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Mercedes-Benz E-Class Sedans
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M
Louis
I think that the 2004 model redesign, and the upcoming GST, redesigned G-wagon will all eventually be produced in Alabama. By that time I think there will be little to no difference in factory quality and vehicle tolerances. I would still take a 2002 ML500 or X5 over any midsize SUV competitor.
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The G wagon is built like a tank, albeit a 20 year old one. My friends who own a G wagon appreciate the solid steel construction and detail the OLD M-B is famous for. The new products, IMHO, are using M-B's reputation for quality to sell cars. But, in 20 years time will that reputation remain intact? I seriously doubt it. I envision the day when the LEXUS nameplate is the standard by which quality is measured and that day is almost here.
As for the best SUV, Lexus/Toyota wins that match easily. As a side note my friend just traded his problem ridden '00ML for a '02 Acura MDX and he can not believe how much better built the Acura is. I would much rather have a Land Cruiser then a ML or X5 in terms of quality.
My hope is that the new E re-establishes M-B as the leader in quality. My next car will be fast and reliable. The ball is in M-B's court.
muffler, fuel injector control unit, sun shade, air conditioner fan control unit. Some of the problems were intermittent and required more than one trip to the dealer.
In addition the dealer replaced cable (twice) and engine mount to curb excessive vibration in idle with little luck. Finally the dealer claimed it was normal. MB sent mechanics to do engine tests and reported it normal, but they didn't (couldn't, maybe?) do vibration test. I even wrote to MB and got the response of everything normal, case closed.
Anyone know how to pursue from here? Is there any state (CA) office or any consumer agency to report to? I always have much better luch with Toyota's and this is my first MB. I cancelled my C-class order and got back my $2000 deposit after experiencing the first few problems with my E320.
"The new products, IMHO, are using M-B's reputation for quality to sell cars. But, in 20 years time will that reputation remain intact? I seriously doubt it" - MB has a hundred-year-old history. It would not have been such had they let things slip, even for a half-car-generation worth of cars. They are already making a noticeable turn. In my opinion, the reputaion will be even better in the future, as well as possessing something that, until a little while ago, belonged exclusively to BMW.
I took some pictures that you won't see at MBUSA.com, but I can't figure out how to attach them to this message. Anyway, the trunk of the 2003 seems to be a welcome 6 to 8 inches deeper. I saw one with a ski sleeve, but I didn't see any with fold down rear seatbacks. The cars I looked at had no spare tire. They have eliminated the cup holder, not that what we have in the 2000-2002 was any good. There is a cover in the console that opens to a hole about 2 by 4 inches. Maybe Mercedes will furnish an odd-shaped cup for it. Some of the cars had a cleanable, 5-spoke wheel, but others had a wheel that would be harder to clean than the ones on my 2000 E-320. Since I was traveling to Eastern Europe as well as Germany, I couldn't rent a Mercedes. But I was impressed with the 2-liter Ford Mondeao diesel that I did drive. It had plenty of power and gave great mileage, even though I spent much time driving 90 to 100 mph. The Germans have done a great job on their diesel engines. I hope Mercedes imports the E270 CDI here.
And, I agree with you wholeheartedly. The Mondeo is quite an impressive car!
replacing. Is this normal? I would expect pad / rotor life to longer on a $50k car.
I know MB using a softer pad but to me that is not a reason for the life to be short
versus most other cars and the owner having spend at extra $600 every 25k miles
to replace.
Read you are selling your 2000 S500 for the E500 sports at 73K with distronics.
I have the 2001 S500 with distronics and ABC. It drives very well. But remember, distronics, ABC, and parktronics are worthless at the time of resale to dealers. Only body kits like "sport packages" which make the exterior look different are worth anything. So bear this in mind.
As for the E500 sports, wouldn't your S500 be a quicker 0-60mph car? Have more room, and more quiet? (I know I am a little bore with my 2001 S500 now, but....)
At 73K, you might want to wait another year for the new E55; which will have sub 5 sec 0-60mph and sport body kits and a massive 460bhp.
Paul
THanks......
It is a bit more unusal for the rotors to need replacing before 60-70k miles. Usually they only need resurfacing at the earlier intervals when the pads are replaced.
Please think objectively about the issue. Lexus/Toyota has dominated the JD Power's initial quality awards the past few years. Consumer Reports consistently rates Lexus at the top of the reliability charts. Sadly, M-B did not win even one award for a vehicle this year or last. The manufacturer that has stood for quality has paid out huge sums of money for warranty repair work. M-B's quality is in serious need of improvement if the manufacturer is going to retain its reputation as "one of the best" in the world.
Objectively, Lexus is regarded as a more reliable brand. The GS and LS430 both won awards this year from JD Powers and associates. BMW received the top two awards in the European region.
I prefer to stick with the facts and leave emotion out of the picture when discussing reliability and quality. If one decides (and that includes me) to purchase a M-B product over the Lexus or BMW that is a personal decision.
Reliability is just one factor among many which helps the buyer to decide which car to purchase.
But, for some it is the most important one.
I chose the E430 for its styling, luxury and handling characteristics. But, I knew it was fairly reliable as well. At the time I thought BMW was no match for M-B in terms of quality and long term reliability. I am not so sure of that anymore. The Lexus GS400 was and still is too weird (ugly?) for me.
As I stated earlier, M-B needs to wake up and start building the best cars in the world again.
Customer loyalty matters a great deal in the market place. A satisfied owner will buy another M-B product. After all, a new loaded E500 will cost in excess of $65,000. For that amount of money the car should be the best in its class.
By the way our town is hosting the F1 Grand Prix this week-end. Most golf courses are running a special, any taker?
