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Comments
I am mentioning this because I wonder if there has been a slight design change in the 3rd light. My TB was built in June.
it sounds as if you know what you want as far as options go on your Trailblazer, so it is easy to get MSRP and invoice prices. Edmunds, kbb.com, nadaguides.com, or autosite.com will all give you MSRP and invoice price on both base vehicle and options. These figures should all be the same on each site.
The dealer does not buy the vehicle from GM at invoice; you have to take into account holdback and what GM calls wholesale financial reserve (floorplan fee),which are both reimbursed to dealer by GM. So, even at invoice price, dealer would make money on the deal.
However, the dealer has to make an appropriate profit to pay the bills and stay in business. Thus, an offer of 5% over dealer cost is usually fair for both you and the dealer. Dealer cost is usually Invoice-holdback-WFR-any rebates; keep in mind that figuring the actual dealer cost is darn near impossible, but the above formula should get you close.
Another helpful site for figuring what you should offer the dealer on a new vehicle is carbuyingtips.com. They have an Excel spreadsheet there that you can download that will take you step-by-step through all of these figures and come up with a fair offer price.
Good luck...I think your original offer of $250.00 over invoice sounds like a good deal.
On my Bravada, I have not ever noticed the pumps running after I start the car (I use the car practically every day). There are times when I go an entire weekend without using the car, and it doesn't discharge enough to cause the compressors to kick in on startup. Usually the only time there is any activity is when I go into a curve sharply that causes the body to roll, or when more than the usual number of people get into the car.
I agree that if the compressor were to run every day, likely it is being over worked for it's designed duty cycle and will prematurely wear out. It is easy to imagine the pump having been designed for height adjustments that take care of discharge whenever the adjustments are made, and that is all. Heck, even basketballs last en entire season without having to refill.
I'm glad to report that my Envoy with 5500 miles is not showing no more sign of oil loss after my 5000 mile oil change. There must have been some problem with the oil supply from GM?
KJ
I don't plan on heavy towing, if any towing at all(you never know).
I drive many highway and city miles.
I like having acceleration at my disposal when I want it!!!!
Is there a large noticable difference between the 3.73 and 4.10? I think my desire for good acceleration rules out the stock 3.53.
Thanks for any explantion and advice.
SAEpope
WARRANTY GOLD
www.warrantygold.com
NEW PLATINUM
Term Miles Price
5 Years 75000 $904
5 Years 100000 $1054
5 Years 150000 $1504
6 Years 60000 $754
6 Years 72000 $954
6 Years 100000 $1104
7 Years 70000 $1004
7 Years 100000 $1154
NEW PLATINUM
Coverage Benefits Include:
60 Day Preview Period
Can be Used in U.S. and/or Canada
Repairs Paid by Visa/Mastercard
Your Choice of Reputable Repair Facility
Sign & Drive Roadside Assistance
Convenient Payment Plan
--------------------------------------------------
Prices do not reflect unpublished discounts.
Call now for current specials.
=========================================
WARRANTY DIRECT
www.warrantydirect.com
--- 2002 GMC Envoy
--- 250 Miles
Terms: Diamond Platinum
$50 Deductible $50 Deductible
3 Years 45000 Miles $600.00 N/A
4 Years 60000 Miles $725.00 N/A
5 Years 75000 Miles $1,100.00 $975.00
5 Years 100000 Miles $1,250.00 $1,175.00
5 Years 150000 Miles $1,875.00 $1,725.00
6 Years 60000 Miles $975.00 $900.00
6 Years 72000 Miles $1,100.00 $1,000.00
6 Years 100000 Miles $1,300.00 $1,225.00
7 Years 70000 Miles $1,100.00 $1,025.00
7 Years 85000 Miles $1,250.00 N/A
7 Years 100000 Miles $1,350.00 $1,275.00
Zero Deductible Add $75.00 Add $50.00
Saepope...I would not get 4.10s unless you are planning on quite a bit of towing. The tires on these models are a lot smaller diameter than the full size pickups (which lowers the effective gear ratio), and from experience I can tell you that 4.10s were a step lower than needed on my 2000 Silverado, since I didn't do much towing.
jim f
I've learned more in the last couple of hours reading your advice and comments than a week at the dealerships.
I could go either way between Envoy Or TB. I could get a TB quicker with what I want and was about to make a deal when I noticed that TB does not have the self/leveling air suspension. For trailering up to 4000 lbs, is there an advantage to the air suspension? Is it fairly trouble free? Will the standard shocks on the chevy keep the rear from sinking alot? GM has 3 different vehicles that are basically the same but TB does not offer the air suspension. Why???
