Toyota Echo

larrykingry · April 2002

My 2002 4 door Echo is listed on invoice for $12761 MSRP and invoice for $11912.35 Dealer. The cruise was added on by the dealer. The dealer said the cruise listed for $250. I quess-timated that the cost for the item and installed was at least $140. That is how I arrived at the $12,900 figure for MSRP with cruise. I paid $11275 for the car alone. The tag will cost me $80 and the tax will be about $500. So, on the road, the total cost is $11,275 + $80 +$500 or $11,855. I don't believe there was a $1000 instant cash rebate when I purchased the car (Mar 28,02) as I talked to several dealers and the subject was never mentioned.

cbie · April 2002

Has anyone else experienced brakes that squeal noticeably whenever braking soon after starting the car up in the morning and softer squeals intermittently when braking at other times throughout the driving day? I'm wondering if this is an isolated problem or should I even be concerned about this squealing? My car has less than 1000 miles.

kneisl1 · April 2002

Perhaps you live in a humid area, this would cause surface rust to form on the rotors of the front brakes and they would squeel for a while until the rust is worn off. Do you drive often? If not this encourages the rust. Its not a big deal, my motorcycle sits for a week or two sometimes and this surface rust happens, then wears off with use. You could have the dealer check it out, after all the car is under warranty. If you think theres a problem, have them look at it.
Have you seen the new Honda Hybrid Civic that costs $20,000 plus and gets 48mpg? My ECHO cost $13,000 out the door and it just got 43 mpg on a trip! What is Honda thinking here? This might give economy cars a bad name! (but maybe not with the price of gas these days)

slugline · April 2002

Probably the same thing Toyota is thinking. Have you seen the price of the Prius?

o0allstar0o · April 2002

hey
Do u guys think that the echo is a girly kind of car?.. I am not trying to make fun of anyone, I am thinking about considering it as something to think about getting and I just want your views..
i think that they are nice looking.. not toyota's best looking car. but, not it's worst..what do yall think?

vocus · April 2002

I don't think it is a girl car. Of course, I am the type of person who doesn't care what other people think.

aeroterremer · April 2002

I don't see a girl car, what I see is a sensible economical 'green' car which does it's job - mainly to transport people from point A to point B - in a reliable manner.

kaz6 · April 2002

girly car? lol I don't think any of us bought the Echo because of what others thought. I've had more than one person come up to me to say they wished they didn't listen to their friend's advice and bought one.
I thought the Echo was the ugliest car around when I first saw it. It is a car that grows on you and it's also the 'shock of the new'. 2 years later and I like it even more! Also, I fell in love with the Yaris(Euro version of Echo) the first time I saw one in Spain...wish the US one looked more like it.
If you're buying to impress someone else, you won't like the Echo. Buy it for yourself and it will continually make you smile.

britton2 · April 2002

and I don't consider it to be "girly" - to me it's just a uniquely-styled little car boasting the Toyota emblem - I heard that Toyota won't be making the Echo anymore after 2003 though -

slugline · April 2002

Seriously, though, only from the front do I find any "girlish" looks on this car -- the headlamp assembly reminds me of "cat-eye" eyeglass frames.

I find it rather neat how some people attach personalities to their cars: My daily driver is a CR-V. After a short time, I decided that it was a "girl" and nicknamed her "Betty." (It comes off the tongue easier than the initials C-R-V!) Or, if you saw the movie Gone in 60 Seconds, notice that Nicolas Cage's character nicknamed the elusive Shelby Mustang "Eleanor." Has anyone else here personified their car like this? Or is the ECHO really just a point-A-to-B machine for everyone? <GRIN>

I took a group of CR-V owners to the Houston Auto Show this past weekend. While there, my ECHO-owning girlfriend and I paid a visit to the Toyota floor. As far as cars are concerned, it looks like Toyota is all about promoting the Corolla and Matrix this year. There was only one lone ECHO on display, at the periphery of the action:

aeroterremer · April 2002

When I said 'point A to point B'I didn't mean to say the Echo was just a vehicle to transport people. I meant to say that it's not a frills car, it does what a car is supposed to do. I have named my Echo, I call her 'Echo Baby'. I tell her she's beautiful everytime I drive her!

