Lincoln Aviator

marsha7 · February 2002

HID headlamps would be standard/optional on the Aviator...is this the first American made vehicle with HID headlamps???...does Ford know what it is doing with lamps radically different from anything else they have sold in the last 50 years???will the option eventually work its way thru the rest of the Ford lineup???

johnnylinc · February 2002

HID lamps will be standard on the Aviator Premium model; not available on the Luxury model.

HID lamps were standard equipment on the Lincoln Mark 8 LSC from the time the LSC was introduced in the '95 model year through its last appearance in 1998. They were called "Luminarc" and were made by Sylvania. I had a '96 LSC, and the lamps worked great until they both failed within weeks of each other; fortunately, the car was still under warranty. I have no idea what replacement cost was, but it probably wasn't cheap. The Luminarcs were odd in that there was no conventional bulb; an electrical arc passed across two poles, and the generated light was bounced across reflectors to create the beam.

My guess is that we'll see HID lamps appearing throughout the higher end of the Ford lineup within the next couple of model years. It's a competition thing; BMW and Lexus and the like have them, so Ford'll step up to the plate. I wouldn't be all that concerned about Ford's ability to use them, my experience notwithstanding; they can't afford to get it wrong on a large scale, and it's not rocket science.

HID lamps are good AND bad, IMO. They definitely give you better visibility IF they're aimed right; if they're not, they can cause lots of grief for oncoming traffic. The sad part is that I suspect that many (maybe most) people want them because they "look cool" rather than because they're potentially safer--witness the proliferation of colored bulbs and aftermarket kits that claim to provide HID benefits. What many people don't know is that these aftermarket bulbs are often hotter than the stock bulbs and can wind up melting the factory housings.

That's way more than you wanted to know, isn't it?

marsha7 · February 2002

actaully, I am quite happy with your extended explanation, as you covered topics I had not considered...I appreciate it when people take the time to answer my questions with additional detail as I gain a better understanding of the facts and their thinking.

karzz · February 2002

Ford has actually been a leader in headlight technology for quite awhile and holds many patenets on headlight technology. As Johnnylinc mentioned, Lincoln had HID lights many years ago on the Mark 8, long before their current popularity. Lincoln was the first North American company to offer HID lights.

Lincoln was the first company to ever use Halogen bulb headlights on a vehicle. Ford was also the first company in the US to adopt halogen lights across the board as standard equipment. Ford was the first company to offer flush, aerodynamic headlights in the early 80s. These first came out on the Mark 7. Now, of course, pretty much every car has flush lights.

Here is a link to what Ford is working on for future models, using fiber optics, etc.

http://media.ford.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=10706

Also, here is a link to an archived article that provides a description of what HID lights are and some of their benefits. (even has a picture of the Mark 8 with the HID lights)

http://media.ford.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=2605

sirknightd · March 2002

is a moon roof offered?

any idea on how late the la will be on the advance trac? or the dvd navigation?

sirknightd · March 2002

thanks for all the information posted...it keeps me going while i await the introduction....

johnnylinc · March 2002

The moonroof should be available at the beginning of production. Audia8q said in an earlier post that production startup is June 3, followed by a quality hold; I'm guessing that that means the first units will start showing up at dealers in late July.

AdvanceTrac is available on the '02 Explorer, and the nav system is available on the '02 Navigator, so my guess is that those items will appear on the Aviator before the end of the year. That's JUST a guess, but there shouldn't be any major technical hurdles since Ford is selling those systems on similar models in the current lineup.

Perhaps some of the dealer folks who post here can provide more info.

sirknightd · March 2002

Dear Johnnylinc

thanks for the info about the moonroof...

