Nissan 350Z

jay_75 · December 2001

How much does the Cobra R cost?
How many are being made?

exactly

wishnhigh1 · December 2001

$54,000 list. With the low production numbers, I am guessing the cobra R runs for about $60,000 at the dealers, or a huge waiting list.

Yeah, great comparison between the 350Z and the Cobra. Face it...the cobra R and the cobra are two different beasts. And I will give you that american cars give you a lot for the money. They are quite possibly the best "bang for the buck" on the planet. But to quote badtoy, buying a car based on its numbers is like choosing a girlfriend based on her bra size. Theres more to a car than just its numbers.

I am stating that the Cobra is only mediocre handling by todays standards for sports cars. The GT is WAY below average by todays standards. We have yet to determine how the Z car handles, but I can almost guarantee you right now that the Z will handle better. It also is more attractive(to me and a lot of other people), with better build quality, more comfortable and attractive interior, and with less weight.

I think Nissan does not consider the Cobra a threat to their sales. Any japanese or german sports car is going to be the same way. If you like big horsepower and straight lines, you go for the mustang. If you want a real sports car, you go for something else. Nissan should have no intentions to steal cobra sales, and it should not expect to have sales stolen by the Cobra.

playathug21 · December 2001

What's wrong with choosing based on bra size?!?!? =] But yes, skidpad numbers mean nothing. Handling can not be determined by numbers, because feel also makes a difference. And the Cobra R (R = Racing BTW) is different than the Cobra. That's like saying the Integra and Integra Type R (although they are quite close in price) handle the same.

Comments?

wishnhigh1 · December 2001

Ive known a few double D size bra girls in my life, and the majority of them also have D size rolls on their waists too.

boomn29 · December 2001

Why are people comparing the 350 2-seater to 4 door rally-inspired cars???
Why are people comparing the estimated 30k 350 to cars costing under 24k???

Try to keep apples-to-apples people!

f1jules · December 2001

Hmm, the Mustang GT posts a slalom speed of 64.0 mph the BMW M3 65.4 (if I remember correctly). Not exactly whale-like handling if you ask me. Besides, a few hundred dollars spent on after-market goodies can make the Mustang handle better than an M3.

Just because it doesn't appeal to you is no reason to trash the car. It is a fairly capable car for the money.

novcenthusiast · December 2001

I don't know if someone may have posted a link to this article in here previously but, here it is anyway:

http://www.roadandtrack.com/RoadAndTrack/features/1201_nissan_350z_p2.html

I think you may find the third paragraph from the bottom of the page interesting, as an s2000 owner. It describes the goals of the handling characteristics for the Z. I'm a little surprised by the direction, although I guess I shouldn't be as the target consumer is likely older than I am.

sphinx99 · December 2001

How quick do you think it'll be? I'm a little concerned by the tendency of Nissan to feature an outstanding powerplant, and still manage to put up mediocre numbers. The 350Z has a 100ft/lb torque advantage over the S2000, only a 300-ish pound weight penalty, more horsepower up top and way, way more torque down low, and yet I'm a bit concerned this car will put up 0-60 numbers identical to the S2000.

That said, the article was interesting although it didn't surprise me. I always heard that the Z was a touring vehicle, not too quick and rather heavy. I hope so because that's the car I want. It's the reason I got two Preludes in a row, and it's nice to see a nice step "up" on the horizon.

6462 · December 2001

They've been getting into trouble lately for exaggerating their claimed performance specs for the Sentra and Q45, so maybe they're just playing it safe now?

novcenthusiast · December 2001

touring car I'd get a 3-series or wait on the G35.

cyranno99 · December 2001

300ZX would be considered a tourer next to a Toyota Supra or a Mazda RX-7. That does not mean it could not go fast, but it did mean that the handling was not as good as the others....

habitat1 · December 2001

..am not not quite sure what Yukawa means by "more mature" handling than an S2000. It seems to me like Nissan has sent a couple of mixed messages regarding their intent relative to the new "Z". On the one hand, they seem to acknowledge that the old Z evolved into an expensive luxo-GT car that lost some of its original spirit and appeal. They claimed they were going back to their 240Z roots with the new Z. Now, in the R&T review, Yukawa talks in terms of the new Z being a "comfortable tourer".

