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Lincoln Aviator

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Comments

  • focusedztsfocusedzts Member Posts: 10
    I'm pretty sure this wasn't metioned so here it goes. Lincoln put up a dedicated Aviator site. Finally we all get to see what that second interior color is.
  • jeepinbankdudejeepinbankdude Member Posts: 8
    I was soo excited to see this awesome new little SUV. I am personally a 99 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited owner and VERY faithful to the brand...but Ford Vehicles,especially the Explorer/Mountaineer and the Exped/Navigator are my second favorite and I follow them closely. The introduction of the Aviator means that my private predictions are not too crazy...Mercury has been dying...and its time for it to go. The only thing that somewhat peaked my interest in Mercury was the dramatically styled Mountaineer. The Marauder while powerful,and reminiscent of the run-away hit 90's Impala SS,will be the last blast for Mercury,similar to the 98 Grand 5.9 Limited when that body style bowed out. With manufacturers consolidating further and further (ala' Oldsmobile...Plymouth) and the introduction of this neat new luxo toy...putrid Mercury's fate is sealed...the path to its exit will now be far easier because Lincoln will have a decent balance of vehicles to sell on its own...and loyal Mercury Mountaineer owners will have somewhere to turn for their next luxo mid size ute. In fact...just a few days ago I was pondering how best to kill the old brand...Ford you stole the idea right out of my head! Congrats and I hope to see this new truck in person soon...
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    Interesting - the picture on the Lincoln website shows a black upper dash trim color. In the prototype I drove and the other one I looked at that part of the dash was the same color as the rest (ash or parchment). I think I even listed that as a dislike - it just didn't look good. Glad to see they changed it. It doesn't show it but I think with the Ash interior you get grey wood trim (zebrano??) and with the parchment you get real walnut burl. Overall I think I like the parchment better.

    Don't forget the adjustable pedal feature - great for shorter drivers.
  • jerry2281jerry2281 Member Posts: 97
    I priced a 2003 Explorer Limited last week-2WD w/
    V-8 and all the goodies. Quoted 38% residual for 3 year Ford red carpet lease. A real disappointment as my 1999 Explorer was 54% for 3 year.

    I am still hopeful that Lincoln will want to fast-start Aviator deliveries and may subsidize early leases to get them out on the road. Especially when they will probably go for full pop initially.

    Ford did this in 1997 when I leased a '97 Expedtion at introduction for 2 year Red Carpet Lease with a residual of 77% Boy, the good old days. Lease payments on 99 Explorer were $75 a month higher for 3 year lease than 2 year on Expedition (both XLT's with similar equipment).
  • marsha7marsha7 Member Posts: 3,703
    with the Aviator, one special reason is that it comes with a floor shifter instead of a column shifter...call me an idiot, but I just do not like auto trans with a column shifter...frankly, if Explorer/Mountaineer offered the option of floor shifter (the same way Taurus/Sable offers both options, so it is not unknown to Ford to do it) I would seriously consider them instead...yes, the 302 HP in the Aviator is nice, but the ordinary V8 in the others would do just fine...just want the damn shifter where I want it instead of where they want it...
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    I believe the reason for the column mount shifter is that the Expedition and Navigator (up until 2003) share their interiors with the F150, and the F150 needs it on the column to accomodate a bench seat. Same with the old Explorer/Mountaineer and the Ranger. It was probably cheaper to leave it there for the new Explorer/Mountaineer. I agree - I much prefer it to the column shift.
  • paul555paul555 Member Posts: 8
    The link to the new Aviator web site is

    http://www.lincolnvehicles.com/vehicles/vehi_avi/default.asp
  • paul555paul555 Member Posts: 8
    This site has a lot of info too.


    http://media.ford.com/products/presskit_display.cfm?vehicle_id=646&press_subsection_id=421&make_id=93

  • audia8qaudia8q Member Posts: 3,138
    Am I the only one who thinks the Aviator's interior is impressive?? I think it represents a luxury\upscale interior better than the competition.

