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BMW 5-Series Maintenance and Repair

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Comments

  • furionbeemerfurionbeemer Member Posts: 3
  • furionbeemerfurionbeemer Member Posts: 3
    My 530i 2006 wont start.
    I went for audio issue and they updated the software it wont boot.
    Later they replaced the Computers 4 or 5 times and this week the engineer from BMW came and still no hope.

    its CPO car and I took 6 year/100k extended warranty and I already paid 1.5k for one of the computer which was not covered

    What are my options?

    Can I demand a new car since the car drove fine except it had an audio issue

    Thanks,
    VV
  • milner007milner007 Member Posts: 20
    Just bought a 2011 535 with run flat tires- seems u have no choice and none too happy about it since according to the salesman they are not able to be patched- no. 1- is that true? no. 2- from the manual it looks like you are supposed to only rotate the tires and not the wheels along with the tires- true? and does anyone know about how much the hard drive holds (the thing you can load CD's on- like an ipod- LOVE that! Thanks.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    The official company line is that they cannot be patched, that said, if you haven't driven the car on the deflated tire, and if the puncture is in the midst of the contact patch (i.e. not in a shoulder), then RFTs can be patched.

    Regarding rotation; if you have the same size wheels and tires front versus rear, then you can rotate your tires front to back as well without having to mess with unmounting and remounting the tires.
  • james27james27 Member Posts: 433
    You have to reset the TPMS when you move the wheels, but as said, if they are the same size front/rear, you can rotate them. My GT has 40G on the HD, not sure if they use the same as the 'regular' 5-series (the GT is built on the 7 chassis).
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    You can patch them, yes, in most cases.
  • milner007milner007 Member Posts: 20
    Thanks for that info, all! Glad to hear about the patch thing!!
    !
  • james27james27 Member Posts: 433
    Industry standard for RFT is to not patch them. There is no cheap way to verify that the internal structure hasn't been compromised by driving it too far or too fast while flat. Doesn't mean you may not successfully get one patched, but if they adhere to the standards, they may refuse.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    "...but if they adhere to the standards, they may refuse."

    As far as I know, there is no "standard" what-so-ever which says RFTs cannot be patched. Do you know different?
  • james27james27 Member Posts: 433
    edited November 2011
    This is what Continental's position is: http://www.conti-online.com/generator/www/us/en/continental/automobile/general/c- - ontiacademy/drivers_ed/tire_repair_en.pdf

    This is what Pirelli says: http://www.pirelli.com/tire/us/en/car/genericPage/all_about_tyres.html

    I know I read similar discussions for some other brands.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    edited November 2011
    So what you're saying is that you agree with me that there are no "Standards". Yes, no?
  • james27james27 Member Posts: 433
    Both of them state that there is no good way to determine if the tire was damaged, and after a flat to replace them...while that may not be an 'industry or government' standard, when multiple manufacturers express the same thing, it is a defacto standard. Performing maintenance that is against the manufacturers' recommendations puts the shop in a severe liability situation, and they'll likely refuse to repair a runflat. Now, if you want to do it yourself, that's up to you.
  • milner007milner007 Member Posts: 20
    FWIW I asked a friend who is a salesman for the Cadillac dealler here abot the run flat thing and he said if it has not been driven on much after the flat then it should be a ble to be patched- I guess what ya'll are saying is that it may be hard to find someone who will do it.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    edited November 2011
    Sorry, your arguments are falling on deaf ears as more and more these days, tire shops are more than willing to do repairs on RFTs. The fact is, there is no "Standard" that says they shouldn't; manufacturer recommendations against repairing are just that, "Recommedations", and as such, are not binding in any way.

    With the above said, I am not at all a fan of RFTs, and there is no way I'd have them on any car of mine. If I wind up with a new F30 328i in the next twelve to eighteen months, the odds are it will come from the factory with RFTs, and as soon as I get the car back here to the States (I'll likely do another European Delivery), the RFTs will come off and a set of GFTs will go in their place.
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    edited November 2011
    I have had Goodyear RFT's repaired at my local Goodyear (Gemini) tire dealer. While they will not repair ANY tire with a puncture along the outer tread section, they have repaired RFT's on my wife's MINI.

    If anyone is inclined to expend the effort, they can find opinions "pro and con" on RFT repair. The fact of the matter seems to be that a qualified, competent tire dealer equipped with the proper RFT mounting equipment can indeed repair RFT's.

    From the Continental site link a couple of postings back...

    Continental advises that a repair to one of its tires invalidates the
    manufacturer’s warranty.

