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Comments
You mean you have to bend over the third row seats to unlock the hatch? Wow, they didn't give that much thought did they?
I guess i'm not entitled to my opinion, just you huh? We do think highly of ourselves don't we? I just used the door "thunk" as an example of another stupid statement concerning an atribute one could quibble over.
I know you read about the time in October of 2004, when I was randomly selected for an opinion poll to actually drive four minivans back to back over a six mile course of city streets, freeway and bad roads (although they are hard to find in Texas ).
You might want to get a job at Car & Driver, Motortrends or better yet, CR!!!!! You're such an expert on Minivans. I'm thankful we have you to educate us all with your unbiased opinions and vast knowledge....from the bottom of my heart - THANK YOU!!!!
The 2006 Odyssey did NOT perform as well in a 15 mile test drive as did the 2004 Sienna...but each performed better than my 2002 T&C LX with 3.3L.
The Odyssey is a nice minivan that caused DC and others to add more features such as the "Magic Seat". Honda could not sell many Odyssey minivans until they made the 1999 Odyssey that copied the size and many nice features Chrysler had introduced to the minivan market over the years.
Isn't it nice that Honda finally made a satisfactory minivan....after Chrysler controlled the market for over 20 years?
I believe the Honda "thunk" depends on the model. I remember being in a friend's new Ody....LX model, and the doors sounded tinny. On this Touring I tried to look at, they sounded like my DCX exactly....nice solid thunk. Must have to do with added sound insulation and leather trim on door panels???
I personally didn't want a high end minivan...not for my lifestyle of camping, dogs, windsurfing etc....plus, I didn't want to spend over $20k for my "beater" van as I joke with friends. One year and 10k trouble free miles later, I know I made the right choice for me.
True both Japanese models are much nicer inside and offer some features Chrysler doesn't, but owners are paying for the extra quality and features. I wouldn't use "quality" so liberally here....not from what I see on these forums!
Well Jpnewt, as safe as most any minivan could be before stability control came out. Granted that helps, but remember less than two years ago, Honda didn't have it either and I bet that wouldn't have prevented you from buying a Honda van or another car, instead of buying a car that had it on it. Now that Honda has it, you think everyone should buy a Honda no matter if it meets our other needs or not. Were Honda's vehicles unsafe before 2005? Were we all buying unsafe vans? Of course not.
Honda does not meet my needs. I bought it to haul family, grand kids and stuff I need when working around my or my sister's house, or to carry home furniture or appliance I buy to replace things that wear out. I also find my van being used to carry an electric wheel chair and electric scooter. Something I hadn't planned on when I bought my van. Things 95% of Honda owners would never carry in their minivans. Why should I buy something that doesn't meet my needs just to get a safety feature that has never been on vans before. It doesn't make my van any less safe than it, or other's ever were before.
If stability control was the be all and end all of safety, why doesn't Honda offer it, even as an option, on it's new 2006 Civics?
Full width frontal crashes are at least as common as frontal offset crashes. Both the IIHS and NHTSA crash tests are complementary. Neither one supercedes the other- ideally you'd have a vehicle that does well in all the available tests.
Those other variables are what make these a poor predictor of crashworthiness. Insurance rates, like death and injury statistics, have a large element of driver profile in them. That is why even corporate twins often have different rates and varying statistics, even though the vehicles are identical.
Try this calculator for starters- plug in some of the corporate "twins" like the GM minivans and note that none of the four are the same...
http://moneycentral.msn.com/insure/autorisk.aspx
Want a real rarity? Try to find a Sienna CE with package #2 (VSC, 4-wheel discs, DRL). It isn't even available in some areas and dealers rarely order them if it is.
http://www.carspace.com/marine2/?14@@index.html!jkdty3=1
Click on pictures to enlarge.
Anyone know how to rearrange them in order?
If I'm not mistaken, weren't the first Odyssies generally the most reliable; using the gen-5 (94-97) Accord's bulletproof engine and admirably reliable transmission?
Generally, the rougher years of Ody trannies were 1999-2001, although sporadic problems obviously exist later than that.
I sure hope 1990 was a typo, sir. Honda didn't start making vans until 1995 (with their Accord-based Wagon-style Odyssey).
It was a typo, I meant below 2000. I don't know of anyone who would want to buy one around 1990, Thanks for pointing it out.
Wouldn't things like an intermittently working dash light, power windows, and power hatch be considered eletrical problems? If all were covered under basic warranty, that's different, I realize, but things like replacing the power hatch opener, window regulators and suspension work (the trouble we had with one of our 2 Chryslers was suspension) sounds like a good bit of stuff to be fixed early in vehicle life (pre-100k miles).
The battery at 55k does seem a little premature (most batteries have a 5 year life to them, but that's admitted nit-picking on my part).
Batteries out here in Arizona only last about 24-30 months.
Window regulators and suspension should have lasted longer than they did though.
Arizona get so hot, very few battery companies will warranty their battries for full replacement past 20-24 months. I think the Die Hard will still go 36 months, but most are far and in between that.
I gotcha.
Would stay away from Hybrids for sure then!!!!
"Wouldn't things like an intermittently working dash light, power windows, and power hatch be considered electrical problems? If all were covered under basic warranty, that's different"
Since the light came back on, I don't see it as being a problem, but in all honesty I wanted to mention it. As far as the power window regulator and motors, I agree that they should have lasted longer. But, they were covered under warranty and because 37K miles and 2 yrs was driven buy another owner, I knew of the possibility of a problem or two. (As far as I'm concerned, this was very minor compared to other problems that could have happened).
"suspension work (the trouble we had with one of our 2 Chryslers was suspension) sounds like a good bit of stuff to be fixed early in vehicle life (pre-100k miles). "
This is what we had replaced for the suspension: 1) Front link, sway bar; 2) Link-sway eliminator; 3) bushing-sway eliminator and 4) Cushion, front sway bar. Cost was $173.12 in parts. All covered by warranty. Because I'm not sure how or what type roads our van was driven on before 37K, I can't say if all these items would have lasted longer. But I do know that our roads in Chicago, are not the best with all the road salt eating at the roads, pot holes, bumpy roads from patches etc. From some of the other post I have read, having to replace front suspension components would seem to be a problem on Daimlerchrysler minivans. I hear a faint knock on the right side in front when going over bumpy roads. I have not had a chance to look into it yet, but will report back at a later time.
With these few minor things, I still stand by my original statement by saying our van has been very reliable. I have read some of the problems that others have had on late model minivans from Daimlerchrylser, Honda and Toyota. Some have had more problems in a few years, then what we've had that were not minor. Rattling doors that couldn't be fixed, engine slug, transmission replacement (more than once), wind noise and ear buffing, power sliding doors that open by themselves, replacing run flat tires after two years, complete dash board black out, clock light gone out etc.
Out of all the things I listed. I consider only the power window regulators and motors being the only problem. The rest, just regular wear and tear with the suspension components being questionable. Since we have a knock now when going over bumps.
I can vouch for effects of road conditions - living in the "motor city" of Detroit where an SUV should be standard in every garage due to very poor road conditions! I had to replace the front bushing on my BMW at 23k miles!!!!!
I'll bet you any amount that the window motors are coming from China. There's been a major switch to Chinese motor manufacturers over the past 5-6 years! Their prices are great, their quality sucks, and don't believe your "imports" don't have the same motors!! My coworker worked for Johnson Electric, one of the biggest motor suppliers in the world...sure sounds American doesn't it? Totally Chinese owned!!!!
The fact that all was covered under warranty (did you get an extended warranty?) is defintely a good thing for you.
Being directly in Automotive working with various OEM, I can say without doubt, spec and price have some part of it but quality is much more than some spec or price. For example, BMW is notorious for tough specs, high standards, and paying top dollars for components...Are they the highest quality automobile? Hardly. Whereas, Hyundai and Kia have low specs, low purchase price of components...yet their quality is improving drastically. Japanese OEM work closer with their suppliers and negotiate prices and specs that are realistic, then stick to them...not coming back 6 months later looking for 10% price cut or else!
We'd give anything if we could get any battery to last four or five years. Most will conk out a little after two and a half years. Maybe three tops, in Arizona. I have tires that will dry rot before they wear out here.
Exactly. I'd buy a battery every 6 months if it meant I didn't have to deal with the northeast weather.
But my family is rooted in NJ, so I deal with it each year.
Actually been very fortunate this year. Cold, but not much snow at all
Is it abnormal that my battery's lasted this long? I remember my Accord's battery died after 4 years and 95,000 miles of Wisconsin and Ohio driving.
I can't recall the make(don't think it was DCX), but one manufacturers minivan had a recall over second row seatbelts not operating properly.
First, let me offer my condolonces for your 12 year old. There is no excuse for shoulder belts failing to properly restrain her in a 35mph impact.
However, I must point out that in many vehicles, you can't test the shoulder belts by jerking on them. There are two types of locking systems:
Systems triggered by the CAR'S MOVEMENT (rapid vehicle deceleration).
Systems triggered by the BELT'S MOVEMENT (jerking the belt).
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/seatbelt3.htm
All that being said, I have no idea which types of system is in the '01 Caravan. However, IF the front belts lock by jerking the belt, it seems logical that the other belts would have the same type of mechanism. That may not be the case however.
You mention a skidmark; did your van have ABS? If it was so-equipped, it sounds like you locked up, and your ABS didn't operate properly. The seatbelt is an obvious problem, which I'd pursue further (perhaps in court?).
If you are hesitant to get an Odyssey with possible transmission problems, then I would look into a Kia Sedona. You can get a brand new one, with the 10 year/100,000 Mile Long Haul warranty for around $15,000 assuming you can find a dealership still carrying the leftover 2005 models. The new 2006 models will be higher priced.
Keep in mind that used Kias will not have the 10 year/100,000 mile powertrain warranty as the fine print in the warranty says that it is strictly "non-transferable". The 5 year/60,000 mile portion is transferable I believe, and that is a long enough warranty.
Correct me if I have any wrong information.
Good luck,
At about $ 20,000 you could purchase a NEW Mazda MPV, Dodge Caravan/Grand Caravan, or Kia Sedona and get the full factory warranty. Honda/Toyota cost almost as much used as new.
You can buy a preowned 2005 MPV(low miles), nicely loaded, for about $15,000 out the door. With 3 years left on the 4 year warranty...your wife will love you!!!
I think local Mazda dealers in Nashville have 2005 MPVs advertised at $16,788ish, but I'm not sure.
I've discovered that buying last year's model can be a very excellent buy if you are keeping the car for a long time. (i.e. buying a 2005 model in 2006) It just requires a little extra work locating the leftover models.
My local Kia dealer has brand new 2005 Sedonas advertised at $14,999 but those may just be teaser prices to get you in the door.
I know I'll get a lot of angry replies for saying this, but if you do not mind driving a lame-duck minivan known as the Ford Freestar, it could also be a decent buy. The local Lincoln-Mercury dealer here likes buying ex-rental Freestars in bulk and selling them off at $14,995. And from their online inventory, some of them aren't the stripped down models.
CarMax may have some used Freestars but I'm sure you'll pay a premium for the no-haggle buying experience.
Good Luck!