrated in the car, so can not work as a nice display for other purpose like CD-player.
2,If you live or travel to a bad neighbourhood area, you have to remember to remove the NAV when you leave the car.

Others:
1, Bettery life is not an issue, since you have the auto kit (including the Car charger for car cigarette plug to cradle connector and PDA mounting holster)
2,Mitac Mio 168 has a 3D view for the map, it's looks straightforward if you like it.
3,I have never use any of the 3, all these come from the review and message board, any experience are welcome.

Piera

307web · May 2004

Some portable navs are good, but the particular ones you listed are far from the best.
Routis 2004 for PocketPCs and Windows laptops or some of the dedicated navigation units and navigation/stereo combo units are nice.

It's nicer to have the built in units if you're willing to spend the extra money for convenience.

jchan2 · May 2004

the built in units are harder to be taken by a thief who breaks into your car.

307web · May 2004

If you use a PocketPC, you can just carry it around with you or stick it in the glove compartment and no one will be the wiser.

I prefer the built in units since they are more user-friendly and have many more POIs (restaurants, shopping etc.) in the DVD based database compared to what fits on an SD card, but the price!

If you already own a newer PocketPC, Routis 2004 software for maps and routing, plus a compact flash or Bluetooth GPS hardware unit to access the satellites will only cost $200-$300 or so for both.

mouseonline · May 2004

You are sooooo wrong.
Just try all 3 and you will realize that the build-in NAV is so much more convenient to use.

igiban · May 2004

Add a pro/con here:
Mobil one, if good, means that you don't have to buy another car for $2K+ more on Nav.
But,
The PDA types are not touch screen, which is very useful when you are using it in a car. Plus, the screen is much smaller than the built-in one.

307web · May 2004

Routis 2004 for PocketPC is touch screen. The buttons are designed so you don't need to use a stylus.
The screen is smaller than a unit built into the ES330, but big enough to read.
If you load the Routis software on a laptop you can have a big screen if you want, but a laptop is not as easy to mount in a car and then you lose touchscreen functionality if you load it on a laptop. But the software costs about $90. You cannot expect everything for that price.

igiban · May 2004

How much is Routis 2004+PocketPC+GPS receiver+adapters? And how do you keep all pieces 'stationed' in a car? Hey it may work out well. Let us know how you like it.

307web · May 2004

I think it's a good deal if you already have or planned to buy a pocketpc anyway. If you buy a PocketPC for the express purpose of using it as a navigation system it can get expensive enough to where it is easier to start comparing it to a built-in nav system and avoid the extra work.

http://www.deluo.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_- - - - - Code=DE&Product_Code=RSSA&Category_Code=GS

You need a PocketPC with 64MB RAM and both SD and CF memory slots, plus a PDA mount. The SD slot is for storage space to load maps using SD cards and the CF slot is for plugging in a GPS antenna.
They make PDA mounts that use suction cups to connect to the windshield, or plug into cup holders or clip to A/C vents. You wouldn't leave it there all the time. Either you take the PDA with you or you hide it in the console or glove box when you leave the car. You could continue to use the PDA for other purposes (calendar, address book etc.).
Then you need an extra SD card from 128MB to 1GB depending on how wide of an area you want to keep loaded.
To hear the nav system commands over radio and road noise, you can either get a PDA mount with a built-in speaker or you can plug the PDA's headphone output into your stereo system with some kind of AUX input (You could load WMA or MP3 files on the PDA so you can listen to music through the PPC at the same time if you have enough space for that plus the maps you want to load.)
If you use a laptop instead of a PPC, you could just load the entire US map onto your harddrive, but you will have a harder time getting the laptop mounted and carrying it around. You can plug the GPS antenna into a laptop with a CF card adapater for PC slots or get a USB GPS unit instead.