I hope the actual car is going to be a better execution of a clear strategy than the inconsistent attempts to articulate it.

BTW, although I only have 900 miles on the odometer, I don't think the S2000's handling is one in which more "maturity" is needed. It is as precise and balanced a car as I've driven. The fact that it responds to inputs immediately and goes exactly in the direction it's pointed is, IMHO, a GOOD thing. And, at 44, I suspect I'm on the "mature" side of any demographic target market either Honda or Nissan has in mind. Perhaps the 350Z, by virtue of a lower revving V6, will be a little easier on the eardrums as an everyday car. For me, the S2000 makes a perfect compliment to my Maxima SE. (And my hearing is half shot anyway).

P.S. Hopefully Yukawa or his colleagues won't be quoted as claiming the new G35 or 2003 Maxima target is "more mature" handling than a 3 or 5-series. Just what we need, another Buick.

novcenthusiast · December 2001

Yep, I understand that. I guess I was hoping that the Z would be more of a "light and nimble" car than a GT geared towards comfort.
I'd probably be happy with a miata if I could fit and felt safe in one. Now that the dealer markups on S2K's seem to have died (for the most part) I may consider one, although I'd feel obligated to sign up for track time if I bought one.
btw, from what I've heard about 3rd Gen. RX-7s and Supras they're way too much car for me... right now anyway

alaskans13 · December 2001

Yea, that kinda dissapoints me too. Well, I guess I should have expected something like this. It's being designed for North America, and US buyers typically like a smooth ride. They probably figure this will help them sell more cars. Which I guess is a good thing considering Nissans financial troubles lately. Look on the bright side, if you really want the go kart handling, you can easily add some aftermarket shocks and springs for about $600. Many people add aftermarket suspension to performance cars, and this will just make the benifits of it that much more noticeable.

playathug21 · December 2001

when they say "mature" I believe they don't mean razor sharp handling and steering, but rather BMW/Prelude type ride, feeling solid and connected but not stiff and harsh. Personally, I would prefer the S2000 Razor Sharpness, but the Z is not meant to be a limited production car like the S2000. But, that's what I believe they mean when they say more "mature". Comparable to a BMW or a Prelude, solid and connected but not harsh.

Comments?

habitat1 · December 2001

..perhaps you haven't driven an S2000, but I personally don't find anything harsh in it's handling and ride relative to what is to be expected of a 2-seater sports car. I had a 1996 Supra Twin Turbo for six months and can assure you it was at "harsher" than an S2000, without some of the nimbleness benefits.

If the "Z"'s target is the Prelude, heaven help us all. I am a Honda fan, but the Prelude was not a sports car. Period. As for the BMW comparison, I again ask what Nissan is attempting to accomplish. No one makes a better handling sedan than BMW. Last time I checked, the Z was supposed to be a 2-seater sports car giving the Boxter S and other comparables a run for it's money.

I just don't think the Z can be all things to all people. It either needs to make performance the priority and add as much everyday comfort to it as possible, or vice-versa. But they will come in conflict with each other at times and knowing which is the priority is important, IMHO.

cyranno99 · December 2001

way too much car? Is that price or performance penalty? Just curious...

Well... from what I've read, Nissan needs to squeeze out more hp and torque from the engine to match the expected competitions. It seems to fall short in acceleration as compared to an M3 or a Corvette. If Nissan can make the Z performs and pampers as well as those two cars and at the expected price, then I'll seriously consider it. OK... don't increase the power too much at the expense of fuel economy... in this day and age, you can do both.....

novcenthusiast · December 2001

performance.

Last Gen RX-7 with the factory performace packages are basically track cars. I'd never be able to drive the car anywhere near its potential, even on a track, not without attending a performance driving school.

flyingfish176 · December 2001

I agree, it does seem a little like the Z doesn't have a clear sense of direction. The only car I can think of the Z "aiming towards" in terms of competition is the Audi TT, which also doesn't seem to have a clear purpose. Granted, the Z will have a lot more power than a TT, but IMO that's a market that only exists in theory. Both cars may look good on paper and in person, but they're not the kind of cars that give people a reason to "go out and buy one right now". Just my opinion.

