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Mazda6 Sedan

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Comments

  • choe13choe13 Posts: 348
    if anyone is writing a comment about mines, what i meant is idiotic ford engineers.
  • maltbmaltb Posts: 3,572
    I really think you don't understand. The tribute stalling is not because of the engine block. It's related to engine management; something that they don't have in common.
  • audia8qaudia8q Posts: 3,138
    The millenia's engine is a very dirty burning engine and would not meet the next round of federal emissions requirements without a tremendous financial and engineering effort that wasnt in the cards.

    btw..have you looked at the service history of the duratec? It is as good as most anything out there. The Tribute issues are not caused by an engine related problem. If it was the Taurus/Sable and MPV would have the same stalling issues. The duratec engine is nothing to worry about.
  • mazda6smazda6s Posts: 1,901
    Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that I always assume the dealer is being dishonest. I don't. I never assume that what what they tell me is either true OR false, unless I know them or can verify it. And, I'm always polite and professional when talking to a salesperson, though I don't automatically believe everything they say.

    I don't have a FAX, but can you tell me what are the current combos, if my "must haves" are a 6i with manual trans, cloth, and ABS/SAB package? The last info I have is that to get that, I also had to get the Premium package. Thanks.
  • choe13choe13 Posts: 348
    ok, i have digested what you have said, and understand. However you have to understand that someone like myself is a little weiry of any products that have the ford label on it. Transmission issues? (it can happen), a plastic component is loose? (it can happen), a engine stalls?? (and they call themselves a car company)?? an engine is the HEART of a car, and that should be one of the top things a company has to build to perfection, no excuses. Ford let their buyers down, and though the issue is over, how can you still trust them ?? The duratec to me is like a "Beta" engine, a chance for ford to redeem themselves. Thats fine, but its still hard for me to give them another chance, without solid reliability proves and good consecutive engines made. i'm sure this is not hard to understand.
  • newcar31newcar31 Posts: 3,711
    "Transmission issues? (it can happen), a plastic component is loose? (it can happen), a engine stalls?? (and they call themselves a car company)??"

    Honda calls themselves a car company, and I know for sure that they have had at least two of those issues. Tranny issues and stalling issues. I experienced one of them myself first hand. I had an Integra that was affected by a Honda/Acura extended warranty----on the ignitor. My car died while on a freeway on-ramp. Talk about scary. I was still on the ramp, accelerating onto the freeway, when the engine fell flat on it's face. I had it towed to the Acura dealer and had the ignitor replaced under Acura's extended warranty (which means they knew there was a problem with some ignitors).

    Other than that, the car was absolutely excellent. I couldn't have asked for a more reliable car. I sold it to my freind and he quickly racked up the miles doing super long road trips. It now has 160,000 miles on it, original clutch, two timing belts, two water pumps, lots of synthetic oil changes, and that's pretty much it.
  • choe13choe13 Posts: 348
    "The millenia's engine is a very dirty burning engine and would not meet the next round of federal emissions requirements without a tremendous financial and engineering effort that wasnt in the cards."

    like i have stated already, i realize this. And also that its expensive to maintain. But why could they have not tried their efforts to fix and improve this, rather than enhancing the duratec(which is from ford)?? even if its more expensive to twist and enhance the 2.3 supercharge, wouldn't you pay 500-700 dolalrs more for an improved supercharged engine that is better than the duratec and on par with the hondas, altimas?

    I do beleive the duratec is holding the 6s down on sales. Not tremedounsly, because it is satisfactory for a v6 engine(i guess), but with someone else better than average, this could have been the one mid size sedan of its class where the v6 actaully sales more than the I4, because it suits its sporty demeanor better. In addition when 6s was tested by the likes of the magazines such as CandD and RandT, this engine caused mazda the title. Other than cost saving, this engine doesn't bring anything worthy to the table .
  • choe13choe13 Posts: 348
    ok your issue is basically a car issue(noone can escape, but with a good car, can avoid)

    Sorry to hear about that tragic incident, but i'm sure your car wasn't at 10k when the engine dropped. Now on the other hand past and current(focus) ford engines rather break and stall whenever they please, rather than understandable breaking from alot of clicks(like 100k)
  • vadpvadp Posts: 1,025
    OK, according to choe13 the Mazda engineers are idiots.
    Instead of improving the I4 they have spent their money and talent on the V6.
    And just the fact that it shares its block with the reliable Ford engine will surely make it unreliable.
    OK. We got it.
    Can we please move on.
  • capitanocapitano Posts: 509
    all the 6s owner are gonna die when their crappy engines "hault."
  • voochvooch Posts: 92
    I personally have not heard or read anything bad about the duratec 3.0. The only negative is the water pump that is used along side it. I think its been around for quite some time too.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    Actually, he said that people HAD died when their Duratec engines "haulted." Then, when asked for hard evidence, he demurred.

