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Comments
Summary:
-2002 Trailblazer LT 2WD
-Transmission failure at 78,000 miles
-Near accident with two children in car ages 2 and 7
-Major repair cost
-Significant safety problem
-Multiple listings of identical failures (sun shell/ reaction gear) planetary system.
-Reportedly known defective and (under designed) part. This will be the NHTSA’s responsibility to investigate and sort out.
-Some reports of “silent recall” however never acknowledged with my conversations
-No warning of oncoming failure
-Owners manual doesn’t recommend any transmission service until 100,000 miles
-Never towed anything
-Wife driven/ garage kept
-Significant engineering accomplishments in transmissions have been made in the past decade with materials and lubricants. There is absolutely no reason a tranny should fall apart on an automible towing or not under 100,000 miles especially if your following the manufacturers maintenance recommendations.
Read on if you have time.
On 10/26/06 while traveling with my two children( 2 and 7) the transmission failed in my 2002 (TB)Trailblazer LT. I was merging into 40~45 mph traffic from a side road, there was more than adequate time to enter traffic and accelerate to traffic speed before oncoming traffic would approach. Entering the intersection I heard and felt a heavy clunk in the rear of the TB and immediately following a horrendous screech and whine (transmission failing). I immediately checked the rear-view mirror since I was now in quickly approaching traffic with no power. The engines RPM’s raced and I let off the gas and then slowly re-applied the gas and the transmission caught (worked), however I could only get the SUV up to about 20mph fearing engine problems because the tranny wouldn’t shift gears and engines RPM’s were racing. At the same time I yelled at the kids to hold on because it looked like the approaching car wasn’t slowing down. ( I assume they saw me enter traffic and presumed I would be at traffic speed by the time they approached). For the second time I heard a horrendous screeching this time the tires of the car behind me. I’m certain that car would have hit us had they not managed to swerve slightly to the right rear of my TB. I managed to slowly drive the TB to the closest Chevrolet dealership, fortunately only a couple of minutes away, and getting the finger from every pissed off Black Friday shopper in the city. Left the TB with dealership and tried to deal with two children and transportation arrangements.
The service department called me back with preliminary diagnosis (blown transmission) metal shavings in the transmission oil and no reverse. They would not do a complete break-down because they were aware of similar problems plus the additional cost of a full breakdown analysis. The sun-shell “grenades” per the technicians words. I told them to go ahead and replace the transmission since I could not afford to be without a vehicle (which ended up costing me an arm a leg and another leg, plus 7 days ) even after GM paid 30%. I didn’t have the money to cover this but the worse of the two evils was to be without a vehicle.
After doing extensive research on the subject it is easy to find that there is definitely a faulty part and a significant safety issue here. Google this for instance: “2002 trailblazer transmission problems +sun gear”. The only thing preventing a full re-call in my thoughts (being an engineer myself) is the huge cost to the manufacturer to recall and replace/repair this problem and most importantly there has not been an injury to date (at least not reported). I am certain Chevrolet/GM is fully aware of the problem based on my research and they are sitting on the problem until they are forced to make a recall, I pray that it is not at the expense of someones life. To see over 81 complaints actually registered with the NHTSA within a narrow search criteria go to:
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/complain/complaintsearch.cfm
use the vehicle search +
Year : 2002
Make : CHEVROLET
Model : TRAILBLAZER
Component: POWER TRAIN:AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION
Some of these complaints do not match my problem but there are TOO MANY that have exactly the same phenomena as I have described (think of how many people just don’t pursue this problem).
Read on if you want to know about my Customer Service conversations.
Customer Service experience:
Talked to Customer service manager and took general information details etc , Immediately transferred me to Specialist (maybe because I mentioned silent recall). Specialist went over details I gave to first person and was very apologetic, however never admitted or denied to the silent recall. Scheduled a follow up phone discussion for two days later after she had time to review the material. Received phone message that specialist would not be able to keep appointment because of promotion however she had advanced the issue to the next level district manager to see if they “couldn’t get this covered” (still have the recorded message). Got a call on 10/29/06 TB was fixed, asked if they heard anything from Cust. Serv. (no). Told them I would have to wait until I heard from them before I proceeded. Called back several times with no return phone call on 10/29/06 because TB was ready. Tried again on 10/30/06 and finally got specialist around noon that day. Specialist said they had reviewed the material and decided to cover 30% of the charges, to which I questioned the obvious known defect and unquestionable safety issue and said this should be 100% covered. This transmission was only at 75% of the mileage before they recommend the first service. The specialist just sat there and listened and never gave any answer just that they had made there decision. At that point I suggested they contact the dealership and ensure the paper work was handled, I needed the car today. Of course I called the dealership before I left work for the day to confirm the paper work was handled and it was not. Immediately called back specialist (this, 4 hours after our initial conversation) and she said she had just talked to them and everything was okay. Demanded she have the District manager call me since he was involved with the decision, to which she said she would put in the request. Called back dealership to confirm and they said still waiting on final decision, so I had to wait until 10/31/06. Talked to dealership on 10/31/06 and still hadn’t finalized with cust. Serv. At this point I’m livid and demand an immediate answer. Dealership calls back shortly and says car is ready and with appropriate paperwork. Got my car and left , never received a call from district manager.