6462 · December 2001

It seems to me like a classier Mustang GT. Maybe they're looking at how many Mustangs are sold per year and figure that they can tap into that market a bit. People will always pay a bit of a premium for the Japanese label, more refined interior, better reliability, and better handling.

alaskans13 · December 2001

I wouldn't say it's a classier Mustang, the Z is the whole package. It will have acceleration, handling, braking, etc. Sure, the suspension may be a little softer for a comfortable ride(soft is only relative here, it's not going to be a Cadillac, think BMW soft), but it will still have excellent handling. The S2000 does have a fairly harsh ride. I know somebody who traded in an S2000 for an Integra Type R, because the R actually had a quieter, and smoother ride. Like I said before, if you want the razor sharp handling, it's very easy to swap in some aftermarket suspension. It's going to have independent suspension all around, so it does have the potential for S2000 like ride with some higher spring rates.

cyranno99 · December 2001

I think the last Z was more succesful in sales than the Supra or the RX-7 because it was more forgiving... just think who will be the potential buyer.. someone who does not care for boy racer image and the rough ride that is associated with such cars... maybe the Mustang GT comparison is valid...

alaskans13 · December 2001

Nah, the Mustang is the American boy racer poster car(as well as the F bodies). The Z is an entirely different type of beast.

cyranno99 · December 2001

well.... to me.. I think the Mustang represents a great bang for the buck as it was originally intended to be. The F bodies and those old muscle cars from Chrysler were just trying to alter that image. So the Z is a car that is supposed to be great bang for the buck as well since Nissan is hoping that it could compete against the likes of the Corvette and M3 at a much lower price.....

dohc32v · December 2001

I'd lay you odds the Japanese view the Cobra as part of their competition to beat. From what I have seen on paper, the Z is not going to measure up to the performance of the Cobra and there is no way you are going to get a V-6 to sound half as sweet as a V-8. Further, if that Rice Cooker is priced over $30K, they are not only going to be bumping up against Ford on performance but they will be over priced as well. The Japanese wanna be muscle cars fell on their faces before, they better get it right this time. The NSX is laughable compared to a Dodge Viper, both in price and performance comparisons. The Japanese are better at building motor cycles (I'll throw the Honda 2000 in with the motorcycles) and five passenger "Podmobiles" than they are at "down and dirty, lets get it on Muscle performance cars". American's excell at this art. Oh, did I forget to mention how I love the throaty roar of a V-8 ~ LOL. You don't need a 2 gallon paint can, hanging on the end of a V-8 tail pipe to hear the music.

g_car · December 2001

My vote for what it counts 300ZX looks better than the 350Z. 350Z has a kinda of TT/S2000 crossbred look to it. Hope it looks better in person. I have a 95 300Z and would love to upgrade to the 350 but the look of the new car just doesn't turn me on. The 300ZX looks good even today. All they had to do was freshen the 300ZX shape up a little esp, the rear light treatment (IMHO).

flyingfish176 · December 2001

If I were to cross-shop a new 350Z with a new V-8 Mustang, here's what the rules would be. The prices would have to be within about $3000 of each other. If one car has an edge in performance and the other has an edge in refinement, it'll be a toss-up. If the price difference is any more than $3000, the more powerful, less refined car starts to look better and better.

Bottom line: the Z's extra refinement is not enough to convince me to spend over $30K on it over the Mustang. (That means my business would probably go to another segment of the market, rather than buy a Mustang) If anyone else thinks like me, the new Z doesn't stand a chance. People won't be willing to make the "sacrifice".

