Land Rover Range Rover

vdandy · June 2004

My front differential failed over the long weekend. My dealer got the car Tuesday morning, and it was ready to go Wednesday afternoon. I have only seen one other comment on this board about this problem, but from other sources I gather it's a biggie. Anyone here experienced the same thing?

djt21 · June 2004

I purchased an 03' Range Rover last Sept. and Im now beginning to wonder about reliability and build quality. Nothing on the truck has actually failed yet, but occasionally I do notice minor electrical issues (gremlins) that happen once or twice then seem to dissapear. Im also beginning to hear some squeaks and rattles. I previously owned an LX470 and cant help but compare the two for reliability. What are your expierences?

nvbanker · June 2004

Why would you do that? Toyota is hands down the best at long term durability and reliability. Range Rover is generally conceded the best at crawling over rocks - not necessarily though, without tons of maintenance. Even if your 03 has the BMW engine in it, did you ever know a BMW not to have electrical issues and gremlins? I haven't.

Europeans are not obsessed with a -0- defect mentality! They build for performance, and expect glitches, gremlins and maintenance to be part of the game.

You shouldn't compare them. It different DNA.

stever · June 2004

Seems to me if I was out crawling over rocks, I'd obsess about reliability and durability - it's a long walk out of some of those places.

Maintenance is one thing but it sounds like you're saying some manufacturers plan on failure. There's not much performance happening sitting on the side of the road (or trail) waiting for a tow.

Steve, Host

nvbanker · June 2004

Not failure, Steve, but Maintenance. The poster above hasn't experienced failure yet, but glitches he has, and he wasn't used to those in a Toyota.

I have a client who is in the defense business. He builds stuff to kill people and break things with. They ordered a component from a Japanese company, and specified a 5% reject rate on the part. When the order arrived, inside the box with the 1000 parts, was a small seperate package, that had 50 parts in it, with an invoice that read; "We don't understand why you ordered these, but here are your 5% defective parts, no charge".

That's obsessive over quality, and it's the advantage Toyota has too, IMO. But, I don't drive a Sequoia, because, as faultless as it may be, I don't like the truck. I'd rather have a truck with some character, even if I have a few things to have fixed once in a while. AS long as it doesn't become unreliable and I lose confidence in my ability to get home, that works great for me. I don't think anybody is making anything that badly anymore.

stever · June 2004

lol, I think that story is an urban legend, but it's still funny.

Manufacturers make more money the fewer warranty claims they have to cover, so I don't agree that the European manufacturers aren't concerned about quality. Some seem to have trouble executing, but you're right, nobody is making anything that badly anymore.

Steve, Host

nvbanker · June 2004

Steve, I didn't mean Europeans aren't "concerned" about quality, just not in the way the Japanese are obsessed with 0 defects.....ever. To a European, Quality may mean how fast it will rev, and for how long, and how fast it will corner, and how quickly it will stop. That's a quality car. They don't make Camrys - which are built more on the lines of, "how long will it run without an oil change before it quits, under moderate load".

It's just a little different mentality. My point was, comparing a Lexus to a RR - it's an apple and oranges thing almost. They're both fruit, but......they taste different.

stever · June 2004

hmmm, I think I need some more convincing. Anyone else want to weigh in (any one else care? <g>).

Steve, Host

agent_orange · July 2004

I took my second test drive yesterday and am definitely ready to place an order.

When I asked about improvements to the '05 model, the sales rep claimed all he knew was that Bluetooth would be added. I specifically inquired about the NAV system change and other new colors, he said he was not aware of anything else.

The '05 was slated for delivery in October.

The Land Rover website is not helpful. I assume that's because they want the '04 models to go first. Is there anyone out there who knows about the new colors and NAV system change? Will it be touch screen with improved performance or touch screen and no other enhancements?

Thanks for reading.

nvbanker · July 2004

I've noticed that most car websites are not helpful, at least to what I need to know. Ford companies in particular, seem to miss the point for me. They give you tons of info on Heritage, History, Employee benefits, and environment and BS like that, when I want to see the CARS, with big pictures and lots of detail, not just a shot of the taillight.

jchris2000 · July 2004

Most likely you are looking at a DVD-based nav & bluetooth for the "major" changes. My estimate is that the additional colors may include White Gold and/or Bonatti Grey. Not sure if/what colors may be eliminated.