petro33 · April 2002

I know what you mean. Almost every Echo I see here in Sacramento is either driven by a young girl or an older person. Do I care!! Not in the least. I do find it interesting that as I was reading a magizine at the doctors office (a teen Mag) I saw at least three adds for the echo addressed to the 18-25 age "girl" market. O'well I enjoy mine! The echo that is!

o0allstar0o · April 2002

thanks to everyone who took time to write me... i am still unsure on what i am going to buy but i am still going to keep it in consideration..i am not going to say that i dont care what/how other other people think of me, b/c i do...but if i do get one.. oh well, they will just have to deal with it..!! thanks again..

kaz6 · April 2002

Went in today and had my new wheels/tires installed. Wow! What a difference in road feel and handling! I did have to reduce psi to 31...at 33 it rendered my cd player useless on anything but smooth road. The only drawback has been heavier steering at low speeds. It has immediate response to steering at highway speeds and ride is firm but compliant.
The rear tire fills that space nicely now and the fronts are just at the edge of the cladding. Glad I didn't get the 16" ones!

wrgraham · April 2002

Kaz, you say the new 15 inch wheels and tires fill the the space nicely now. I would suppose
that the circumference is greater than before, else they wouldnt fill the spaces any more. If the circumference is greater, then the speedometer/odometer would be reading wrong now, no? And the gearing would be even taller than the original? I dont care so much about the speedometer
readings, but if the gearing is even longer, less revs at the same speed, seems like the car is going too far in a direction where it was already pretty far out. Or maybe you have done this change differently than what I am supposing.

kaz6 · April 2002

Actually, the circumference doesn't change,at least not enough to affect odometer...just the width and the size of wheel. I have very low profile tires on-205/50/15's. When I say 'fills in the space' I mean the width. Probably the weakest angle looking at an Echo is the rear quarter view as the stock wheel/tire is well inset which has led many to believe the Echo has skinny tires when in fact it has the same as many other cars on the road. The dynamics change with the upgrade as it changes the unsprung weight.
I can say it feels like I'm driving a bigger car now. I didn't go for 16's because of price and proportion. Anything bigger than a 15" makes the car look almost cartoonish IMHO

I have seen an Echo here with 17" wheels and it looks cool but not for me. The true test of mpg etc. will be when I do my usual drive to Vegas. The aerodynamics suffer with bigger/wider tires so it'll be intresting to see what my mpg is now. I'd post a pic but don't know how! lol

lynnann1 · April 2002

because his mother had locked the keys in her car while at the grocery store, and he needed someone to take him up with the second set of keys. His first words when he sat is my ECHO were "Wow! this car is big!" BTW she owns a Camry about circa 1999.

I had the opportunity to ride in a Subaru Forrester a few weeks ago and it felt smaller than riding in my Precious. Goes to show you can't judge a car's interior by looking at the outside and also confirms my Dad's comment when we first got her that she's a TARDIS.

aeroterremer · April 2002

Unfamiliar with that term. Please explain.

majorthomecho · April 2002

The TARDIS was used by Dr. Who (a character in the same titled British sci-fi TV series). It looked like a British police box on the outside (think old style phone booth), but it was a very large spaceship on the inside.

Personally, I think of my car as male and that is one reason I gave him a male name. Major Tom (his name) is the name of the character in the David Bowie song, Space Oddity. The Echo is a space oddity because it is bigger inside than it appears from the outside.

Nicholas Cage called that one car, Eleanor, because that is what it was called in the Original Gone In 60 Seconds movie. You should buy or rent the original. Amazing what the film maker did on a low budget.

majorthomecho · April 2002

Toyota had two or three Echoes on display at my local autoshow. Most of the emphasis was given over to the new Corolla which is as it should be since the Corolla is new this year.

I think the Echo is not selling to the young people because they think it does not have enough horsepower.

Be honest, if you did not take a test drive, would you think something with only 108 horses could be as fast or as fun to drive as the Echo?