Make your complaint known to the NHTSA.
POWER TRAIN:AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION
TSB #040730035 -- RELEASE OF REAR TRANSMISSION MOUNT SEPARATE FROM EXHAUST MOUNT. *TT (NHTSA ID #10011217, AUGUST 01 2004)
TSB #00702 -- SLIP CONDITION IN 2ND, 3RD OR 4TH DAMAGED 2-4 BAND 3-4 CLUTCH ON THE 4L60E/4L65E AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION. *TT *MJ (NHTSA ID #10005476, JANUARY 01 2004)
TSB #040730002 -- RATTLE TYPE NOISE COMING FROM UNDER THE VEHICLE. *TT (NHTSA ID #10011130, JANUARY 01 2004)
TSB #11202003 -- RATTLE NOISE UNDERNEATH THE VEHICLE OR AN AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION FLUID LEAK. *EH (NHTSA ID #10013261, NOVEMBER 20 2003)
TSB #030730056 -- 4L60-E AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION OIL PUMP FIRST AND SECOND DESIGN IDENTIFICATION. *TT (NHTSA ID #10005566, NOVEMBER 01 2003)
TSB #020421008A -- SHUDDER, ROCKING MOTION, BINDING, FEELS LIKE VEHICLE IS TUCK IN 4WD WHEN TURNING AT LOW SPEEDS. *TT (NHTSA ID #10001101, FEBRUARY 01 2003)
TSB #010730038 -- SOME CUSTOMERS MAY COMMENT THAT THE SERVICE ENGINE SOON LAMP IS ILLUMINATED, NO 3RD AND 4TH GEAR, THE TRANSMISSION DOES NOT SHIFT CORRECTLY, THE TRANSMISSION FEELS LIKE IT SHIFTS TO NEUTRAL OR A LOSS OF DRIVE OCCURS. *TT (NHTSA ID #628934, DECEMBER 01 2001)
TSB #010730043 -- SUBJECT REGARDING DIAGNOSTIC TIPS FOR SLIPPING OR MISSING SECOND, THIRD AND/OR FOURTH GEAR. *TT (NHTSA ID #628815, DECEMBER 01 2001)
TSB #181001 -- SOME VEHICLES MAY EXHIBIT AN INTERMITTENT 1-2 SHIFT SHUTTER OR POSSIBLE 1-2 HARSH SHIFT CONDITION. *TT (NHTSA ID #628011, OCTOBER 18 2001)
TSB #161001 -- SOME ALL-WHEEL DRIVE OR FOUR-WHEEL DRIVE VEHICLES MAY EXHIBIT A BUMP OR SURGE THAT CAN OCCUR WHILE THE TRANSMISSION IS STILL IN FIRST GEAR. *TT (NHTSA ID #628000, OCTOBER 16 2001)
TSB #10501 -- THIS MESSAGE APPLIES TO A POSSIBLE DELAYED ENGAGEMENT OF THE TRANSMISSION THAT MAY OCCUR AFTER THE VEHICLE SITS FOR TWO TO THREE WEEKS. *T (NHTSA ID #619777, MAY 10 2001)
TSB #3516 -- VIBRATION FELT AND HEARD AT LOW RPM DURING PARKING LOT MANEUVERS. *TT (NHTSA ID #10017393, no date provided)
Now here's a free tip. If your having a problem with clunking sounds while running over bumps in the road try this. Remove all your end links and drive your vehicle. Don't worry about them being off while driving just don't drive that way for a week. If you no longer hear or feel the clunking then the end links were your problem, replace them. You will need an 18mm open end wrench and an allen wrench (size fails my memory at this time). Good Luck
Thanks...
Perhaps HOST can post the question throught Edmunds.com forums.
Thanks
There's also a Gee, thanks, GM! - Onstar analog to go silent discussion with a few posts in it.
http://www.onstar.com/us_english/jsp/explore/onstar_basics/helpful_info.jsp?info- - - -view=tech_equip#hardware
and if you need to remove the gas tank.
Thanks
It didn't last any longer than my stock ones did :-(
Deano
Thanks guys,
Bobbie
http://www.gm-auto-parts.com/
This is just one on-line retailer, there's many others. You need to search the online catalogs for the part you need, which can be frustrating.
Of course you can always go to the dealer parts department.
The part was pretty easy to spot as it mounted in the plastic ducting facing upward, has about a one inch connection going to it, and a separate set of wires (actually two wires) that go to the connection at the blower motor itself, about 8 inches away or so.
