Buick Rainier, Chevy TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy

iexplore2000 · July 2003

Honestly, I prefer to use the "good oil" myself, but sometimes the dealerships have bad ideas in terms of what they refer to as good oil and want to charge you an arm/leg for their particular brand of oil.

Here's my method for oil changes. I also like to take my vehicle to the dealership to have the oil change performed so that everything is on file given that any potential engine trouble should arise down the road. Prior to taking my vehicle(s) in for an oil change, I will usually stop by Walmart, Auto Zone, Pep Boys, etc. and pick up a case of the Mobil One fully synthetic oil (5W30) and purchase a Mobil One oil filter to match (approximately $11 for filter, $30 for oil). Then, I take my vehicle to the dealership and let them perform the service on the vehicle utilizing my own supplied oil! Works out pretty good actually because they only charge me $8 - $11 for their labor. For some this may be an inconvenience having to make several stops along the way prior to hitting the dealership, but for me it gives peace of mind. I know that my own supplied oil is going in my vehicle and that I am using a top notch filter as well.

Most important, I can visually see the servicing technician pouring the oil into my vehicle. That also gives me peace of mind because when I first started doing this, I would go to a dealership that took my vehicle to the service area and then I had no clue as to whether or not they were actually "using" my oil or simply taking it home with them. With those ill feelings, I begun asking the dealership to allow me to look over my vehicle while they were performing the oil change; to which they politely obliged. Now, I eliminate that issue by taking my vehicle to a servicing dealer that has the oil change equipment right in front of your face!

Also, for the record I also have fallen victim to the every 3K oil change but with the use of synthetic oil, I've become a little more laxed because of the durability of synthetic oil. On my new Envoy, I will do 3K oil changes up until about 6K, then I will do every 6K after that. This keeps me in line with the service schedule since most items fall at the 12K, 18K, 24K, 30K range (i.e. tire rotations, etc).

Hope this helps you! ONLY the best oil and filter for my baby!

Thanks!

IExplore2000

PS: Just for kicks, if you get your oil changed, don't reset the DIC.. just watch it to see how often/when I determines that you should get an oil change. I did this with my Impala due to the large amount of miles driven for my job. Although I changed the oil every 3 - 6K, the DIC would consistently display the "Change Oil" light around 6 - 7K. I wanted to try this with my Envoy, but unfortunatly the dealership reset my DIC a few days ago during my first oil change! DoHH!

mc3dah · July 2003

Need a little help. I rotated my tires yesterday, and being an conscientious technician, I looked up the torque value in my owners manual, and found the value of 100 foot pounds. Got out my adjustable click-type wrench, set it to 100 lbs, checked it on the calibrator in the shop, it clicked at 94, and proceeded to tighten the nuts.

Low and behold the studs started STRETCHING. Not good. Backed off setting and tried again. One broken stud at 90 lbs and another at 74 lbs. My 2002 Envoy is in the shop right now getting all studs replaced, and it is NOT being covered under warranty. This will be a fight for a later day.

Has any one else had a similar experience?

I will mention that when I searched this site, I found a few posts about over torquing by impact guns. Did any one have to have their studs replaced? Was it done under warranty? The only other time my wheels have been off is when the dealer did my previous rotations.

Thanks in advance for any info.

pepper50 · July 2003

Bobbie wrote: Hi Folks....Question...I have an '02 Bravada with about 17M miles on it.

That's good news, Bobbie, and makes us feel confident in our vehicles. The 17 Million miles is a lot to get off of one engine! You've driven a lot more than the 17K that most people would have driven at this point

pepper50 · July 2003

Onlyagirl wrote: I had one service manager tell me a few years ago that my oil was 75 dollars because they put the "good" oil in my car by mistake....as he patted me on the head and basically said now be a good girl and just pay the bill and don't ask questions...that I should be so happy to have the "good" oil..

My response to that would be "Well, I'll consider letting you leave it in if you don't charge me for it, and in return, I'll help you cover up your mistake by not pointing it out to everyone. Otherwise, I want it removed, and the oil I specified put in." Then I would further put him on the spot and ask him how such a mistake could be made, since the regular oil is in bulk and the "good oil" is in bottles.

stever · July 2003

I'm grinning ear to ear about your "good oil" post.

Tblazed, I remember your earlier post about the cam phaser system, and that I remember that being from a "legit" source. Doesn't apply to my drivetrain apparently though :-)

Oh yeah, Onlyagirl, I think it'd be great if the quickie lube places sold an instant oil analysis. What they lost on oil changes they'd probably make up on testing revenue.

