Mercedes-Benz C-Class Sedans

paul_p · June 2001

Can anyone offer an in-depth explanation of how the C230 "driver adaptive" transmission works? I know it is supposed to change the shift points based on how the vehicle is driven, but how long does it take to do that? I can't seem to find any info on this. Does anyone know of a link or documentation? I've read somewhere that even the cruise control also factors into (down)shift decisions.

BTW no major problems to report, but this is a weekend car - only 2,700 miles since delivery. Minor issues have been metallic sliver paint related & intermittent remote trunk key operation. Everything else is flawless and predictable, especially engine warm-up idle and shifting.

michhala · June 2001

Drew -- Thank you for the suggestion -- but I had already decided against the invisible bra, although it came highly recommended by many of the posters. I will just have someone run in front of me to sweep away the loose gravel

Miki

michhala · June 2001

Emory,

My choice was between the C320 and BMW 330i (2001). I chose the C320 over the BMW for the following reasons:

1. Rear visibility on the C320 was much better than on the BMW. The head restraints on the C fold down at the push of a button; whereas on the BMW they remain up and obstruct the view out the rear window.

2. The trunk in the C320 is much larger.

3. The CD player for 6 CD's is installed in the glove compartment of the C; it is in the trunk of the BMW. There is a CD on the dash of the BMW, but it is only for a single disk.

4. The alarm system for the C is factory installed; BMW has it installed by the dealer.

5. I am 5'2" and the seat setting could be raised to a position that gave me front visibility that was better than that of the BMW.

6. Mercedes has Tele Aid -- a very important feature; BMW did not have it on the 2001 models.

7. Mercedes has free road assistance for the life of the car; BMW has it for only 4 years.

After having my C320 a few months, I went back to test drive a BMW and there just was no comparison with the C IMHO. I owned only BMW's for 14 years and they were nice cars, too -- but this year they were just not for me.

If you get a C320 that has only minor and usual new-car problems, you will be delighted with it. I don't know the percentage of problems that the owners of C320's experience, and I don't think we can measure by this forum either pro or con -- however, those without problems are not as likely to post, except for zmeenow

Miki

nanky · June 2001

I believe that out of frustration, and rightly so, we tend to be more vocal about the problems we have with our C's and often neglect to verbalize the positives. A significant number of posts on this forum serve to seek information on whether others are experiencing same kind problems and if so what the fixes are. I am just as guilty of that. I have owned my C for close to a month yet have not posted how impressed I was when the other driver cut in front of me and I was able to brake "on the dime" and the car almost behaved as though it was normal driving in LA nor have I shared with the forum how an 18 wheeler, in a merging lane, didn't move over and with a tap of the accelerator rocketed my way out of being bullied off the road.

Like some on this forum, my wife and I were almost set on the BMW 330 until we test drove the C and compared the driving experiences of the two, not once, but several times. To date, I always have a smile on my face whenever we see a 3 series BMW and my wife repeatedly says she is so glad we didn't get a BM. A friend works for Lexus and has the opportunity to listen in on customer calls periodically. The nature of the problems she hears appear to be no different from what some are experiencing with their Cs. My heart goes out to those who have not been as fortunate with their cars yet I know statistically, this forum does not provide the most objective means of sampling for the worthiness of the C.

If your wife likes the C, I say go for it. I was concerned about buying a 1st year product myself yet have no regrets. Do some unorthodox research on your own. Before ordering, I talked to folks in the grocery store parking lot, and anywhere I could find Cs and their owners about their experiences. I even spent a couple of Saturday's at a dealership service bay talking to owners and finding out the reasons for their visits. Bubba sums it up well by saying "these cars are sophisticated and technically advanced, they are reliable but they are machines and imperfect."

Good Luck!!

zmeenow · June 2001

I post in the interest of fair and balanced reporting!
im sure there are thousands of happy ,satisfied c owners that never even heard of edmunds!maybe as many dissatisfied... i dont know!
but for the newer readers... you need to know that there ARE well made good performing c's out there!

mleskovar · June 2001

6,000 miles on my C320 and happy. Would buy another one.

sargent4 · June 2001

I have not posted in a while but do scan the messages. I have my car almost 3 months. The first week I had the infamous "bad key" problem but now have three working keys. I am not a car fanatic and really don't know what makes a car go - I love the looks of my car. Had a Lexus GS300 before and it took me a while to get use to this C320 but now how I love the it. It is really fun to drive - so peppy. The only problems I have had are not knowing how something works. The 400 page manual could be shorter and written better. I think your wife would love this car!!!

