Buick Rainier, Chevy TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy

pmmandejm · October 2003

I have an '04 Envoy XL with XM Satellite Radio. It has distorted sound, which is especially noticeably on talk radio stations. It sounds like it is searching for a signal in the background and has a relatively high-pitched noise. Dealer says this is normal. This does not happen on AM or FM stations. Has anyone had this problem? Is there a fix? This does not seem to be normal.

2002slt · October 2003

Number one...why are you listening to talk radio on XM?
Seriously, I have XM in my boat and don't hear ANY distortion. I only wish there were a way I could get it in my Envoy, without being FM modulated.

jmcwhorter · October 2003

I have an 03 Envoy XL SLE with just the base stereo. The stereo has an AUX button that I'm guessing goes with the optional CD changer. Does anybody know if the wiring harness is still ran even though the changer isnt there. If not, can I order just the wiring harness. Where is the changer in the Envoy. Maybe I could go look myself. I want to tap into that input with a DVD system.

Are there any other message boards that are centered around Envoy performance and aftermarket stuff?

tidester · October 2003

Are there any other message boards that are centered around Envoy performance and aftermarket stuff?

Several. Here's a couple of them:

GMC Envoy Owners: Accessories & Modifications

Toyota Highlander vs GMC Envoy

Also, feel free to discuss performance issues right here!

tidester, host

tblazed · October 2003

Have seen it get to -1°F (-18°C) once. Our record cold down here. It normally gets into the low 20's (F) a few times a year with a nice “brisk” wind from the NNW. Fortunately I have a well-insulated garage and cloth-covered seats. They don't feel as cold when you sit on them, likewise in the summer they don’t fry you when the interior is hitting 135°. In my case I would like forced-air conditioned seats!

scottc454 · October 2003

Fortunately I have a well-insulated garage and cloth-covered seats. They don't feel as cold when you sit on them, likewise in the summer they dont fry you when the interior is hitting 135°.

The durability and ease of cleaning of leather trumps the advantages of cloth.

scottc454 · October 2003

I seem to recall talk about a wiper motor recall? Any news? Is this going to happen?
My intermittent wipers have become overly intermittent.

Kirstie_H · October 2003

scottc454, I've seen that there's a TSB on this, but you might try posting your question in the Technical Service Bulletins to see if any of the techs have additional info.

kirstie_h
Roving Host & Future Vehicles Host

ficuss · October 2003

My 2002 TB wipers were intermittent for a while. They would stop mid wipe when in the interval mode. Bring the car in and they will replace the motor, no questions asked. They know there is a problem. They will fix it. If you wait too long, they may quit entirely during a rain.

Frank

tblazed · October 2003

"The durability and ease of cleaning of leather trumps the advantages of cloth." But the comfort of cloth beats leather, to me anyway. Hot or cold. The leather seats in these seem very hard to me, except in the Bravada, I like those. Everyone has preferences. And in a few years I won't have cracking deteriorating leather to look at. Don't eat in it so no worry about cleaning any gunk off the seats. Also aren't these just leather on the seating surfaces only, and if so the vinyl trim around the sides will give out well before the leather does. Been my experience anyway. Good thing there are choices. Different strokes...

ficuss · October 2003

ah yes, rich Corinthian Rayon. BTW, you won't generate static electricity getting out of leather seats.

2002slt · October 2003

"BTW, you won't generate static electricity getting out of leather seats."

If they aren't helping to generate it, what is? I have had leather in my last 3 vehicles, and have certainly been shocked upon exiting them. Usually only occurs during the cold months here in the Chicago area.
I kind of like it in the mornings, though. It helps to get me going.

ficuss · October 2003

The only times I've had static electric buildup in cars was when the cars had a cloth or velour seat. I'm in Chicago also, so the climate is the same. Some cars will build up static due to other reasons besides seats. I had a Honda Accord that built up so much static that I would shock the toll booth attendants if I handed them coins. This had nothing to do with the seats, since I didn't leave the car. There are many possible causes for static buildup in cars. The seats are only one of them. You usually feel the static when your foot touches the ground and your hand or arm touches the metal car body.

kpp14 · October 2003

"I kind of like it in the mornings, though. It helps to get me going.

"
Hey Mike. (Sorry but I can't help myself)Wouldn't sitting on sub-zero leather absolutely freeze your (insert your favourite slang here)......... off. As far as getting going in the morning I prefer a coffee while driving.
t-blazed, us guys in the North can't clean the leather or anything else for that matter unless you have a heated and insulated garage. The truck and your cleaning chemicals get frozen solid. Toronto dumps 1000's of tons of salt on the roads to melt the ice and snow. A little coffee on the seats is nothing compared to the road crap everywhere. Buffalo NY gets the worst winter conditions anywhere because of the lake. You can go off-roading on the road there! Host, if someone uses "questionable words" but is still funny does he get booted in the..i mean out.

tidester · October 2003

...if someone uses "questionable words" but is still funny does he get booted in the...

