Chrysler 300M

300mike · February 2002

Just came back from a short trip and some of the highway was a little rough. Seemed like they used larger stones in the concrete than they should have. Because of this, the interior noise was loud and quite annoying. Smooth paved roads seem fine but heck, my Ford Explorer is quiter than my M even on those roads.

Has anyone done anything to lower the noise level in the interior of their Ms? I've heard that the tires make a big difference (Still have my Goodyears on) and will eventually change them, but is there anything else I can do?

I just purchased my '99 M used a few months ago.

Thanks in advance.

beach15 · February 2002

Oh, you've entered my world! We took a trip yesterday to Baltimore (2 hours west) and I was annoyed to say the least about the interior noise. This car is absolutely horrible on the interstate even if it's smooth; worse yet, throw in a few bumps! Of course, we still have the Goodyears too but the noise isn't all that bad in daily driving. It's not until you take a freeway trip that you find the true 300M "beast" and it's not a good one!

To fix it though, is a different question. I think first, a nice new set of tires helps a lot. I've been looking, and for an acceptable price, the Dunlop SP Sport A2's still seem to be one of the most noise-free tires out there. Then, comes insulation. More sheet insulation would really help and spray foam in certain body cavities is also beneficial. 300Michael has done a lot of this to his 99'. I think the farthest I could ever convince the mother into is tires though.

For the price though, I think one of the boneheads at Chrysler should have known how to make the car at least acceptible in the noise intrusion area. Here's how I think the model years have evolved:

1999- Very, very noisy, lack of insulation and the Goodyears.
2000- Still rather noisy, a little bit more insulation but not much and the Goodyears.
2001- Noisy, but slightly better and now with standard Michelins (though they aren't that quiet either).
2002- Seems to be the same as a 2001 but a few Special owners have commented that their cars are noticably quiet at speed.

Just a note, what do you think of the highway ride after about an hour or two? I think it's nice at first but quickly starts to feel ragged and we have the "soft" base suspension.

easyrider300m · February 2002

the noise is the only major drawback to the M---talk to 300Michael ---he added lots of insulation and stated that it helped a lot--- if price for tire si critical, go with the Yokohama Avid T rated tires--on tirerack they are only $88 each plus shipping and mounting. The Dunlop Sports are also highly rated on Tirerack but are a bit higher at about $122 each. I have a 2000 M and look forward to getting rid of the Goodyears. I now have 30k on the car and new tires are in the near future.

jona57 · February 2002

Beach-

Did this stuff start after the accident? If so, I would go back to the repair shop and have them file an addemdum to the insurance claim for hidden damage!

300mike is right about the noise levels being improved in these cars from 99-01.
I have a 2001 M with the PHG which I love, but I agree the road noise is excessive- FOR A $30+K LUXURY SEDAN!!!! And the noise is NOT 'cured' by replacing the Goodyear LS's- (which BTW I feel are slightly quieter than the Michelin MXM4's on my car (check the ratings at tires.com- their customer ratings back this up impression). I think I am going to try the insulation treatment on my 300M this Spring- pulling up the carpet and laying Dynamat Extreme or a similar sound deadener. The road noise is that bothersome to me. In an absolute sense, though, the 300M is still reasonably quiet. Better than most mid-size to full-size sedans, but again not up to today's luxury car standards. Popular Mechanics is one of the few auto tests which publish interior noise levels, so you might check out their tests if you don't believe me. Anyway, if I do proceed with the full sound insulation treatment, I plan to use a noise meter to document the before and after results for fellow 300M Club members.

Jon

beach15 · February 2002

Okay, here's the rest of the Auto Show pics from Baltimore. I'm kicking myself for not having taken more but I was having such a field day crawling through them all, I forgot about my camera!

Take a look:

http://public.fotki.com/slate300m/2002_baltimore_auto_show/

sirharper · February 2002

When transmission fluid is cold it is unable to produce the required pressures for ultra-smooth gear changes. No car I've ever driven is exempt. My company cars of a Merc Grand Marquis and a VW Beetle both do it as does my boss's Infinity J30 (which doesn't even start below 20 degrees or if it is wet) and even his new Benz E-Class does it to some degree.