Some truck stops offer instant analysis for truckers, but otherwise the only way to get one done is to order a kit off the internet, wait for the mail, etc.

Finally, I check my oil every time I fill up. Usually I'm the only one with a hood up though.

Steve, Host

nuyorkah · July 2003

"Is the DIC "average mileage" the average on the whole 17,000 or just since the last fill up and reset?"

If you reset the "average mileage" back to zero by holding down the button with the arrow on the lower right-hand side of the steering wheel the answer is no, the average is from the point that you reset it.
If you've never held down that arrow button and set it back to zero then yes thats the 17k "average mileage".

aldan93 · July 2003

I have done this also, but after 15-20K you can get a feel if it is burning oil or not, so only on occasion do I check it. Valvoline, I go to valvoline they are quick and have not been left dripping oil out of a loose filter, or plug. Also Valvoline is ridiculous as far as flushing engine, filters, and synthetic. I could see someone getting taken advantage of. I have a big K&N sticker on the intake, so they don't bother asking. Also the Techs always pull the dip stick out and say, man thats black! We offer a flush etc... Come on I change my oil every 3k. Its always been black. I owned a Dodge once with a 318 V8, Its the only vehicle after 3k-4k the oil was still an amber color!!

brunopuntzjone · July 2003

Picked up an 03 Trailblazer LTZ last week and the option is the "Curb Assist Mirrors" or something like that. Must have changed the wording since the 02 stuff.

dshepherd3 · July 2003

Only 2 things possible here and you calibrated the torque wrench, so lets assume that they may have been over tightened during a prior removal? or the studs are defective, prove this, tough job.
I have rotated mine 4 times with a none calibrated wrench and do not feel any stud stretch.

jerryweigel · July 2003

Why not change your tires at 10K. They are used up as much as your oil is at 3K. You don't because you can see the tires are fine for continued use. If you had the same knowledge on your motor oil, there would be no reason to change oil well past 10K on these engines. I doubt a single oil sample would come back with any problems when sampling at the computer recommended change interval. I have had oil samples test in a diesel pickup that I run. Much harder operating conditions. I change its oil every 24K miles. Never had a sample say the oil needs changing. If has over 230K miles on it. You have never seen black oil then with 24K miles of use, yet it was still going its job.

Nothing wrong changing the oil every 3K, but it sure is not doing your engine any good.

Grab a sample if you really want to learn something.

jjw
ND

stever · July 2003

Here's another oil change link from the EPA.

In case you've missed the buzz about displacement on demand, here's a recent article from Motortrend:

Displacement on Demand Arrives in 2005 GM SUVs

Steve, Host

dse1 · July 2003

I also had this problem, at a relatively low torque (~80 ft*lb), lug split right off. (REAL INCENTIVE TO ROTATE TIRES, HUH?????) Dealer replaced it under warranty, no questions asked (it had already been in for 25-30 days of service before that). Anyone know if there are discounts on the GM extended warranties for those of us with potentially faulty engine cylinder sleeves?

dse1 · July 2003

Anyone with the 'noisy Tach' have the recall done? Does the recall solve this problem too, or is it simply a PCM reprogram?

onlyagirl · July 2003

Steve, glad you enjoyed it

I wondered if any man ever got that explanation...that whole experience( my first SUV..'98 MClass ) was a trip...many more grins would be found with the "rest of the story"

Pepper50 I wish I'd had those words then but,at the time I just paid ....but when I had my meeting with the MB regional service manager to discuss the many problems with my vehicle and with the service department it was just another round of ammo...he was incredulous that someone actually told me that...

I'm sure no one cares but given all the discussion I've decided to get the oil changed before my trip...then will let it go longer the next time....I will try to be good and check the oil level more often...but I will do it at home...I just think I would look a bit silly trying to do that at a gas station...trying to look like I knew what I was doing...when I really don't....

bingotc · July 2003

doing a 24 hr test drive on 03 tblazer. ext v-8. don't know whether to go with v-6 on ext or the v-8. we don't haul a lot of stuff, but what would have better resale? also which is the better engine. it has home link. what is that?can someone help me make a decision? or point me towards the options i should have or not?

canddmeyer · July 2003

Recommend V8 on EXT due to 400lbs. extra curb weight

hardhawk · July 2003

Homelink is a built in 3 button garage door & other electronic device control system. You have 3 buttons you can program to operate 3 different garage door openers, electric entrance gates, and/or remote control light switches (you have to buy those in addition if you want those, but not from the car dealer). I love mine. 1st button is for home garage door. 2nd button is for my elderly parent's garage door, and 3rd button is for my office garage door. It is really nice to not have to clip the regular garage door opener(s) to the visor!

brunopuntzjone · July 2003

The price of the V8 isn't much more than the V6 IIRC. $800 or so? Resale may get you another $400 or so out of it. So figure an extra $100 a year for the V8, I'd go with it.