It depends on how "questionable" the words are! It doesn't take too much skill to find a way of saying what you want without testing the boundaries - unless of course you hit your thumb with a hammer in which case prompt utterances are unavoidable and serve to mitigate the intense discomfort. But then you're not posting on a message board anyway! ;-)

tidester, host

aldan93 · October 2003

First snow flakes of the year are FLYING!!! Lets see if we can get more than last years 10 FEET!!!
LOL!!! I'm from the south town's of Buffalo, we get it the worst, Near the Boston Hills!!!! Thats why I snapped and got a TB in DEC 29 of 2002!!!!

leopardmech · October 2003

Hey KPP it you would drive your Trailblazer an hour north on the 400(just to keep it on topic) to Barrie you will see what snow really is. The snow belt is here and it is amazing how much difference an hour on the highway makes. The snow on my lawn last year was up to my chest.
Those guys in the south don't know how good they have it other than the fact they don't get to live in Canada.

Later
Leopardmech

tblazed · October 2003

Yes, I have spilled coffee on my cloth seats. It beaded up- did not soak in or stain. It seems to have an effective fabric protectant on the cloth. Darn "cup holders" these have don't fit any coffee cup I have found so far.

One thing I noticed on both the Bravada and the Rainier I looked at last week at the fair, they both use basically the same console, they are missing one cup holder hole on the console. A piece of wood grain plastic is there instead.

BTW- Potential Bravada owners, get your piece of Oldsmobile history as GM puts it, '04 "Oldsmobile Final 500 Edition" Bravada while they last starting in January. They get special fender badges and embroidering on the seats.

ross1962_99 · October 2003

My two cents: The reason I opted for cloth is that leather doesn't really hold up well to salt water and sunscreen lotion. I bought my TB, so I could put my surfboards on it and take it to and from the beach. It is an SUV after all.

bobbies · October 2003

Hi folks...My 02 Bravada is about due for fuel filter change. Will anyone tell me where it is and the best way to depressurize the system. I plan to remove the gas cap first. Is there anything else to depressurize? Any issues I should be aware of? Thankx

scottc454 · October 2003

I haven't done it, but I heard you can remove a fuse to the fuel pump. Then start it and run it until it uses up the pressurized fuel between the pump and the engine.

I don't know if I'd bother. You'll be getting fuel on yourself no matter what.

scottc454 · October 2003

My two cents: The reason I opted for cloth is that leather doesn't really hold up well to salt water and sunscreen lotion.

Yeah but how does cloth hold up? Doesn't it soak up everything and stay wet? I guess maybe they have Scotchguard or something on them. With proper care, leather will hold up fine to that stuff. Also, these seats have some sort of super protective coating on them - nothing appears to soak into the actual leather, because they dry instantly when I wash them.

I bought my TB, so I could put my surfboards on it and take it to and from the beach. It is an SUV after all.

Some folks out there knock SUV's for having leather seats, saying that's a luxury item that's out of place on a real SUV. Of course, nothing could be further from the truth. Leather is rugged, easily cleaned, and truly belongs in an SUV. What are the best hiking boots made out of? Leather!
Run DMC named an album called "Tougher than Leather." I'm not sure "Tougher than Cloth" would have the same effect, nor would referring to Marines as "clothnecks."

Allright, I'm hereby finished promoting the benefits of leather seats.

quickdtoo · October 2003

You can find detailed instructions here.
http://www.e-toolbox.com/ads/rq.cfm

tblazed · October 2003

Going by my ol'88 S-10 out there in the garage with the red cloth seating surfaces on its bucket seats, the cloth still looks fine, after 15+ years no wear to show no holes or visible wear, but the sides that are made of vinyl are cracking and splitting. That's the way the leather seats are on most cars and SUVs or whatever- leather on the seating surfaces only and trimmed around the sides and backs with vinyl. I'd almost bet money the seats on the triplets are only leather on the seating surfaces too.

"With proper care, leather will hold up fine to that stuff." I thought the advantage was you don't have to do much to maintain it. I go over my cloth seats with a vacuum cleaner maybe twice a year. With leather I could be out there putting leather cleaner and conditioner stuff on the seats a couple of times a year. Not too sure I see the advantage there as far as maintenance goes.

