Toyota Echo

kneisl1 · May 2002

I doubt a larger filter will fit the location. Almost all cars use these small filters nowadays. Just change your oil every 4 months and youll be fine.
My wife bought a Saturn for our son to learn to drive on. I know what you mean about getting in and out of it! Makes me apprciate the ECHO all the more. But to get in it I open the door, face away from the seat and sit down and swing my legs into the car. Car is ok but not as good as ECHO.

wrgraham · May 2002

I parked next to a new white Corolla today, lined up the front doors just about even. When I got out and started comparing my Echo, it was clear how much similarity there is. The Corolla was a little longer on both ends, and it was a bit lower than my Echo, but not much. Looked from the rear and the sides, and there is just not that much difference. Seems to me that the Echo was a push (in styling) that was more than the marketplace wanted. So you scale it back a bit, but stay with the same ideas. And the 14inch wheels on the Echo came right as the market was going to larger and larger wheels, so that wasn't good timing. I guess the net effect is that I appreciate my Echo even more.

vocus · May 2002

I have actually mistaken a 2003 Corolla for an Echo at least one time when passing it quickly (it was parked). I think they are pretty neat looking. As far as the Echo's wheels, they could have always offered bigger ones, but decided not to. I think the Echo handles pretty well, or at least the rental I had did.

pulgo · May 2002

The larger oil filter fits perfectly. In my case 4 months is about 11K miles, a bit too much in my case to trust such a small filter. I think I will add an extra remote Amsoil filter (at least 4 times more volume than the standard filter), increase the amount of oil by about a quart and stick with 15K miles oil change intervals (and use only synthetic oil). I know, I will spend more money than with regular intervals and dino (mineral) oil. I'm not doing it for the savings but for the protection of the engine. The plan is to keep the car for at least 300k miles and I don't want to have to replace the engine before that. These Toyota engines would probably reach that mileage on regular oil anyway but I'd like to think that with synthetic oil chances are much higher that I will get tired of the car long before the engine fails.

micweb · May 2002

Make sure there is ground clearance if you use a larger oil filter. The Dodge Neon, when it was introduced, had a larger filter than it does today, but it hung down a little from the chassis and some drivers sheared off the top of their filter going over bumps etc. Net result, total oil loss! Chrysler rectified the problem by going to a shorter filter, so the lower chassis protected the filter top.

On the other hand, the Focus ZETEC engine can take either a large or small filter. The small filter is the same as on their 8 valve, sohc engine that fits in the focus. The owner's manual for the ZX3 only showed the smaller filter, but the filter manual at WalMart showed both filters - either were ok with the ZETEC engine.

If you find out that there is an alternative larger filter for the Echo, let me know. The current filter looks better suited to a 1.1 liter motor. But, a lot of cars must be using it, or WalMart wouldn't have it on the shelf. (I just checked a manual and it is the same filter spec'd for the Corolla...,)

pulgo · May 2002

Even the 4 cylinder Camry uses the same filter. I think the only good option is to either use a filter relocation kit or an additional filter installed somewhere else in the engine bay.

lynnann1 · May 2002

You guys are going to think I'm being silly, but I miss my Echo. She's in the body shop for repairs. We dropped her off on Monday and they found additional damage (I was rear-ended by a Dodge Dakota) and I won't get her back until sometime next week.

The rental company gave me a Saturn SL2. I've just finally gotten used to looking in the right place for the instrument panel, but I'm still not used to sitting so low.

vocus · May 2002

The Saturns do have a very low seating position. The interior design is almost cryptic, because it's so small and dark inside. I am 6'3, and can't even fit into one of those cars. The Echo is miles better.

aeroterremer · May 2002

Check Out Piroppy's Website at http://planet.gaiax.com/home/someday/main/

Very cute!

blue_echo · May 2002

A Lincoln Continental, backing out of a driveway dented my car door, really buckled it. So for a week I've been driving a Pontiac Grand Prix. I think the rental guy thought I'd be happy with the free upgrade since that's all they had, but I can't wait to get my Echo back! I feel like I'm sitting at the bottom of a well trying to see out the top to drive. It has pretty good pickup but it's so big and dark... and smells like cigarettes. Yuk!