If Toyota is not cancelling the Echo, I think they should bump the hp up by about 7 to 17 horses. I doubt that Toyota will bump it up to 125 horses total because then you are getting into the hp range of the Corolla which has 130.

But bottom line is that to sell more to the youngsters, the answer is more power.

vocus · April 2002

I am 23, and have a 1.8T Jetta. I had rented an Echo when my car was in the shop for a day. I am glad they had an Echo, because I wanted to drive one of them for a little to see how I would like it (I thought about getting one for my dad a couple months ago, if you remember). Anyway, I liked the handling, and the power was not too bad at all for an economy minded car. It was faster than my 2001 Protege that I had before. The handling didn't feel tippy to me either, and I took some off-ramps pretty quickly in it. I didn't mind the looks, but of course the interior was sparse to me, only because I am used to having power everything, etc. But it was not that bad a car at all. Would definitely get one (if they added another inch of front leg room) for myself as a commuter or second car.

kaz6 · April 2002

I'm afraid that with the announcement that Toyota will be adding the "Scion" line the Echo will most likely be dropped. I question their logic but do hope that they bring over cars more like the Yaris/Vitz in more or less untouched form. I especially like the sport versions of these models. Speaking of which, has anyone seen any instrument kits for Echo's? The Yaris has a very cool pod!
Take a look at the Saturn Ion...seems like the Vibe is not the only one sharing Toyota parts! The dash looks like an Echo hybrid!

slugline · April 2002

Yeah Major, I think "108 horsepower" doesn't properly convey what people are getting. The VVTi design really does a nice job of squeezing out the most from 1.5 liters. Does anyone know if there is a published dyno curve for this car?

vocus · April 2002

Everyone cracked on the Echo's dash, and then they turn around and put it in the ION. Makes no sense to me, a dumb marketing move.

I drove the Echo, like I said before, and the dash was not a problem for me. Once I got used to looking to the right instead of straight ahead, it was no big deal. It did feel funny to have an empty dash in front of me though. And also, Toyota needs to add some more instrumentation to the pod as well. It looks too cheap with just the speedo and fuel gauge in there.

majorthomecho · April 2002

If the Echo is cancelled, will this board be allowed to continue on?

majorthomecho · April 2002

My roommate and I took a test drive of the 2003 Corolla yesterday. Very impressive car and I thought it was at the top of my roommate's list. However, we were driving around today and passed a red Echo. My roommate said that the Corolla was very nice, but she preferred my Echo. The major reasons were the interior design of the Echo and the center mounted gauge cluster.

We are going to take a test drive of the new Suzuki Aerio on Saturday and then we will head up to the Toyota dealership so my roommate can test drive an automatic Echo.

pat · April 2002

As long as anybody wants to talk about the Echo, this discussion will be available, whether they are still making them or not.

Pat
Sedans Host

aeroterremer · April 2002

I've been looking for one since the Echo came out. If anyone knows where or even if they make one, would you post it here...thanks! I've tried several scale model mfrs and haven't seen any Echos listed.

kaz6 · April 2002

I've been having problems with my cd player as of late. It gets stopped by road disturbances and then reads 'error 1'. 'error 1' is supposed to be dirty or damaged cd but the cd is fine. This was happening before I upgraded wheels and tires as well so I know it's not that. I've cleaned the lens and cd's but it seems overly sensiive to any surface irregularities. Anyone having similar problems? It only started happening this past winter. I have over 25k on mine now!

majorthomecho · April 2002

Thanks.

cbie · April 2002

aeroterremer, Hobby Link Japan is an excellent place to buy scale models. The ECHO is listed as the Vitz. The website link is http://www.hlj.com. The wonderful part about this website is that it does money conversions and the service is impeccable! I highly recommend this site for all your scale model needs. Model FUJ18631 and FUJ03482 are the ones you're probably looking for. Have fun customizing your model...