If big American V-8's are the greatest thing that ever happened to performance cars, I wonder why we don't see more of their defining characteristics in top-end racecars, such as Formula 1 racers. Low-revving, normally aspirated, "throaty roar"... those are concepts that are completely foreign to Indy cars. I wonder why.

alaskans13 · December 2001

The thing is that big American V8's haven't been selling well. So it's not like they are the thing to beat. The Z isn't going to be competing with them much anyway. Granted I'm sure there will be some cross shopping, but not much. The muscle cars have lots of straight line performance, and that's about it. They're all about brute force. The Z like I said before is the whole package. It will have power, acceleration, handling, refinement, etc. It's competition will be the S2000, RX8, etc. These cars and the American muscle cars have two entirely different design philosophies.

habitat1 · December 2001

..if you think a typical 350z, S2000, NSX or BMW M buyer would give a Ford Mustang or, for that matter, a Dodge Viper, any serious consideration. Others here have been more polite. If you still don't get the message, Nascar and Formula 1 don't mix; Miller High Life and fine Port don't mix; "down and dirty" and quality and refinement don't mix.

The fact that US manufacturers have chosen to stick more cylinders and raw horsepower in their sub $30k cars rather than compete with the Europeans and Japanese on the basis of quality and refinement is about their only choice for selling anything to anybody. Trust me, the other side is not envious of this.

You want instant down and dirty gratification. Get a Ford or Dodge. But before you talk about value, watch how quickly your investment depreciates. There are any number of $40-50k+ cars that are considerably better long term values than your sub $30k Mustang. I sold a 911 in 1995 for nearly what I paid for it in 1985. The S2000 residual in 5 years is higher than any Ford product at 3 (check out cars.com).

As a previous poster suggested, you might want to consider changing your "dream car" from a 360 Modena. The NSX and S2000 that you apparantly dislike have infinitely more in common with a Ferrari than does anything EVER put out by Ford, Dodge or GM. As of right now, your reality and dream suggest severe schizophrenia. I think "Bigfoot Truck" would be just what the doctor ordered.

P.S. For the record, this is not meant to critical of the Musclecar mentality of the "don't mix" sides. If you know what turns YOU on, go for it. Just don't cross the line and try to suggest superiority to me/us on the quality, refinement and long term value side.

barresa62 · December 2001

I was thinking of whether I was going to respond to dohc32v or not, and what I would say. You covered all the points I was going to make very well. Thanks.

Stephen

dohc32v · December 2001

>>>>>The fact that US manufacturers have chosen to stick more cylinders and raw horsepower in their sub $30k cars rather than compete with the Europeans and Japanese on the basis of quality and refinement is about their only choice for selling anything to anybody. Trust me, the other side is not envious of this. <<<<<

I thought this was a discussion about the new Z and it's chances of success for a second go around in the American market place. Since Ford sells 100,000+ Mustangs a year I would imagine Nissan, as a wanna be hope to be, profitable enterprise; they would be sizing up the competition. I think you are wrong in discounting the Mustang Cobra out of the "buyer" decision making equation. But who knows, maybe that is why Nissan and their 300ZX left the market place the last time. Could it be they lost sight of what most Americans want and the market bench mark for pony cars. (You are welcome to your fine "Port", I just hope you don't spill any on you as I bump your elbow swilling my "Millers".) I'm just wondering if the Japanese learned anything about American buying habits and performance desires in the high $20 to sub $30K performance car market. They packed up and went home in mass a few years ago, because they stepped out of that marketing window of opportunity. Have a nice day and I hope you look down occasionally, because people with their nose that high up in the air have a tendency to trip a lot. Your high brow attitude and air of superiority is not where the main stream of the American market place resides and I think that is what the Japanese should be considering with the launch of their new Z. The rubber only meets the road when buyers are willing to pull out their pocket books and we all know there is a lot of Mustangs on rubber out there don't we <Smile>.

sphinx99 · December 2001

Well, I also agree that if the 350Z passes the $30k mark it's going to have to be damn good to compete with a Cobra SVT Convertible. The main reason is that Mustangs simply put have sex appeal, and the 350Z I'm seeing doesn't, it looks like... well, like the spawn of a Audi TT mating with an Acura RSX.