mltomek · May 2002

i just got a 2002 echo---i noticed the cd player would skip while driving when i first got the car----then i lowered the psi to 32 from 45!! i guess the dealer inflates them for a better ride. the cd player has worked nearly perfect since then---HOWEVER on occasion it will still skip. my 2001 rav4 NEVER did this. any suggestions?? i know it is NOT THE CD's----they all are clean and never did it in the rav-4. should i have the dealer look at it or is this common in a economy car versus the 24k rav4?? any suggestions would be appreciated!! i love the lil' echo--TOTAL pleasure!!

p.s. i keep reading the posts on here about oil and intervals. i plan on doing 5000 mile changes with castrol 5w-30 FULL synthetic oil. How does this sound??

mike

wrgraham · May 2002

I don't know why the problem with the CD. I have a unit that functions flawlessly. So nice.

lynnann1 · May 2002

The rental I'm driving is a Saturn SL2, but I, too, feel like I'm sitting at the bottom of a well!! I can't wait to get my Echo back either! I don't know when that will happen.... hope it's soon...

sigh

(

BTW I've never had problems with my CD player either.

micweb · May 2002

Your experience with overinflated tires from the dealer echos (!) my own experience. I asked the salesman if tire pressures were checked at delivery, and he told me they were (I couldn't double check them at that time because the tires had been warmed up on a test drive). He added that the tires come off the delivery trucks overinflated to 40 psi to help keep the cars firmly mounted during shipment. Just to be safe, since I was going to hop on the interstate, did a "cold check" (before driving) the next morning and discovered one tire was way overinflated to 40 and the others were from 2-4 pounds over. I adjusted them all down to the required 32 psi. FYI, maximum permitted tire pressure on the Michelin MXV4 tires that came on the car is supposed to be 35 psi....

(If the variation had been consistent and minor, I would have attributed it to minor gauge variations, but in this case it was significant and inconsistent, and one wheel had apparently been overlooked altogether.)

So it pays to doublecheck...especially with something as important as tires.

kaz6 · May 2002

My CD player has become unusable. It used to skip occassionally then it would not want to play when I had the heater working during the winter. Now it just plays for a bit then stops saying "Error 1" which according to the manual is a dirty cd. I thought it might have been due to my new tires being too stiff but the cd player does this even while the car is parked!
There was another post about problems with the cd player and I will have it checked when I have the 30k service done next month.
In the mean time I have been using a 'Walkman CD' with a car kit. The factory system has excellent sound so I'm anxious to get it fixed.

vocus · May 2002

Have you tried cleaning the player itself? Maybe the lens is dirty or something. Follow the owner's manual instructions (if any) on cleaning though, as not to void the radio's warranty.

kneisl1 · May 2002

My CD player rarely if ever skips, even over fairly bumpy roads. Take the dealer out for a demo and ask to compare to another ECHO.
If youre going to drive 30k miles a year then changing with synthetic oil twice a year makes sence, although you might have a warranty issue there. I find the main thing synth does is give you good starting in cold weather. Not sure Id want to change my oil once a month, but its a good idea to get the old stuff out of there. Also, you will leak/burn more synth because its thinnner when the engine gets older. Probably with todays oils you can go much farther than the mansufacturers recommend.

mltomek · May 2002

you guys really are pretty awesome!! thanks for the response so quickly. this is kinda nice that we can all help out each other. my brother is looking at a 2000 4 dr red echo auto w/ manual windows n locks, has a/c, manual outside adjusting mirrors--and it appears aftermarket cruise control. is 9995.00 a good deal?? is the first yr 2000 as good as the 2001 and 2002's? i know lil has changed---but i am talking bugs. i don't think i like the aftermarket cruise. does this sound like a good deal??

mltomek · May 2002

it has 21k's on it---perfect interior n exterior

mdrew · May 2002

mltomek,
From my own experience and most of what I've read on here, the 2000 Echos have had very few problems; my 4dr auto/ac has had zero trouble and Sunday's my 2 year anniversary. (The cd player has also been flawless with lots of use; maybe skipped once or twice on a bump.) Don't know much about used car prices; you might check Edmunds'"True Market Value" section, but I have no idea how accurate that is either.