The rest of your M's problems I'm gonna attribute to the accident and poor driver adaptation. Do us all a favor and buy yourself a Toyota Camry and just pretend it is prefect like the rest of the lemmings!

achance · February 2002

If you don't like a little road noise, buy a Borla. Turn up the stereo. Actually maintain and understand the car. A Camry would work too, I guess.

achance · February 2002

Well, after mature reflection; I do have one complaint. I could not for the life of me fit a six foot tall cat climbing tree in the trunk of my M. Guess I oughta get a Camry.

easyrider300m · February 2002

I'll bet it will fit through th sunroof---the M is very adaptable for carrying large loads---a pickup truck its not

sdmike2 · February 2002

LOL!

alta_300m · February 2002

Before I purchased my 2001M PHP, I did a lot of comparisions (Specs and Test Drives)of many different cars in this class. I found the M's interior noise level to be good as did all the reviews I read. The engine noise level (or lack of it) is fantastic. The road noise is slightly higher than others, but can be mostly attributed to the wide, harder, all Season tires. Having a performance car with wide tires like the M has will produce higher road noise especially if the engine noise is low (more noticeable).

After test driving my new M, I knew I would have to get an aftermarket 'Underbody sound barrier' installed. It did make a difference and was money well spent, the difference was quite noticable and it is quite cost effective. Visit you local Ziebart dealer or equivalent and they can show you specs and noise readings before and after. I highly recommend it and no need to rip up those carpets

As for Interior room...compare the specs! The M far outclasses other cars in its class. Being a larger guy (6' 1" - 200lbs+) interior room was my most crucial criteria. There is no other car that came even close to the M especially in Backseat legroom and headroom. Try getting in and out of the backseat of a Pontiac GP or even Bonneyville. Sitting in the backseat of the GP my head was touching the REARWINDOW! What a clostrofobic SP! feeling.

beach15 - seeing that nobody else is having the Water in Trunk problem doesn't that tell you something.

sirharper · February 2002

I figured most of you would appreciate the Camry joke. From what I remember on my M before I "Borlatized" it, it was very quiet on the road. Now it just has a very pleasing exhaust rumble to it.

300michael · February 2002

I did several steps. First was to take up as much as the carpet as possible. I used an Elastormric material. Building (and roofing) supply centers carry the stuff. I found it to be less expensive then Dynomat. I lined the interior floor boards wheel wells and even the trunk areas.
Second, I got expandion foam, carried at the home centers. and foamed the wheel wells (the area between the plastic liner and metal encloser. I also foamed most of the exterior body cavities. One trick I learned was to keep the tip of the foam hose submerged in the foam so that it made it denser.
One last step it to spray under coating on the underside of the center hump.
And finally change the tires. You can check www.tirerack.com they list noise rating on the tires. I put on Bridgestone Potenza S-03 Pole Positions. They are a Max. rated tire and cost $160 each. (bought from Discount tire) I still get some noise on the rough pavement but the car is a lot quieter now (on average 9db less) then before.
One thing I noticed about noise, After a while the car seems to get noiser (perception wise) but not in reality. About a month a go I seemed was noisy until I rode in someone elses 99 and it was loud. Suddenly my car got a lot quieter again.

sdmike2 · February 2002

...about that 300michael talking to himself. lol

300michael · February 2002

What was the cost of the Ziebart coating?

sdmike2 · February 2002

How about some commentary with those pictures describing what we're looking at. I think I see a Viper nose, but what's that car in picture DSCF0005?

achance · February 2002

Easyrider, I woulda' done the sunroof, but it was snowing like H**l. I think I need a '48 PowerWagon.

lonestarsled · February 2002

Ok.....so does anybody know how to remove the upper part of the back seat. I can get the lower part out easy, just can't find the majic fasteners for the top part. Does it bolt in or snap in like the bottom? I need to remove the top part of the back seat to get the trunk liners out. I am starting a dynamat treatment and starting w/the trunk first. Thanks for any assistance.

300mike · February 2002

Thanks for the tip. I saw your website and read about how you did your sound insulation. I'll give Ziebart a look at first to see if it would be better to let them get their hands dirty. If not, then I'll probably do it your way.

Also, while I was at your site, I noticed a lot of other mods you've done. Especially the air intake. Id' love to try those things, but in Pennsylvania, we have yearly state inspections along with emmision inspections. The last thing I'd want to do is add a mod that would not pass those tests.

Thanks again.