And this is the American market, not the European one. In the price range described, the Mustang is one of the best selling and most popular cars of the past ten years. The Z is just struggling to come back alive. In terms of marketing and the public's wallet, the Mustang doesn't need to explain itself to the Z, it will compete with the car by price and size alone.

alaskans13 · December 2001

The Mustang isn't all that, most of the 100,000 sold are 6 cylinders. I don't know why you think it will compete with the Mustang. The Acura Integra, Subaru Impreza, Toyota Celica, Mazda Miata, etc, etc, have all done just fine even with a far more powerful Mustang GT in their price range. I don't see S2000 sales being slowed by the mighty Mustang Cobra. You guys must be Mustang owners, or lovers, because they are not the giant you make them out to be. The Z has nothing to worry about from the Mustang.

cyranno99 · December 2001

but the Z will definitely has to face with the upcoming competitions... the new Toyota and Mazda sportscars.

cyber_x · December 2001

I thought the new Toyota sports car is going to be a supercar, or at least pseudo-supercar (depending on how picky one is in defining "supercar"), and will be priced closer to the NSX price range.

wishnhigh1 · December 2001

"The Japanese wanna be muscle cars fell on their faces before, they better get it right this time."

First of all, the japanese never tried making muscle cars. Second, American muscle cars fell on their faces too, but they had the home court advantage to keep them here in the US.

greddygtr · December 2001

American muscle cars have definitely fallen on their faces. IMO the only true muscle cars left were the f-bodies and they will soon be gone. The whole premise behind the American muscle car was big cubic inches to go along with a price tag that the average consumer could afford. Sure the Corvette and Viper pack big performance but they also carry price tags that place them out of reach for most Americans. I really don't feel that the Mustang GT qualifies as a muscle car. It has a V8 but the motor still only makes 260 hp and it only runs about a 14 s quarter mile. A Subaru Impreza WRX comes close to matching, if not improving on the acceleration of the GT. The Cobra could be considered the last remaining muscle car but it's sold in fairly low numbers. It probably accounts for less than 5% of total Mustang sales.

hgiles · December 2001

Never in a million years did I expect to read a significantly lengthy discussion regarding the head-to-head competition of the Mustang and the 350Z. I really like what I've seen of the new Z car. There are always going to be rare individuals who cross-shop all kinds of weird cars/trucks. The overwhelming majority of people will be looking a the Z and comparing it to the Mazda RX-8, Acura RSX, Subaru WRX, 3-series BMW and the Audi A4.

tnjrobi1 · December 2001

Here is my opinion (which everyone is entitled to their own opinion.)

The Z is a true sports car(2 seats rear wheel drive) where the Mustang is a sport coupe (4 seats rear wheel drive.)

The Z is more targeted toward the driving enthusiest (30-50 yrs old.) The Mustang is targeted toward the younger generation (16-35 yrs. old.)

What dissapoints me about the Mustang is the fact that you see so many around. I can take a ten minute drive around town and see over 20 Mustangs.

And a lot of the Mustangs I see have a baby seat in the back (forgive me, but a baby seat in a sports car does not compute.)

Most of the people I know do buy Mustangs & Camaro's because of what you get for the money as far as performance (you can usually get either one with a V8 for under 25K.) But I often wonder how these people can be so happy about buying a car that has no individuality (I would not want the same kind of car everyone else drives.)

The Z, Supra, RX8 & S2000 are special cars (OK maybe they might get beat by a Mustang or Camaro from red light to red light(heck the other day I met someone that was bragging that he beat an S2000 in his old souped up Maverick.)) The fact is there is always going to be something that can pull a faster quarter time, but personally I would have much more satisfaction riding around town in the Z, Supra, etc. because of what they are. And I espesially wouldn't want to be caught dead in the Maverick (I wouldn't care if could pull a 12 second quarter.)

cyranno99 · December 2001

well.. most of the ones on the road are V-6 engines. Also, I think that Mustangs do have a great mod potential and that is why many owners love them. If I buy a Z or a RX-7, then I would not care about modifying it at all.