kaz6 · May 2002

I have cleaned the lense on more than one occassion. I made sure the cd going in doesn't have any scratches or dirt. It goes something like this:
After playing flawlessly, the cd player will abruptly stop and the 'Error 1' message comes on. The disc then ejects itself. This happens while the car is parked as well as in motion.
After playing for a while when the heater is on, the cd player does the same thing as mentioned above.
The funny thing is that the player never really skipped at all and I love the sound quality considering it's a factory unit.
I remember someone posting that they had to leave the unit with the dealer to have it sent in for inspection. I don't know if I can survive for an extended period of time without it! I will most likely replace the unit eventually with an aftermarket cd changer/mp3/cassette system.

wrgraham · May 2002

Mltomek,
...My opinion is that the price should come down a bit from 9995. I also tend to think that the red color is less generally saleable - hence the seller has a harder task. 21K is not a lot of miles, and I think the car should be excellent, if you dont find anything to the contrary. But I would suggest you get the price down to about 9000 flat. Else keep looking.

cpo4 · May 2002

could anyone tell me if they have herd of any changes in the 2003 echo . drove a 2002 yesterday and loved it .

echorick · May 2002

I bought 2000 ECHO 2 door 5 speed with AC and nothing else last May. It had 7700 miles on it. I got it from a dealer in Los Angeles area as a Toyota Certified Used Car with a power train warranty to 100,000 miles or 6 years from first sale. I paid $8,800. It was a hard bargaining, but it can be done. Tell your brother to be willing to walk away.

I have put 16,000 miles on the car and I love it.

mdrew · May 2002

Well, 4dr vs. 2dr./Auto. vs. manual is worth another $1,000 or so on the Echo price, so the $9,900 vs. $8,800 for those 2000 cars is pretty comparable, not to mention the cruise control. Of course, it's good to get the best price you can.

rep1158 · May 2002

i have a 2001 echo automatic. the owners manual does say you should not tow anything. I want to tow a 10 foot fishing boat on a light trailer. Does anyone know if thats possible? or should i stick to what the owners manual says/
rick

pulgo · May 2002

In Germany the Yaris TS, which is essentially the same car as the Echo in North America but without a trunk, is allowed to tow 2000 pounds (900 Kg) at a maximum 12% road inclination. This is for the car with the manual transmission.
If you want to use this car for towing I would do it after the warranty is over, strongly consider the installation of a transmission cooler and change the transmission fluid every 20 K miles.

echorick · May 2002

I agree the ECHO mltomek asked about is worth more than my 2000 ECHO. However, I paid $8,800 in May of 2001 and he was asking about 2000 ECHO price this May, a year later. I do not think the price mentioned is bad, just that with some hard bargaining I believe he should be able to do better. In any case , I am glad he is enjoying his ECHO and I hope his brother does a deal that he will be satisfied with.

kneisl1 · May 2002

If you can find a hitch that fits the ECHO it should not be a problem 1)as long as you keep the load light 2) the trailer is balanced ie it wont fishtail easily.
Generally it isnt recommended to tow with a FWD vehicle because the handling qualities of these vehicles are different from RWD. It can get really screwy. But Ive towed with (old) Subarus and the VW Fox so it can be done. Just take it easy. (but you might void the warranty!)

vocus · May 2002

If towing is not recommended in the owner's manual, and you do it and damage something, be prepared to pay the bill because the warranty will be void.

majorthomecho · May 2002

How many people read about the Scion Ist that Toyota sells in Japan? Has a center gauge cluster with lots of storage bins. Sure sounds like an Echo to me. Toyota says they have no plans to export the Ist to the United States.

pat · May 2002

Folks, please remember that you can only use the "img src" tags to display a picture that you own or that you host your own website. Otherwise, the Town Hall runs afoul of copyright laws.

You are always welcome to post a link to a picture on another website (as long as there is no contrary term of service with that website, of course).

Sorry, I had to remove a post for these reasons.