    Seems Continental is against any tire repair, RFT or GFT.
  • james27james27 Member Posts: 433
    None of the sites are saying that it isn't possible to make a RFT air tight, it's just that because of the way they are made, and the unknown manner it may have been driven while flat (heat is the big problem, and driving too fast or letting it build up by driving longer than allowed) can compromise it internally that is NOT visible. So, to protect themselves, their policy is to not do it. Independent garages can do what they want, but if you wanted any manufacturer support, you're not likely to get it on a repaired RFT.

    I would think that if you treated it like a normal tire, and stopped as soon as you noticed it was flat (although I had one boss that asked me what the 'crown' symbol on his panel mean, as it had been there for months), it should be safely repairable as long as it wasn't in the sidewall area, just like most any tire.

    There are a lot of inept people out there that don't have a clue. Then, there's the enthusiast that notices the slightest change. Repair at your discretion, but they all advise it may not be safe. If you know you haven't overdriven it while flat, and it's in a safe spot to patch, I'd try to get one of mine patched.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    i think it's just their lawyers who wrote that, not their engineers.
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    Maybe, but as I stated earlier, I have had Goodyear RFTs repaired at Goodyear company stores. Seems that a company owned store would follow company policy.

    I do agree with you, however, that, if the RFT performs as intended, it can be difficult for the untrained eye to make an adequate judgment on the tire. Still, to one with adequate experience, they can tell whether a RFT is worthy of repair.

    Like Continental's warranty policy, I doubt any company would warrant a patched RFT... Which seems understandable and reasonable to me.

    And, as Mr. Shiftright said... Warranties and such are written by lawyers, not engineers.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    There is no "standard" when it comes to repairing RFTs; many shops will happily perform the repair, and many will not.
  • cdnpinheadcdnpinhead Member Posts: 5,504
    I can easily see tire shops in my part of the world refusing to repair RFTs, given the crap they continue to give me about putting new tires on the steering axles (that'd be the front) of my verhicles. I often replace tires two at a time (rather than all four at once), and the last several times I've had these people tell me that new tires should "always" go on the rear. B.S. There may be some merit to that in climates where it may rain once in awhile and/or snow, but here in the desert dictating where tires should be placed based on some over- or under-steer study interpreted by some lawyer someplace is completely irrelevant.

    That, and I've had them refuse to repair GFTs because they were "too worn," even though the wear bars weren't making contact with the pavement at all, let alone clear across.

    In short, they won't do what I request, and I can see the same thing happening with RFTs, particularly if the other option is to sell a $250-300 new tire.

    I fear this is partly due to the flurry of lawsuits resulting from the Ford Exploder fiasco 10 or 15 years ago, combined with the desire to sell as many new tires as possible.
    '08 Acura TSX, '17 Subaru Forester
  • gardisgardis Member Posts: 185
    Guys,
    I have a CPO 5 series, 2007 530i which I love. It still has til JUN2012 on the warranty. I am finding that every 3,000 miles or so, I am adding one quart of oil. I've gotten the oil warning on the iDrive when this happens. I spoke to my tech rep whom I've known over the years and I trust her (she and her husband have a CPO 7 series 2006 so she put her money where her mouth is) and she tells me these newer engines (i used to have a 1996 3 series) this is typical useage of oil, that BMW specifies that it's normal to put a quart in every 1000 miles even. Nothing to worry about. The car is definitely not burning oil, but I don't remember adding oil to my 3 series. Otherwise I love the car, it has 40K miles and is beautiful.
  • gardisgardis Member Posts: 185
    guys,
    update this morning: got into the car, all systems show normal on the iDrive. I didn't add the quart yet. I'm waiting to see what happens. But still why would that warning come on? And it has happened in the past. The last time I added was about 3000 miles ago.
  • james27james27 Member Posts: 433
    edited November 2011
    Year-to-year, there are differences in how the sensor works. I've got a 2011, and it needs the motor to be on for more than a few miles before it can measure the oil level. Mine's a 535, and I've got about 8K miles on it (it's pretty new), but it still shows max oil level once it can actually report it. I've heard that the V-8's regularly use more oil than the I-6. In some ways, I miss a dip stick. I'd like to be able to check it while in the garage, before I leave, rather than having to wait to have driven enough so it can get an accurate measurement.
  • gardisgardis Member Posts: 185
    guys, I guess it had to register, yup, I'm needing to add that quart.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    edited November 2011
    Well a shop can do whatever it wants but it's possible their shyness is due more to a lack of knowledge. I deal with two tire shops and both repair RFTs just as happily as you please, presuming it CAN be repaired of course.

