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Comments
autoban95...the engine swap is the holy grail that we have all been waiting for, you really need to do this so we can live vicariously through you and dream of doing it ourselves someday.
i've been dreaming of that engine swap for a while now. i know it can be done, considering there is hardly any difference in blocks and the trannys are identical. it won't be for a while though until things fall into place. cash is tight right now - i'm going to the University of Buffalo for dual majors, aerospace and mechanical engineering. tuition isn't cheap these days, but it should be worth it in the long run.
maybe i could offer to wash and wax other people's Auroras for some money on the side since i love detailing mine so much! LOL
but now your answer begs the question...
what is "theftlock" and what does it do?
I am glad you laughed.
I am sure I speak for the majority of the aROARians here when I say -- "Nobody touches my car but me!"
But thanks for the light hearted offer.
I am hoping for someone on our little board to take the plung and put in the Caddie 4.6. I will not be far behind you if it really makes a difference. Though I admit I would probably buy another Aurora to do it with. (Although my 95 is used to going under the knife. -- The Shop King.)
By the way, if I start saving now, put a 2nd mortgage on the house, and cash out my 401K, I should have enough to get the Caddie CIEN if/when it comes out.
Has the weather warmed up enough for you to replace your brake rotors and pads? How did it go? Can you tell us the brand, model, and part numbers for the cross-drilled rotors you mentioned in post #2251? I believe the front rotors on my '97 are a bit larger in diameter than the '95-96's, but it would be good to have the part numbers anyway. Are your rears vented? I think mine must be solid, judging from the thickness (0.433") listed in the service manual, but I have not looked at the edge yet to see for sure. What did you decide to use for pads?
Did you need a special tool to bottom the cylinder that automatically adjusts the parking brake function?
The prices you quote are excellent compared to stock GM replacements which list at $203 front and $87 rear. I found a dealership willing to discount over the internet for $129 and $55 respectively. I'd rather have the cross-drilled at a lower price if there is no problem with them.
to answer your first question, no, the weather hasn't warmed up enough yet to do the brake job. a whopping 26 degrees here right now! but that fact doesn't restrict me from passing along the information about the rotors. i do have pictures of them and i'd be more than willing to email them to you if you'd like.
they are made by a company called roto-tech,out of Canada. the appearance of the rotors is that of very high quality and precision machine work. if they perform as good as they look, i will be very happy.
i have the bill in front of me now, and the part numbers are 56325X for the fronts, at $40.95 each.
for the rears, they are 56241X, and they are $26.95 each. i had them special ordered through Hutchins Automotive, i'm not sure if they are a nationwide chain parts store or not. they took about 3 weeks to get, since they machine them to order from what i understand. i couldn't have done the machine work myself for that price.
both the front rotors and the rears are cross-drilled and vented on the friction surfaces. however, only the fronts are "finned", just like OEM since they are so much thicker.
as for brake pads, i am going with the Grizzly pads which can be bought at Halfway Auto parts. i haven't actually purchased them yet, so i am not able to quote you a price. i chose Grizzly pads because i can get the same compound for both fronts and rears, where with a few other brands, i could only get high performance compounds for the fronts, and i would have to use a cheaper grade on the rears. i like to keep things balanced. another reason for the Grizzly's is that i've heard they produce very little brake dust. i did find some incredibly high-performance Kevlar (green) pads for both front and rear at tirerack.com. i believe the coefficient of friction for those was around .46, where for most other pads that number would be around .33 or so. (i'm pulling those numbers from memory, so they may be off a touch.) maybe the next time around i'll spring for the Kevlars!
just let me know if you have any other questions.
Taylor
I'm interested in any answer you get about reading the codes. I can't afford an OBDII readar yet, and I am finding there is a big difference in features across the brands and models. I was really disappointed to find that my '97 Aurora had no built-in function to display the DTC codes after owning an '86 Toro that had that capability. Progress?!?*
My fuel guage is also flaky. There is a fuel level sensor kit available from AC-Delco for about $105 list. I haven't replaced it yet because I'm not absolutely sure it is the culprit (hence my great interest in your question about reading codes), and I'm also thinking about replacing the fuel pump as preventive maintenance given Henry's experience in the Holland Tunnel. Does anyone know if new fuel pumps come with a new fuel level sensor?
an erroneous distance to empty. I am still under warranty and should take it in, however, I use the gallons used info in the DIC. Dealer never mention fuel pump along with sensor. I have had new filter put in pump. Hope we both can get some info regarding the fuel gauge.