Pat
Sedans Host

mltomek · May 2002

WHAT EXACTLY IS THE PURPOSE OF A HOST ON EDMUNDS.COM??? I HAVE LOOKED AT OTHER BOARDS AT EDMUNDS AND THEY SEEM TO BE PRETTY UPTIGHT HERE ABOUT ALMOST AYTHING---FOR EXAMPLE, A FEW PEOPLE WERE DISCUSSING PRO'S AND CON'S OF BOTH THE ECHO AND FOCUS IN THE FOCUS ROOM(SOME HAD FOCUS'S AND SOME HAD ECHO'S) AND WERE TOLD BY THE HOST TO TAKE EACH CAR TO A SEPARATE ROOM, EVEN THOUGH MOST WERE EXCHANGING FRIENDLY MESSAGES. IS THIS CHINA?? OH MY GOSH--THE RULES ARE TOUGHER THAN SECURITY AT A ALL NIGHT GOLDEN GIRLS PUBLIC SHOWING!! LOL---JUST WONDERING WHAT EXACTLY THE "RULES" ARE AND GOSH FORBID I BREAK ONE.

P.S. WE PICK UP MY BRO'S LIL ECHO TOMORROW!!!! IT IS HIS 1ST CAR, A 2000 AND I HAVE A 2002. I GOT HIM A FEW STARTER ITEMS----HE IS AS COMFY IN HIS MASCULINITY AS ME AND THINKS THE ECHO IS "ADORABLE"...HIS WORDS LOL!!

8u6hfd · May 2002

Saturn Ion dash.

http://www.canadiandriver.com/previews/03ion.htm

geegee1958 · May 2002

-the Echo got criticized for this feature, but when other cars do it.....no comment in the review at all. Oh well!

pat · May 2002

mltomek - there is a link on the left side of this page to "Member Agreement" - it's under Community Tools. That's where all the "rules" are. :-)

You agreed to abide by that document when you joined the Town Hall. Drop me an email if you have any other questions.

8u6hfd - thanks - sorry I had to do that.

Pat
Sedans Host

micweb · May 2002

I tried to find a Chilton or Haynes on the Echo, but couldn't, and would like to know more about the car "under the hood." In particular, how to change the air filter (looks like you have to detach two hose clamps) and plugs, whether it has a transmission oil cooler etc.

We have had high winds in the Bay Area (San Francisco) the last few days and the car is relatively stable - it "jiggles" but doesn't wander. You can feel the wind, but don't feel like you are going to be blown out of line. It calls for more attentiveness on the steering wheel, that's all. (When I drove back from LA, there was only wind at the beginning so I didn't experience any fatigue from the drive.)

micweb · May 2002

I usually buy black seats to avoid stains from dropped food and miscellaneous dirt. This is not an option with the Echo, which only comes in light colored interiors.

Should I treat the seats with any stain repellent? I am reluctant to do so if the stain repellent is going to stain the seats or clothing, or if it is going to make the cabin air "toxic." (I.e., outgas.) I think some stuff from 3M (Scotchguard?) is still available at WalMart.

micweb · May 2002

I notice the factory mat on the driver side is already showing stain and wear under the accelerator "heel" area. Any suggestions? Has anyone tried cocoa mats (www.cocomats.com) or black rubber mats (from WalMart etc., generic aftermarket)?

micweb · May 2002

The upper dash and window moldings (where you can rest your arm) are made of "hard touch" plastic instead of "soft touch" or "padded vinyl" like on most other cars. I like the look, but don't know if any treatment is required or advisable. Armor All is traditionally one treatment used to minimize cracking and give a "richer" appearance (it has matte or gloss versions out now). But once you put it on, it isn't coming off.

Has anybody tried any "vinyl" treatments like Armor All etc? How did you like the results?

micweb · May 2002

First I get a comfortable leg position, because reclining the seat isn't going to help. By comfortable, I mean I have good control over the brake and gas pedals and my driving (right) leg isn't too cramped up. I don't like to be at a distance and have to bend my foot and use my forefoot to use the gas pedal. Usually I can click in or out one click and still be in the "zone."

Working out of the "zone," I adjust seat angle to have a comfortable "reach" to the steering wheel. On my Echo, this means various degrees of "upgrightness" because short of clicking the seat forward to its closest tolerable position, and then almost straightening up the seat back, I have to hold my arms out straight, racing style, to reach the wheel.