Joie

'04 RR
*Adriatic Blue
*Parchment
*Cherry
*Luxury interior
*20's
*Additional cherry trim package
*Running boards

sam818 · July 2004

I am wondering if TinCup can help with this or if others owners can comment:
1. On 04 RR battery will go dead in a little as a day or two if car not driven
2. There is a TA # TA03 8603 which talks about a drain on the battery from the a/c when the car is parked.
3. It MAY affect VIN # 4A156466 to 4A164860
4. LRNA was working on a fix
5. My dealer could not duplicate my problem (of course!)
6. BUT.. I have heard what appears to be a fan running behind the dash when the ignition is switched off, even after a short run (so it does not appear to be a regular cooling fan)
7. Any ideas on the fix and if it is available?

tincup47 · July 2004

The fan noise you hear is actually normal and it is from a small fan inside the vehicle. When you open the door the fan activates to draw air from the cabin over the ambient temp sensor to allow the ATC control to determine the setting needed to cool/heat the vehicle to the desired temperature. This is supposed to shut off when the vehicle is turned off. In some cases this does not happen, then the battery gets discharged. A fix is due to be released soon, but in the mean time you may reduce your chances of the battery running down if you avoid opening the doors without cycling the key on and off.

1236 · July 2004

I've just found a interesting site that offers a wealth of info on the upcoming models & the introduction of a diesel Range Rover in the U.S.
Check out: www.landrover-center.com/

lovephoto · August 2004

Has anyone experienced any discounts on the "04 Range Rover? The factory is now giving $4000 to the dealers until September 30. Are the dealers passing on the savings to the customers?

outrigger · August 2004

While I was at a nearby recycling center a couple of days ago, I stopped my 2003 RR on a certified scale. With the gas tank needle almost touching empty & no passengers or cargo, the weight was 5460 lbs. The curb weight shown on this Edmunds web site is 5379, so that must be the totally dry weight. Actually not too bad, considering the size, ultra stiff body structure, and overall capabilities.

sam818 · August 2004

There is now a TA out with a fix for the 2004 RR dead battery issue. The Dealer will install a new harness on the circuit board which controls the AC temperature sensor.

bedwards · August 2004

Just purchased a new black '04 with black luxury package interior. Ended up paying about $10.5k under retail.

youngturk · August 2004

Congratulations! Sounds like a great deal. What color interior? Do you like your new Rangie?

YoungTurk
'04 Range Rover
Black/Sand

1236 · August 2004

Got a call from the dealership yesterday (here in southern california) bluetooth phone system, touch-screen nav, auto headlights & BMW engine will be standard for the 05. Available sometime in November.

pathdoc · August 2004

What is new about a BMW engine? The new engine will be a supercharged 4.4 liter Jag engine with a 6 speed transmission in the 2006 model due out in the Fall of 2005.

johnj01 · August 2004

Went to the Range Rover Event in Irvine, CA last week. Took the RR through the hills of Laguna Beach, really put it through the paces, glad it wasn't my $74K going down some of those hills. Handled beyond my expectations, no rattles, etc. Waiting for a 2005 but can't get a straight answer from dealers, US headquarters in NJ nor HQ in England, on delivery dates. Call UK once a week hoping to find a knowledgeable person no luck. New Navigation is confirmed, they're having problems w/ some of the new electronics, but no confirmation of Jag engine. All I get from all I call is delivery between Oct. and Dec. Kind of frustrating. Anyone have solid info on delivery?? Just a little nervous with some of the negatives I've seen, re: reliability, problems, etc.

ttalone · August 2004

Just ordered my '05 today from my local dealer in No. Calif. New features as confirmed in earlier posts: New touch screen and voice activated Nav System, Blue Tooth Ph system, upgraded stereo (785W), auto head lights and 4-wheel driver information system (more info on the Nav / Info center). Same BMW engine as '04. Price went up ~700 USD. I was in the 2nd order group, which should arrive in Dec. 1st order group to arrive in Nov. Hope this helps.