But like I've said before, if the Trailblazers had the same type of leather seats as the Bravada, I'd go for those. Just personally I did not like the hardness of the Chevy seats in leather.

gator36 · October 2003

As far as I know, you CANNOT remove a fuse to the fuel pump as the engine will not start. The proper way is to get a fuel pressure gauge that allows for the bleeding of pressure off. It dumps the fuel through a hose into a receptacle you provide. The Gauge screws into the fuel rail fitting provided for pressure readings and such. Even after bleeding the pressure, disconnecting the fuel lines will release a good amount of fuel.

quickdtoo · October 2003

That's the correct procedure according to the factory service manual, done it myself. Although technically you remove the fuel pump relay, not the fuse, same thing happens, the fuel pump won't energize when the ignition is switched on. tim

wpkelleysr · October 2003

I have an '02 Trailblazer with the straight 6. My latest performance products catalog says that K&N has a polished aluminum kit that will replace the air box/filter. Looks pretty cool. Has anyone had any experience with these? Are they smog legal in California (I live in the Sierras).

- WPK

ross1962_99 · October 2003

The K&N Filtercharger and the Fuel Injection Perfrmance Kit (FIPK) are legal in CA. the other products are not. I use the filtercharger and I think it's well worth the money. Order on the Internet for the best price. I paid $50. I've seen them locally for $80. Performance is good.
Some have posted here that they got better performance by modifying the box (removing baffles), but you have to be careful that you don't introduce warm air from the engine, or radiator into the intake. Doing this also will increase noise when accelerating.

dse1 · October 2003

Just did this last week.

steps to depressurize:
1. remove fuel cap
2. remove fuel pump RELAY from fuse box (labeled on the top/inside of the box cover)
3. start the car, and let the engine stall (mine only cranked), then let it crank a few more seconds
4. remove the negative terminal from the battery
5. replace the relay AND the gas cap

replace the fuel filter (it's directly in front of the fuel tank, towards the front of the car, on the driver's left)

6. reconnect the negative terminal

then if you trust your work, just turn the ignition to the run position (don't start it) for 10 secs, then back to off for a few seconds and it should be back to new....

just make sure to bring lots of towels for the fuel that's still in the pump and lines, it's not pressurized, but gravity still does it's thing...

easy 2-3 min job, I spent twice as long trying to find the relay they show in a diagram in the service manual - obviously an old photo, looks more like the PCM than the actual relay...

momstruck1 · October 2003

went to get gas in NJ currently cheaper then here in NY. Well at the station not only did the attendant spill gas all over my TB but a few days later I noticed the Service Eng. soon light on and guess what it was. The attendant never put the cap back on the tank. the light has since gone off . i am just warning all of you in states where you can not pump your own gas to just get out and look after the attendant is done . I will always do this now .

tblazed · October 2003

Can't help but ask- what's the deal with that? They protecting the gas attendants union or??

I guess that would help eliminate the occasional no-pay drive-offs that happen. Do they make you get out of the vehicle for safety while they pump it for you? (I guess that would explain that VW ad they used to run on TV where the driver is standing outside the car in the rain while the attendant up-sells him to Super Premium and pumps the gas. Didn't make much sense to me before.)

Last time I remember getting full-serve and no choice to pump it myself was in '69 or '70. Unless you are in a high class neighborhood around these parts where they offer full serve at about 50¢ a gal. higher price, it's all self-serve.

On my TB the original cap was teathered to the vehicle. I since took that off and put on a locking cap. Was yours left loose or was it gone?

quickdtoo · October 2003

Yup, they aren't the only one, Oregon has no self service gas either, it's illegal to pump it yourself. Consequently, gas is considerably more expensive than here in Washington just across the river. Full service gas stations in Washington are few and far between, don't know of any locally. tim

dragonhead08 · October 2003

if anyones interested in gettiong in on a pre order for custom gauges. ie you decide colors and logs. go here. I'm itchin to get my hands on these.

http://www.speedhut.com/15orders_el_detail.asp?auto_number=48&amp- ;bhcp=1

boat10 · October 2003

Trading my TB I got in May 2001 (31528 miles) for a new 2004 TB/LT.
Looked at the Rainer, but for the money I'll stay in the TB. Fully loaded @$39,745.28. Same options on the Rainer was over $43,000.(no V8)
Never had any real problems with my '02, just the normal nitpicking items which were fixed by my selling dealer with no hassle.
I've read everyone one of the posts to this board and cannot belive some of the things people bring up to squak about. New vehicles need a year or two to get all the bugs out; so that's why I'm headed to a new 2004.

ficuss · October 2003

My only squawk with trading in a 2 year old with 31k miles would be the amount lost on the deal. The only reason ( unless it was leased) to ever trade in a car with that low mileage is if the car is a disappointment, either mechanically or power wise. Assuming the TB had good power performance, it must have been the "normal nitpicking items" that pushed you to dump an otherwise good car. Normally, normal nit-picking items don't push someone into selling after just 2 years, they must have been worse. BTW, if you don't mind, how much did you lose on depreciation?

jimmyp1 · October 2003

because they want to and because they can. Not saying I agree, I'm much more in your camp ficuss, but I've seen the other side.