Thank you for your valuable research. I want to take you up on your offer of photos of the roto-tech rotors, both front and rear. My email address is lester.young@att.net
My Aurora is probably one of the 'tiredest' ones around here, but I can't believe this engine is anywhere near needing to be replaced. But if you just want to see what it's like, I'll take up a collection to pay for it and volunteer my car for the operation to put in a 4.6L!
What implications will this have for my well-used transmission? Which 4.6L should I be looking for? Do you think a run-of-the-mill local mechanic could do the swap, or is it going to require a Cadie hotrod shop? Do any of the Caddie use the same transmission. I may actually price this swap out if it's not going to destroy my trans.
I don't know if I posted this last time, but my radiator developed a crack. I had a guy put in a replacement ordered from a radiator shop that cost $240. The dealer price for this part is $600.
Too bad the guy left a transmission cooler line loose. I had been losing a bit more "oil" on the driveway than usual. In fact, I think some of the oil was splashed all over the bodywork. Since it was time for a transmission fluid flush, I had it looked at - they found the loose connector and said it was about 3 quarts low. It really was starting to run bad - now its much better! I would have been checking the level, except someone (dealer?) installed a coolant flushout of some kind over the top of the transmission opening. I've been meaning to more that thing out of the way!
Someone asked about what oil I use in my car. No, I don't use synthetic, and I do wait for the DIC to tell me when to change the oil. I generally do it myself with Penzoil dino-oil and a Fram filter. I'm not sure how the previous owner took care of it for the first 150K miles.
I did check with the original dealer for maintenance records. They had minimal records on this car - nothing major.
Dan - Naperville, IL
If you are concerned about the tranny, you could always have it rebuilt (unless that's real expensive). I imagine it could take it, though.
I doubt you'd need a hotrod Caddy place, but they might be better if they are more familiar with things. A mechanic that you find competent would probably be fine, though.
Why'd you go with Fram filters and not ACDelco, as they tend to cost about the same?
I have to say, if your Aurora has that many miles on it, I wouldn't swap the engine. I would run it until it died so I could see how far it went. I think racking up that kind of mileage is pretty cool.
You can buy nationwide at O'Reilly's and at a lot of independent retailers. O'reilly's has for $149.95 everyday and I got mine on sale for $129.95.
Go to website, click on "products", then "code readers", then "OBD II reader", click on "where to buy" by zip code. Sometimes are on back order but usually get one in within 5 working days and I got mine on sale. I have not used it yet, but I feel this is the best for the money. A laptop or Palm system with connectors and software were between $300 and 500 dollars. This is a great inexpensive alternative and was highly recommended to me.
At over 200k miles you are the granddaddy in the group. I really dont think the northstar will wear out in the foreseeable futire provided it is taken care of. The 4.6L "upgrade" is for folks who just want to do it. Personally, I would take it back to the dealer (if he is willing to do it) or a hot rod shop.
Someone on the board said that it would not be a good idea to put in the caddie computer since other connected systems may be different. Howevr, I was talking about putting in the caddie computer and keeping the 4.0L.
I dont know if putting in the computer and the engine is the way to go.
Opinons Options Opinions Options Opinions anybody?
The car now as 80K miles on it (warranty has expired) and has been exceptional. During the 30k miles I've driven it I've put a new set of Monroe SensiTrac shocks on it - front and rear - (just because they were getting soft), replaced the fuel regulator valve (the only warranty claim I had) and recently put on a water pump. Other than that, the car has been a dream and I have no regrets whatsoever.
As far as price, I paid $11,000 from a Buick/Pontiac dealer here in the Tampa Bay area. It is a non-Autobahn but has every other option except CD. It was completely reconditioned and they put a brand new set of continental tires on it. The warranty was in addition.
If you buy the car, I would have the tranny power flushed (not just fluid changed) and the fuel / air system cleaned and flushed. My car has had both done every 25k-30k miles and I am a big believer that the extra maintenance will more than pay for itself in long-term repairs. Additionally, I change the engine oil every 3K miles religiously and use a name brand 10w-30 (i.e. Penzoil -nothing special)
I hope this is of some value.. GOOD LUCK!
What is the significance of the build date? I assume the ealier 95's may have had some issues that were fixed during later production runs. What about a build date of 6/94 (my car)?
Or do I want to know?
Larry
I would say that if FENCESITTER wants the 1995 he should get it. At the RIGHT price. Also, I have been told that any car that has been driven by an old lady from Passadina is not a good car for me. The Aurora has 250 horses and when I drive its "Everybody in the Pool."