Jean
It was after 13 months, that the wood panels surrounding my COMAND screen began to make creaking sounds, which the service department can do nothing about. Same with the ML430 with door noise.
Sure, the Lexus LS430 is much more quiet and has better looking materials, but the exterior is bland. The S500 drives a lot more athletically than a LS430. Same can be said comparing a ML430 with the RX300, but especially the 470.
It is really a survival move by Mercedes to cut cost and price their line against the likes of Lexus and BMW. If they were to make the quality of the line as they were, say pre 1999, the cost of the S500 might be over $100K base. At nearly twice the cost of one LS430, Mercedes might be asking too much. Perhaps this is not the reason for the poor QA, but it certainly makes good business sense.
However, there is no doubt about it that the Mb has received the lesson and they have already started adressing the issue. They have too much at stake here to risk everything only to save a few bucks. The newest models show this: while I have had no chance yet to see the new E, I have driven the new SL500 on several occasions, one of them for almost two weeks (my family's in Europe), and it feels just as solid throughout the cabin as the old one (again, two examples in my family). The facelifted S will further accentuate the turn.
Sorry, but when talking about MB I cannot leave my emotions aside, as the car is a pure unadulterated source for them. This is what differentiates MB (or BMW) from Lexus or Infiniti. I hope no one takes offence in this last sentence. Just how I feel. I wuold not want to start a feud like in some other instances at MB boards.
An AMG E55 with M like power and handling plus the reliability of a LS430. That sure would be nice.
At first I was disappointed with my 6 cylinder BMW 330. The engine seemed to lack the refinement of M-B's motor. The power occured at the high end of the RPM and the engine seemed a bit noisy.
But, over time I have come to appreciate the smoothness of BMW's inline 6. This engine grows on you and full appreciation takes some time.
If you want spirited performance and best in class handling buy the BMW. If you prefer quietness and a pure sense of luxury this car is not for you.
IMHO, the BMW 330 would make a nice addition to your E320.
Jean, test drive the Lexus IS as well.
Jean
I did all the above work myself. Replacing the pads is a piece of cake and there is no reason to pay a dealer hundreds of dollars to do that. Replacing the rotors is a little more work. I also have found a terrific source for parts via the internet. It is http://sasponline.com ; also known as Smitty's Auto Service & Parts. I've ordered twice from them in the last couple of months. Their prices are truly discounted, they sell the OEM parts, and their delivery is fast. For example; the front pads made by ATE list at $74.00. They sell them for $37.66... The rotors are also less than half price. The shipping charge for the two rotors and the set of pads was only $12.75.. The total weight was 37 pounds!! Not a bad deal.. And I had all the parts within 4 days.
When I did the pads two years ago, I bought them from a local dealer in eastern Mass. who claims to be a discounted source. It cost me over $60 for the pads alone.
Wally
Good luck with the car.
Brake Pad Replacement:
You will know you need new pads when the warning is displayed on the dash as the brake sensors in the pads will be triggered when they make contact with the rotors. When you have the tires rotated, one can look in and see what the percentage of the pad is left. Until then, I wouldn't worry about it unless you are about to take a long trip. Also, I do not believe the rotation of the tires is part of the free service that Mercedes offers. I wish it were. Just my opinion.
Wally
Perhaps, an early pad replacement can save me some money on the rotors?
Anyone know how long the pads on the E55 last?
Just curious as I want at least 325Hp in my next car. Those SUV's are getting some big engines of late and I enjoy my power advantage.
I had the same problem with my CD player and also the integrated phone wouldn't work. I don't remember what they replaced, but they replaced some power unit and haven't had any more problems. I did have the CD player replaced for another reason as it was skipping.
Hope this helps.
Wally
Thanks.
Grand High Poobah
The Fraternal Order of Procrastinators
My '98 E-320 is approaching 40K miles so I'm thinking about trading for an '03. My minor complaint about the 98 is too low geared and too much road noise. Otherwise it's a great car.
That is the first time that I ever heard that complaint about an E320. Help me, what causes you to believe that it's too low geared? As for the road noise, that's generally caused by the type of tire that you are running. I have the Goodyear Eagle F1's on my E430 and they are very noisy. Am looking forward to them wearing down so that I can replace them. What kind of tires do you have on the car? I have several friends that have the E320 and they aren't noisy and the're certainly not low geared in my and their opinion. More than likely the 03's will have the same gearing as they will have the same engines, at least to start with.
Wally
Brakes still original, no light yet.
I recently applied zaino. New accelerater to harden wax makes application easier. Shines like nothing I ever used before and dirt does some funny things, like falls off!
I love this car! Have had no mechnical issues.
Radio volume is variable. I find it can lower it too much depending on the CD being played. I might consider turning this feature off. I reupped on the teleaid, but never use it. BUt not using it is a good thing!
Without reservation I recommend the 99' or newer models based on mine and friends experience. This is not to "diss" any other model year, just based on personal experience and my feeling that the newer motors once a year in the field is a great choice.
For those of you not using Zaino I recommend this new product. Every major wax manufacturer is now selling this stuff. You spray it on while the car is still wet and then towel dry the car. The car looks fantastic when you are finished.
IMHO, zaino is a better product for dark colored cars and paints that tend to have swirl marks after towel drying. But, my silver E looks great with Consumer Reports number one rated product:
Zymol. Zymol is cheap and available everywhere like Wal-Mart and auto part stores. The detail spray keeps your paint smooth and glossy between Zymol applications. If I had a Black E I would opt for the Zaino.
I have never used the W mode in my E. Is there any condition in Florida that would merit using this mode over the S (summer) mode? How about a 3" down pour which is common here every summer afternoon?