Sarg

sandiegotom · June 2001

I don't like to whine about my C320, but it's whining at me! Specifically, when I let off the gas and coast, at speeds above about 45, I hear a whining noise that appears to be coming from the rear wheels or differential area. If I even lightly reapply the gas, the noise goes away. On a recent trip from San Diego to Palm Desert (in temps above 100), this whine was particularly noticeable, and irritating. Is this one of those "They all do that" things, or is this unusual and indicative of impending problems?

Other than the above, I've had the car for eight months now, 6600 miles, 22.4 mpg (75% urban freeway driving), and NO problems.

Tom

mleskovar · June 2001

Definitely not a 'feature' I would put up with. My car does not make the noise.

dawin · June 2001

Have it on my C320 too.
I heard mine with or without applying the gas when driving on smooth pavement with the radio off. The whinning gets louder/faster as the speed of the car increase.

jrct9454 · June 2001

Sounds like a legitimate drivetrain problem to me - in the olden days, that would be a classic case of a bad differential. Or could be U-joints in the rear...in any case get the service dept cracking on it. This is not "normal".

nyca · June 2001

I've seen a couple of stories in the news lately about auto GPS systems being used to track cars. Specifically, a rental company used it to track someone renting a truck from them and assessed him $450 for speeding (it's in court). Does anyone know if TeleAid is active all the time, ur is it just activated when you press the button or the theft system is triggered.

hensley · June 2001

Just bought a C240 (get it in a couple of days) and appreciate all of the participation in this forum. No, I have not read all 3500 messages but was wondering what the feedback is on driving in snow. Just read a review that made the C240 sound like a dog in the snow, just the opposite of what the dealer said.

Any white stuff feedback??

Slee

fuzzo · June 2001

I followed the advice of one of the posters here (thanx ben747) and ordered my car through Valley Motors in Baltimore. I dealt with Marsha Bennett and she was a very pleasant lady to work with.

I enjoyed the fact that they threw in a free CD changer. This is something no other dealer in the DC area would do.

Infact, I have a few gripes about certain dealerships in the area... does anyone know an email address or contact for MB corporate?

Thanks in advance.

bubba3007 · June 2001

Hi Jeff, welcome aboard. We are practically neighbors. I live in Bellevue, NE. (Omaha) and have similar Winter weather. My C 240 was delivered Feb. 5 and we had a bit more snow than usual last Winter so let me help put your mind at ease. If you'll just drive with what I call "Winter sensibility", i.e., to drive at all times remembering that sometimes you must stop quick, like RIGHT NOW!!! you'll do just fine. Your C with it's ESP will beat the socks off of most FWD cars. Just use your head, drive according to conditions, don't spin your wheels (hard to do with traction control), and you wont have any problems. My car was delivered with the Goodyear tires. I've driven better tires but they are good enough that I don't feel any need for Winter tires on this car.

Bubba

"... my friends all drive Porches, I must make AMENDS..." J. Joplin

ong2000 · June 2001

I got my C320 tested for the hot weather, and I feel the AC is not as good as my Camry.
Any comment?? Thanks.

husky11 · June 2001

steady your manual. The AC should be putting out well if you have the buttons set correctly. If that doesn't work, a trip to the MB service manager is in order. Good luck.

michhala · June 2001

Send a fax to:

Mr. Paul G. Juron, General Manager
Client Assistance Center
Mercedes-Benz USA, LLC

He will put you in touch with your local Mercedes Benz representative, who is totally empowered to handle all problems with the car, including those with the dealer and their service.

Miki

michhala · June 2001

I don't know if you have the 320 or the 240 and if the AC is the same. I keep my climate control on automatic at 72F all the time and it works very well driving in hot parts of my area where the temp does hit 90 - 100F. When the car has been shut for a few hours, it does not take long to cool down. I keep the large triangle air vent on top of the dash open to allow for maximum air, in addition to the individual vents.

Miki

dadval1 · June 2001

we have a new C240 which, from the first day has hesitated when going slowly around a turn,
then feels like it's going to stall. When accelator is pressed hard, it then lurches forward.
Anybody experiencing anything like this?

fuzzo · June 2001

I will do that

dvancao · June 2001

I got my C240 two weeks ago, with @1K miles on it now.
No problems except for the exit feature. It's when I get in, the seat does not move forward enough to my original setting. One small chip on the hood and someone scratched the underside of the driver's side rear mirror. I have not checked the distortion of the windshield yet.
This morning, I made the ASR come on while doing a left hand turn. Love the car!