    The new interior on the 03 Navigator is certainly a big factor driving the sales here in our little part of the world....We get alot of the wow factor when we open the door. I think the Aviator will get the same positive response.
  • jeepinbankdudejeepinbankdude Member Posts: 8
    I do believe the interior is very upscale and sets it apart from its stablemates. In fact the Navigators new INTERIOR styling is one of the factors that has it neck and neck with the Escalade again in my book. The old navigator looked so much like an expedition on the inside there was nothing special about it. The only demerit I would give to the Aviator is that black area surrounding the dashboard. I think that a fully matching color would look best. I Believe akirby23 mentioned that the one he drove DID have a matching color as opposed to the one in the Ford press picture,which has the black.
  • paul555paul555 Member Posts: 8
    I agree about the interior, very classy and unique. It also sounds fairly roomy too.
  • paul555paul555 Member Posts: 8
    Does the Aviator come with free maintenance, if so how many years worth?
  • johnnylincjohnnylinc Member Posts: 308
    The Aviator will have no-charge maintenance (regular schedule) for 3 years/36,000 miles. This is the case for all '03 Lincolns; the program has been in place since the '01 model year.
  • marsha7marsha7 Member Posts: 3,703
    hey, you have no idea how nice it is to have someone agree with me without any add'l flaming...LOL...also, thanks for the explanation about the F150, as I would have never known why Ford did that...

    Bob
  • jerry2281jerry2281 Member Posts: 97
    Talked to local dealer today RE: Aviator.

    Limited availability initially 1-3 per month

    No subvented leases or discount financing yet.

    Unhappy, as I am also, that no AdvanceTrac available at Job 1. 2003 Mountaineer apparently does not have AdvanceTrac option at Job 1. Do not know why since 2002 1/2 and 2003 Explorer does and they are all made in the same factory.
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    Purely a guess here, but they may not want that feature to be available on the Mercury until it's available on the Aviator. Might force some buyers into the higher priced Aviator. Not sure why the Avaiator wouldn't have it at Job 1, though. Probably a marketing decision.
  • e350v10e350v10 Member Posts: 92
    I just got a copy of the Aviator brochure. It says the Navigation system will be late availability - December 2002. The Lincoln rep has told my dealer that the first Aviators won't be available until January 03. Does anyone have any more info?
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    I think your dealer is confusing the Aviator with the LS which should arrive in December/January.
  • sirknightdsirknightd Member Posts: 96
    I will be waiting for the navigation system and the advance trac.

    Could the delay of the advance trac be related to the AWD system available to the aviator and the mountaineer somehow posing an incompatibility which ford is dealing with? ( The explorer 's and navigator option is 4wd which is somewhat different than awd )

    Any updates on the PROPOSED dates of availablility of the advance trac and navi will be greatly appreciated

    Thank you
  • zman3zman3 Member Posts: 857
    What you say makes sense. IIRC the Explorer site here at Edmunds lists an AWD version of the V8 Explorer for 2003 and that vehicle does not have advance trac as an option but the 4WD version of the same vehicle does.
  • haironghairong Member Posts: 153
    Aviator's AWD w/o AdvanceTrac and AWD w/ AdvanceTrac are two different systems. The w/o one which uses a viscous coupling is a permanent awd with a 35(f)/65(r) torque distribution. The one with AdvanceTrac employs a single speed (no low) t-case and is 100% rwd in normal driving. This is a TOD system that uses t-case to transfer torque fore/aft, and use advanctrac to transfer toque left/right. It has open diff in both axles.

    Both '02 & '03 4wd explorers have AdvanceTrac as option, I don't know why Aviator does not offer it at init. production, since the torque between the two v8s are not that different: 280 vs. 300.
  • jerry2281jerry2281 Member Posts: 97
    Since I started this discussion in Dec., 2001, I have been seeking every tidbit of info on the 2003 Aviator.

    I extended the lease on my '99 Explorer for 6 months waiting for the delayed Aviator intro availability date. My time is up November 10 and I just can't wait any longer.

    Yesterday, I reluctantly factory-ordered a 2003 Explorer Limited with AdvanceTrac to be delivered o/a 11/10.

    I really wanted the Aviator and would have paid a premium over the Explorer. But no AdvanceTrac at intro was the last straw.

    I own a 2001 Lincoln LS V-8 Sport w/AdvanceTrac and have had no problems and great service by the selling dealer. The free maintenance and longer warranty were also a plus for Lincoln. Although I will still be around this site, I was hoping I could be an early Aviator owner and share my experiences.

    For those who can wait, I envy you and look forward to your discussions of your new Aviator. I am confident it will set the standard in mid-size SUV class as the best value.
  • jerry2281jerry2281 Member Posts: 97
    I am guessing that the delayed availability of AdvanceTrac on the Aviator and Mountaineer may be due to the fact that an upgraded AdvanceTrac will be available shortly.

    The Lincoln LS will have AdvanceTrac II with understeer control added to the current AdvanceTrac. Perhaps final testing and release for production was delayed as the new system was finalized. The LS is scheduled to be introduced in November/December, 2002 time frame.

    I will bet that AdvanceTrac II will be available on Job 2 Aviators and Mountaineers, to provide an upgrade over the Explorer.