P.S. I'm not talking to myself either. Good thing cause I doubt I would even listen.

sdmike2 · February 2002

Well, I may have one of the least quiet Ms but it's my fault. Dual exhaust, basslink and some Red Hot Chilipeppers take care of engine noise, tire noise, wind noise, window motor noise, rattle noise, cop behind me noise...

300mike · February 2002

I also don't mind the sound of great tunes playing while crusin down the highway....but when taking out business clients and trying to have a conversation, the road noise becomes quite apparent.

That is unless my client is as hip as you and me.

sdmike2 · February 2002

I know what you mean. When my kids are in the back I leave the tunes off or real low. It's then that I discover annoying plastic-on-plastic squeaks and other annoyances. I really notice the difference between asphalt roads and concrete ones. On asphalt roads all I hear is my exhaust humming along. On concrete ones is when road noise becomes an issue. However, I still think my M is quieter than my Galant, my Eclipse or my wife's Grand Caravan by far.

kosh_2258 · February 2002

No offense there fella, cuz I remember what I was like at your age, but did it ever occur to you that some of the difficulties could be self inflicted?

The tranny is of the learning variety and constantly clearing it and resetting it is probably giving the drive train module a complex.
The tranny needs time to settle in once reset and relearn it's habits. That can take several weeks to a month. Especially if the driving cycle varies a lot from trip to trip.

To be honest, I never had a bit of tranny trouble with my 98 Intrepid even though both my wife and I drove it. And believe me we have very different driving styles.

Maybe just resist the urge to tinker with the car for a while. Have the body shop scope out the leak and fix it, and the dash rattle unless you really feel inclined to chase that one down.

As for the road noise, that appears to be a characteristic of the 99 and early 2000 cars until it was addressed - I know it was a problem with my 98 Intrepid. So your choices are to live with it, or follow the noise supression steps members here have outlined using the expanding foam in the cavities and other measures.

The sad reality is that the car was in a major accident and regardless of how good the repair job that was done, it is NEVER going to be the same again. The impact energy telegraphs through a unit body and affects it in ways that are not obvious. It isn't unsafe, but the body integrity just will not be as good as it was. Just like bending a piece of metal, you can straighten it back out, but it will be weakened.

kosh_2258 · February 2002

From personal experience:

Yes, the PIAA 9005/6 bulbs fit the Intrepid, the low beams are a bit snug and you have to loosen the 3 screws on the retaining ring, seat the bulb and then snug them down again. The bulbs are mounted by using a push and twist to lock them in place.

The 300M IS different. It uses a seperate twist lock ring to hold the bulb in place. The end of an XS bulb is flush with the back of the twist lock ring, which has a center hole. Now when I hold a 9005XS bulb side by side to a 9005 the back edge of the XS is flush to the back edge of the 9005 but that puts the 90deg plug smack in the path of the twist lock ring. There is NO WAY I can see that the 9005 bulb will work on the 300M housing.

alta_300m · February 2002

I had Ziebart do a "Total Protection Package" on my new (actually demo with 9000kms) 2001, so it is difficult to pull out the undercoating cost by itself. The "Total Protection Package" was approx $850 CAN which included:
Rust Inhibitor,
Sound Deadening,
Paint Protection,
Interior Protection,
and Leather Protection.

I have had it done on all my other new cars too and I believe the individual cost of the sound undercoating to be around $250 CAN. I just got called into work on an emergency computer crash call and was crusing the highway at a highrate of speed, and for once I turned off the CD and just listened to the road noise. Definately on good asphalt she is quite as a baby, on rough asphalt or concrete (bridge decks especially) is when I start to notice the road noise. Getting skinnier regular radial tires would definately help, but for now I like the W I D E ones! and the occasional road noise does not outweigh the awesome look, performance and features. Made it into work in record time tonight! constantly checking my Radar Detector

achance · February 2002

I can remember "tuning" my father's 56 Chevy BelAir sedan at 15 or so. I wore out the threads on the carburetor idle screws, totally screwed up the throttle linkage, put on a chrome air filter that didn't have a filter in it (remember chrome and screens). Then I broke the panhard rod on a '59 Buick, and then wrinkled the left rear quarter panel of of '66 Fairlane. Completely tore the rear suspension out from under a '69 Comet. I simply can't imagine what I might have done with a car like an M at that age.

scotian · February 2002

On Monday I get them from Diversified Cryogenics. Cross-drilled, silver cadmium plated. And Porterfield R-4S shoes all around.

