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Toyota Echo

18283858788115

Comments

  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    Next silly question! 22k miles now and the car is about 3 1/2 years old. The only problem so far is I THINK the illiminating light over the idiot light cluster is burnt out. I havnt had time to check it out. Otherwise no problems the car runs like it did the day I bought it. Im averaging 36-38 mpg winter 40-43 mpg summer and I drive the car 6.5 miles to work in city traffic and that is about 75% of the mileage on the car. I never exceed 45 mph driving to work, but on long trips it cruises at 80 just fine. The Potenza tires are still good. Incidently i just read an article about some 6 series BMW that cost $75k and it had Potenza tires on it according to the article at least! I got them lifetime balanced at Sears and they are spin balanced every year on the cars birthday. I plan to remove one of the front tires and inspect the brake pad thickness soon. The clutch is great and I plan to fix it so you dont have to depress the clutch to start the engine. Engine is fine all I have done is change the oil three times a year. I use Fram filters and whatever oil is on sale, dino only 5W-30. I plan to change the coolant, manual transmission oil, and brake fluid next time this year when the car will have about 28k on it. Also plan then to bleed out the hydralic clutch at the clutch cylindar. The battery is origional and I check the water in it every time I change the oil. It will be four years old in November and in my experience thats nearly the life of new car batteries. I will replace it with a Diehard when it goes. The exhaust is origional I understand it is a stainless steel exhaust (is that so?). The SS exhaust system on my wifes 93 Saturn is still on the car at 114k miles. When the exhaust does go Toyota offers a lifetime warranty if they install the exhaust system so thats where Ill get it. DO NOT GO TO MIDAS for this they are a total ripoff. It cost $350 to change my wifes 92 Accord wagons muffler there a few years ago and it was gone in a year and they only would give us $15 towards the new one. Dealer price for the same muffler? $180. The body is fine except for where I backed it into a pole at about 2 mph and skimmed the right rear cracking the taillight. ($85 for the lense at the dealer...not bad)
       I do NOT plan to allow the dealer to service the car. They overcharge way too much for routine maintenance. Its costs me about $7 for an oil change and I read the owners manual and inspect everything myself. When the rear brakes go Toyota will do that as well as the exhaust system and shock struts. I plan to check the valve clearances myself at 60k miles. About five and a half years from now by my count. I use Nu Car Finish on the hood, roof and trunk every spring and fall.
       Basically the car drives like new and there have been no problems.
  • wrgrahamwrgraham Member Posts: 112
    I am surprised at how little you use your car, especially being so knowledgeable as you are. At 103K miles now we are still on original battery, muffler, clutch and brakes. Changed tires twice. Four years and one month since purchase.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    I also ride a motorcycle 12 months of the year and dont have to go far to work so I guess thats why. I think it helps your car when you drive it a lot as you do to get maximum life from the components. 103k on a set of brakes is great! Which you wouldnt get unless you are a very careful driver.
  • wrgrahamwrgraham Member Posts: 112
    I had a stretch of about 3 years where my motorcycle was my main transportation. I think it helped to make me a better driver, in two ways that come to mind. First, you get so watchful of the other people on the road, and once that is a habit you dont lose it. Second, motorcycles are so fast as compared to cars that you feel stupid trying to accelerate quickly in a car. So your car driving becomes your mellow side. And maybe you lose some but not all of that once you are not with motorcycles any more.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    I am a complete milkquetoast driving my ECHO. Actually a complete milkquetoast on the bikes too!
  • bpraticobpratico Member Posts: 23
    I called Toyota U.S.A. to ask them to bring the Echo hatchback to the U.S. for 2005. They thanked me and asked me to send an email via the Toyota web site - which I did.