Jim

agenteleven · October 2003

I took my 02TBLTZ in for the wipers skipping and hesitating across the windshield in rainsense mode.

After reading about some of the similar problems folks were having with water in the motor housings, I thought the dealer would know about this...

I picked it up and was told my charge would be $40 for wiper blade inserts... said that my current blades were "dried out" and that's what was causing the problem (never mind that it worked fine in normal mode).

The wipers work OK now, but then, it's been dry for a while here.

I paid for their expensive inserts after deciding that if I refused them, they would always attribute the problem to the inserts. I just hope the wipers start to act up again before these inserts "dry out."

scottc454 · October 2003

$40 for wiper inserts? Ouch! Dried out wipers would probably slide across the windshield better.

I have the same problem with my wiper motors.
Although it appears that the blades are binding up on the windshield, I proved otherwise by putting the blades in the up position and turning on rainsense mode. They still hesitate.

agenteleven · October 2003

Yeah, $40. If it wasn't for the laundry list of other warranty items that I had it in for, I would have screamed bloody murder.

Good idea about pulling the arms up! I'll try that next time I take it in to prove it's not the blades.

packy910 · October 2003

Help! I' continue to have a consistent squeak in the front end of my 2002 Envoy. It sounds as if it is coming from the right front end. Have taken to dealer on numerous occasions and they are clueless. Can anyone shed some light on the culprit? I supect there is a somewhat prevalent problem. Last time they were looking they loaned me an '03 Trailblazer. It had the squeak too!

kpp14 · October 2003

"Can anyone shed some light on the culprit?"
Did you mean, how did the culprit become clueless?

My dealer has had six "squeakers" on the front right side of the Envoy. Go outside and lubricate the right hood hinge and see if that works, worked on six Envoys I know about.

4156 · October 2003

I found my squeak to be from the hood latch. Lube that part of the U shaped rod that is attached to the hood, where it hits the latch when closed.

gam2 · October 2003

My squeek is between the plastic inner fender and the sheetmetal under the air filter box.

Yikes!

GAM

offroad57 · October 2003

my front end squeak on both 02 tb.and 04 tb.stopped when the rubber hood stops was greased with lithuim grease.talk about taking a loss,22000 trade in with 12,000 mi.but lots of problems with 02.i thought there was no difference in trans.prog.but after taking trip with lots of steep hills that i also took in the 02 the difference is like night and day,constant dropping out of overdrive,i never did feel the 02 go into overdrive while i owned it,dont know if something was wrong with the 02 or the 04 gonna have it checked soon i know the throttles not right on the 04 too much foot pressure to take off from a red light or stop sign.other vehicles take off and im still sitting with enough pressure on the throttle to be moving.anyway if theres nothing wrong with the trans.in the 04 i had much rather have the 02 trans.prog.sorry for the long post.have a good evening all.

richardcoulson · October 2003

My squeak was resolved by replacing the front shock bushings. I didn't know that shock bushings could be replaced without replacing the shocks...

jvwheel · October 2003

My 2003 TB LTZ (straight six engine) Temp-Gage approached the Red Line when I was stuck in heavy Frwy traffic for about 35 minutes. The traffic was stop and go, never exceeding 20 MPH. The outside temperature was 105 degrees and I was using the A/C, Stereo, and the Onstar phone. The gage returned to normal (straight up) once the traffic cleared up and I was able to travel uninterrupted at 50 MPH. Has any one else experienced over-heating. I am concerned that this vehicle will not be able to travel in the mountains of Arizona or pull light trailers even on flat terrain. Does anyone have experience with these uses. Thanks!

ficuss · October 2003

did you notice if the cooling fan engaged? You would be able to tell by the roar it makes. If not, your TB may have a bad control or the fan may be bad. This may be a good time to investigate the possibility of forcing the cooling fan on manually via a simple switch. Flipping the switch would give you 100% fan activation. How about it GM. Can it be done?

Frank

ltz2003 · October 2003

My 03 LTZ did the same thing last may in SC pulling my trailer. But it did not overheat i forgot about it till i seen your post.Dont know if my fan was working never gave it a thought.If you go to the dealer and they have a way to check it keep us posted.

jvwheel · October 2003

No - there was no roar of a fan. I guess the fan didn't engage. Thanks for the probe - I will have the fan tested at my next oil change. I hope that is all it is - A vehicle that can't be driven in traffic or climb a hill is not of much use.

ficuss · October 2003

one more thing, just because the temp. creeps toward hot doesn't mean your car is overheating. The fan is programmed to come on in stages. If the car had actually overheated without the fan coming on at all, I suspect the engine would have shut down to a reduced power level, and the air conditioning would have shut down. Your temp gauge may be a little off too.

Buick Rainier, Chevy TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy

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