They also make wireless Bluetooth GPS antennas that you could use with either a laptop or PocketPC (if they were BT capable) but they cost more and use batteries that will need recharging after use.
The BT units are nice though since you wouldn't have to physically connect it to your PPC or laptop.

bjk2001 · May 2004

Guys, I am using a laptop with earthmate GPS. it works fine for Navagation stuff. I have some friend using Carmin stand alone Nav system, it works ok. You have to remove it or hide it everytime you get out the car, it's like to remove car stereo face plate becomes an nuisance after a while. Not even metion plug in the A/C cord, then you haev to boot up the system etc. It is such a nuisance, most of the time I just don't turn it on anymore, a few times I need to use it while I was driving and system wasn't on then you go thru the whole boot up thing while you were driving. Highly DO NOT recommend that.
Also, no matter where you mount it, dash mount, a/c duck mount, it doesn't look good like a factory unit. For the money I am going to spend for my ES330 $35K I won't put something UGLY on my dash board. Also keep in mind when its time to trade in your ES330 with NAV sounds more luxury. These are just my 2 cents.

307web · May 2004

If you use the nav so often that you need to connect and disconnect it every time you go in and out of the car, then the built in system is more attractive. A lot of people only need to use the navigation once in a while and can't justify the $2000 cost for something they may use only need a few times a month at the most.
A PocketPC doesn't take long to boot up like a laptop and you shouldn't be messing with it while driving anyway. Even most built in nav systems like the one in the ES330 block you from setting up routes unless the car is in Park.

Resale is no justification. It doesn't make sense to spend around $2000 to get $500 extra resale value 3 years later. For people who didn't want the Mark Levinson stereo and were "forced" to take it just to get the nav system in an ES330, the cost is even higher.
The massive depreciation on built-in nav systems is so severe, it reduces the car's residual percentage on a lease.
For people who would use the nav system constantly and would have to keep removing and reconnecting a portable unit several times a day to prevent tempting thieves, the built-in system makes the most sense.

igiban · May 2004

You can get Nav w/o ML now. BTW, did you look into one of these garmin or magellan self-contained mobile units? Seem cleaner than these PDA pieces.

307web · May 2004

Some of the newer self-contained ones are good and easier to set up especially if you aren't very familiar with how to use a PPC or load software on it, but if you already own a newer PocketPC then the PocketPC-based systems would save a lot of money for a some extra effort in setup.

solara00 · May 2004

On my Toyota Camry NAV system, which I think is similar to the ES 330 system, you don't have to be in Park, but you do have to be traveling under 3 MPH. Not much difference, but a little.

At any speed - 65, 70, 75, whatever - you can select one of 5 pre-programmed memory destinations (e.g. your Home address), plus Hospitals, Police, etc. There is no speed limitation on those addresses and the system will automatically re-route you based upon the selection you make.

I agree with you that the cost is probably hard to justify for most people. Since I usually keep my vehicles for 7-8 years I'm not worried about the depreciation. And my line of work allows me to use the NAV more than most people would.

Plus having a portable system cluttering up my car is just not something I would like. I can't say how the Toyota/Lexus systems compare to others, but I sure like mine. It has been very accurate and very user-friendly.

ahnj · May 2004

For me, a laptop/PDA based NAV solution was too clumsy for everyday use.

There are significant advantages to a built-in NAV system. I made the mistake of purchasing my previous Lexus with the same line of logic as yours four years ago and have regreted it since.

This year, I've tested out the NAV systems from Lexus, Volvo, Infiniti and BMW. Lexus' touch-screen based system is superior hands down. My background is in software, so I'm really picky about the NAV system's software and user interface.

For 2004, ES330 has a new generation NAV system with upgraded POI database and faster routing speed. The system is still based on the proven Denso NAV platform.

J.

sev6 · May 2004

What are the updates to the 05 ES? By the way i'm new here.

sev6 · May 2004

Anybody?

randyr52 · May 2004

I recently bought a 2004 model ES330 and was wondering(rather backward, I know), when the new model with updated electronics and new body style is coming out?!?! I traded a 2004 Honda Accord EXV6 because I could not endure the HARD highway ride. But the electronics were OUTSTANDING!!!
Having XM radio incorporated into the radio was really great.....this new ES330 does seem a little dated in that department. My other point is the slow shifting tranny, but I am sure that has been beat to death here. I love the ride and the quietness. Also does the treadwear rating of 140 translate into 28,000 miles? Saw somewhere you double the numbers and mutiply by 1000. Correct? Anyway, hello and hope we all can enjoy the Lexus "experience". We had a RX300 for 4 yrs. and loved it. Thanks and hello!