    If I were an RFT owner (not any longer, got rid of 'em) and I had a flat, I'd do whatever was possible and prudent to avoid buying another RFT, and if the other 3 RFTs on my car were say down to 4 to 6 / 32nds, I'd just ditch the 3 good tires and start over with normal tires, get the spare kit or whatever, and live happily ever after like I did. I have a better ride, better handling and oh, so much quieter. :)
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    Four weeks? At a BMW dealership???

    I suspect there is more to this issue than we are seeing in your posting.

    After all, there are a finite number of things that would keep any car from running...
  • furionbeemerfurionbeemer Member Posts: 3
    yes BMW service center.
  • delwrangdelwrang Member Posts: 6
    I am not a real fan of the legal climate in the US, but when a company repeatedly denies the existence of customer complaints, it is time for a class action wake up call.
    A quick follow through of a web search of “ventilation odor” or other similar term produced hundreds of owners who have had smell issues with their BMW. My 3rd and likely final BMW due to this issue is a 2009 535xi. What a great car. This followed my X5 and along the way we picked up a Z4. All good. All fun. All solid.
    Four months ago the 535 began to smell. As widely described on the internet, a smell when you turn the car on that passes. My fix was to turn the fan off until I drove it for 5-10 minutes, then turn the system on. Then the service department did the air freshener thing. Then they did a clean out. Well, things are a smidge better but still not tolerable. How bad is it? Please don’t judge me, but I have begun to prefer driving our Lexus 250hs over the 5-series. Sad but a glorified golf cart is winning out over a real car because of the smell.
    Well, the lease is up and I took it in for one last shot at service. My service writer, who is tremendous, gave me the following word from on high, “Complaints of this nature are not caused by defects of material or workmanship, but rather by the environmental conditions in which the vehicle is operated. Consequently, there is no warranty reimbursement for labor or materials associated with the disinfection of the evaporator.” Much less replacing it, which is what is actually required to fix the issue. Bull feces, bull feces, bull feces.
    Consequently I will dump old stinky on some unsuspecting soul and NEVER buy a BMW again.
    My dealership has no jurisdiction to resolve this. Is there anyone out there who has contact data on the high level management people who handle BMW customer complaints? I would like to let them know why they lost a good customer.
    Thanks
  • mhutchinsonmhutchinson Member Posts: 17
    Within 5 days of each other, the fuel gauge suddenly dropped to empty and the airbag warning light came on, both while driving the car down the road. I have disconnected the battery twice now, after refueling, as I am using the trip meter to avoid running out of gas. Any suggestions on why these items might be failing? Could this be a fuse or computer problem? Might there be another "reset" solution?
    Thanks.
  • cenla71466cenla71466 Member Posts: 2
    To Shipo, How do you come to the notion AMSOIL is "snake oil" ??? The company has been around since 1972 and was the first to have a API rated fully synthetic engine oil for passenger cars ???

    Here's two links you can check:
    http://www.amsoil.com/lit/databulletins/g2808.pdf
    http://www.amsoil.com/lit/databulletins/g1990.pdf

    By the way when a product is a gimmic / snake oil product that company doesn't stay in business for over forty years and manage to become 100% debt free.

    So next time your wanting to give free advice please have your facts correct. And if you want please visit the Federal Trade Commision web site and perform a search of cases against AMSOIL for fraud and misleading advertisment. Then check the other motor oil companies. After that judge for yourself.
  • cenla71466cenla71466 Member Posts: 2
    Well, if a certain brand of oil is "required" by a manufacturer it has to be provided to the consumer free of charge by the manufacturer.

    You may want to read the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act of 1975 before giving out advice.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    edited February 2012
    Please don't post any hot links about AMSOIL if you sell it--this is regarded as soliciting and posts can be removed by your host.

    If you aren't a dealer, we have specific topics on oil such as SYNTHETIC MOTOR OIL and I'd invite you on behalf of your host, to talk about comparative qualities of oil in one of those topics.

    here's another topic you might enjoy: FUEL AND OIL ADDITIVES

    Let's keep this topic on target for BMW 5 Series Maintenance and Repair
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    Just my opinion, but you do know you responded to a 3 year old posting, don't you?

    I can't say, but was the oil shown in the PDF your post displayed available (with the same specs as in the PDF) in March 2009?

    A lot can change in 3 years.

    And, it's certainly not beyond the imagination to think that independent shops would recommend a product that is contrary to the manufacturer's recommendations...