If a car is not used to this, it will not hold up well for the new owner. Therefore, fencesitter needs to know his driving style and what the car is used to. Now this advice dates back to the 80's. I do not know if it is still true for the cars of the 90's and the 2000's.
Henri
I would also watch the radio on the 95's. Also the 95's have the smaller sway bars so the car will lean more on turns than the 1997's and up. also 95 was the only year for OBD 1 in the Aurora. Stistically the 95's have had more issues thatn the later years. Howevr, some of that may be due to age as well as the first year of the car curse.
Like I said just make sure the price is right. Which at this point should be way way WWAAAYYY south of $10K.
As for the 4.6 in the Aurora. I'd go with the 275 HP. In addition to the considerable extra torque all over the curve, it has more HP all the way up to about 5,000 rpm. The HP difference is pretty large at certain parts of the curve too. I still think the 275 HP motor in an STS with the 3.71 would beat a stock STS. Either motor would certainly put a smile on the face of an Aurora owner.
RJS - I got the wheels just sitting in a box. No tires yet. I guess I could weigh myself on the bathroom scale (if I had one) with and without the rim. They are amazingly light. Maybe the shipping info on the box has some info. I'll look.
800wattaurora - free dyno's - oh man. Let us know about the throttle body project from RSM. That one is probably tough to test "back to back" because it would be hard to test on the same day. I think the job might be a little long. Maybe not.
Thanks for heads-up on the brake diode. I must have missed that somewhere in the earlier posts. Is there a web site where we can go look up the TSBs? I'll also go over the car's service records to see if that's been addressed.
Larry
I can't believe they would feature something like that without a dyno test. It's like watching an infommercial.
Pretty cheezy on Hot Rod's Part. The product was from jet-chip.
I am thinking about trading/selling the Aurora for the Cadillac SRX (depending on how it looks). The CTS doesn't quick make the grade and I have been thinking station wagon anyway. The SRX starts with the old northstar V8 too (as in 4.6 liters with RWD = a straight exhaust system-300+ horsepower without diddling the engine).
After the MAF BS, I have a pretty negative view of these gizmo's and then you see a major publication seemingly push one of these gadgets without any back-up. It's aggravating
It's easier to see the possible gain with a K&N because it isn't as reliable as a paper filter, so a manufacturer is more concerned with durability (for example, as a K&N gets dirtier and dirtier, it still flows, but doesn't stop all the dirt. A paper filter will keep stopping the dirt, it's just that hardly any air will get in and your car will not make as much power). Same with a computer chip because they tend to be much less forgiving of excess heat or poor quality fuel. Plus, sometimes manufacturers do actually use K&N filters for extra horsepower, like on the Viper GTS (which picks up an extra 10).
It's probable the tornado company was a sponsor of that episode, and that's why they showcased the product without any real testing. That is pretty crappy, though.
Would it be bad to dyno in the moring than later in the afternoon? Better same time Sat. and Sun. asuming both days are sunny and cloudless, than the same day 2 to _? many hours later? It's inside with exhaust vacum.
Taylor
BMW: Finally drove the BMW 740iL. The Aurora is about 90% as good for less than half the price. I was surprised, given its 325 ft/lbs of torque (282 HP) that it was not all that much peppier on highway acceleration - that 30 to 50 or 45 to 65 mph acceleration. It runs a 6.9 0-60 whereas our legacies are in the 8.0 range I guess. Anyway, I expected to be more boweled over.
Sat in an M5, turned it on, but declined a ride since its out of my price range.
Infiniti G35 (not to be confused with I35). A rear wheel drive competitor to the 5 series BMW. Quite impressive. I have a feeling this car will sell in big quantity.
0-60 in about 6.2. Cornering and handling were excellent. A big contender for my dollars.
Acura TL 3.2 S. 260 HP around 240 Ft/lbs torque. After driving the G35, it seems like an older car. Improved pep compared to older model. but I didn't like the dash, and except for the nice-sized trunk, not on my list.
Cadillac STS. First ride in an STS; had previously riden in an SLS. Least impressive: the 300 HP is only marinally faster than the Aurora, it seems about the speed of the 740. Best feature: the ability to go over RR tracks without any bump! An amazing suspension! I may get a used STS or SLS for $20-25K used (98-99)
Cadillac CTS: I can forgive the exterior looks but the center dash is still ugly. A little slower than the STS or 740. About 0-60 in 7.0. Tremendous cornering. Go to a Caddie dealer and get on a course where you can turn corners at twice normal speeds - no brakes. The best I have ever driven. Rumor is that next years engine will be faster - making this a potent combination. People who own BMW, Mercedes, Audi, ect. are impressed and I can see why. Another 5 series competitor.