I haven't seen the advance trac stablilty system offered on any mountaineers or explorers...its actually what I was waiting for to order my mountaineer..but I ve waited for the feature so long..i m now going to wait for the aviator..with all the other goodies...

be well..

jerry2281 · March 2002

Visited my Ford Dealer today since I too have been waiting for Advance Trac option availability. Ford is introducing 2002.5 models with some great improvements available beginning March 4. Details posted at Edmunds Explorer/Mountaineer town hall. Advance Trac-Option Code 61V-$795 including trailer tow and 3.73 axle (according to dealer)and is available now. Aviator is to be assembled at same plant in St. Louis as Explorer, so I expect that Advance Trac will be on JOB 1.

scot29 · March 2002

Auto Week has a picture of the Aviator in the Mar. 11 edition. As suspected, it looks like a Navigator, hard to tell them apart without seeing the size. The article says it will have bigger brakes, speed-sensitive steering and a plusher ride than the Explorer.

peachtree103 · March 2002

Blue Oval News has a story on the Aviator with interior and exterior pictures. Looks are O.K., but my first impression is that there's as much Trailblazer &/or Durango in the design as the Navigator. Still very clean and attractive. Interior looks good. More pictures available in an upcoming Vanity Fair magazine, where Lincoln will have a massive, multi-page spread.

btate2002 · March 2002

http://www.bonforums.com/lincolnmerc/aviator_release.htm

There's nothing new or exciting as far as design goes. Just kinda looks like a Navigator with Explorer door handles. I do think the dash design is kinda cool.

hairong · March 2002

The Aviator definetely looks like its big brother the Navigator, from hood down. The sloped hood actually reminds me a little bit of Jaguar, but nothing of Durango or Trailblazer. The whole (front end) styling is softer than the Nav. but still tastful. It looks good, but won't be a trend setter/leader. Actually, the Nav. was the trend setter, I liked its styling very much. It took Ford a bit too long (5 years) for a follow up.

Now, I will have to buy a copy of Vanity Fair, for the wife of course.

jerry2281 · March 2002

Don't waste your time or money. Ten pages of all Linclon products, 2 1/2 pictures of Aviator, the same which can be viewed free at Blue Oval News link per Post #63. Very disapponting. Mostly a fashion advertising puff piece with the moronic Martin Sheen ??? featured. Was hoping for some specs, but noooo. That would provide information that a potential buyer could actually use.

hairong · March 2002

Thanks for the tip, Jerry. What more specs do you like to see? The dealer guys here have posted about everything they have (I saw the ordering guide too). I want(ed) to see more pics, esp. rear view and side view. Did you see the side-by-side Nav. & Aviator pic in VF? media.ford.com has that pic but very small and unclear (out of focus?).

toyotas1 · March 2002

Obviously ran out of money for an original exterior design, but the interior is great, may have TOO MUCH power, and if they keep it under $40k (loaded), they'll have a true RX/MDX sales leader competitor on their hands. Good job, Lincoln! It's only 5 years too late.....

btate2002 · March 2002

HAHAHA

There's no such thing as too much power toyota!

hairong · March 2002

It was parked in front of a Ford building. It looks like a Navigator from the front, and an Explorer from the back and side.

Frankly, I am a little dissapointed. This is exactly what I was afraid of, looks too much like an explorer. I have no problem with it looking like a Navigator because 1) I like Nav's styling and 2) I don't mind brand theme, every auto maker does that, why not Lincoln. But I don't like the family resemblence of the exp. If you want to sell a luxury suv for a premium, please at least make it look different from its non-luxury cousin, to make the buyers feel it's worth the extra $$$.

Don't get me wrong, over all I think the Aviator still looks pretty good, with excellent mechanics under the skin. But it won't prevent me from looking elsewhere, mainly MDX & Pilot. However, if the price starts (4x2 luxury) at around 35K MSRP (not street price) and tops off (AWD premium) just north of 40K, I am sold.

sirknightd · March 2002

Guess we should have more info after debut on march 29 in manhattan, new york..

sirknightd · March 2002

I have not been to an auto show in years. I am thinking of going to the debut at the Javits Center in New York.