dohc32v · December 2001

Believe me, I have a Mustang Cobra that you would not mistake for the average run of the mill Mustang you see on the street. There is a myriad of suppliers to select from to customize your Mustang. Further it tickles me to see your age group selection for Mustangs. You might be right for late model V-6's ( driven by secretaries) but nothing could be further from the truth for Vintage Mustangs and Cobras. My guess is the median age group for restored vintage Mustangs and Cobras is approaching 50 to 55 years of age. Here in southern California, the Rice Cookers are the preferred form of transportation for the 16 to 30 year old car enthusiast. I feel about those Rice Cookers the same way you feel about the Maverick. I happen to be 65 and I'm looking forward to blowing the doors off the first production Z, with a paint bucket resonator can, that thinks he is King of the Road ~ LOL.

tnjrobi1 · December 2001

I do agree with you about the vintage Mustangs (they are usually owned by the older generation.) But here in Tennessee where I live every 1 out of 10 cars you see is a Mustang (mostly V6's and GT's (and most of them are owned by people under 30.))

Most of the people in my area are factory workers or laborers (not a very high percent with college degrees.) And most of these people grew up on Mustangs and refuse to buy into anything but Ford, Chevy or Dodge. When I argue with these people about the better build quality of Japanese cars they gave me an answer like "who cares about build quality when your kicking some Japanese cars butt".

I do agree that mustangs are fast and they do look pretty nice. I even though about getting a Cobra or SVT, but the problem is still having a car that looks just like everyone else's car. The Cobra & SVT are better than the GT's, but they still look the same (OK they might have minor differences, but not enough to turn heads.)

The town I live in has about 15,000 people in it. I would say that there are probably around 30,000 cars in the town. Out of this 30,000 I would estimate that around 4,000 of them are Mustangs, 1,500 or so are Camaro's, 15,000 or so are SUV's or trucks, 4,000 or so are old pieces of junk (old monte Carlo's, etc), probably 5,000 family movers (Taurus, Accord, etc.) and only around 500 or so Japanese sport or sporty cars (Celica, Integra, Supra, Prelude, old Z's, etc.)

So to sum it up. If you buy a Mustang in the area I live in you will be joining the majority, not setting yourself apart. And if you get something like the new Z or anything over 30K you will be in a very rare catagory (most of the people that spend over 30K are buying full size trucks and SUV's.)

sphinx99 · December 2001

It's mostly the same here, although I *do* work in Detroit. Here, Cobras are way more common than a variety of the import coupes, so having a Mustang does not at all put you in rare company, no matter what trim you have. The only Mustang I don't see too many of are the SVT convertibles, which is odd since this is the only Mustang I personally would buy

I still feel that there will be some competition if the Z maintains good performance (sub-6 second 0-60 times) and keeps the price under $30k. The Mustang has had a reputation as a softer touring car (compared to the camaros) and that's the market the Z will target. However, while the Z might steal away a few Mustang buyers, I doubt it'll have much impact due to its lower volume and the fact that the Mustang's price point for the GT is so much lower. In in motor city where it's easy to get company discount prices, I see a lot of new GTs selling around the $20k mark. That makes it a very attractive car for the price.

cyber_x · December 2001

It's probably already been mentioned before, but regardless of performance, most "Mustang people" I know would never consider a 300Z or 350Z, and most "300Z people" I know would never consider a Mustang.

The "300Z people" (at the time) might look at cars like the Supra, 3000GT, RX-7, and RX-8. The "Mustang people" would typically look at the Camaro and Firebird (ok, well, to be fair, the die-hard loyalists probably wouldn't look at either).

More important than any actual real differences between the cars is the fact that they appeal to entirely different people - people that tend to be highly polarized when it comes to how they feel about their own cars and the "other side." That being the case, I wouldn't expect the 350Z to steal more than a very small handful of potential Mustang buyers.

Personally, I would take the 350Z over the Mustang. I could care less if the Mustang turns out to be faster and costs less, and I doubt too many 350Z owners will regret their purchase just because a Mustang outruns them. But that's my personal preference only, and the Mustang isn't necessarily a bad car, I just don't like them myself. It is indeed very hard to beat the Mustang's performance at its price point, though.

obiwankenobi1 · December 2001

I would rather have a Z than a Mustang for reliability issues.