    I agree, can we please move on?
  • choe13choe13 Posts: 348
    "Instead of improving the I4 they have spent their money and talent on the V6.
    And just the fact that it shares its block with the reliable Ford engine will surely make it unreliable."

    ok first what are you talking about?? i never said anything you have stated above. The I4 is an excellent engine. We are not talking about that engine. What i'm talking about is rather than to fix up the duratec they should have made their homework on the 2.3L supercharged engine. Also where do u go off saying reliable ford engine?? have you not been reading our forum thus far, especially about previous stalling issues regrading it.
  • choe13choe13 Posts: 348
    what prove is needed when its logical that when a car haults in a middle of the highway death is highly to occur?? so are you telling me if actually that guy did not die, but he suffered a major injury instaed, then that lets ford engines get off easier??

    The point is, the engine stalled(made by ford) in the middle of the highway, the car going at illegal speeds, and someone could have died.

    Why is there forgiveness than for such engines made by ford let alone motor a car.?? its totally unlogical to me
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 14,295
    Not knowing the specifics of the case, it is very rare that an engine dies becasue of the traditional "engine" part (the moving parts). These days, it's usually electronic, and my not even be part of the engine (could be ignition, etc.)

    The Duratech has proven to be a durable, reliable engine for the most part. As a former Contique owner, I got used to hearing about the engine and defending it.

    2013 Acura RDX (wife's), 2007 Volvo S40 (when daughter lets me see it), 2000 Acura TL (formerly son's, now mine again), and new Jetta SE (son's first new car on his own dime!)

  • choe13choe13 Posts: 348
    you can defend for it but it still doesn't seem safe. It is after all the next generation v6 ford engine from the previous stalling version.
    Ford is just boneheads to make a mistake like that before. I'm sure the duratech is fine, but it honestly doesn't give me peace of mind still like anything else made by ford.

    so i will live with the 6i(waiting for the hatch) and if i have a need for speed, mate it with a turbocharger, or supercharger kit designed for the mazda 6.
  • fowler3fowler3 Posts: 1,919
    Don't buy any car with a Ford engine, then you have nothing to worry about. End of this thread. The rest of the people here will do what is right for them.

    Choe113, I wouldn't be surprised if there aren't lots of things you should have done and/or should be doing, but haven't for financial reasons. Companies are the same way. ;)

    Ford isn't the only bonehead on this planet,if in fact it is.

    fowler3
  • And to add a question to this otherwise spicy dialogue, I have a real question!

    Is Mazda taking custom orders yet? Is it possible for me to get exactly what I want with PIO's instead of dealer installed accessories? That is, I want a fully loaded S with AT, and I'd like to get doodads like the homelink mirror and MP3 player. I'd really prefer to have these items installed at "port" rather than at the dealer. Is this possible yet?

    Also, what's the best way to negotiate a price on a custom-ordered car? I would think that waiting two months on a build-to-order car makes you appear less flighty to a dealer than a walk-in purchaser. In this case, is it best to negotiate the price before placing the order? is that even possible?

    thanks,
    -Alt
  • shado4shado4 Posts: 287
    ...are the Optitron gauges only available with the Sport package? I don't see the connection. I hate the "boy racer" ground effects package and spoiler, but like the 17" wheels and Optitron gauges.

    I'm also waiting to see when (if) a NAV option will be added.
  • regfootballregfootball Posts: 2,166
    duratec is a solid motor. A good one, too. No reason to grouse about it.
  • choe13choe13 Posts: 348
    does anybody know if mazda has plans to create its own v6?? or are they slowly fusing with ford regarding every component, where eventually the mazda 6 will be the ford 6??
  • zaimonzaimon Posts: 124
    You may have to wait until the new Miata. Motor Trend says that Mazda may put a small displacement v6 in the 2006 Miata (and maybe a new RX-7?) to better compete to the BMW Z4.