    Just sayin'...
  • james27james27 Member Posts: 433
    BMW's stand (as I understand it) is that for best, long-term performance, knowing their specific metalurgy, they want you to use oils that have passed the LL-01 testing procedure (the M-series uses a different testing and certification). As far as I know, Amsoil does not have an oil that has submitted to or passed that test certification. that doesn't mean it may not be a good oil, but that it has not elected to try to pass that test. So, the user is in a quandry - use an oil they know is acceptable to the manufacturer (there are probably at least 5 or so available that I've found), or something else, they aren't sure about. At least during the warranty period, the oil changes are free, so that decision is put off for at least a few years.
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    edited February 2012
    I remember looking this up a year or so ago, and at the time, could only find 2 oils officially meeting BMW's recommendations that were available in the US.

    One was Mobil 0W40, and the other was Castrol... At least, that's how I remember it.

    Since I can buy BMW oil cheaper at my local dealer using my BMWCCA discount than I can buy Mobil 1 at Walmart, I didn't dig any deeper.

    Here is what BMW currently states:

    http://www.bmwusa.com/Standard/Content/Owner/SyntheticEngineOils.aspx

    I don't believe either of the oils listed in the poster's PDF links are BMW LL-01, but are LL-04...
  • james27james27 Member Posts: 433
    BMW, if I remember correctly, has three different specs for their engines: Non-M's, M's, and diesels. There may also be a difference between what they spec for Europe verses the USA.
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    Agreed. The M series use 10w60 as the primary recommended viscosity.

    I have no idea if Eurpoean models have different recommendations.

    Frankly, I couldn't tell you the difference between LL-01 and LL-04. I'm guessing the LL stands for "long lifetime"...
  • james27james27 Member Posts: 433
    You'd have to find a copy of their specifictions, and then, you'd probably not know unless you were in the industry. Never looked for it, it might be easily found.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 236,830
    LL does stand for LongLife..

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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    BMW even specs LL brake fluids.
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    I'm thinking you're correct about having to be in the industry to understand it, or at least have a specialized degree in the area of petroleum chemistry.

    Like tires, I understand sizes and tread patterns and usage indicators, but I wouldn't have a clue when the conversation moved to in-depth compound types.

    I can identify a GFT from a RFT, as well as an actual flat tire.

    The "LL" guess was a safe one...
  • james27james27 Member Posts: 433
    Did not find the wording of the LL-01 spec, but did come up with this: One of the criteria to meet the LL-01 spec is the high temperature high shear value...it must exceed 3.5 at 140-degrees C. Most of the oils are lower, in the 2.5-2.9 range (don't know the units). This measures the ability of the oil to maintain a liquid film on things like a bearing at both high temperature and shear stresses. The higher this is, in theory, the higher the drag, so if wear isn't a concern, using one with a lower value might provide better mileage, but not longer life.

    Some people worry about a low value on a multiweight oil, like the zero in a 0-30w. All that figure means is that it can pour easier at a lower temperature...it has nothing to do with the ability to flow properly at design temperature. ALL oils are thicker at low temp that desired, but one with the smaller number in the beginning will tend to flow and start to lubricate when an oil pump might not be able to move one with a higher number. Synthetic oils tend to have less variation in temperature and flow better during startup, so that helps. But, nothing wrong with using a multigrade oil with a low first number in hot or cold climates - they all are in the order of 10x thicker than desired at operating temperature during a cold start, but your oil pressure and flow will improve, and most of the wear (when using the proper oil) is during cold starts...getting the oil where it needs to be faster and easier should be the goal and the better it can flow while cold (not at operating temps) does help.

    The 'proper' grade of oil is the one that can maintain the desired design pressure at load...too thick, and the pressure goes up, flow goes down, heat goes up and some stuff doesn't get lubricated. Too thin, the pressure goes down, and you can't maintain the lubrication between the metal parts, and wear is excessive. BMW knows their engines - second guessing what is required is fraught with ignorance and folly. Without knowing what mix of characteristics and features an oil really needs to work properly in one of their engines, IMHO, you're foolish to not use one that has met their specs. What you think may be 'better' for your engine is going against millions of miles of test data and experience. Proceed at your own risk!
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    That's exactly why I use, in the case of my BMW products, the factory approved lubricants.

    Really cheap insurance, and I don't have to worry about compatibility issues.

    It's easy for me, because I pay the same at my local dealer as I would usually pay at an auto supply, due to my BMWCCA membership.

    I don't mind using regular generic oils on my other cars, since they are generically designed... Toyota Tacoma, Nissan Versa and Altima (all 4 cylinders).