pathdoc · August 2004

I also attended the Range Rover Event in Irvine and also had a very positive opinion of the Range Rover. I am currently without a sports utility but previously had a ML 430 which was a piece of junk and the worst MB I had ever owned.(I still have several). I am driving a Jag XKR and so I was very interested in the new engine which is reportedly (confirmed at the event) a supercharged Jag engine slightly modified from what I have in my XKR. The availability is supposedly Fall of 2005 as a 2006 model. I am now trying to decide if I should wait for that model since when I drove the current version it had better acceleration on the freeway than I expected.Also they gave a $1500 coupon at the event and evidently are dealing on the 2004s.

johnj01 · August 2004

Thanks for the responses. The confusion is getting straight answers about the engine from a dealer, NJ or Eng. I heard they were going to keep the BMW engine and offer the Jag Supercharged as a model mid-2005 as a 2006. Sure would be nice to know if I should wait for the Jag engine or not. Probably just go order a 2005 and see what info comes out as the fall progresses. The coupon was a nice touch, too bad it comes along with an inferior Nav. system.

pathdoc · August 2004

I also attended the Range Rover Event in Irvine and also had a very positive opinion of the Range Rover. I am currently without a sports utility but previously had a ML 430 which was a piece of junk and the worst MB I had ever owned.(I still have several). I am driving a Jag XKR and so I was very interested in the new engine which is reportedly (confirmed at the event) a supercharged Jag engine slightly modified from what I have in my XKR. The availability is supposedly Fall of 2005 as a 2006 model. I am now trying to decide if I should wait for that model since when I drove the current version it had better acceleration on the freeway than I expected.Also they gave a $1500 coupon at the event and evidently are dealing on the 2004s.

rovrage · August 2004

I have a 2003 Range Rover that I love. Problem is, it's a lemon. LRNA in NJ agreed to (1) buy back or (2) replace it. Problems were tons of glitches and electrical snafus, and major issues related to headlights. They replaced the entire headlight assemblies and still had problems. I was thinking of cashing out and buying a 2004 at year end (and discount), or awaiting a 2005 for a replacement. Still, I LOVE it and wouldn't even consider a different vehicle.

I also attended the Event in Irvine. TON of fun and a First Class event all the way!

johnj01 · August 2004

Rovrage, obviously you live in Orange County. Which dealer did you buy it from and with your problems, were you satisfied with their customer service?? I'm considering either Mission Viejo LR or Anaheim Hills.

caltri · September 2004

I am thinking about purchasing an SUV with a V8 engine, off-road capability, luxurious interior and a nice ride. Right now I have a BMW 330Ci coupe which I love but just doesn't give me enough room. I tested the X5 which doesn't have a very smooth ride and I didn't like the Cayenne's cheap interior materials. The only vehicles out there that really met my preferences are the Land Rover Range Rover, Lexus LX470, or the Lexus GX470. I didn't like the GX's swing out door, so now I'm trying to decide between the Rover or the LX. I think the Range Rover has good looks, especially the cool LED taillamps and the xenon headlights. The LX has neither of these, but it does have Bluetooth and DVD Navigation. I didn't try out the stereo systems, but I like the Harmon Kardon in my BMW, so I assume it's just as good in the Rover as the LX's Mark Levinson. Both vehicles seem about the same in terms of size, performance, off-roading abilities, pricing, cabin furnishings, and ride quality, although the dealer said the LX doesn't have rack and pinion steering. I was very inclined to go with the Range Rover because of its stellar looks, but I'm wary of the company's bad reputation for poor build quality and the fact that it's now owned by Ford, which is not exactly in stable financial condition right now. I wonder why BMW got rid of Land Rover even though it invested so much in the Range Rover, which I think is an excellent SUV? The LX has been out since 1998 and looks refined and luxurious but ordinary compared to the stylish and more modern Rover. However, Lexus does have a reputation for excellent build quality and luxurious interiors on par with Mercedes-Benz and BMW. Although the LX is based on the Land Cruiser, which has a distinguished heritage, the Range Rover has a more prominent one, not to the mention that it seems like Lexus may decide to discontinue the LX. Does anyone have any opinions on which would be a better choice?

chipawa · September 2004

Hello,

maybe you folks can help. I am in the dilemma of purchasing a leftover 04 RR Lux Package with all of the incentives and the Test Drive Coupon, all told about $9K off. Car should run around $68K...or should I wait and suck it up and get the 05 in November?