Good point on the homelink, I couldn't think of anything other than a garage door. Now I can program my dad's garage as a 2nd button.

iexplore2000 · July 2003

Bingotc,

Please scroll up a few post and see my critiques concerning our trip in my aunts 6 cylinder TB Ext.

Personally, I have the Envoy SLT XL V-8 and after making this 700+ mile trip loaded with passengers in the Trail Blazer, the V-8 has my vote!

Ironically, my aunt mentioned yesterday while riding in my Envoy how she had wish that she purchased the V-8 model. However, after owning a regular length TB LTZ, she assumed that the 6 cylinder had ample power, therefore she never test drove an EXT model.

Good luck with your choice, I like both engines for their overall smoothness but for a small reduction in gas mileage, the V-8 is definitely worth the price of admission!

Thanks!

IExplore2000

tblazed · July 2003

"Why not change your tires at 10K. They are used up as much as your oil is at 3K."

Slightly worn tires won't leave sludge and deposits inside the engine especially if you do a lot of short drives and the vehicle sits sometimes 2 or 3 days, allowing contaminants suspended in the oil to settle out.

"Nothing wrong changing the oil every 3K, but it sure is not doing your engine any good."

It certainly won't cause any harm either. I change mine based more on TIME than miles since I don't drive a lot. 3 times a year in Oct, Feb, and June. If I went by GM's Oil Life System recommendation I would be leaving oil in that engine for a year at a time. I don't buy that. Not in MY engine anyway.

Also, RE: steve_ HOST "Tblazed, I remember your earlier post about the cam phaser system, and that I remember that being from a "legit" source." The source is from the GM Service Manual section about troubleshooting the "DTC" or trouble code that sets if the cam phaser fails to respond properly. Poor oil quality is a possibility.

bobbies · July 2003

UGH...pepper50 the suffix "M" and "K" both mean 1000 in case you haven't heard.

tblazed · July 2003

I always thought M was mega for million and K was kilo for thousand. Learn sump'n new...

rainers · July 2003

I agree Homelink is nice but 1 thing I do not like about it is that it can still be used with the truck turned off. I also own a Mercedes ans when I remove the key from the ignigtion it disables the the door opener.

2003 TB
2002 C320
1971 Cutlass Conv.

aldan93 · July 2003

2003 TB LS 4X4
1997 Nissan
1990 ariens 9hp rider
2001 MDT 8HP Snowblower
20" Murray push lawn mower 3hp
pair of inline skates
red rider wagon

oh a wheelbarrow?

gam2 · July 2003

2003 Envoy SLT
1999 Cavalier Z-24
1994 Camaro Z-28
1972 Cutlass Supreme
1968 M274-A4 Military Mule
1999 18 HP Sabre Lawn Tractor
1967 10 HP Bolens Lawn Tractor
1995 3.8 HP Ralley Lawn Mower
1993 Ryan Weed Wacker
1974 Cox .049 Airplane
Numerous 1/18th scale Diecast cars

Gee, this is silly!

GAM

stever · July 2003

Any new owners want to weigh in and tell us about their new GM SUV and sidetrack the silliness?

Steve, Host

brunopuntzjone · July 2003

Here's some pics of the ride. Picked it up Tuesday of last week and have put 1000 miles on it since and absolutely love it. Little rough on the $$$ when it comes to gas, but I'll live.

I had the aftermarket Delphi Skyfi unit put in. It's an 03 LTZ and didn't come with the $150 Traction Assist option, go figure. The horrid cheap plastic "Trailblazer" logo above the rear wiper control was the perfect mounting spot. I lucked out

http://myweb.cableone.net/brandon1337/dcp_1256.jpg

http://myweb.cableone.net/brandon1337/dcp_1253.jpg

http://myweb.cableone.net/brandon1337/dcp_1258.jpg

Of course it's the best looking one out there

stever · July 2003

It is a nice color! You got enough off MSRP with your rebates to splurge on premium all the time.

Enjoy the XM too.