    Just an educated guess.
  • jeepinbankdudejeepinbankdude Member Posts: 8
    For those of you who are delaying your purchase of the Aviator for the simple lack of Advance Trac. Consider this...

    There is no real point in a TRUE AWD vehicle ALSO having Traction Control. AWD (QuadraTrac,QuadraDrive in Grand Cherokees)will always be superior to a 2WD system with Traction control because it involves the transfer of power between wheels and axles,whereas Traction Control is usually just a sophisticated computer controlling ABS on the vehicle brakes. Both are very safe systems,and in a passenger CAR (i.e. BMW,Lincoln LS) I would always choose traction control because it deters little from a CAR's handling characteristics,rather than something like a Subaru(except WRX which still handles EXTREMELY well)which also has AWD. BUT in something as cumbersome as an SUV,where handling is not really its strongsuit anyway,an AWD system will always be my top pick because it can be used over a greater variety of conditions with minimal driver input. There ARE some DISadvantages to AWD however. One is that many AWD systems involve a viscous coupling...these over the course of many years tend to go bad and are co$tly to replace. Additionally if you like to use 2wd(you like to peel out in your SUV??)then an AWD system will not suit your needs.These concerns are minimal however when compared against the Pro's of AWD. Bottom line...dont forgo this great truck over something as trivial as Traction Control when youve already got AWD..
  • sirknightdsirknightd Member Posts: 96
    Arent traction control and stability control(Advanced Trac) two different things?

    Currently I have a 96 explorer which has control trac 4wd with a limited slip differential which i understand in the auto mode means it is rwd 100 % until there is slipage then the front wheels would be employed to some extent. I m curious how the aviator awd with the stability control would be different than the system I have now...I realize the stability part would be different..utilizing the brakes to stop swerving situations..but if it is rwd until slippage..it sounds the same as what i have in my explorer...
    I m wondering why a system which starts out as all rwd would be better than a system which has the 65/35 rwd/fwd split from the get go?
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Check out the 4WD & AWD systems explained discussion too.



    Steve

    Host

    SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    is NOT traction control. It prevents the vehicle from understeering or oversteering (loose or pushing for you NASCAR fans) using yaw sensors and applying the brakes to one or more wheels and/or cutting engine torque. It can save you from overdriving a corner or possibly losing control in slippery conditions.

    Traction control applies brakes and/or cuts engine torque to prevent rear wheel slippage in a RWD car. That is slightly different than AWD which moves torque from the rear to the front.

    I don't have Advance Trac on my LS and probably wouldn't go out of my way to get it on a new vehicle. But others have said it saved their butt on at least one occasion. So I can understand why it might be a requirement for some buyers.
  • haironghairong Member Posts: 153
    AdvanceTrac is more of a safty feature than a driving mode. Without going into techincal details, it kicks in when you turn too fast, too sharp at an unsafe speed (relative to road/weather condition). Your normal AWD won't save your butt in these situations.

    Aviator's AWD w/ AdvanceTrac should have been called 4x4 auto or auto-4WD. But, this is my guess, since there's no low range in its t-case, Ford didn't want to use the term 4WD.
  • jerry2281jerry2281 Member Posts: 97
    I was going to buy a 2WD Aviator, but ordered a 2 WD Explorer. Would not purchase without AdvanceTrac. I have AdvanceTrac on my LS, so I am fully aware of it's capabilites. I considered a 4 WD and would still insist on AdvanceTrac.
  • tgeddingstgeddings Member Posts: 1
    I talked to my local dealer about a week ago and he told me their first aviator has a build date of 9/16 and should be arriving within 2 weeks of that date.
  • jerry2281jerry2281 Member Posts: 97
    Base prices and options for all 4 Aviator models are now available on Edmunds.com.

    I believe Lincoln did a heck of a job aggressively pricing for the Aviator. It should sell like gangbusters.
  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    My dealer says Job 1 for the Aviator has now slipped into October....... Bill doesn't want any shipped until they're sure they're right. Can't fault him for that.
  • rosie123rosie123 Member Posts: 2
    Last week I called 8 dealers in the Virginia/Washington area asking them when the Aviator would be available. Every month between October and January was mentioned. One message (234) indicated that the delivery date has slipped to October. Versus when? September? And Bill said, he didn't want any shipped until they were right. What's wrong? Usually the car come out and there is a delay in the pretty brochure. This is the reverse. Looks like there is a quality/production problem.