When a vehicle debuts, typically is it roped off or can you get near it to see inside it through the glass?

thank you

pf01 · March 2002

The Aviator will be in show rooms this summer, so it is highly likely that they will allow you to play inside. I hope that the Aviator will have rear self-leveling air spring, more comfortable ride and less body rattling(an inherent problem with body-on-frame construction). The latter two problems are serious enough that the "Car and Drive" mentioned several times in their review of the new Explorer.

stever · March 2002

Ford Unveils First Midsize Luxury Sport Utility Vehicle

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sequoiasaurus · March 2002

www.wieck.com has official photos!

hairong · March 2002

Look at this photo.

http://osx.wieck.com/pv/WKA/2002/03/27/WKA2002032719663_pv.jpg

I have never seen a seat like that. It does make access to 3rd seats that much easier. Is this a Lincoln or Ford exclusive? I don't think the '02 Explorer and Mountaineer have this type of seats.

dielectric7bb · March 2002

holy smokes. Is there any room in that 3rd seat???

hairong · March 2002

Yes, there is. Go to the wieck site to see the pics (pick "public" then search for "lincoln aviator").

I've sit in the 3rd roll seat in a '02 'Neer, without the easy entry of course. It has plenty leg room, but too low for adults, because it has to be able to fold flat. I don't think they will change the design for the 3rd roll seat, better material, yes, new design, no.

porknbeans · March 2002

Those seats have been around for at least a couple of years. My 2000 Durango has those flip forward seats although not nearly as nice. If I remember correctly there is a similar version on the Expedition.

hairong · March 2002

My bad. Those seats are not exclusive to Lincoln. It's just the Aviator's version is packaged in such a nice way, especially with the "foot nook", that makes it look like nothing else.

From Ford's press release,

Does anybody know what kind of AWD system is this? Thanks. I will also ask this question in the "AWD explained" forum.

avlv · March 2002

I got this from a Ford Web site..
Traction Anytime, Anywhere
Aviator uses two all-wheel-drive systems, neither of which requires driver intervention. A permanently engaged all-wheel drive system that uses a viscous coupling to transfer torque fore and aft is fitted to vehicles without the optional AdvanceTrac interactive vehicle dynamics system. In normal driving, 35 percent of engine torque is directed to the front wheels and 65 percent to the rear.

Vehicles equipped with AdvanceTrac (late availability) use an electronically controlled single-speed torque on demand transfer case. On most surfaces, this system operates in rear-wheel drive, but if wheel slip occurs, a clutch pack can send up to 100 percent of torque to the front wheels. The system monitors front and rear driveshaft speeds and throttle position, and can anticipate rear wheel slippage and redirect torque before traction is lost.

All-wheel drive Aviators equipped with AdvanceTrac need only one wheel with traction to move because AdvanceTrac monitors wheel speed at each corner and uses the anti lock brakes and engine management to control wheelspin. This allows engine torque to be directed both fore and aft and side-to-side without heavy locking differentials.

jerry2281 · March 2002

FEATURES:
Front seat headroom and legroom are best in class.

Aviator's standard third-row seat folds flat to the floor. Third row legroom is also 5 inches better than the Acura MDX, the next closes competitor. Headroom is three inches greater.

The front bumper beam is designed to align with passenger car frames to improve crash compatibility.

Dual-zone electronic climate control and an auxiliary climate control system for second and third-row passengers.

Heated, power-adjustable side mirrors with built-in approach lamps and turn signal repeaters.

Sound blocking laminated from door glass and privacy glass for the rear quarter windows and liftgate.

A DVD based navigation system, telematics, second generation AdvanceTrac (LATE AVAILABILITY) and a five spoke chrome wheel will be available later in the model year.

All aluminum DOHC 4.6 V-8 and variable length intake runners-302 hp and 300 ft. lbs. of torque.

Maximum towing-7,300 lbs. 46% better than Mercedes ML 500 and 22% better than BMW X5 4.4. Can even out-tow some full size luxury SUV's, including the Lexus LX 470 by 800 lbs.

...speed sensitive, variable assist ZF Servotronic II rack and pinion steering.

...four wheel disk brakes with anti-lock control and electronic brakeforce distribution.