Steve, Host

aldan93 · July 2003

LOL, I wish more people had a sense of humor!!!

jerryweigel · July 2003

Tblazed...if you have had a problem with todays oil and sludge or you have had your oil tested to backup your opinion than that is good to know. My experience is with diesel engines in a pickup. Todays oils will protect beyond 12 months. Up here in ND I think very short trips in the winter would really test the oil. I found it caused the worst samples in my pickup but not enough to lower the change interval. I do not run any bypass filtrations either.

BTW, I had the head off my diesel engine with over 220K miles. No sludge to be found in fact it was remarkable clean considering how black to oil gets, how long I extend the drains and over 200K miles.

Oil testing is the oil way to SEE what is going on. Based on what I found in my pickup I will not change oil any earlier than what the computer says. I have never found the manufactures to be anything but ultra conservative with it comes to warrenty issues as a result of PM schedules.

jjw
ND

gam2 · July 2003

This board needs some silliness sometimes IMHO.

I change oil on my wifes Z-24 every 3000 miles, but she only puts on 3500 miles a year. I'm going to go 5000 miles between changes on my Envoy. That's half what the DIC is telling me and about twice a year. Oil is a LOT better than it was when 3000 mile intervals became all the rage. 3000
miles on a synthetic is a complete waste of oil. The only ones who even suggest 3000 mile intervals are the car dealers, and you know their reasoning.......$$$$$$

GAM

mcali17 · July 2003

I changed the oil on my 2002 Envoy SLE at 3000 miles, and put in Mobil 1.I reset the Light and figured I would see what happens. At about 11,400 the light came on. So that would mean about 8500 between changes. Which in my opinion is pretty normal, given that the extended service interval on the old 4.3s was 7500.

The best part about this debate is the whole "Mileage" thing anyway. What does mileage have to do with engine wear? Nothing, what the industry should due is add hour meters. Then between your hours and your mileage you would have a much clearer picture of what kind of miles have been put on a vehicle.

How good can it be for the oil if a car idles for an hour a day in the heat on a 15 mile trip? What does the 15 miles show?? Nothing....

Just my $0.02

ficuss · July 2003

Does anyone have facts concerning use of one touch power windows? Are they allowed to be one touch closing? I just bought an Infiniti G35 and the one touch function will raise any window, without reversing if something is in the path of the window. I have asked about the function on the Infiniti board, but I think more people read this forum. I performed a test and put a hamburger bun in the path of the drivers window after pushing the one touch up button. The window sliced through the bun like it wasn't even there. I hate to think what would happen to a childs arm or finger.

Frank

redline65 · July 2003

The price of the V8 isn't much more than the V6 IIRC. $800 or so?

Save your money and go with the I-6 if you aren't going to be hauling a lot of stuff or towing anything really heavy. Sure it will take about .5 seconds longer to get to 60 mph but you will have $1500 (MSRP) more in your pocket, and save 1-2 mpg in gas (10%?). However, I would suggest the 3.73 or 4.10 rear axle ratio. It'll get you off the line a little quicker.

brunopuntzjone · July 2003

When does the "break-in" period stop and gas milage get to the point that can be expected for the rest of the life of the car (generally speaking)?

Or am I just dumb and making that up about getting better gas milage after approximately X miles.

And a good point on the auto windows. I wish they went up automatically (er if they do, I haven't figured it out). I really wish there was a "break-point" on the auto down. My mum's 00 Jeep Grand Cherokee has a good feel. You push it down until you feel resistance, then push until you hear it click to make it auto go down.

In the TB it's hard to get it to go down just a little, without having it go down all the way.

tmac8 · July 2003

Interesting link on D.O.D. I was planning to trade in my 2002 Envoy in three years for a new one, but now I think I'll either grab a 2004 or wait long enough to evaluate the D.O.D. on the 2005's. Looks good on paper, but then doesn't everything ? Here's a thought; If they're going to cut out half of the cylinders at cruising speed, then why not bump the HP output to 375 or so ? Then you would have P.O.D. (Power on Demand). Wouldn't that be great. Thanks again Steve.

stever · July 2003

Ok Tmac8, let's get GM to stick a turbo on the DOD systems. Get to enjoy the best of both worlds, eh?

Brunopuntzjone, I haven't played with my spreadsheet lately, but my mpg on my minivan has gone up from day one basically. Last I looked, it was still going up - a tiny increment, but up. I was at 20.3 lifetime at 20k and 21.2 at 75k.

fwiw, I went from around 14 to 20 mpg over the first 17,000 miles.