andy71 · May 2004

Toyota Motors like to keep things under wraps until a month or two before release, so really we are all in the dark. The 2005 Avalon is rumored to get an all new 3.5L V6 rated at around 270 Hp. Again these are just speculation and certainly not etched in stone. If the Avalon gets a new 3.5 engine, I am almost 99% certain that the Lexus ES330 will become the Lexus ES350 to signify the increase in engine displacement. It is hard to imagine the Avalon getting a more powerful engine than the Lexus ES. Other options on the table could be XM satellite radio, gosh I love that. A mild refreshing of the exterior look will probably be in the cards as it is consistent with Toyota policy to update the looks in mid cycle.

307web · May 2004

The Avalon is a bigger, bulkier car. There is no reason an ES330 has to have a engine of the same size just to match the Avalon especially since they recently changed to the 3.3. I really doubt they will change the engine 3 times in one body style.
Maybe when they totally change the design for 2007.

k124 · May 2004

Hi,

Just purchased a 2004, the dealer said he never heard of this incentive which is listed on Edmunds and all the other car buying places as a finance incentive, then he wouldnt take a draft from capital one for 3.6%
Said my rate would be 4.75%. Our credit rating was very high by the way. Am I being foolish to settle for this or I am just being picky? I already signed the papers but havent taken delivery yet. Also we said we wanted to take the actual car for a quick test drive and they stopped the registration process, saying it had to be on their plates. So we are doing that today.

thank-you

lenscap · May 2004

I can't see the Avalon getting a 270 hp engine at all. The car is a luxury cruiser aimed at an older crowd. The Avalon just broke in to the top 10 cars with the oldest average buyer at 61. Most of these buyers do not have power as a priority. With the new Lexus GS being a sports sedan and getting a new 245 hp engine, I just can't imagine a car like the Avalon getting a much more powerful 270 hp engine.

maxhonda99 · May 2004

307web,

The 3.3L is not really a new engine. It is merely a enlarged version of the 3L V6 currently in the Camry V6(except SE which has the 3.3L).

The current bodystyle ES330 won't be getting a new engine either. The next generation ES is only a bit over 2 years away, and that will probably get the 3.5L V6 if the Avalon does.

As in the past you can bet the Avalon, Camry, ES, RX, Sienna will get basically the same engines. If the Avalon gets a 3.5L V6 so will the ES.

sev6 · May 2004

How do you know? Toyota is werid about what engines they put in their cars. Only time well tell...

maxhonda99 · May 2004

No, they are not really that weird about the engines they put in their cars.

Take for example the ES over the years:

1st generation ES300(92-96):
92-93 had 3.0L ironblock V6.
94-96 had a redesigned 3.0L aluminum block V6.

2nd generation ES300(97-01):
97-98 had a 3.0L V6 basically carried over from 96 ES with minor mods for improved power/efficiency.
99-01 saw the implementation of VVTi heads on the 3.0L V6.

3rd Generation ES300/330(02-06?)
02-03: basically the same engine as 99-01 ES300.
04 sees a enlarged version of the 3.0L V6 to 3.3 liters.

See a trend? See how the 3rd model brings improvements?

sev6 · May 2004

I mean how the new GS is getting a 3.0 v6 while the new avalon is getting a 3.5. There are some other examples but i don't feel like writing or typing. Later cuz.

maxhonda99 · May 2004

Well, the ES already has a larger engine than the supposed 3.0L in the next GS300.

I don't believe the 3.0L V6 in the next GS. I won't believe it until I see real specs released. I think Toyota/Lexus is hiding alot about the next GS.

lenscap · May 2004

There has been no confirmation that the new Avalon is getting a 3.5. In fact, it is pure rumor. I won't believe it until I see it because the Avalon targets a very old buyer (average age 61) and I can't imagine Toyota putting a big engine in that car (bigger than the new GS).

1716 · May 2004

Too bad I'm now just reading about the Lexus ES330 shifting problems on this website. I, too, have these problems and sometimes I think the car is dangerous! Does anyone else have the loud windshield wipers that are distracting in a rainstorm? How about the car still thinking the key is in the ignition when it is not and not letting you lock the doors? This is my third Lexus...what happened with this one!!!

Lexus ES 300/ES 330

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