Dat.

jrct9454 · June 2001

Your symptoms have indeed cropped up here before; you may need to go back at least a month for the proper posting, but there seems to be a problem with the electronic throttle, for which there may be a known fix. Go back and read forward, and then get yourself to the dealer...

jrct9454 · June 2001

Your "problem" may be the benchmark you are using: Toyota makes the best, coldest, most powerful AC in the business, across the board from the least expensive model up to the Lexus LS.

None of the Germans can compare; VW is particularly weak in this area, but neither MB nor BMW have systems as powerful as Toyota. That doesn't mean there might not be something wrong with your car, but it is possible it is doing all it was designed to do...

matthew23 · June 2001

Well, the dealer just called to let me know that my new C320 finally arrived, and I'm looking forward to taking delivery. I do have one nagging question though, for all those who may have leased. What kind of money factor did you get? The one they are quoting me seems kinda high, given my creditworthiness, especially when compared to finance rates. Given that it's the end of the month, and I'm sure they'd like to book this deal before Saturday, I'm willing to beat on the dealership a little bit, but only if I have good cause to do so. Hence the inquiry. Would appreciate any responses.

mleskovar · June 2001

Several posts with this symptom but not after turning that I can remember. Just sitting idling and the engine starts to die then revs up on its own and car lurches forward. Fuel pump was the culprit. It stops delivering enough fuel for smooth idle, the computer senses it and compensates by telling pump to increase output, but it has a problem complying, so the computer tells it to increase even more, then it complies all at once with too much fuel. My interpretation, I'm not a professional mechanic.

benz747 · June 2001

this post is for 2002 C 240s, I just spoke with my dealer and as per him my C 240 was built on 12th June and on docks will be on 28th June and I should get her on Mid July, however MB has not released any price information on 2002 yet and they are expected to hear from MB in early July

thanks for everyone for valuable contributions

benz747 · June 2001

let me know how I can upload pictures, I have three FUTURE MB insight views I got from my friend

hensley · June 2001

I appreciate the snow feedback. I always take my time when there is snow around so now I have no worries. THANKS.

cartesio · June 2001

Go to www.mbusa.com then enter the site. Under "Owners Online," there is a "contact us" selection. Good luck.

Host: Why doesn't THIS site recognize the Tab key or the space bar???

maxq2 · June 2001

None of my local dealers have any 2001 C240s in stock. A several dealer about 2 hours away do, however. If I buy from them and then have problems with my car like hesistation from the engine, sqeaks and rattles, etc, will my local dealer service the car? Thanks.

nanky · June 2001

You don't have to service your car at the dealership of purchase. Any Mercedes dealership in the US will service your car even if you didn't purchase from them. Hope you find the car you are looking for and happy driving!!

husky11 · June 2001

Re: A/C performance. You said in #3575 that none of the German cars can compare to the Toyota [air conditioning system].

I have a 1993 Toyota Camry XLE AND a 1999 C280 MB. I must note that there isn't anything wrong with the MB air conditioning system. They both work very well - all the time.

Last year, we took a long trip to Southern California in the MB. One passenger actually complained that it was "too cold" in the car - this was in 96 degree weather!

I would like to know how you arrived at your broad paintbrush statement. ???

pat · June 2001

I'm not sure I understand your question. The tab keys works for me (to get from message title to message post box I think may be the only time I use it), and the space bar works fine when I type.

You might want to drop by the News and Views board and outline your problem in more detail in Our Software - Your Questions Answered.

Pat
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drew_ · June 2001

Just a reminder that the MB chat is on tonight (6-7pm Pacific/9-10 pm Eastern). Hope to see you there!
http://www.edmunds.com/chat/mercedeschat.html

Drew
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jrct9454 · June 2001

I can make this generalization because I have owned them ALL...and I do mean all of them. I did not say that most people wouldn't find MB's AC acceptable. I did say, and believe strongly from my own experience, that Toyota sets the standard in this regard, and has for a long time. [And my territory is the Calif Central Valley...we just finished a typical week where every day was 100F+].