A Mustang is still a Ford and a Cobra is just a good engine in a Ford. Do I want a Ford (same company who out out such great cars as the Tempo and Contour?)? NO! Plus, before 99 they are all live rear axle cars. No thanks!

Give me the new Z's mulitlink all around please!

dohc32v · December 2001

>>>>NO! Plus, before 99 they are all live rear axle cars. No thanks!
Give me the new Z's mulitlink all around please!

<<<<<

IRS in a Muscle Car is not desirable for the 1/4 mile strip. There is a firm in Southern California that specializes in stripping out the IRS in 99 and newer Cobras and installing big Ford 9" solid rear ends with 4:10 or 4:30 gears and traction bars. IRS rear ends don't take kindly to 500+ rear wheel horsepower mills. It's called "Hop, Skip & Jump" with rear axle windup and then "Kurpow" out comes the whole rear end.

obiwankenobi1 · December 2001

Ok, I admit, I never thought of how a high horsepower muscle car could destroy an IRS. But with what you say, it makes sense.

I guess I was just dissapointed with the 98 stock Mustang Cobra I borrowed from work for the evening. The rear end road like crap!

But if we are talking modifications (which you are), then live rear axle makes sense for durability. If we are talking stock, then I STILL like IRS.

I can only imagine an IRS suspension coming apart at 100+ speeds! :-/

ligart · December 2001

People who want a Nissan Z don't want a Ford Mustang. People prefer American vs Japanese vs German vs Italian cars for different reasons. And there's probably someone for whom nothing but a Renault will do! As has been said before, but evidently ignored: "it's the whole package".

dohc32v · December 2001

>>>>People who want a Nissan Z don't want a Ford Mustang. <<<<<<

I suspect you maybe right in this observation, however street bragging rights carries a lot influence in the automobile performance community. Initially I suspect the young and upcoming gold chain crowd will shun the Mustang Cobra in favor of the snob appeal and the newness and uniqueness of the 350Z. It will probably eat into BMW's and Porche's sales base for awhile. However as we have seen with the Boxster and the Z-3, the newness wears off after awhile and you best have something up your sleeve to keep the excitment brewing. Hence we have the S Boxster and the M Z-3. I suspect that it won't be more than one or two model years before the 350Z will be sporting a blower or more cubes for better go power. However in the mean time, you are going to have a lot of automobile performance folks, that like Rice Cookers, upset that Nissan didn't put more spinach in the 350Z to start with. I'll bet the after market performance tuners are already working on performance mod's for the engine. I hope Nissan hasn't tweaked the engine for everything it is worth, like Honda did to the S-2000. I understand no one has had much success in squeezing any more pony's out of that mill.

>>>>"it's the whole package"<<<<<<

No no ~ LOL, the basic car is just the platform from which you start introducing your own ideas on what the car should be and how it should perform. I guess if you are just interested in a 36 month lease, maybe you don't. But that is the fun and joy of owning a Mustang. You can turn the car into a show car and a street screamer, that becomes a personality statement of it's owner. It isn't just another shinny jelly bean among a forrest of other jelly beans. I can assure you a tricked out Mustang, done in good taste, will outshine any Boxster, Z-3 or Mercedes SLK at a car show and Katy bar the doors with trying to outrun a hot one on the road. So don't look down your nose at the Mustang, it is the basis of one hell of a nice car, with a little individual care and attention to detail. In the long run you won't have a heck of a lot more money invested in it either, over and above what you would pay for the high priced spread. It is also, oh so gratifying to watch the high priced spread disappear in your rear veiw mirror to ~ LOL. Detroit makes some fine basic Iron from which you can develop a real road rocket and a nice looking chariot, if that is your bag. I think Nissan probably recognizes that fact and will be introducing some options on that Z car of theirs in short order.

sphinx99 · December 2001

What's the volume on the 350Z?

I'm seeing a lot of discussion regarding this car being the "hope" for Nissan, "stealing sales" from everyone from Porsche to Ford, etc. All these statements suggest a high performance, high volume, highly available car, but I have no idea if that's the case.

How many of these things will be on sale next year? 5,000? 15,000? 50,000?

Nissan 350Z

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