    It seems that Mazda is also planning a 3.5l v6 (242 horses, 204 lb. ft. - anyone know if this is another Duratec?) as shown at NAIAS this past weekend. They used it in their Washu prototype (if you ask me, the styling is a huge miss). By the looks of things, Mazda may be adding a large sedan to their lineup. Dare I say Mazda9?


    Another Washu link.


    The Ford/Mazda partnership will mostly yield inline 4 engines, in fact Mazda will be designing all of Ford's i4 engines from now on, the next to be put in the next Protege and Focus.


    Concerning the Duratec engine, while Ford really can't excuse itself for it's relatively poor manufacturing process at some assembly sites, I honestly can't see any merit towards reservations on the Duratec Engine. It's rock solid, I love it in my Tribute and will enjoy the Mazda variant in the 6s! Keep in mind that it's just the Duratec BLOCK in the 6, everything else is Mazda engineered, so, overall, the engine truly is Mazda's. Besides, who else can say they have a sedan who's v6 was designed by Porshe!?

  • Regarding the V6 engine choices: Please understand that there is an enormous investment required to build the manufacturing/machining line to produce an engine block. The reason Mazda turned to supercharging the Millenia engine was NOT because it would produce the best drivetrain. It was because the existing block would not support an increase in capacity and the manufacturing line would not support a design that would allow it. The supercharger was a band-aid fix and an expensive one at that. The V6 & supercharger combo probably cost as much as a non-forced V8 and weighed about the same.

    By using the Duratech as the foundation for the '6, it gives Mazda a larger displacement engine at low cost due to the high volume of common blocks being manufactured at the Ford plant. The only thing wrong with the Duratech in its current configurations are the choked off heads that the bean-counters saddled it with. Mazda has addressed that and made a nice engine from it.
  • qddaveqddave Posts: 164
    I would like to add my two cents, so please bear with me. I would personally hate to be called a Ford engineer if I worked for Mazda. Point, being, isn't the V6 engine used in the Mazda 6(notice I didn't say Duratec)designed, engineered and manufactured by Mazda, NOT FORD? Save for the block, of course, but there's more to an engine than just a block. Yes, Ford owns a share of Mazda, which makes them one (un)happy family. But that doesn't mean Ford has their greasy little hands on everything. IT'S NOT A FORD ENGINE. Now lets all have a good day.
  • <sigh> Just saw a decent pic of the Hatchback version over in THAT forum, and now I think I may hold out until they're available here in the States. Which is reported to be either this summer or next December.


    http://www.mazdausa.com/mazda6/images/gallery/mz6_gallery_20.jpg


    My first car, a '79 Capri, was a hatchback, and I remember how much more convenient it was loading and unloading stuff than with a traditional trunk. And my rear seats folded over in that --- I would ASSUME they will fold over in the M6 Hatchback also, like they do in the sedan.

  • meinradmeinrad Posts: 820
    The more I look at them the more I think the hatch is 100% better looking than the sedan and would definitely wait.

    It would have been cool to have all 3 at one time.
  • boxfanboxfan Posts: 180
    The hatchback and wagon will be out in December. Danto, who is a team leader at the plant, looked up the official release date. The hatchback is supposed to have flat-folding seats (the seat bottom comes forward, I believe). Yeah, I love that particular picture and agree that it's better looking than the sedan. But that's personal preference. From the European specs, the hatchback is only about 80 lb more than the sedan, so there shouldn't be much loss in power and mileage, and a little more weight in the back can only help handling by achieving better front-rear balance. Road noise and a rattling hatch are the possible drawbacks.
  • ambullambull Posts: 255
    That was an interesting discussion, with a minimum of name-calling (except the poor Ford engineers). I think we all learned a lot about Mazda engines.
    Choe13, I too prefer the I4, not because I'm afraid of the Duratec, but because the extra weight of the 6s over the 6i has a negative effect on the skidpad and braking. I also might be interested in some kind of power-improver(s) at some future date.
  • mazda6smazda6s Posts: 1,901
    The 2.3 V6 in the Millenia is a Miller cycle engine, which isn't simply a supercharged V6. It has a different combustion cycle. But you knew that, right?
    If you look at the GM 3800 in the Pontiac Grand Prix GTP, now that's a normal V6 with a blower bolted on to give it V8-like performance.
  • audia8qaudia8q Posts: 3,138
    I hate the drag this on but I can't pass....the MPV which has zoomed ahead of the Honda Oddy minivan in just about every catagory including reliability and customer satisfaction (check the edmund consumer ratings) and they did it with a Ford duratec engine.
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