Please help, my color choices are disappearing!

Thanks

nvbanker · September 2004

How long do you expect to keep it? The longer you do, the less the model year will matter. There will be some upgrades on the 05.... How important will they be to you?

1236 · September 2004

I know the 05 Lux will not have the hand-stitched leather dash. It all depends on how important the touch screen nav & bluetooth phone system is to you. I personally beleive the 05 will be the best Range Rover to date. The way I see it, if you're going to drop 68K on a vehicle what's another 10K?

chipawa · September 2004

Thanks Folks,

for the responses, In fact the remaining 04 Lux Ranges do not have the leather dash. I was told they were pealing, even though it looks cool, I can live without it. Also one dealer told me it was faux-leather? I have seen 3 without them. I am siding towards the 05, while the price isn't that much of a factor, it always comes down to the money. I do suspect that the new features will be of value to me. Especially if more States and places like D.C. make cell phones more difficult to use. Also if I keep this one longer than my 03 Disco, the extra money will make little difference. Of course I will trade it in, in a heart-beat if they bring over the TD6 in a year or so! Or the Jag engine with 6spd sounds neat also. Then I should get the 04, and trade in 06! Man, I can't make up my mind. Probably why I'm not married either, trouble committing.

Lastly, I just received in the mail a coupon (like the one from the Rover Event)except it seems like I can use it on any Range delivered this year so that would include the 05.

Choices, Choices

ttalone · September 2004

Does anyone know how to get a "coupon" that has been mentioned regarding purchasing a RR vehicle this year, sounds like some type of a discount or cash back. Any info would be appreciated. Thx

chadwj · September 2004

I just got $6,000 off an '04. I assume this is the $4000 factory and $2,000 from the dealer. This seems to be within $1,000 of the best deals I am seeing here in the northeast.

chipawa · September 2004

I have an extra $1500 coupon for an 04 that I will send anyone, actually I have 2. Just the otherday I received the new coupon enticing me, this one includes the delivery of an 05 as long as get it before 12/31/04. Neat thing about these coupons is negotiate your best deal then lay it down on the table. The Coupon comes from LRNA so the dealers are ok with you using them on top of any current deals. send me a direct email, if you want the coupons. Also there are some some very stong deals out there on 04's better than what has been announced on this forum. Let me know I will direct you to the right people, in the Mid-Atlantic
chipmacgill@comcast.net

edf · September 2004

I finally decided to dump the FX-35 I purchased only a year ago and have decided on the RR. I traded in a fantastic LX470 which only 3 yrs old because it just seemed to big, but the FX isn't making it, even with the tricked out tech package. If you still have a coupon you could forward it would be great. I'm taking a beating on the FX. thanks.

pathdoc · September 2004

I too have been looking at the 04 vs 05 issue. What kind of discounts have people been getting in Southern California? There is a factory to dealer $4000 good until 9/30. Is anyone getting more? The luxury package seems in short supply. Is it worth the extra $. How much better will the new navigation system be?

Thanks

andrek · September 2004

I am considering buying a 1999 RR SE with about 60K miles. It appears to be in great condition. Probably limited off-road use since I am in NJ.

Suggestions, advice or comments from anyone would be appreciated.

Thanks,

stranded_in_sn · September 2004

Not sure why anyone would still buy a range rover these days. We bought the new (re labeled BMW) RR in 2002 and we use it to drive between our two places of business in San Diego and Colorado. During the 2 years we have owned it, we have had just about every major thing on the car replaced. Seems the more RR works on it, the worse it gets. Our local dealer has replaced transmission, transfer case, front axles, steering column, steering box, brakes twice, console computer, nav system, CD changed, Radio 4 times, Air system 6 times, radiator one time. The "service engine soon" light has come on more than 50 times and each time we get the same story. Bring it in immediately and do not drive it, no matter if it was just low on OIL or has just backfired or if we left the gas cap off. We now have 47k miles on it and it smokes like a chimmeny and uses a quart of oil every 1000 miles. Pings and chugs up hills. I had thought that perhaps the local dealer (pioneer centers in SD) was incompetent, so I took it to Newport Beach RR. They did my 35k service and it came back without any water in the engine, my stereo system destroyed, and the brakes messed up.