99_300m_ric_va · February 2002

FYI

http://www.berrysweb.com/SoundDead.htm

http://www.b-quiet.com/

bigmike5 · February 2002

Ziebart sound deadening cost me about $160. The net result was a slight improvement. More improvement occurred when I dumped the Badyears.

Blonda--on the chrome shifter, I must have missed that old post by Av, but the chrome shifter swithover went without a hitch, and I have the fish scale device. Only problem was finding a tool to loosen and tighten the set screw on the front of the shifter. I thought it was a hex or Allen and I had one, but none of mine fit and the guy at Autozone said it was a "star" head screw when he looked at the one on the chrome shifter. I had to buy a cheap star screwdriver and it worked, [but it still looks like a Allen or hex head to me]. The set screw loosened easily after I shifted it to the autostick position to get room for the screwdriver, and shut off the engine and set the parking brake. I said a prayer after slipping the new one on, and thank goodness it worked. Sometimes things work even for the mechanically challenged!! But if I can change one out, you can too. Only thing I didn't like was the $75 for the shifter. A bit stiff. A lot of profit there.

300michael · February 2002

Just keep all the smog connections hooked up and you should be ok. All my intake mods passed inspections.

beach15 · February 2002

Yeah, I know what you guys mean by all your comments and I respect them. Sometimes (or quite often) I put myself in situations that don't really concern me, but it's all in good regards. I appreciate the respect though.

Thanks for the comments. I have always liked the car myslef, it can just be annoying. But, I have to remember, it's not mine, I don't pay for it, and as long as the owner's like it, then it's none of my business.

As for tinkering with it, I don't really think I'd screw much up, as I do not even go near stuff that's very difficult or risky. So far, all I've done is the clockface and that was much easier than even the instructions I saw.

So long for now!

drpixel · February 2002

I have received several email messages from folks informing me that links --especially under Member Modifications don't work as they are pointing to something called '.....photopoint.com'. I know that photopoint has gotten ornery about displaying your pix fror free, and that many-if not most of youse have re-setup or moved your stuff to other places.
Can those of you who have moved your 'stuff' to a greener, happier place email me the new location and thus make the world a happier place again?...Thank you...we now return you to the regularly scheduled forum......

Doc

silverbullet4 · February 2002

I too was a menace to society as a teen driver. I wrecked two new cars. After the second one, my dad wouldn't speak to me. He was really steamed. One night I was sitting in HIS chair, reading HIS newspaper when he approached me and yelled "I'm tired of you wrecking my cars", and proceeded to hit me on the noggin with a sledge hammer. I thought I was a dead kid, but it was made out of foam rubber, and my dad was laughing so hard he couldn't stand up. After getting my heart out of my throat I realized he was making sure I understood his frustration, but letting me know I was forgiven.

Silver

blonda · February 2002

Thanks for the info. on the shifter. Still trying to decide if I want to fork out that much $$ for it. At one point I was considering changing out the shifter to the boot style, but in some ways it makes the car unique as there are very few that were built that way.

blonda · February 2002

I have to comment on the road noise in a '99. I personally don't think it's that bad at all. Granted, one my vehicles is a SUV with very noisey, fat snow tires, my previous vehicle was an Olds Ciera Brougham (yeah I know...it's an old person's car...I inherited it 8 years old with only 36K on it). Switching over from the Olds to the M I didn't even notice the road noise. I notice more the wind noise which is of course because of the cab forward design. I also will drive w/o the radio on when I have passengers to talk with a lot - I never even notice the noise (plus I'm fortunate to have never had any squeaks or rattles I guess).

Another comment to Beach on the tranny shifting. I'm frequently in stop and go traffic on the way to work. The car always shifts sluggisly when I leave work at the end of the day (so of course I floor it the first chance I get!). On days when traffic is light in the morning -- it shifts crisply and perfectly. Just goes to prove that the learning tranny can and does get "retarded" sometimes because of driving styles or traffic, but always corrects itself in a short period of time.

scotian · February 2002

A couple weeks ago I emailed prez300mclub@hotmail.com a list of changes for links to my new Fotki account...

scotian · February 2002

doesn't exist anymore, and took all the pics with it.

kosh_2258 · February 2002

I sent an e-mail to Sylvania asking if the had plans to release their Silverstar super white bulbs in an XS version.