...optional AdvanceTrac II (late availability) which provides drivers with an interactive vehicle dynamics aid that can help correct oversteer/understeer skids. This system will also add a new industry-leading technology that can reduce the likelihood of untripped vehicle rollovers.

Another feature that will appear on Aviator later in the model year is a tire pressure monitoring system that will alert the driver when any of the vehicle's tires-including the spare-becomes severely under or over-inflated.

4 year/50,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty. 3 yr/36,000 mile complementary maintenance.

Full info at: media.lincolnvehicles.com, then view the "2003 Lincoln Aviator Media Kit" then "product information".

hairong · March 2002

Thanks avlv and jerry. I also found the article on the media.ford.com site. At my first visit there, I inexcusably forgot to click on the "Driving Dynamics" link, where a lot of things are explained, including the above piece.

marsha7 · March 2002

you pull up Lincoln's home page, they have placed the Aviator on it, and if you give them your email info, they will send you updates...obviously they seem to want to sell these things, most likely to inconsiderate buyers thru inconsiderate salesmen...:):):)

sirknightd · April 2002

I just purchased my tickets on line for the ny auto show....

if anyone has any questions about the aviator that i can answer by looking at it...ask now

nedculver · April 2002

Does it have keyless entry?
Does the third seat fold completely flat?
Thanks,
Ned

sirknightd · April 2002

I ll check those two items out...keyless entry and completely flat third row

i d like to know when the dvd navigation will be offered
and the vivid red color

nedculver · April 2002

To clarify my last, sirknightd: By keyless entry, I meant does it have a numerical keypad on the door, or post, like the Explorer or Mountaineer. So you can leave the car running with the doors locked.
Thanks - have fun at the show!

audia8q · April 2002

yes to both questions.

pexpl · April 2002

Does anybody know if ford will sell Aviator in canada? Because the mountaineer didn't came in canada and for me it was a big disapointment. In addition would hid light come to canada, if Ford does sell the avaitor here? From what i understand, goverment of canada might be banning it, i got the facts from the salesman in volvo, because volvo was about to place hid light in their new suv xc90 but planned has been called off, fear of lost in investment.

sirknightd · April 2002

as for the bottom line
yes to both questions

they keyless entry pad appears to be located at the same location as the explorer and mountaineer

at the ny auto show the aviator was on a raised revolving platform.which was fenced off...so i couldnt get close enough to touch it

i was told by a 'product specialist' that the third row cushion on the bench can be removed to create even more room and allow the the folded seatback to fold more flat

i was also told by a product specialist that the parchment interior comes with burled walnut

whereas the light grey interior comes with zebrano wood...

i like the burled walnut better as i saw it on the navigator

there appears to be a power point behind the third row
i was told there is one on the console for use of the second row occupants

overall the interior seemed delightful to me
( from a distance)....
the exterior was very cautiously designed...in that it wont offend but wont excite either

i ll get mine when the dvd navigation and advance trac are out

bennewman · April 2002

Does anyone have any reliable information about pricing info? When will the DVD navigation system be available?

hairong · April 2002

Saw another Aviator today. Noticed the trunk space behind 3rd row seat is very samll. The depth on the floor level is like 8" ~ 10" (est. but definetely less than a foot). Mountaineer has a longer trunk floor, if memory serves me right. Seems Lincoln moved 3rd row seat backward a litle bit for more leg room.

stever · April 2002

Preview: 2003 Lincoln Aviator

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marsha7 · April 2002

but, for those of us who might remove the third row seat completely (or do the same on the Mountaineer), would the rear cargo space then be identical from the second seat to the rear cargo door???

hairong · April 2002

Did you mean remove remove? as in taking it out of the SUV? I have no idea about the cargo space after removing the 3rd row seat. but it won't be pretty. That seat is not meant to be "removed". Maybe an Explorer EB or Limited without the optional 3rd seat can fit your need better.