    I encourage everyone that wants to see the Echo hatchback come to the U.S. to do likewise. Email link is under: Search/Help - FAQs - Email Toyota.
  • brad3brad3 Member Posts: 8
    if toyota, brought the hatchback to the states, they would triple the sales of the echo!! i'm going on the website to ask for the hatch here!!!
  • fuelmiserfuelmiser Member Posts: 26
    prefer. I have looked into the process of importing one, and it is, of course, much more inconvenient than going to my local dealer here in Maryland. But I expect to do this sometime this summer unless, of course, Toyota US decides to offer them. What is that email address to write to?
  • rep5858rep5858 Member Posts: 45
    I was wondering if anyone knows a seat that will match the bolts of the 2001 echo. I need a front driver's side seat for my 2001 echo. With one trim line I will need a seat from another car Corolla? would that match? please help.
    rick
  • stevengordonstevengordon Member Posts: 130
    How do these two compare and differ? Is the xA basically an Echo hatchback that happens to weigh a little bit more but be a few inches shorter?
  • bpraticobpratico Member Posts: 23
    There is no email address (undoubtedly to prevent spammers.) You have to send it from the Toyota web site. On the Toyota web site, the Email feeback form is under: Search/Help - FAQs - Email Toyota
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    I note that the Scion line has racked up the MOST defects per vehicle in a new car of ANY manufacturer which is astonishing. I guess thats the main difference between ECHO and Scion.
  • stevengordonstevengordon Member Posts: 130
    I agree, kneisl1. It surprised me, too. It made buying a Hyundai rather enticing. I wish the Elantra 5-door wasn't in the higher trim line with leather.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    Hyundai continues to remain in the "worst" catagory in terms of long term reliability. That defect survey only includes new vehicles. The ECHO is still the best small car you can buy.
  • odmanodman Member Posts: 309
    It is almost impossible to take a brand new vehicle across the border, but used cars are a completely different story. There are lots of threads in here on how to do it. "Used" Echo hatches are going for CAN$16,000 (less than US$12,000 at current rates) with less than 15,000 miles on the clock.
  • odmanodman Member Posts: 309
    For the first quarter of 2004, Toyota sold 6,600 Echos, up almost 30% over 2003 (Toyota as a whole is down 2% in its car sales in Canada).

    The Echo is the 5th best selling car in Canada (excluding light trucks), and sells almost as many as the Corolla does. Although the sales figures I've seen aren't broken out by bodystyle, I'm sure that it's remarkable sales performance is due to the hatch. They are all over the place and people love them. A woman in my office with a blue hatch says that other Echo drivers (esp. the blue ones) give an "Echo wave" everytime they drive past one another!
  • stevengordonstevengordon Member Posts: 130
    Isn't the long-term reliability of the currently engineered Hyundai models is yet to be determined? The current edition of the Elantra is too new to have been counted in any long-term survey...or so I would guess.

    The differences between the ECHO hatchback and the Scion xA seem to be that the ECHO has more front and rear shoulder room, but is less roomy with regard to leg and hip room. (I base that on the last toyota.edumunds model comparison webpage I accessed from Toyota's ECHO page.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    I have looked at the Hyundai and I am not impressed with the build quality, compared to the ECHO. Its true the new ones arent old ones yet. But until I see Hyundais selling for 2/3of new price when a couple of years old Ill remain skeptical.
  • stevengordonstevengordon Member Posts: 130
    The ECHO does appear to have clinched the top spot, at least according to the last Consumer Reports annual car issue I read.

    Besides, it has a more utilitarian approach to its design. I like the double-glove box, the tray under the seat, and all the cubby holes.
  • stevengordonstevengordon Member Posts: 130
    Just reviewed a review of the ECHO hatches in Canadian Driver's website. Seems that the hatch has seating positions for two in the backseat. That wouldn't work for me.

    Funny that I can't find a hatchback or tall wagon that seats 5, is 5-star in the crash ratings, gets 30+ MPG in the city, and isn't styled like something from a sci-fi movie. Doesn't Honda or Toyota recognize a purely utilitarian need for an economical hatchback/wagon?
  • bpraticobpratico Member Posts: 23
    Check out the Honda Jazz/Fir which Honda is reportedly bringing to the U.S. for 2005.
  • stevengordonstevengordon Member Posts: 130
    To compete with the ECHO and Scion offerings? I thought I'd read that Honda was delaying the Jazz/Fit for another model year. I could be wrong, though.
  • bpraticobpratico Member Posts: 23
    "Honda will bring a version of its micro-compact Fit to the United States as early as this year, according to Japan's Nihon Keizai business daily."

    http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=6806
  • bpraticobpratico Member Posts: 23
    Nissan has also announced it will bring the Nissan "Cube" to the U.S. for 2005 as its entry-level vehicle. This will directly compete with the Echo hatchback (also Sion models) and the Honda Jazz. Most intriguing is the the fact that the Cube offers 4WD.

    http://www.cardesignnews.com/news/2002/021012tokyo-nissan/
  • stevengordonstevengordon Member Posts: 130
    ...this onslaught of similarly-sized pretenders to the crown?

    I really wish Honda or Toyota could make a hatchback at the size of the Civic or Corolla, that was utilitarian, lacked all of the brushed chrome accents and irridescent lighting. Just make it a practical vehicle, an "SUV for the rest of us."

    BTW: thanks for the links for the Cube and Jazz/Fit.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    I really wish Honda or Toyota could make a hatchback at the size of the Civic or Corolla,...

    How about the base Matrix? Tons of space, good passenger room, Toyota quality.
  • stevengordonstevengordon Member Posts: 130
    I'm dubious about the thinning side windows from front to back. Not sure if my kids would find it claustrophobic. And the glitzy gauges bug me...but I can get over it.