Couldn't really see how to fix the part itself. Mine was pretty fried, and any attempt to fix probably would have been temporary anyways.
Definitely an easy job to replace by the DIY, and relatively cheap to replace at $30. Old part number in the '03 Envoy is 15415788. It's been replaced though as apparently the resistor has been a problem for several. Newer part I got is a little more compact and apparently (time will tell) a better design. AC Delco part #15-80860 in case anyone is looking for a replacement. After I pop it in tonite, I'll be all ready for winter in Canada!
Bill
Bobbie
We live between Rochester and Buffalo NY so dealing with snow usually is an issue (although for some strange reason not much last year and almost none this year).
I'm no expert but I like how the Michelins have performed so far.
Just wondered if there are some better choices out there?
I'm interested in exploring going up to one size larger tire.
Any ramifications other than the speedometer being off a little?
New to SUV's and tire issues so advice is appreciated.
Thank you.
Side Note #1: It takes about 30 seconds to change the air filter in my wife's Toyota. Unlatch, flip cover up, pull filter, drop in new, flip cover down, latch, done.
Side Note #2: My Envoy is currently sitting in the driveway with a dead battery and the key stuck in the ignition.
Side Note #3: I have owned GM vehicles all of my life and this one is my last. Ever.
Good Luck.
I have a 2003 TB and switched to them about 15k (1-1/2 years ago). LOVE THEM..... Much better in the winter and the rain here in MN. They are so quiet compared to others I had on my TB and Explorer. They are even better the Michelin LTXs
Any help or further descriptions are appreciated.
Thanks.
Any help or further descriptions are appreciated.
Thanks.
After diving into this thing a bit more, Fuse #35 is definitely the HVAC blower motor. I've found that when I insert the fuse, the blower starts and runs at a low speed with everything off. I've seen a number of posts about blower motor resistor pack problems, could this be one of those? Or, is it more likely a stuck relay?
All help appreciated!
Thanks.
C.B.
P.S. Let us know how it turns out.
C.B.
There are very few 255/60x17 tires out there, and I was afraid I would have to stay with the Michelins. I finally tried a set of 245/65x17 Cooper Discovery (Outside diameter is almost identical between these two sizes.) They have 25K on them, and have a lot of life left. Dry and rain performance matches the Michelins, and snow performance is much better. Also, I got the Coopers for about 2/3 of the price of the Michelins.
You absolutely have to retain the same outside diameter - if you change tire size, all of the car's instrumentation is messed up. It's not just the speedo - the antilock brakes and a lot of other things use the wheel sensors. Modern cars don't give you any freedom here.
At 58000 miles (still under warranty!) the driver's seat adjuster itself failed. The dealer ordered a new one (the entire track assembly has to be replaced). When the new one came in, it was also defective. The shop had already cut the old one out, so my car was out of service for 4 days because the parts supplier refused to Fedex the replacement. They had to rent me a car for 4 days because somebody was too cheap on the overnight service.
Anyway, the replacement adjuster just failed again after about 16 months in service. This one will be on my dime. The replacement part lists at about $845! That is literally highway robbery for a part that lasts 16 months. I am going to holler at GM but I don't think it will do any good.
I have definitely bought my last GM vehicle until they straighten out all of their parts suppliers.
C.B.
Sorry for the long delay (been out of town for a couple of weeks). The problem turned out to be a bad blower control module. I had to submit to the dealer for that one. The part was about $150 and labor around $200. I'm starting to thing that I should have sprung for the extended warrenty.
Glubash
I found a site that's selling the full text of TSBs for even cheaper than Alldata or Infotraxx. The posted prices are $2 for each individual TSB or $20 per year for a subscription that gets all TSBs for your vehicles. What makes them really cheap is that they don't charge extra for additional vehicles in your account up to 7 vehicles. So you can have all the TSBs for 7 vehicles for just $20 per year. The website is at http://www.iamsam.com/tsb.aspx
Sometimes the NHTSA has full text for free, but not too often.
If you know of any (preferably free, but anything is good) online repair manuals for the Triplets, let me know so we can add them to the Online Repair Manuals guide.
To get things started, I have a 5.3 V8 that is uglier than sin but runs as smooth as ice. The top of the engine looks like a cover is missing. I noticed that pictures of the 07 Denali Envoy shows a clean looking Vortex engine cover. Does anyone know if that engine cover will fit the 5.3 in a Rainier? My friend thinks that I am actually missing "the" engine cover on my V8. Do other Rainier owners have one or do the engines look like something is missing as well???
My power mirror joy stick switch works intermittently but the mirrors work just fine with the memory buttons. I went to the dealer to have a new switch ordered (they are color coded to match the interior). They told me they would not order the joy stick switch (under warranty) because the problem may be the "computer programming" of the switch. Has anyone heard of this ????
tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper
gmfan
That makes sense. I appreciate the feedback.
Mini...