wrgraham · April 2002

I was surprised by the earlier posting about the Echo needing more horsepower. The basic factor in providing performance is the weight to horsepower ratio. The Echo weighs in at 2060 pounds, and with a horsepower of 108 that means less than 20 pounds per horsepower. Now look at the Civics and the Protege and Corolla and you will see that those cars have equal or more pounds per horsepower. And the new Matrix is certainly inferior to the Echo in this regard. Of course when you start looking really closely you should be looking at the torque delivery all the way up the RPM curve, as well as the gear ratios. But basically the Echo is pretty fast because it is light.
....My 18 year old friend rode a lot with me in my Echo till he got his first car recently, a used Accord. He was not out a lot with his peers initially, but surely is now. When I saw him the other day and we were talking cars, he mentionned that "most people think the Echo is junk", referring to his peers, where the older Civics are the car of choice. Seems clear to me that the reason for disapproval is the looks and the tallness. Even the newer Civics are less desirable amongst the younger set due to that tallness. And when I refer to the younger set, I am talking about a group who is into performance and performance-looking. I am sure there are lots of other young people, in other areas of the country, who have different priorities.
....(Thanks for the further info on your tires, kaz6, makes sense.)

mltomek · April 2002

I RECENTLY TRADED IN MY 2000 ECHO FOR A 2001 RAV-4. I LIKED THE RAV-4---VERY NICE VEHICLE, SOLID,DEPENDABLE,PLOWED THRU THE DEEP SOUTH DAKOTA SNOW DRIFTS---BUTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT, I MISSED THE ECHO SO MUCH I TRADED IT BACK IT FOR A 2002 ECHO MANUAL(I MISSED DRIVING A MANUAL-KEEPS MY HANDS BUSY). I LOST ABOUT 2K ON THE DEAL---BUT NOW I KNOW I WILL DRIVE THE ECHO FOR MANY YEARS, UNLESS THE BRING THE TOYOTA SPORTIV OVER TO THE U.S. MY 2002 IS MANUAL WINDOWS(I LIKE THAT), POWER DOOR LOCKS(CHEESY),A/C,PWR STEERING,PKG 1 AND 2. INDIGO BLUE--I FORGET THE COLOR NAME---BUT DEF NOT THAT BORING SEAFOAM BLUE. WHAT A GREAT CAR----I LOVE LISTENING TO THE CAR'S ENGINE OR WHEN I SHIFT. THIS IS A AWESOME LIL' CAR AND I HAVE HAD A FEW NICE,MUCH MORE EXPENSIVE CARS BUT THE ECHO IS JUST MY STYLE. IF THEY QUIT MAKING THE ECHO---WILL PARTS BE HARD TO COME BY?? AND WHAT ABOUT THIS TOYOTA ENGINE SLUDGE LAWSUIT?? DOES IT AFFECT THE ECHO AT ALL?? I ONLU USE CASTROL 5W30 FULL SYNTHETIC OIL EVERY 5K. I JUST NEED A NAME FOR MY ECHO NOW. MY FIRST ALL PEARL WHITE 2000 ECHO WAS MISS MINNIE(AFTER MINNIE PEARL). I THINK THIS ECHO IS MORE A BOY. I JUST BOUGHT CAMOFLAUGE SEAT COVERS FOR HIM!!! I LOVE THIS BOARD! AND I LOVE SEEING FELLOW ECHO DRIVERS---I ALWAYS TOOT N WAVE---FEW N FAR BETWEEN---I LIKE THAT!!

MIKE

cbie · April 2002

Fujimi model FUJ18624 is closest to the American-named ECHO. By the way, my silver ECHO is affectionately named "pokie."

aeroterremer · April 2002

I'll definitely purchase one of the scale models from the website you provided. I'm very excited and happy to finally have a model of my Echo. When I was younger, back in the early '60s, I enjoyed building AMT models. Only wish I had kept them!

lynnann1 · April 2002

Thanks for explaining the TARDIS also the letters stand for Time And Relative Dimensions In Space.

cbie · April 2002

Here is a link to the scale model kit available from HobbyLink Japan.

http://www.hlj.com/cgi-local/hljpage.cgi?FUJ18624

The model FUJ03482 is also a good model. However, the 82 comes with all black body and interior. Unless you have or want an all black model, a lot of painting and customizing is involved. I recommend model FUJ18624 for ECHO enthusiasts.

majorthomecho · April 2002

I did not say that the Echo really needed more horsepower. I was saying perhaps the Echo would sell better among the younger set if it had more horsepower. Pick up any tuning mag and what do you see discussed most? How to get more power.