    I thought the Matrix had a (comparatively) weak engine...

    Guess I'll have to try it out with the family.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    Ive driven a Matrix and it drives like a truck. I wasnt impressed with the power availible from the engine either. The daskboard can only be described as juvenile. REALLY tacky. The Prius has a very nice high quality yet understated dash and interior. The new ECHOs have all kinds of stuff going on on the exterior like bulges and badges like they were trying to make it more sophisticated looking. Making a purse out of a sows ear is the expression. I just finished up my first bottle of Nu Finish car wax on the ECHO after nearlt three and a hald years. Its so small it only takes about 15 minutes to wax it too.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    i just read on the NYC Online that the average car sold in the us (including trucks) weighs more than 4000 pounds! Man are we going in the wrong direction.
  • fuelmiserfuelmiser Member Posts: 26
    odman (#4322) I am curious about this. I am planning to go up the the Niagara area and buy an Echo hatchback in Canada and bring it back. I have looked into the process and it does not seem to be so difficult. Did I miss something?
  • odmanodman Member Posts: 309
    I haven't looked into it carefully yet so I can't really advise you on importing into the States, but others have (take a look at the Echo Canadian Model thread or do a general search in the Echo section or in Edmunds more generally). If you buy used it will be a lot easier. On the www.trader.ca website I saw a blue Echo HB model with a 5-speed for CAN$12,000 -- that's $8k or so in real US dollars!

    In border towns there are brokers who will take care of importing and making the changes necessary to make the cars comply with US standards. There aren't many to worry about since Canadian standards are harmonized with US standards(switching the odometer is the big one). I would call a few of those first and ask them some questions about process, fees and pitfalls. Having warranty coverage is a big one, but again, on a used car it is not the same thing as a new one. Also, although it is a hatch, it is based on common Echo components, so most US Toyota dealers can fix them. Since the Echo hatch is selling extremely well in Canada, importing hatch parts won't be a big deal either.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    I was just reading Edmunds long term test on the Prius. What do you think the numbers were for their overall mileage after 5000 miles? 50 mpg? 60 mpg? 70 mpg? NO! That stupid car got 40.8 mpg! Have IQs dropped sharply in this country or what? Why on earth would any body BUY this car? Now that its summer my ECHO is getting at least that mileage just driving six miles to work.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Why do you continually bash the Prius, on a board devoted to the ECHO? It's not like anyone is forcing you to buy a Prius. You like the ECHO, other people like the Prius (and are getting way better than 40.8 mpg BTW)--why all the fuss?
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    The Prius is an engineering abortion. It is not cost effective. It gets 15% more mileage than my ECHO but costs 75% more. Yet people buy them so manufacturers will make them and force the rest of us to buy them also. We need to be driving fuel efficient cars. The bill for our foolishness in wasting energy and resources is on its way. Its going to be painfull when it arrives. But solutions like the Prius are not the answer.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Please name another midsized car that averages at least 40 mpg. For a car of its size, the Prius is VERY fuel efficient.

    And no one is forcing people to buy anything they don't want to buy. If they wanted to buy ECHOes, they would demand them and Toyota would make more of them. It's a free enterprise system.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    Thats the point. People arent buying a car like an ECHO nor are they demanding them. 40 years ago VW came out with the Beetle, a car that was several orders of magnitude weirder than the ECHO. There was a lot of pressure then to buy American. Yet people came to understand that this was a good, reliable, and cheap form of transportation and VW sold millions of them. Today people are brainwashed into thinking they need a car with 17 inch wheels and 300 horsepower. Just read Edmunds comments about the cars they test. Very few people are taking advantage of the ECHO, the VW Beetle of its day.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    If you're blaming Prius owners for that, I think you're pointing the finger in the wrong place. Someone who buys a $20-26,000 midsized car isn't likely to cross-shop an ECHO. Look elsewhere if you want to see where erstwhile ECHO buyers went. And blame Toyota for its out-of-the-mainstream styling of the ECHO and its lack of marketing support. Not to mention its failure to bring more than the sedan to the U.S.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    Very few people want a car like ECHO no matter what it looks like. Even if it was imported with a diesel and a hatch, there wouldnt be many more customers. I think Toyota doest spend much promoting ECHO because they have done surveys and know the numbers just arent out there. Im grateful Toyota has kept the ECHO on as long as it has. They say it will be around next year too.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    With gas way over $2 a gallon in many places, maybe next year will be the year of the ECHO.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    The scary part is the consumer just doesnt get it. Back in the 70s small cars were flying off the shelves with high gas prices. Edmunds comments about ECHO in its evaluation are probably reflective of most peoples views...ECHO is something you scrape off your shoe. Cetainly its looks havnt helped, but no one held that against the beetle. They just recognized value. I havnt seen that happen yet with ECHO.
  • stevengordonstevengordon Member Posts: 130
    I don't think they're bad. Maybe the editors do, the car reviewers, but personally, and subjectively, the last revision to the car rounded the corners and the whole thing looks good. Looks more modern and less like a beetle (the insect, not the car) compared with the Corolla.