Their reply:

"The 9005/6XS product line is fairly new and therefore is not always first in line for product upgrades. Currently the straight base product line is available in the Cool Blue version and may not be available in the Silverstar version until mid summer. If you need any further assistance feel free to contact me."

bigmike5 · February 2002

Blonda--forgot to list the dealer address. Got it from Beach and the address is K & M Northfield Dodge (800) 999-9470 and ask for Tom. Part #4593526-AA; $76.50 plus $4.59 shipping. He got it out the same day and I had it in 3. Good luck.

sdmike2 · February 2002

anyone put an aftermarket shifter on their M? most of what i see out there is for manuals, but there are some nice ones for auto too. I'm thinking burlwood

would something like this fit?

http://www.mach3accessories.com/shift_knobs/sk_11.html

scotian · February 2002

I got them. They're nice, shiny, and full of holes.

sdmike2 · February 2002

just what the scotian ordered

sdmike2 · February 2002

that was the most expensive one I've seen. Most are around $50 - $70. I just posted it as an example to ask the question about whether aftermarket ones would work on the M. I guess I don't understand how the automatic button works. If I did I could probably answer my own question.

blonda · February 2002

Thanks bigmike. The other contact listed on the Club Board has them $75 incl shipping - but you have to mail him a $order. I just may go for it (not that I really NEED one)

I think what makes this shifter so special as opposed to an aftermarket ones is that they only made them a short period of time -- almost like a Limited Edition item.

sdmike2 · February 2002

Ok...who wants to trade me a chrome shifter for a full leather one plus an OEM air filter (like new) and a set of OEM plugs?

Blonda - If you get a chrome shifter I'm going to come to your office and smear fingerprints all over the chrome

laurasdada · February 2002

Lucky you! Wish my father had thought of using foam rubber instead of...

Coming from a '95 Dodge Intrepid to a '99 300M, I don't think the M is very loud!!! But it ain't as quiet as the evil wife's Lexus.

SDMike and others: I may be late on this, but I'm hoping that the fires haven't caused you or yours any direct harm or loss...

Typical NE weather today: This morning, near 50 degrees...this afternoon, snow...tonight 30-50mph winds with temps in the teens (or lower)tomorrow. Gotta love it!

Almost 33,000 miles on my '99M, two window motors, one tranny speed sensor and a couple of light shows that were solved by playing with the rheostat. Dealer couldn't duplicate light show, of course. I'm really hoping I don't need to replace the BCM after warranty.
Again, great car.

blonda · February 2002

Mike - Ya know I think I'm gonna have to wear latex gloves when I drive to keep the prints off!

Laurasdada -
I can't speak for anyone else, but SDMike, Glenn, and Mrl and myself are safe from the fires...we can't even see the smoke from where we are. It's really not that far away at all, but the wind is taking it directly out to sea.

jona57 · February 2002

300 Michael-
Did you take noise readins during your sound-proofing project? For example, did applying sound deadener to the trunk make more difference than doing the interior firewall/wheelwells/floor, etc?

I agree about noise being relative. I thought my 99 Gr Caravan ES was relatively quiet- until I got my 2001 300M. The 300 is much quieter on the road than my GC. My next door neighbor is an officer for a large Toyota dealer and brings home Avalons as his demo cars. Funny thing is- these are quieter on the road than the 300, but seem not to keep out external noise as well (e.g. someone talking outside the car while it's sitting in the driveway.). Overall the Avalon is quieter, but BORING!!!!!!! Now that 2dr Solara is better, but the interior lacks style IMHO.

Jon

sdmike2 · February 2002

Criminies...

I just got Big Red back after my wife having her for 4 days while she took a class near downtown. I just gave her a bath (the car, not my wife) and I found an 8 inch long scratch that runs from the driver's side view mirrow towards the back at a 45 degree angle. There's also a good 1 inch scratch on the side mirror. Of course my lovely, darling (evil) wife didn't notice and has no idea how it could have gotten there. I'm saying a prayer that it's only through the clear coat. It looks white (and not white paint) so I think that's a good sign that it's just through the clear coat. If it doesn't come out I might have a "trade in" soon. The wife, not the car.

If Big Red wasn't so much fun to drive I'd just build a big crate for her and nail it closed.

Mike

sdmike2 · February 2002

Posted by a member of the yahoo board:

http://www.ritchiefamily.com/misc/objects.jpg

Chrysler 300M

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