I will order either the 3.73 or 4.10 instead of the stock 3.42. I had a Tahoe and I loved it but wished I had the lower ratio. Any thoughts?
It's been 16 years since I bought a new car.... and I wouldn't be now if a stupid girl hadn't rear-ended me (not another car on the street, go figure). My "old" car is now a "totalled" (but I still can drive it) Old -top Cutlass and I feel like the bride at the altar with buying this new Bravada. Everything has changed so much! So please forgive the ignorance.
Now, here is my latest dilemma. I've seen posts regarding maintaining a good relationship with the dealer. Well, I bought the new Bravada 40 miles away and about 1 1/2 hours drive-time...yeah, there was a reason. But obviously, I don't want to drive all the way up there for service and if I have major problems, I couldn't leave it overnight....... There are 2 other Old dealers here in town. Do you think I would get satisfactory service from them even though I didn't buy the car from them? How about resolution of problems, God forbid, if they arise? Any thoughts on this would be appreciated.
During the break in period, I pretty much followed the guidelines but did go up to 65 for very short periods on the freeway. Almost all my driving was country and freeway and I averaged 20.1 mpg for the first 540 miles. I suspect this may go down a little now that I will step on it a bit more to accelerate and drive a steady 70 on the freeway.
Hambone7 - 12.5 mpg is a lot different than what I got. You either drove it a lot different or have a problem and should see the dealer.
Saepope - I think you would be happy with either the 4.10 or 3.73. There is no doubt the 4.10 will give the best acceleration. The 4.10 is a must for heavy towing and would allow for light towing in drive instead of third as recommended. For towing a mid weight trailer (which I have at 3,000 lbs) you should tow in 3rd gear. At 70 mph this means the engine will be turning at about 3,500 rpm. A 3.73 rear end would lower that to 3,200 rpm and be a little easier on the engine and still provide adequate power.
So far I have no complaints about this vehicle. My wife and I love it and are delighted with all the bells and whistles.
Even the Edmunds Host of that section will give you the same advice....that the Factory warranty is your best bet for "NO Hassle" service.
Hope this reaches you in time!!!
P.S. They are always "always" running "Specials"!!!Be Cautious!!!!Sometimes, spending a few dollars more can save you money in the long haul.
Engine noise difference is insignificant between 2100 and 2300.
After evaluating a number of extended warranty outfits I've come to the conclusion that my peace of mind would best be served by putting the money it would cost in the bank or going with an extended manufacturers' warranty.
There were just too few statistics forthcoming to get a comfort level about these firms; there were too many cleverly crafted legal exceptions in their contracts; vague future preventive maintenance requirements gave them too much wiggle room; and the smell of a shell game with a series of corporate name changes, re-insurance companies, risk retention groups, off-shore offices, and independent administrators worried me.
Final adjudication appears the sole discretion of their administrator, or you must go through a very expensive and time consuming arbitration process. Finally their slick marketing answers to lots of straight forward questions, the hint of company shills and paid-for recommendations on these sites, and too many horror stories about lack of service, killed any interest for me.
The peace of mind we are looking for is much more possible via an extended manufacturers' warranty.
Any help is appreciated.
Troutfan
www.arifleet.com/production.html#gmtrucks
Anyone with similar expeience or thoughts on problem?
Brad
tpellow - was at Olds dealer yesterday and the DVD player will also be available on the Bravada as our dealer said it's no longer constrained on their computer (nor is the sandalwood paint color for anyone that cares, although you all porbably already knew that...) I woudn't be surprised to see it on the Envoy as well, but that's my opinion...
Anyway, I got into a wreck about a week ago and totaled my wife's car (ouch and ouch), but I'm now looking for a new vehcle for her. Looking around, the Bravada is at the top of her list and I like it also (I like the looks of the TBs better, but who am I to say anything) We were able to test drive it and play around with the bells & whitsles and, in short, it's a solid vehicle with a very smooth ride. I did notice the air compressor running at the beginning of the test drive along with the hissing of discharging air (kinda sounds like a bus), but it only happened once during the 1/2 hour ride, so I guess it wouldn't be a big deal. Also, the sales dude started the engine and about 40 seconds later, it died at idle. I'm already a little weary about throwing this much money at an American manufacturer, and that didn't help ease my mind...