Steve, Host

tblazed · July 2003

"Tblazed...if you have had a problem with todays oil and sludge or you have had your oil tested to backup your opinion.."

Last time I checked, an oil analysis cost $25-30. I can change the oil and filter for about $15 myself so I did not think the analysis was cost-effective. I change it more than once a year due to my short drives and the truck sitting sometimes for a few days at a time. My reasoning for that is 1) moisture that condenses in the engine as it warms up and doesn't always get hot enough to evaporate off that water, and 2) during cold operation up to fully warmed up, closed loop condition, the engine is running more rich, contributing to more carbon buildup in the oil. Regardless of how good todays oils are, they still get contaminated with the normal by-products of the combustion process. My opinion is culminated from over 35 years of vehicle ownership and maintenance, studying a lot of manuals, and asking a lot of questions.

tblazed · July 2003

"I performed a test and put a hamburger bun in the path of the drivers window.." Maybe test it with a roll of paper towels? I think that's how they test garage door opener(closers) to make sure it won't crush a person or animal in the path. Obviously the power window has to have enough power to run the window up with a certain amount of normal drag. I think on the auto-up windows, the system monitors the window motor current. If something restricts the window movement up and the current increases above a certain amount, it will sense that and stop and reverse the window.

redline65 · July 2003

A hamburger bun by itself probably doesn't have enough resistance. Maybe try a Big Mac or Whopper.

scottc454 · July 2003

Come on, be brave and test it with your arm!

dlare · July 2003

The DIC (and other maufacturer installed mileage computers) is basically a "toy" that's designed to give you something to do on those long stretches of boring highway. They're not known for their accuracy, and are most times a little optimistic versus actual numbers.

Dean

dlare · July 2003

"A hamburger bun by itself probably doesn't have enough resistance. 'Maybe try a Big Mac or Whopper.'"

Better yet would be a drumstick (extra krispy) from KFC. That would have the bone inside and emulate a human appendage...

Dean

pauleul · July 2003

Hey, can Onstar roll down the window remotely like they can unlock the doors?

My arm is stuck ;>)

mc3dah · July 2003

Did your broken stud happen at the dealership, or were you doing the rotation yourself?

To replace all 24 at the dealership it cost $380, out of my pocket, so far.

Thanks
David

redline65 · July 2003

Better yet would be a drumstick (extra krispy) from KFC. That would have the bone inside and emulate a human appendage...

Right you are, LOL!

bradrx7 · July 2003

I want to retrofit the new 22 gallon tank into my tiny tank TB. Anyone done this or looked into the mod?

richlavoie · July 2003

I am towing my tent trailer during weekends. I find that when I put the TB on D, it has a hard time keeping up, like it would like to slow down. On the other hand, when I put in 3, what a difference. Very strong, can accelerate on hills, etc. On 3, I keep it at 100km/h (65m/h). The RPM is between 2500 to 3000. I haven't seen much difference in gaz mileage between both. Question is: Should I use D or 3?

I believe it could keep up on D, but I would hate to give it more gaz. It looks like it is not working as hard on 3, just having higher rev (500 RPM more).

I want to change my trailer next year, so I want to make sure this baby can really pull.

I have a 3:42 axle ratio. My tent trailer weigh around 3000 lbs plus load.

Any advise?

dragonhead08 · July 2003

actually i found in my glovebox an amendum from gm. The service people must of put it in there. it says thqat you can use 3rd gear for regular driving for more power. It says that the downside is that more fuel is used. Once I saw that notice I've been using 3rd gear all the time

cwhawk · July 2003

A recent posting asked, so hear is my input:

I used Pennzoil 5W30 at first in my 2002 TB LTZ. It was changed at 1500, 3000, 6000, and 9000 miles. I switched to Mobile 1 at 9000 miles and now have 13,000 on it. I expect to change every 5000 miles with the synthetic.

My gas mileage has remained constant from the second tank of gas. I get 14.5 in combined driving and 19.5 on the highway. The TB has the 3.42 rear axle. All PCM updates have been made and there has been no difference in performance or mileage.

I expected a slight improvement with Mobile 1, however, it has been the same. I drive the same route each day with little traffic.

Overall, I am pleased with the TB, but I did have the usual repairs: headliner, mirrors wandering, AC controls, rear hatch molding. I would like the gas mileage to be closer to the EPA estimates. In every car, I have always exceeded the EPA estimates.

If anyone has done anything to improve gas mileage or performance, let us know.

Buick Rainier, Chevy TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy

Comments

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles