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Saturn ION

13468967

Comments

  • vuefor2vuefor2 Member Posts: 490
    Anyone know when the Ion will be available?

    I have not seen anything anywhere.
  • hpulley4hpulley4 Member Posts: 591
    With the coupe to follow either very late this year or early next year but I haven't heard anything definite about the dates.

    Also heard that the 180hp turbo engine from the Opel Speedster will be available in the upscale coupe next year, in addition to the 140hp base version.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    Opel Speedster may go to Saturn and it may stay an Opel from what I hear. I was reading an article in the local paper and rumors are flying that Opel and Dawoo cars may replace Oldsmobiles in a year or two. Wouldn't that be interesting!

    I also hear the Ion will be here in late September. Production will probably start in August.
  • 300silverbulit300silverbulit Member Posts: 60
    2003ion.com for more
  • hpulley4hpulley4 Member Posts: 591
    for it to work here. www.2003ion.com
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    Let's make that a link, shall we? :)


    http://www.2003ion.com

  • 300silverbulit300silverbulit Member Posts: 60
    There are alot of things I like about the ION. To replace my old SL2 which has a loose front suspension and shakes along with the interior dash. I saw them both at the NY auto show. The sedan looks just as plain in person as it does on the ION site. The quad coupe looked alot better though. that is what I wan't. The way the suicide doors open leaving a big cargo area on the passenger side with the front seat folded forward is very useful to have in a compact coupe.

    The seating position looks higher than the S series also. But we couldn't sit in it. I like the fact that you get the same engine in the base model as the upper level ION's also. I can live without power features.

    A base coupe with A/C and the VTi trans would work for me. The VTI trans sounds like the ultimate stop and go rush hour warrior. I'll get my own CD stereo and wheels. This car is bulkier than the S. I can't see why they are putting 14" wheels on the base model. If it can come in like that for under 15 grand that could be my fourth Saturn.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    I don't think the sedan looks plain, but it is a little odd looking over all. That said, I think the new Civic and many other cars are a little odd also. I think what will sell these IONs is quality and performance and hopefully Saturn will deliver.
  • magnetophonemagnetophone Member Posts: 605
    God the Ion is an ugly sedan!
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    Ya I think you mentioned that before.
  • vuefor2vuefor2 Member Posts: 490
    We recently bought a V6 Vue which we are very pleased with. It's been a great little truck for us and the sales experience was miles ahead of any other dealer. I saw pictures of the Ion on and it's abit quirky, but I like it and we may get one to replace our old 323. Much will depend on price as we don't want to spend a lot.

    I am looking forward to seeing and trying an Ion.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    I got this paper in the mail the other day with some pics of the ION sedan, and it said the car would be available this fall sometime.
  • benjaminhbenjaminh Member Posts: 6,311
    I guess I'm in the minority, but I think the Ion looks like a pretty impressive entry-level car. It has 10 more horsepower than a Focus ZTS, and from what I've heard GM's ecotech engine is smooth and reliable. The trunk is also larger than the Focus. I haven't seen any exterior dimensions, but it looks like it might be just little bit bigger than the Focus too. I did read that that Ion doesn't have independent rear suspension, which is probably one of the things that makes my Focus ZTS so fun to whip around corners in, but the Ion's probably good enough in that department. Regarding the looks, to me it isn't quite as nice looking as the Focus, but overall I like it. Perhaps it's slightly "ugly duckling" quality could make it endearing like the original VW bug in the 60s. One question mark is the center gauge pod in the interior. Does it work, ergonomically, or would it be a major pain to live with everyday. I think you'd have to drive it for a while to find out. With a car that good, in fact, I wonder if Saturn doesn't risk stealing sales from it's already underperforming L-series. If my GM card $s worked on the Saturn, I would definitely think seriously about that car.
    2018 Acura TLX 2.4 Tech 4WS (mine), 2018 Honda CR-V EX AWD (wife's)
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    Ford Focus is not exactly a mainstream looking car either. Extremely quirky in my opinion. Like I said, if it's well built and performs well it will sell. Saturn dealers are amazing. As for the Ecotec, I love the one in our Alero. Smooth and very peppy!!
  • 300silverbulit300silverbulit Member Posts: 60
    like most things in life, a person could just get used to it. I like the looks of them on the ION site. My 94' SL2 guages are blocked because I have the wheel tilted all the way up to keep it out of my way when I raise my leg up to brake. I like the dash of the ION. After seeing the quad coupe in person I really liked it. I wondedr what the color choices for the coupe will be?

    The VTI trans won't be available when the ION sedan comes out this fall but maybe by winter/spring when the coupe arrives. The 5 speed auto will be available though.

    It looks as though the cabin of the ION will be alot more open and airy over the S series. And you won't be sitting so low. You still won't be able to see around all the SUV's but it's better anyway.
  • cayennered1cayennered1 Member Posts: 193
    It never ceases to amaze me that with all of the resources at its disposal GM seems incapable of designing a really stylish car. On the truck side they do a decent job which makes the failures on the car side even more perplexing.

    There are plenty of ugly cars out there from other manufacturers but they do seem to get it right from time to time with some even getting it right most of the time.

    But GM? Well the the Saturn L restyle is charitably boring and bland, the Ion looks like a mock up more than a real car with all those extraneous lines in the roof and trunk area and the CTS? well after three 7 & 7s I might be able to say it's not bad. I actually like the Vue's styling (lousy interior though).

    Lutz must have been beside himself when he saw what GM styling was putting out. I'll be anxious to see what changes are in store in the next couple of years.
  • verozahlverozahl Member Posts: 574
    Magnetophone's right about the sedan. The Quadcoupe looks interesting, but not with those stoopid center gauges.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    Big deal! After driving the car for a few weeks you will be used to them. The older on becomes, the more resistant one becomes to anything unconventional. The younger crowd will likely be ok with it all.
  • vcjumpervcjumper Member Posts: 1,110
    Maybe if they are Saturn GM fans they will like it. Lets see if it sells like or outsells Corolla/Civic/Pro/Jetta/Focus or ends up a market failure like the L. Atleast Vue is doing decently, outselling one decent competitor the Tribute.
  • jimbeaumijimbeaumi Member Posts: 620
    YES!! You've read my mind! All that money, all that talent, and still -- YUCK. Somehow, GM Europe gets it right. Somehow, GM Australia gets it right. Sheesh.
  • verozahlverozahl Member Posts: 574
    Well, I wouldn't cough at Opel-Vauxhall-Holden in the way I do as Chevrobuick or Pontiacadillac.

    Def: Saturn: "GM parody of Toyota/Honda/Mazda."
    S-Series is a bit old, obviously, but not bad to look at or own or drive* ...

    *I have a bridge to sell you.

    ... but the interiors of the ION and VUE show that they need a KLU.
  • jimbeaumijimbeaumi Member Posts: 620
    Further, had the Aztek been designed by GM Europe, they would have been run off the continent.

    A KLU -- that's very good.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    And how is the Focus styled any better? It would seem to me that Focus is a best seller yet is just as quirky looking. I'm not saying the ION is the best styled car, I'm just saying there are other examples of strange designs that still sell very well.
  • jimbeaumijimbeaumi Member Posts: 620
    There is no sense of integration on the Aztek. Lines, panels, lights seem to be from different designs. The Focus is at least a tighter design, and better integrated. Aztek is just a mess. As for the ION, lines swoop up and across with no rhyme or reason, and the roof looks like they could not decide how to complete the C pillar, and just gave up.
  • cayennered1cayennered1 Member Posts: 193
    It's totally bizzare how GM Europe and Australia do such a great job on styling while GM-US believes the words styling and grotesque go hand in hand.

    By accident they could do a better job than they do. They absolutely seem to go out of their way to make US designs either extremely boring or just plain butt ugly.

    it's almost as though they think US consumers have no interest in stylish cars or can be convinced that anything is stylish as long as they are told that it is.

    Ask anyone who actually likes cars whether they'd rather drive a Holden or Opel sedan or a Malibu or Grand Am and I don't think there will be any question that the US cars will lose out.

    I've got my fingers crossed that the next generation Malibu, Cavalier, etc. will be carbon copies of the european models.

    Frankly, it's probably even cheaper for GM to just make a similar design for US and Europe. I have to believe Lutz is kicking butt so there may be hope down the road.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    FYI.. Malibu pictures are already posted a few places. It will look a lot like the Opel it's based on. Grand Am looses it's ribs for 2003 (thankfully).

    As for the ION, I still can't see how it's worse than the bizarre Focus. I guess we will have to agree to disagree. That said, I do agree Saturn could have done a better job on the sedan.
  • 300silverbulit300silverbulit Member Posts: 60
    look at the compact and midsize sedan market. sales leaders are always the civic and corolla. The accord and camry. Bland style cars. Those cars sell on things other than style. Which is what most buyers wan't. Car Folks like us who actually take the time to post on town hall. Wan't more, I agree.

    Take a look at the quad coupe when it comes out. It has more to it than the sedan which is very plain. The coupe looked alor better than in the pictures. And you get the strongest enigne in the base model! Untill the possible supercharger comes out for 2004.
  • vuefor2vuefor2 Member Posts: 490
    I don't think the Ford Focus is any better looking than the Ion. If Saturn makes the Ion like our Vue, I'm sure it will sell just fine. Personally I like the new Ion looks and we may look at one in a year or two as we have been very happy with the treatment we get at Saturn.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    I think the Focus 2-door is particularly wierd looking, but you see lots of them around. The ION 2-door is definitely the best looking of the 2 configs I have seen so far.
  • magnetophonemagnetophone Member Posts: 605
    I drive a Focus 3-door!
  • vcjumpervcjumper Member Posts: 1,110
    I think it just looks very Euro from pics of other European market vehicles. It has handling/road manners as its distinguishing positive characteristic. With the solid rear end, I guess Saturn/GM isn't trying to distinguish itself in that respect.

    As for the Ion, I wonder whether it will keep the bumper car style steering wheel.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    No offence but you have to admit the Focus styling is not conventional. It's not ugly, but it is strange in my opinion. The Ion too is strange but I think it will sell if the quality is there.
  • magnetophonemagnetophone Member Posts: 605
    I admit the Focus 3 door is not a work of art, but it is very, very clever. The arched windows conceal what would otherwise be a bread-van side panel. The arched windows give a deceptive mask of how tall the car really is, which was quite ingenious when the car first came out. While the car still look somewhat odd here, it has inspired several me-too's, only with other brand DNA - the Peugeot 307, the Renault Megane, etc. all owe their restylings to the Focus.
  • cayennered1cayennered1 Member Posts: 193
    I'm no great fan of the Focus although I find the 5 door zx5 kind of appealing in a eurocar sort of way.

    The problem with the Ion and many other GM cars is that it seems styling is either an afterthought or they go overboard to try and make a statement on styling and just get it totally wrong (CTS, Aztek). The Ion sedan looks like a convoluted Neon. When I think of all the slick looking eurosedans they could have copied I just shake my head.

    Look, GM is not the only offender. Most manufacturers seem to miss the boat. Want stylish sedans? Try Audi, Alfa Romeo and Opel.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    The ZX5 is the best of the Focus line up. Ford did a decent job there.

    I thing the ION sedan looks great in the front end, it's just the rear that seems odd. Looks like a copy of the new Altima.
  • magnetophonemagnetophone Member Posts: 605
    I never think of Opel as a stylish company. But I guess it's in the eye of the beholder!

    I still need to be reminded why people (logic1) are so hell bent on defending GM over any other car company!
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    I don't think 'reg' is bamboozling the ION as you put it, he speaks the truth. The car is not anything outstanding, and surely a waste of time to wait for from the S-Series if you ask me. The sales prove it.

    As far as factory incentives, even Audis have them now (here in the US anyway), so that's not a factor in today's market.
  • magnetophonemagnetophone Member Posts: 605
    I was not trying to start a flame war, but you do spend a lot of time overdefending GM. Just curious as to why...
  • magnetophonemagnetophone Member Posts: 605
    You know that he meant Opel vs. American GM.

    When I say GM, i generally mean the United States - if i say opel or vauxhall i mean European GM.
  • jimbeaumijimbeaumi Member Posts: 620
    Magnetophone, thanks for clearing up the U.S. v. Europe point (GM styling). Same goes for Ford v. Ford. They use different design studios. Or dare I say GM Europe uses a design studio, U.S. uses a styling studio.
  • jimbeaumijimbeaumi Member Posts: 620
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    Hey folks, we're talking about the ION here!?!?

    Looks like we're headed into one of those, um, "conversations" that belong in any one of a number of active discussions over in News & Views.

    I sure would appreciate it if those here who have heard that same tired refrain from me in many discussions would pay attention.

    Instead of waiting for me to throw wet blankets around, you really could just go ahead and head to the right place. I'm more than a little tired of you continuing to divert multiple discussions on this board into the same off-topic arguments.

    You know who you are.

    Any questions, please drop me an email.

    Pat
    Sedans Host
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    Should be interesting to see what the actual production car does in fact look like.

    Our office administrator has a 95 S-series and is waiting to get an ION.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    Some time ago, I requested more info from Saturn about the ION, because I was curious. About 2 weeks ago, they sent this little blurb thing about the car to me in the mail. If you go on to http://www.saturn.com, I am sure you will be able to find a link for it.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    Ion is garbled......have you seen Cumberford's trashing of the Ion design in the latest AUTOMOBILE? I don't think much of Cumberford but I do agree with his thoughts on Ion.

    Can't rip the Focus.....its packaging is excellent and it looks snazzy in ZX5, ZX3, and wagon forms. The ZX5 in particular is top notch. The only things keeping Focus from being the total market champ is a lackluster set of motors (why don't we get the Duratec HE and TDCi diesel?) and unfortunate recalls.

    The worst part of Ion is the interior design and center gauges. Way to go out on a limb and risk cutting your throat marketing wise by offering center gauges as standard. Lose about half your potential buyers there. They should have made center gauges an option.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    They said in a test of a ZX5 in Consumer Reports that the car's engine and mileage was mediocre, and the reliability sucked. Said the same about workmanship.
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    I like the ZX5, but the sedan and ZX3 both look strange to me. The dash on all the Focus models is bad, so the Saturn can't be much worse. As I understand it also, the Focus is on recall several times a year.
  • regfootballregfootball Member Posts: 2,166
    that Focus will outhandle any GM product under 30k.

    Mileage is mileage. Hyundais get crappy mileage too.

    The Focus has had recalls but Car and Driver had a 40000 miles tester that was extremely reliable. My sisters' ZX3 has been reliable.

    As far as the recalls that plagued the 2001 and 2000 models but by now 2002 it should be fine. Ford, like GM is always a bit slow out of the gate getting final [non-permissible content removed]'ly quality down. Overall GM is no better over time than Ford.

    Style wise it depends on what you like. The new Ion sedan is questionable in my mind. The coupe is a lot better but still looks like a generic GM coupe (dull and 5-8 years behind the style curve) and breaks no ground. There does not appear to be the extra space created inside like the Focus does with its silhouette.

    When i was L series shopping I checked the wagon specs for the Focus vs. L and darn if the Focus wagon isn't practically the same size as the L for a lot less money.
  • ghuletghulet Member Posts: 2,564
    ...can anyone post current pictures of the Ion here, please?
    I can't be bothered trying to find them on the Saturnfan thing.
  • vuefor2vuefor2 Member Posts: 490
    My sister has a Focus and it has been a lot of trouble. She likes the car a lot but is worried about more problems. To be fair, I think it was one of the early models but her Ford dealer has poor service and that doesn't help.

    We are real happy with our Vue, so she and I are both eying the Ion as a possible future small car. Saturn is good company and as long as they treat me right I just may keep buying. The new Civic was a disappointment for me, but the new Corolla looks good also.
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