We used the 4x4 once in a snowstorm to get down our frozen driveway. When I went to shift out of creep mode and 4x4, it locked up the shifter. Our calls to road service was that they would come get us in 8-12 hours with a tow truck from 400 miles away. Sure glad I was not stranded 20 miles from nowhere in the snowstorm and having to sit for 10 hours.

All in all, we loved the styling and the performance, but the service and maintenance shoots all that down. How would you ever trust something like that offroad like they advertise?

stranded_in_sn · September 2004

Yep, we noticed our steering was hard to do and there was a loud clunk when we shifted gears. It took me 4 visits to the dealer before they admitted that the front differential and front axels were bad. After they replaced that, the steering column would not telescope any more, so they replaced that. After that we could hardly steer it as the steering box was stiff and jerky. So another visit to get a new steering box. I have driven more Hertz SUVs than I have my RR in the last couple of years.

stranded_in_sn · September 2004

I previously has a Lincoln Nav (1998) and did far more offroad work with it than I have ever done with the RR (I have taken the RR offroad about 500 yards total to survey a house lot once on a graded lot). I have taken my Navigator over alot of passes in Colorado that makes Jeep owners shudder. In my 4 years with the Navigator, I replaced the brakes twice in 72k miles and had one update to the radio.

I asked my son who does off road driving in his SUV if he wanted to go into the back country of Colorado with me in the RR. He looked at me and said "are you crazy, we would never get back out".

We are dumping this heap as soon as we find a repalcement.

nvbanker · September 2004

Has anybody had good service from a RR?

youngturk · September 2004

I certainly have. 7k miles on my Java Black/Sand 2004 Rangie. Bulletproof, bank-vault solid, flawless. Along with my 2001 Porsche Boxster, the best car I've ever owned.

YoungTurk

socalfrank · September 2004

I have been shopping for an SUV recently and the Range Rover certainly is appealing. It is very handsome and not a "mommy" car.
I am concerned about build quality and reputation and have good reason considering I owned a 1996 Range Rover 4.0 which was a total disaster. I bought into the whole prestige factor and "best 4x4 by far" marketing back then and paid dearly for it in repair costs and time out of service.
I was hoping things had changed with the BMW/Ford factor, but after reading some posts here, it looks like business as usual...so I can't understand how people are willing to pay $65-80K for these rolling mechanical tragedies.
Sure, some people have had good experiences...namely the ones who have recently bought and haven't given their RR's a chance to break down on them by garaging them.
Consider this....go to the Edmunds.com site and do a side by side comparison of the current RR and the V8 VW Touareg. It is truly amazing how similar in specs and features these 2 are. Granted the RR is slightly better off road, but if you don't plan on risking getting broken down in Anza Borrego, the VW might be the best choice...besides, what kind of prestige is there in constantly driving a Disco loaner? That is if your dealership offers a loaner at all.

sam818 · September 2004

I have a 2003 and a 2004 RR... BOTH have also been bulletproof. Two minor TSB items: replaced electric steering column replacement gear on the '03 and an a/c-blower motor fix to prevent the battery from running down on the '04. Other than that... great on road, AWESOME off road... beautiful build and excellent quality. I think the past few messages simply bought out the few lemons!

outrigger · September 2004

My 2003 RR now has 15K miles on it. It had the steering column motor replaced when I bought it 15 months ago, and the check engine light came on once, which was fixed by the dealer in less than a day, without replacing any parts. I've had about 50 vehicles in my life, and this is the best one so far.

sam818 · September 2004

Here is a link to info about the 2005 RR.
DVD nav with touch screen and a movable cam. which can be placed anwhere on or near the car. Click on the pics for a larger view of the new nav screen. NOTE: the leather top dash still appears on this UK spec 2005.
LINK: http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/?news/ae_news_story.php?id=50263

jamesgibbons · September 2004

Hi Guys

Do you know if its possible to retrofit the nav system on the 05 to the o4. I realy wanted the dvd nav

thx

james

nvbanker · September 2004

Ok, but go look at the Trouble board for the Touareg, and you'll see just as much, if not more tragedy from VW. I hardly would consider VW as a solution to the Rover reputation.....

Land Rover Range Rover

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