    I wonder if sales are beginning to pick up with the ECHO now that gas prices have risen.

    I'm hoping that a 5-seat ECHO hatchback joins the fray this coming model year.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    It's not that the ECHO looks "bad"--it just doesn't have the same-old boring lines of most small cars (e.g. Civic, Corolla). Like it or not, the bland styling attracts (is less offensive?) to a broader range of buyers than unique styling like the ECHO has. One of the reasons IMO the Corolla and Civic are perennial best sellers--not to mention they are quality cars with great reputations for reliability. But then so does the ECHO.
  • fuelmiserfuelmiser Member Posts: 26
    a very practical one for a smallish car. I have a 1987 Sprint, and with the hatch open I have carried a cast iron bathtub in it! Slowly, of course.

    There is a diesel version of the Echo hatchback that is sold in Europe; called the Yaris. I think that, as is, it might not meet US air pollution standards. There ought to be some decent selection of reliable, fuel efficient, and relatively inexpensive cars available to the US consumer. There is not. The relaxation of the CAFE standards is probably as much to blame as anything for this sorry state of affairs.

    The Sprint was apparently imported by Chevrolet to help their CAFE numbers, and I have been the beneficiary of that for the past 17 years. Mileage of the ER model I have has varied from 50 to 60 miles per US gallon, and the car sold for about $6,000 in 1987.

    Here we are in 2004 and there is nothing to equal the Sprint for economy and fuel efficiency. We are spending billions to fight wars over oil, but hardly a penny for efficiency or conservation. This is progress?
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    My roomate in college had a Subaru 360 Van. It was about 1/3 the size of a VW Bus. The 360cc 2 stroke motor would have to go of course, but it was a terrificly untilitarian vehicle. It was big enough for two people up front with a smallish storage area behind. It had ten inch tires. With a two cylindar diesel it would be great. Too bad we dont have cars like that.
  • stevengordonstevengordon Member Posts: 130
    was an '88 Mercury Tracer. It was a hatchback built by Mazda in Mexico. Similar to the 323 hatchback, Mercury added some luxury items (well, manual lumbar is a luxury item for me!).

    When we needed to haul stuff, it was better than the Windstar. Pop off the headrests and lay the split rear seats flat.

    I envy the last generation of Civic hatchbacks. They were utilitarian and, I believe, got the same or better high mileage as the sedan version.

    Personally, the ECHO is the only car that's thrilled me when I test drove it. I love the storage nooks, the way that the pieces of the dashboard meet, everything (except the velcro closure for the sun visor--that was too cheap-looking for a car that approached a Civic LX in price).

    Anyway, let's hope that the ECHO flourishes enough to justify its place in the Toyota lineup.
  • rwgreenbergrwgreenberg Member Posts: 154
    Drove a Honda Scamp in Perth Australia for about 2 years in 1980. It was a little hatchback and had a 380cc engine. Did just fine with it, as long as I was careful pulling out onto highways (few and far between in Perth).

    Love my Echo too.
  • fuelmiserfuelmiser Member Posts: 26
    is the Smart. It does not have much carrying capacity, and is strictly a 2 seater. The price (around 19K) reflects its boutique status. I read that it will get about 60 miles per US gallon. Spare parts? Might be a problem unless a lot of people buy them. Reliability? I don't know.

    If the initial purchase price was about equivalent to the Echo I might buy a Smart. But the extra 7K for a smaller car with somewhat better mileage does not make sense to me.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    The transmission in my wifes 93 Saturn may be toast. Its going into the shop Thursday to be evaluated. $95. Its been a good car so we may opt to fix it. About $1500 for a used trans installed or $3000 for a rebuilt one installed. Convieceably the diagnosis might find something to fix that would be cheaper. BUT we might ditch the car for another one...and that might be a used ECHO. About $8000 for a used one I figure with 20-30000 miles. That would assume the price of used ones hasnt gone up because of the price of gas!. A third possibility is a new Ford Focus. I like the Focus because you can get one with 0 interest for 60 months and it is the highest rated car in its class by Consumer Reports. Reliability would be an issue though.
  • pulgopulgo Member Posts: 400
    $ 3000 for a rebuilt transmission sounds way too expensive for me. A local transmission shop would likely charge less than half of that for a properly rebuilt transmission, including installation.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    AAMCO says they will rebuild it for $1900.
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