Anyway, my questions:
1. Has anyone had any problems with this new Vortec, or had any additional maintenance performed for any reason?
2. Does anyone have any crash test data or know of anyplace to look for this model year Bravada? The only thing I have seen is on the Autobytel website under safety (credibility?) and it lists the Bravada as POOR. This doesn't sit well with me either as I was just involved in a collision and don't want my wife and family driving around in something that won't protect them as well as another vehicle for the same $$$...
3. In line with the last question, how are insurance rates for this vehicle? I know it depends a a bunch of coverage variables, but would you consider it comparable to other vehicles in this class, higher/lower?
4. Do these vehicle have child seat safety anchors? Couldn't tell during our dealer trip, perhaps someone out there knows...
5. Finally, a money question. is $32,500 a good price for the Bravada with convenience pkg, 6 disc & heated seats? I know I can get this via GMS, but should I/can I try to do better by haggling? Don't know if I can get under $32K.
Thanks for laboring through this and any answers/opinions to the above would help greatly with our decision. I like the vehicle a lot, and the 60/60K Olds warranty helps ease my mind a lot as well, with my only remining issue being the safety factor. Thanks.
Yes there are child safety seat anchors in the rear cargo area right behind the rear seat back. This provides the anchor point the seat strap to attach to. Full instructions are in the owners manual -- ask your dealer to show you.
Also I saw a post somewhere regarding price, and
if you're willing to wait to travel or have one shipped, you might want to check:
http://www.98over.com
You purportedly can pick up most GM/Daimler-Chrysler vehicles for $98 over factory invoice. See site for details. Had I known about this site, I might have tried them before utilizing GMS pricing plus the $1000 GM loyalty check that I received in the mail... Has anyone here bought their vehicle thru 98over.com?
Just got my 2002 Envoy SLT on Saturday and thanks to this site I feel, for once that I got a good deal on a vehicle. The information from this board and site was very helpful while negotiating with the dealer.
So far, so good. Love my Envoy!!
When I press the "Auto Vol" button it gives me two choices "On" "Off". (This is different from the non-6 disk version which gives several choices).
My problem is that I push the button (when I push it "Auto Vol OFF" always displays) until it shows "on". Then I just leave it there. I have noticed NO difference in audio volume even if I open the moonroof at highway speed. (I have tried the same thing in my Cadillac Seville and I can hear a NOTICABLE difference in the audio volume both going up and down).
Funny thing is, when I press the "Auto Vol" button it ALWAYS comes up to "OFF". I have taken it to the dealer several times but they said that all of the Bravada's they have do that.
I'm not sure what to do next. I thought I would see if anyone else has theirs stay to the "on" position.
Thanks in advance.
http://www.arifleet.com/production.html#gmtrucks
will inform you should production be stopped or delayed.
In short if you turn it on and you roll down your windows while your driving the volume should stay the same as if you did not roll down the windows. If you read the section above in the manual for the AUTO VOL. you will be able to understand the difference with the NON-Bose. Sometimes the Owners Manual knows more than the dealers do. Hope this helps.
1. Toyota Highlander
2. Ford Escape
3. Mazda Tribute
4. Jeep Liberty
5. Jeep Grand Cherokee
6. Chewy Trailblazer
Here is my humble opinion regarding each of the aforementioned vehicles.
Toyota Highlander
Great ride. The handling of theHL is excellent. the looks are also great. However, as I continually looked at the vehicle, it reminded me too much of a mini-van which I was currently selling. I wanted an suv with the ride and handling of a car. The HL certainly can deliver on that, but the mini-van look and, I think, the higher prices that Toyota is commanding made me look elsewhere. I currently also own a Camry so it was hard not to go Toyota again.
Ford Escape
Great handling, great road feel, middle of the road interior and great engine performance. However, I couldn*t get over the extensive plastic lower body cladding. I had to pass due to this design feature. I know that the vehicle is supposed to present an "outdoors look" but I wanted a mix that also looks good at the country club. If the escape came with painted matching or contrasting bumpers and cladding, I probably would have picked this vehicle.
Tribute
Really this was my first choice until I finally got to drive an ES model last week. The road manners around town are great. However, on the open highway the stiff ride was not comfortable. Especially in the back seat. I felt at highway speeds of 60-70 the ride in the back made me crave for dramamine. Also, I was very dissapointed in the interior appointments. The cargo compartment carpeting looked like it was cut, end-stitched and just layed in the back end. Also, the head-liner over the cargo compartment on both sides hung down and was not even tucked into place. Also, the dealer was charging $350 over msrp. (Give me a break). This vehicle does not command that kind of money. No vehicle does. In my mind, no vehicle commands msrp. I ruled the vehicle out due those reasons.