Lastly, I went to a Jaguar dealer who was very informative and nice for about a half hour. When it came time to drive and SL8 he dissed me, talking up all the important people who drive these and inferring that it wasn't worth his time to give me a test drive. Yes - snobby! Ooh, that hurt. Doubt I'll be back there.
In a nutshell, I am a bit more concerned with 0-60 than handling. I hope to drive a BMW 540 (used, of course) and continue my search.
Bill K,
Aurorabill
In addition, my oil analysis also showed extremely low levels of dirt - even factored for the 8 quarts, and I do a lot of city driving. The K&N filter is doing just fine.
Free air flow and lower pressure drop does not necessarily translate into lower efficiency. The paper filters use small openings in the media to trap debris which immediately plug the filter. The air must then find another opening - and so on. When the debris comes in contact with the oily gauze media of the K&N, it sticks, but the media being much more open remains open and plugs more slowly.
Chips are the same way. I can buy that they make some acceleration improvement in many cars. This is because they remove some of the safety built into the programming in order to be more aggressive. I can picture in my mind how this might improve power on some cars (but I don't think it is worth it because the cars usually don't run as well and aren't as forgiving of bad gas or hot days). I can't get my mind around how some propellor shaped thing in the air intake, or some magnet on the fuel line would have any positive effect on anything (except the seller's pocket) though. If such a simple device made such a difference, with no effect on reliability, then why on earth wouldn't they be standard on more cars?
Aurorabill, what is the SL8? Is that the 4.0 S-Type? Is the L for extended wheelbase? I didn't think there was an extended wheelbase S-Type.
Which lists every line from Hummer to Saturn to Saab, but suspiciously doesn't list Oldsmobile... I mean, there are still Olds owners out there...
Anyway - the efficiency of the K&N filter gets better as it gets dirtier - just like paper. I don't think lots of dirt would start getting by unless you maybe just left it in there for many many years. But it still flows pretty good and doesn't cause a restriction when dirty. Starving the car for air is really bad though - very dirty paper.
Your idea about the dolts is right on the mark though. Not only is the filter costly, servicing it is a lot more than just dropping a new one in. You have to use a special cleaner, rinse with water from the clean side only to push the dirt out, can't blast the water, make sure it is totally dry, and then oil it correctly. It's really easy, but no way in hell I would trust the general public to get this right. It would be an absolute disaster. It's the "dolt factor" all the way. You are right on there.
I'm sure they can't advertise the performance with a K&N system and then sell it with the paper filter. Can you imagine all the engine damage from regular people that goofed up the K&N filter?
Other than the special type car you mentioned, I don't think they will ever be standard from the factory on much.
As for chips and other doo-dads, yeah, I really have little use or trust any of this stuff either. It's the wild west with this stuff. It seems that there are some basic things that always help if done correctly such as free flow induction and exhaust. That larger throttle body sounds like a good induction helper too. Other than that it seems like you have to get into the engine - no thanks.
Eric
I thought about superchips but decided against it. If I am goin to mess with the engine, I will stay with GM stuff. I still like the 4.6L idea. But who amongst us is going to do it first?
It's an eye opener. After reading it, I'm amazed that their claims are legal. The article did not seem to mention the claimed power increase, but the results were really poor if anything at all. I agree with your sentiments, and I think you will find that article interesting.
After seeing my car's performance with leaner and richer air/fuel ratios, I feel pretty good as to what the factory set it at.
I am not sure what you are referring to by an SL8. I checked my article' and found no reference to it (although it is the end of a long day!)
The BMW is the 740 with comes in "i" or iL (L is longer, mainly back seat floor area). The Cadillac is STS or SLS.
Feel free to write me off-list at bill9@mindspring.com
I test drove a Mustang GT today. I liked the responsiveness of the engine in doing typical "Bill" things - highway accelerations, getting around cars, etc. Its 280 HP, 305 ft/lbs. torque just about did it for me. What wasn't in-sync was the 2-door, the slighly youngish and aggresive looks (like hood scoop), and the generally "dragster" kind-of sound - quality of sound and noise levels. Maybe if I were in my 20s. But it did have a pedal - halfway to the metal responsiveness that was refreshing. List price $25K> The Cobra by the way, is in very limited supply, sells for over list (ends up $35K or so from my dealer) but has a delicious 390 HP, 390 Ft/lbs from the same 4.6 engine using a supercharger.
Aurorabill