If you meant just folding down the 3rd seat, I am not sure if the cargo space are identical between the two. The two Aviators I saw both had 3rd seat up. If you want the spec. number, media.ford.com lists them. If I remember correctly, the total volume behind front seats, with both 2nd and 3rd seats folded, Aviator is less than Mountaineer, cant recall the number though.

kahkgozinya · April 2002

Another re-badged domestic trying hard to be a wannabe pseudo-luxury car. It STILL is a domestic, and it STILL won't have the mystique or exclusivity of German or Japanese imports it's trying so hard to emulate. Caddy and Lincoln will never be able to shake their reputation as being the favorite makes of the geriatric population, no matter what their marketing staff do.

porknbeans · April 2002

Funny, if I remember correctly there used to be stereotypes regarding the VW being the vehicle for the hippy/free love generation, it looks pretty mainstream now. Or how about the reverse of your stereotype. Caddy and Lincoln used to be coveted by young and old people as the epitome of fine car building before many of the Japanese brands even existed.

I will not argue your point that the median age of Lincoln and Caddy owners is high. I won't argue your point that these brands are now trying to play catch-up and are in a number of respects copying what the European and Japanese have out there. But to say that they can NEVER shake their reputation as being the favorite make of the "geriatric" population is a very, very strong statement. Never is a very long time. Marketing, time and the American populace are fickle and elusive animals. There could very well be a backlash against "foreign" cars just like the backlash you're starting to see against SUV's and minivans.

porknbeans · April 2002

It's not my intention to say that Lincoln and Cadillac are the best vehicles on the road, they're not. It's also not my intention to wrap your knuckles. However, for you to come out and say that they can never be considered a vehicle that is coveted by people under 65 without backing it up is irresponsible and wrong.

I'm 35 and don't want anything that Lincoln or Cadillac currently have on the road. Both companies did make me turn my head with the LS and the CTS. They are offering vehicles that are making more people take notice. They still aren't there but they're closer than they were even 10 years ago.

avlv · April 2002

I have not read anything about seat removal on the Aviator. However when I checked out the 3rd row seat on the Mountaineer the dealer advise the 3rd row seat cushion was removable. This would allow the seat back to for flat.

marsha7 · April 2002

basically, the idea of third row seating is useless for me, I would take the 3rd seat out and use for cargo, but the thought of the luxury amenities of the Aviator as better equipped than the explorer/mountaineer is appealing...better engine, floor shifter (hate column shifters), probably better seats, etc., but the third seat is a no-no for me...no kids, may only put 2 adults in the back seat, thrid row seating worthless to me, so I would remove them, if possible, and use for a boat anchor, wheel chock for a semi-truck, or a bullet shield while advancing on the enemy (LOL)...

schulhof · April 2002

I am a bit suprised at so little discussion regarding this SUV which seems to be a real winner?

Lets start a little discussion.

What do you folks currently drive, that you are going to replace (potentially) with a Lincoln Aviator?

My wife drives a '96 Isuzu Trooper with 104k dead reliable miles on it. It has been absolutely fantastic. Unfortunately Isuzu has let us down and has not responded with what the market demands, which is a powerful mid sized SUV that seats 7. So we nned to look elsewhere.

The Explorer just seems a bit "cheap" to me, speaking in terms of materials, fit and finish. We would like to upgrade from the Trooper which has fairly standard Japanese fit and finish, and the Explorer, even a Limited or EB feels cheap.

The wife demands seating for 7, we need to tow a boat so FWD minivan is out (plus I am WAY too cool to drive a minivan!).

I refuse to buy a HUGE SUV. So Expedition, Navigator, Suburban, Sequoia, Yukon are out. I also require mileage better than the Troopers miserable 14 MPG.

My search has led me to Aviator, XC90, MDX, Pilot. I am a bit weary of a Turbocharged 5 cylinder (?) SUV, the Pilot probably won't satisfy the desire to upgrade to a more luxurious car. So I think the MDX and Aviator are on top.

From what I have seen this Aviator looks impressive.

The wait continues.

Lincoln Aviator

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