Jeep liberty
Although not that spacious in the cargo compartment, this vehicle is great. I test drove a full leather version with the premium stereo system. MSRP was 26,200. The vehicle handled supperbly although the ride is a little stiff, especially on uneven pavement. This feature was especially evident in the back seat. IN the front seat this was not an issue. The interior appointments are the best of all the vehicles I test drove. The white guages with the I*ll call platinum trim are great. The leather seats looked great although I am not partial to leather.
The tail-gate system that Jeep employs on this vehicle is great. One pull of the lever and the window pops open. Two pulls and the gate swings open. One big pitfall concerning this vehicle though for me stems from the tire mounting on the swing gate. I just personally don*t like tires mounted on the back because of damage that could ensue with minor rear end collisions. Also, the swing feature of the rear gate presents a problem for a guy like me who frequently hauls junk bought at Home-Depot that is longer that the cargo area and requires the lift-gate to be up. With the liberty this type of hauling would be impossible. Also, the cargo compartment on this vehicle is limited without the seats folded down. This would be a real limitation on vacation trips. Although this vehicle definitely raised my blood pressure, from a handling and interior design standpoint more than any other that I tested, for the above reasons I had to rule it out. However, I predict that I will own a Liberty as a second vehicle some day.
Grand Cherokee
The grand cherokee is one of the best looking SUV*s on the road in my opinion. I test drove a Laredo. I liked the road handling of the GC. I also liked the interior although Jeep has not done as good a job in this department as with the liberty. I was very concerned with the horror stories that I have read on this website regarding brake rotors, drive lines, etc. etc, and the poor maintenance record of this vehicle. I personally spoke to two people at my place of employment who have had extensive problems in this regard with the 99 jgc. During my test drive I noticed what I percieved to be a very loud engine roar when stopped at red lights during "in town" driving. Also, although the interior was quite nice in the grand cherokee, I expected a little bit better. With the 2500 jeep rebates, the prices are quite attractive on this vehicle which prompted my test drive. However, after all was said and done, I could not forget all of the vehicle problems which I have heard about. For those reasons, I had to rule out the vehicle.
Chevy Trailblazer
After the first test drive of the TB I was impressed. My mother has a 96 Blazer and I was very biased towards the negative when I first drove this vehicle. Since I have owned 7 foreign vehicles since my last Chevrolet, I never thought that this is where I would end my search. The interior of the TB is "so-so". I purchased the LS with the LS-3 package. My TB also came with the raised white letter tires which made the indigo blue color my favorite choice. The engine in this vehicle is quite remarkable when compared to the old Blazer models. The 270 horses really pull the hills in this part of the country. Also when merging onto the interstate, the engine provides more than enough umppphh to merge and leave traffic in the dust. another reason that I chose the TB was the price compared to the options that came standard. Standard on the vehicle are anti-lock brakes, side-air bags, a full spare with matching aluminum wheel, rear heat and ac and dual climate controls. For the money, I thought that the standard option packages as well as the ls-3 package was as good a bargain as could be expected in these days of inflated prices. I believe that Chevy could do more with the dash system as far as looks go and I feel that it is rather pedestrian. Also, the rear seat is comfortable but rather upright and non-adjustable. I am waiting to see how a 10 hour ride to the beach will work out in the rear seat. However, the front seats are a 100% improvement over the old models. Also included on the ls package is a manual lumbar adjustment which is great. Also, with the in-line six the problem of where to place your feet up front has been eliminated with this new iteration TB.
The vehicle has a brute look about is which I feel is important in an suv. The ride is very comfortable. In fact I would compare it to that of a luxury automobile. Also, the quiteness of the engine coupled with low level interior noise levels lead me to the TB as my choice. If the repair man does not raise his ugly head too many times during the next three years, I feel that I may have been converted back the the "Good old USA". I*m
TB too. I can*t stand the road debris which kicks up on the sides. Even the 3-m tire dressing is already showing up as little drops on the side of my new vehicle. Also, does anyone out there know of a place to get a good deal on a bike rack that would slide into the class III hitch on the back of the TB. I really only need the capability to haul two mountain bikes. Any held would truly be appreciated. thank you.