    I do use full synthetic in every vehicle I own.
  • wantequus2012wantequus2012 Member Posts: 1
    I'm in the market for the BMW 550i(2011). I test drove several BMW's and this is my favorite, however, some of the FM stations don't come in that well(static and noise), not just on this model but on all of them. 70-70 k car and they can't get a top of the line antenna. The radio overall sounds ok not great. Any ideas?
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    edited February 2012
    Could be where you live maybe? some stations in some cities with lots of hills or obstructions are just bad. I have this problem in parts of the San Francisco Bay Area.
  • jodar96jodar96 Member Posts: 400
    I am looking to buy a 2008-2009 5 Series manual. I feel the 528 is too heavy for its 225hp engine. Does anyone agree with this? I had a 92 325i and loved its inline six but that was a 185hp engine and was in a lighter 3 series body.

    The 535 appears to be a good choice but I am hesitant to deal with its twin turbo...Didn't 2005-2007 have issues with Turbos. I know 2008-up are new engines, but any issues? I have never owned a turbo car. I know on time oil changes are a must, but do they rev themselves to destruction by 100K or that is not true?

    How is the 550i engine and electrical reliability? How does the clutch hold up in this engine? how is the gas mileage if driven under 75 on the hwy. I had a 2001 MB E430 that got 28.8mpg on the hwy. That was the only V-8 I ever owned and were impressed with its smooth engine and seamless 5 speed auto.

    Are there any real or on going nagging issues with any one them in 2008-2009 style to stay away from?

    Thank you,
    Joe
  • dansa2dansa2 Member Posts: 28
    2008 528i 40,000 miles. A couple seconds after starting car, in park, hear a clunk sound from under car. Dealer cannot give answer to why this happens. Car drives and transmission shifts fine. :confuse:
  • james27james27 Member Posts: 433
    Back when turbos were first being installed in cars, they were often oil cooled and you had to be quite careful after driving to let things spool down and cool off before you shut the engine off. If you didn't you'd burn the oil and ruin the bearings. All modern tubo engined cars now use liquid (system antifreeze) to cool them, and that problem has gone away. I'd expect you'd get a lot more miles than 100K, but then, there's always the exception.

    The way BMW does their turbos, they make an insane amount of torque at low rpm. Torque is what really moves the vehicle...generally, top speed is limited by max horsepower. In the USA, you can't legally drive anywhere near the top speed of the vehicle. 225Hp is a decent amount. I'd try it before I wrote it off as too little. There's something to be said about using a manual and the available horsepower - it takes more skill with a lower powered vehicle, but it can be quite fast.

    BMW generally uses the computer to decide when the vehicle needs an oil change...it is not strictly a rigid mileage thing. It could be anywhere from in the order of 4K to 20K miles, or one year, whichever comes first. You'd want to use BMW's filter and one of their approved oils, but if you do, it should be reliable. The V8 tends to use more oil than the 6's (the 4 is realtively new to the states). My 535gt went about 11K in the first year and never used any, or at least the computer said it was still full. The computer said the oil change was still 7K miles off (i.e., at 18K) based on my driving, but the one year was up so they did it for free under the new vehicle service plan.

    There are some people that have had issues with the head bolts on some models, but it didn't affect my model year or engine...you may wish to search on that.
  • bschmidt25bschmidt25 Member Posts: 14
    Hi Joe,

    There were no turbos in the 5 series until the 535 in 2008. If I remember correctly, the engine in the 525 from 2006-07 is the same as the 528 from '08 on (N52). The 530 preceded the 535 and it has 255 HP. Both the 525 and 530 were naturally aspirated. As far as the 535 goes, the big issue with them is the high pressure fuel pump (HPFP) and fuel injectors. BMW ended up recalling the HPFP because there were so many issues with them and I believe they are now covered for 6 years and 110K miles. Supposedly, 2008s are much more affected than the others. I also hear that some are having problems with the wastegate on the turbo. I don't think it necessitates replacement, but it still could be expensive. There's no doubt a 535 will cost more to maintain than a 528 because of the added complexity and heat generated by the turbos. Proper maintenance is a must for the 535.

    The 550 is said to be very reliable. I have driven them a number of times and they are pretty thirsty - around 15-16 in town and 23-24 on the freeway. It's an amazing car, but I personally wouldn't be able to justify the fuel costs. That's just my opinion though...

    Hope this helps!

    Bryan
  • milner007milner007 Member Posts: 20
    I bot a 2011 535- in November 2011- it had 9 miles on it- the computer says I can go till July 2013 (!!!) to change the oil. Should I do this? I had a 2000 528 before this car and changed the oil every year whether the computer said to or not- I think I should change it and not reset the computer- what do ya'll think?? I cant imagine not changing it till 7/13
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