Ok, here goes:

81 Tercel; 82 Pickup; 82 Celica 4 cyl; 82 Supra; 87 Camry; 88 Camry [x2...one was wrecked for me by an idiot in an Olds Toronado...no contest]; 91 Cressida; 91 Corolla; 93 Camry; 98 Corolla

First, let's eliminate the non-AC Mercedes: 69 220; 71 220; 77 240D. That leaves the 73 SE4.5; 76 300D; 78 240D; 79 300SD; 81 300SD; 84 190E; 86 190E; 89 260E; 94 C220; 98 E320.

Plus 85 Civic; 86 Integra; 96 Acura RL; 98 Accord 4cyl; 01 Accord 6 cyl.

And 66 BMW 1602; 85 325e; 86 325e; 88 325i...and...the recent experiences of my best friend, who owns a new Passat that is not up to the task of taking care of Texas heat...just so you know the experience there is personal and fresh.

Broad paintbrush? You're darned right, partner...bought and paid for...

michhala · June 2001

I have not seen any posts about how much strength was required to use the horn. My Black was easier than the Obsidian. If something happened that needed the horn, I could never beep it in time. The left side is worse than the right. My service advisor wants to see what's up and he was concerned also about the window distortion, because he felt it could be a safety issue. I did not attach much importance to the distortion -- just mentioned it and surprised he even took note. There is, however, definitely a safety issue with the horn if I have to stand on it or use a hammer to make it work.

Miki

jrct9454 · June 2001

All of my recent Mercedes seem to require a good healthy push to get the horn to function, and I agree, in a real pinch I have sometimes wanted a toot and got zip. Like yours, one side was often better than the other.

Every car I've owned in at the past 15 years, and the list is extensive, has had at least some windshield distortion. Certainly all of the MBs have had some waviness in the lower corners; to be perfectly honest, it has never occurred to me to speak up about it, either to a dealer or in this forum, because I guess I just never found it especially distracting. I can certainly imagine circumstances where it could be a real problem, but mine have never been in an area where I needed to focus for any length of time. Replacing a windshield is something I would not do unless the situation were serious. And you are throwing the dice that they can actually come up with a new one that is not going to have some of the same problems...

pk6 · June 2001

Having driven my 99 now for well over 40k zero problem miles have to say that this car has the best heating/cooling of any car I've owned, including my previous 93 Camry.. One thing to try I found on mine is that if you have the center vents aiming directly on the rear-view mirror which is where I think the sensor < on the previous model anyways> is located, the system is tricked into thinking it's colder inside than it is. No problems whatsover in Chicago/Detroit last summer, and tons of heat here at home in minus 30 degree winter weather, fastest warmup too.
Maybe someone can check out that sensor location. I could be wrong, but it sure seems to make a difference in my car.

benz747 · June 2001

I have three New MB pictures I wanted to post so eveybody can see it, does any body know how I can do IT -

sequoiasaurus · June 2001

This is taken directly from the "help" section in in the upper left corner:

Posting a Photo

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Please note that the URL location for your photo cannot be longer than 100 characters.

As a courtesy to your fellow Town Hall members, please do not post extremely large photos as it will decrease the speed of the page download. If you wish to share a photo that is large in file size, please post a link to the photo using just the URL instead of the HTML "img src" tag.

michhala · June 2001

My thanks for the info on the horn. Always good to hear that someone else shares an opinion with me -- makes me feel less neurotic

I agree with you about the windshield -- there is no way I want to replace it. I was having a telephone conversation with my service advisor and he asked how everything else was other than the horn, so I mentioned the windshield. I have a circular driveway with two exits, so I do not back out. Because of the curve of the driveway and the street, this is the time when the distortion is most visible on the sides, when looking to the right or left for oncoming traffic. On the freeway at a fast speed the side scenery sometimes looks wavy; however, I don't often look at scenery while driving

I can say with complete certainty that I do not have the least desire to replace the windshield until it becomes badly bruised.

Miki

drew_ · June 2001

You know its funny that you mention the windshield because on my most recent test drive of a C-class ('01 C240 Classic), which was only a couple of weeks ago, I noticed that the right side of the windshield was also very very slightly wavy. I didn't find it a problem though, and in fact I didn't notice it until I was driving at highway speeds and happened to glance that way. I too wouldn't bother getting it changed.