    If anyone is looking at the new Volvo SUV - think twice. The 4 speed T6 engine was "made" to fit and this engine is presently being re designed.
  • dvdstevedvdsteve Member Posts: 6
    Does anyone know if the middle seats will recline??? My '01 Navigator has the split reclining bench seat which is a great feature for long trips...I know the Mountaineer and Explorer do not have reclining middle seats...

    Thank You

    Steve
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    I don't think they do, but I didn't specifically check them either.
  • haironghairong Member Posts: 153
    I think they do. To what degree they recline back, I don't know. 2nd row outboard seats are flip&tumble style (see the pic in this thread), so the seat backs are not fixed, it's only natural that they also recline back. Though I haven't seen one doing that yet.
  • johnnylincjohnnylinc Member Posts: 308
    According to the Aviator ordering guide, the 2nd row bucket seats (which are standard equipment) do, indeed, recline. If you get the optional 40/20/40 2nd row bench, I can't say. The ordering guide doesn't specify a reclining feature on the bench. My guess is that it's not there; otherwise, it would probably be mentioned. The only way to know for sure is either ask a very knowledgable dealer or wait for the Av to arrive in the showroom. You could also try calling Lincoln customer assistance at 1-800-521-4140. They might be able to tell you.

    Has anyone seen an Aviator brochure yet? I ordered one on via Lincoln website, but haven't received it. (The Blackwood brochure arrived in less than a week. :) )
  • navigator3740navigator3740 Member Posts: 279
    That's because the Brochure was ready about a year before the Blackwood was. A dismally failed execution, which has now marked the demise of the Blackwood. Nice work, Jacque......
  • craigcurrycraigcurry Member Posts: 14
    I got one from my dealer about 3 weeks ago.
  • sirknightdsirknightd Member Posts: 96
    Got my brochure today from the dealer. NO mention of advance trac.
    I m still guessing advance trac I is incompatible
    with all wheel drive.Any idea when advance trac II
    will be here?
  • zman3zman3 Member Posts: 857
    Additionally, what is the difference between advance trac I and II?

    I'm in the market for an Expedition or Explorer and I assume they have advance trac I at this point. What would version II add?
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    Advance Trac II simply adds understeer protection to AT I's oversteer protection. Or so the press release says for the 2003 LS:

    The software governing Lincoln’s AdvanceTrac™ traction and stability
    enhancement system now incorporates understeer control. Understeer control
    provides improved steering control and maneuverability on snow and ice and also
    in dry road emergency situations where high lateral accelerations are induced.

    It's not clear whether the Explorer or Expedition will get this or just the Lincoln versions.
  • shalhoubshalhoub Member Posts: 1
    I confess my confusion about it's merits w AWD based on conflicting emails (I know zip about vehicles). I live in Boston and we do get snow and ice...thanks to Global warming it's much less than 30 years ago!

    I don't care about paying extra $ but I don't enjoy waiting, my lease is up NOW on my 2000 Continental (in rugged shape) & I HATE to miss gadgets & (especially) safety extras.

    Advance Trac, DVD Navigation and the tire pressure monitoring system & five spoke chrome wheel are all available "later in model year". Which means...?
  • sirknightdsirknightd Member Posts: 96
    The brochure stated dvd navigation to be available
    December 2002. Seems like the brochure was printed prior to any delays.

    Also, for anyone interested
    vivid red is an offered color in the brochure with light parchment interior.
  • haironghairong Member Posts: 153
    2nd row seats do recline

    18" wheels will be available as an option

    A 2003.5 model seems likely, but I don't know what changes will be in there.
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    Advance Trac is a nice to have but if you don't get it you probably won't miss it. I personally wouldn't wait for it. I don't have it on my LS and haven't missed it yet.
  • cclittlecclittle Member Posts: 23
    "Advance Trac II simply adds understeer protection to AT I's oversteer protection. Or so the press release says for the 2003 LS:"

    Except I don't see anyplace in the '03 LS documentation that specifically refers to this feature as "AdvanceTrac II"... where are you getting it from?
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    Chris - I honestly don't remember, but I did see it somewhere. May have been an Aviator press release or review.
  • cclittlecclittle Member Posts: 23
    I think I found the difference - from the Aviator "safety" sheet:
    "The second-generation AdvanceTrac interactive vehicle dynamics system, a late-availability option, represents a significant advancement in safety technology because it now is capable of helping the driver maintain control and avoid possible rollover situations, in addition to helping correct oversteer and understeer skids."

    No worries then, on something like an LS! :)
  • gunz1gunz1 Member Posts: 9
    I see that the premium model has heated and cooled seats. In the luxury model can this be ordered as a stand alone. Does it come with only heated seatsn as an option or standard?
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