Is this just a very "upright" car (the seat, I mean) or am I missing something? I did discover the steering wheel tilt adjustment, so I have already optimized that (there isn't any "telescoping" adjustment).

8u6hfd · May 2002

Spend some money on the Toyota repair manuals from the dealerships. Every now and then, you'll find a good offer on eBay.

I personally like 3M Vinyl/Leather Cleaner/Protectant location.

pulgo · May 2002

After 20K miles I had worn through the factory floor mat in the heel area and now I just use a rubber mat purchased at WAL MART. It is not pretty but what else can I do?
Furthermore, the carpet beside (to the right) the accelerator is also worn trough. Solution: I bought some velcro strips and attached a piece of similar colored carpet to the damaged area. If it wears trough I'll replace it again with a new patch.

geegee1958 · May 2002

got them in June 2000, the same day I picked the car up. They were $19.99 and are dark gray, almost black (charcoal gray?) and are wearing just fine. They get a little pilly (clumps or snags) which I just trim with a scissor, and wait a few months, and then clean them up again. The bottom of the mats are plastic/rubbery and have raised dots, which keep them firmly in place. I have a 2 door Echo, and rarely have passengers in the back seats, so when the front mats get too yucky, I will rotate them with the rear ones, but after 2 yrs, so far, so good.

kaz6 · May 2002

Yes, the Echo has a very upright position. It's funny how a lot of people recline the seatback as soon as they get into the front passenger seat. You will also find that the seat may feel strange for the first 1k miles as I felt the seat cushion was not shaped right. Once acclimated the seats are some of the most comfortable I've been in! I can go 4 hours with no squirm or discomfort. The seat padding material is very high quality and does not lose its shape.
As far as stains and such, I use an upholstery cleaner by Turtle Wax that does the job fine. It got out dried coffee stain from the passenger seat with no fuss.
The floor mats in front are covered by SUV grade rubber ones. I rarely carry people in back so I just have the factory ones back there.

slugline · May 2002

micweb: I looked for a non-Toyota service manual for the ECHO earlier this year and came up empty. I posted about the air filter change awhile back; I hope this helps:

slugline Feb 10, 2002 11:18pm

Also, I am in agreement with kaz6 on the seating position. I do not drive an ECHO on a daily basis, but getting behind the wheel requires no significant adjustment because my daily driver is a CR-V, the design of which also best accomodates an upright driving position. Many CR-V reviews gripe about buslike steering angles as well.

geegee1958: Edmunds has mentioned center-mounted pods before:

http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/roadtests/roadtest/47564/article.html

Apparently, it's a cost-cutting move in subcompact car design, but if you do it in a $128K BMW roadster, it's OK. <GRIN>

lynnann1 · May 2002

The center instrument cluster on the Saturn ION looks like an ECHO clone -- also names of both cars are in all caps.

kaz6 · May 2002

Does anyone know if there are aftermarket kits for the instrument pod? They have 3 different setups in europe for the Yaris...wish we could have one that is like the ION's!

micweb · May 2002

I jumped to your old email. Great pic. The original filter does look "pleat deficient." I think I will change to a Purolator at 10,000 miles. I was thinking about a K&N but would rather use a tried and true paper filter, just change it more frequently for good breathing.

micweb · May 2002

This is an interesting webpage, from the Purolator page.

http://www.pureoil.com/TEMP_old_site/air.htm

Purolator says that for each gallon of gas burned, typically 9,000 to 10,000 gallons of air have to go throught the air filter!

Therefore Purolator recommends replacement every 7,500 miles.

I don't think dire things will happen to an engine with 30,000 mile AIR filter changes, but I have performance concerns. I believe Toyota recommends 30,000 miles, except 15,000 miles in "severe" conditions. I want maximum performance out of my little 1.5 vvt-i engine - it is capable of it - so an air filter change more frequently is probably a cheap performance maintainer.

I think I will go with 10,000 mile air filter changes. On a "do it yourself" basis this is cheap and easy - not like changing spark plugs, anyway.

If anyone has experience with different brands, and pricings, let me know. Autozone wants $14.95 (!) for an "STP" air filter. WalMart doesn't carry Echo air filters from Fram.

Toyota Echo

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