I'm surprised that no one else has mentioned this, but the right side wiper of the new C-class is actually an adaptation of the former one blade system. There is a cam that allows it to reach further to the right, and higher up the windshield, hence providing excellent coverage. I only found this out on my last test drive when I had to use the windshield washers to clean the windshield of the C240; it was brand new with only 57 kms on the odometer, so they didn't really have time to detail the outside yet. There were a lot of water spots on the windshield as a result. On my 50 km test drive (1/3 of it was uphill, and the rest in the city; average speed of 65 km/hr), I still managed to average a very good 21 mpg.

Drew
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ong2000 · June 2001

C320 :
On a hot sunny day 95+F, I set the temp at 74F / AUTO ,the cooling system (blower) is in full power for hours to keep the car cool, and its kind of noissy. The blower just keep running in full power. If I set the temperature manually, then I won't have enough cool air, unless I set the blower at the highest. If I try to lower the blower then the temp inside the car raise.

Camry LE:
My 1997 Camry LE will do a better job with the same condition. I just need to set the blower at the lowest position and it does the job very well, keep the car cool, plus its very quiet . I enjoy driving in quietness rather then noissy.

My other Benz/380S and BMW/520 can't beat my Camry in this department.
Any comments are wellcome,
Joe

michhala · June 2001

>test drive of a C-class ('01 C240 Classic), >which was only a couple of weeks ago, I noticed >that the right side of the windshield was also >very very slightly wavy.

Drew,

Well.... It appears that "slightly wavy" windshields are here to stay for a while

I noticed distortion first on the right side; but when I went and sat in the passenger seat, I could see there was some on the left, too. I can deal with it -- better than the other stuff. I would like to be able to use the horn, though.

You mention windshield washers as having better coverage on the C. Happy to hear that for those who use them. Would you believe I do everything possible to avoid using them -- they spurt water everywhere. The Obsidian has headlamp washers that are pretty wild, too. Have not used them yet. Put the seat warmers on once to ease the guilt of paying the extra money for things I did not need in order to get the Xenon, which, by the way provide very good and comfortable light for driving. I have not had to put on my high beams since I got the car, and I drive where it is very dark.

Miki

nanky · June 2001

Miki - I have the same problem with the amount of strength required to make the horn sound. I first noticed this when I took delivery of the car and wanted to see if it passed Andy Rooney's test. Andy claims you can determine the build quality of a car by the sound of the horn and the way the doors close:) In a driving situation, when I really needed it, I managed to get it to sound after the fact. I took note of how much effort it took to get it to work but didn't give much thought to it afterwards. I will mention it to service to see what they say. The windshield distortion I haven't noticed. Will look to see if mine has it too.

jrct9454 · June 2001

...using the horn in Europe is considered anti-social, and rude. Last desperate resort before something really awful happens, or the automotive equivalent of flipping someone off. This may or may not account for the amount of ooomph MB seems to require to make it work. In any case, it is a common characteristic of the brand...

michhala · June 2001

>... using the horn in Europe is considered anti->social, and rude. Last desperate resort before >something really awful happens, or the >
>automotive equivalent of flipping someone off

This is an interesting fact to know. Actually, I use my horn rarely, but it is that one time "before something really awful happens" that I want it to work. There have been instances when I have been grateful to someone else's horn, too, warning me not to go there

Miki

ctic · June 2001

I don't use my horn that much anymore, but sometimes, like when a guy is backing into you without looking into the rear-view mirror you got to use it!

So what do the Europeans use, the finger?

drew_ · June 2001

Actually I was referring to the windshileld wipers having good coverage of the windshield, but the washers work well too :-). Regarding the headlamps washers, they do work well too, but do leave a mess of windshield washer fluid on the hood. Lots of fun to use when you have an unsuspecting passerby walking in front of your car ;-)

Would you believe that the headlamp washer dispersal pattern is actually specially engineered to blast as much dirt away from the headlamps as possible? And all of this time I thought that all they did was simply squirt the washer fluid! I do miss those mini wipers that they used to have for the headlamps though. Seems like only Volvo has them now.

I didn't know that your new C had the Xenons. Did the Black C320 have them too? They're great aren't they? About 2.5 times more light (not to mention the much higher colour temperature) than the halogens, which are already very good too.

I didn't sit in the passenger seat for that C240 that I test drove, so I didn't notice any distortion. I didn't notice any distortion in other new C's that I have sat in on the showroom floor, but then again I wasn't moving along at highway speeds either. :-)

Mercedes-Benz C-Class Sedans

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