Welcome Mike, but could you not post in all upper case. It made your posting hard to read. Regarding engine sludge, there is a thread in either news and views or maintenance that is Toyota specific and a Toyota rep answers questions through the board. You might pose your question about the Echo there.

Got to disagree with you about the seafoam blue being a boring color. I think it is a very snazzy color. Major Tom is black sand pearl, but if my roommate gets an Echo, she wants the seafoam blue and I agree with her choice.

mpgman · April 2002

You were gone for so long I half expected you to come back as Lieutenant Colonel ThomEcho! Welcome back!

majorthomecho · April 2002

I have been gone because I got hooked on a darn game and then I started a new job where I have ended up working twelve hour plus days. Thanks for the welcome back.

kaz6 · April 2002

I finally figured out the best psi for my new tires (205/50/15): 29 front and 28 rear. The max psi is 35 and even when I had it at 33/32 I was getting unbelievable mileage! 40-45mpg would be easy at that psi but the ride would be very rough. The CD player is very sensitive to heat these days...the manual says to run a/c for a bit before using the CD player on hot days. I think I'm going to look into installing a CD changer with better shock protection soon.

babyboomer · April 2002

Toyota Motor Sales Vice President Irv Miller said "Echo was a product ... that was successful in lowering the average age of our owner. The Celica and MR2 was an extension of that. The Matrix is a natural next step to reach out again to lower the age."

Seems that the corporate strategy is to sell to the youngest buyer possible to create product loyalty, a lifetime of buying Toyota. The Matrix is called a crossover utility vehicle that contains "the style and performance of a sports car, the functionality of a sport-utility vehicle, and the affordability of a subcompact sedan." Toyota hopes to sell about 70,000 Matrix in 2002.

I thought that the Matrix was in answer to the PT Cruiser. Will Matrix's possible success signal the end of Echo?

kaz6 · April 2002

The player is out of commission now. I remember someone posting last year their experience with having the dealer replace theirs so I'll wait until I have the 30k service done. In the interim I bought a car-ready walkman cd player w/ remote. It works well and the drawer under the passenger seat is a great place to keep it! Sound is about the same as OEM.

jeprox · April 2002

anyone know if echo will be around for 2003 and if they will change in looks?

thanks

peacejbm · April 2002

I purchased my ECHO on Dec. 12, 2001 and it now has only 1600 miles on it. The little maintenance booklet says to get the oil changed at four months or 4,000 miles. I am at the 4 1/2 month point, way below the miles they indicate yet the service dept at the dealer says to wait until I have had it for 6 months for the first oil change. Thoughts or suggestions?

jeprox · April 2002

my opinion is that it wont hurt to wait another 2months.
if you want to be safe, it wont hurt either to change the oil/filter now, even though you're way below 4000 miles. oil and filter are both cheap so it's not a big deal if you change it often.

vocus · April 2002

How do you only have 1600 miles since December? I bought a new car on 11/3/01, and have 14K miles almost on it already. I commute ~70 miles a day though.

pulgo · April 2002

Just returned from a trip to Texas (starting point was Vancouver, Canada) of almost 8000 miles. Average mileage was 42, not bad for speeds up to 80 and using the AC a lot. Not one problem so far with the car. Mileage stands now at 38000.

Only costs so far (other than fuel): 7 oil changes @ $ 20 each (synthetic oil only), 1 transmission drain and refill @ $38, one coolant drain and refill @ $ 35, new spark plugs @ $ 8 (Bosch Platinum).

Only complaint: Toyota floormat (driver side) is already worn through and the carpet beside the accelerator pedal has a hole (probably my size 13 feet :-))

jeprox · April 2002

wow!! from vancouver to texas!
how long did it take you and how many stops in-between?

kaz6 · April 2002

Have you noticed any difference in performance/gas mileage with platinum plugs?

Toyota Echo

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