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Minivans - Domestic or Foreign

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Comments

  • dennisctcdennisctc Member Posts: 1,168
    It does seem that, with many rag comparos, they will pick out one vehicle to be that articles punching bag. Write about all the negatives and very few positives.

    I find that the auto rags always hype the latest and greatest, heaping awards on it etc.... then 6 months later it's the biggest piece of crap on the road.

    Those that put down "Stow N Go" don't actually own a DCX van or sat in them at the autoshow for 2 minutes or a test drive. It won't be until all the other manufacturers catch up with their own copies before their version of "Stow N Go" is the greatest thing since sliced bread. BTW - totally off topic, but has anyone caught the History channels "History on a Bun"? Look for it!!!
  • dc_driverdc_driver Member Posts: 712
    "Those that put down "Stow N Go" don't actually own a DCX van or sat in them at the autoshow for 2 minutes or a test drive. It won't be until all the other manufacturers catch up with their own copies before their version of "Stow N Go" is the greatest thing since sliced bread."

    I disagree. I do think that DCX sacrificed seat comfort to achieve Stow N Go. I challenge you to sit in the DCX vans (leather or cloth) then sit in either the Odyssey or Sienna second row seats back to back to back. It is noticeable and that is why it shows up in all the reviews.

    I am not knocking Stow N Go, but in my case, I do not need the extra space. The Odyssey has built in storage in the floor and I have not even used it yet.. The seats fold flat down and I have no problem carrying large items. If I really needed to, I can take the 2nd row seats out pretty easy, but too be honest, I do not see myself needing to do this anytime soon. I am not so sure that other manufacturers will be so quick to go the Stow N Go route if it sacrifices comfort. If Honda would have gone this route and the 2nd row seats were less comfortable, I would have purchased a Toyota or Hyundai.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Member Posts: 1,168
    disagree. I do think that DCX sacrificed seat comfort to achieve Stow N Go. I challenge you to sit in the DCX vans (leather or cloth) then sit in either the Odyssey or Sienna second row seats back to back to back. It is noticeable and that is why it shows up in all the reviews.

    My parents have traveled in them for over 7 hours and they thought they were fine, with firm cushions that supported them like many german sedans. If you just jump in and out of them, you could think the cushy seats of other vans are superior, just like the many reviews.

    I had a friend stop by the other day to borrow something, he had never seen "Stow N Go" and i showed them to him. His initial reaction was typical "oh yeah they're kinda small". Then he actuall jumped in one and adjusted the headrest, the seatback angle and proclaimed "I could easily sleep in this on a trip".
  • marine2marine2 Member Posts: 1,155
    Nearly every professional review I have read commented that the second row seating in the DCX vans are not as comfortable as the competition. I found that to be true in my test drive as well.

    I have a 2005 DGC and my Sister has a 2006 Chrysler Minivan, both with stow-n-go seats. She and her husband came out here (Arizona) from Ohio and my brother went back with her for a vacation. He rode all the way back in the second row stow-n-go seats and said they were fine. He did say they were firmer than on his 1999 Plymouth minivan, but said they were comfortable. That is a two and a half day, 2,000 mile ride.

    Now I wouldn't doubt one bit they are not as soft as the middle seats in the Honda, but I bought my minivan because they had stow-n-go seats and couldn't be happier. If you want a people hauler, you can't do better than a Honda. But if you use your van to carry a bunch of other stuff and like to keep stuff hidden, stow-n-go is the neatest thing to hit the market. They are well worth a little more firmness for the convenience of being able to carry anything you can get in a minivan on a minute's notice. Your always ready no matter where you go or what you do. I gave up a two year old truck to get this van because of stow-n-go. I have never regretted it one bit. All depends on what you want to use your van for.
  • marine2marine2 Member Posts: 1,155
    Outside of stow-n-go seats, the A/C is the next best thing I love about my 2005 DGC. Here in Arizona, the tempature has been right around 105-111 in all of June. That sucker will cool down in just a few minutes, unlike my Dodge Dakota I had before. I never could feel cool in that truck and it didn't have one third the space to cool as this van. If it can keep it cool in Arizona, it should be able to freeze you out in the North and East.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Member Posts: 1,168
    Outside of stow-n-go seats, the A/C is the next best thing I love about my 2005 DGC. Here in Arizona, the tempature has been right around 105-111 in all of June. That sucker will cool down in just a few minutes, unlike my Dodge Dakota I had before. I never could feel cool in that truck and it didn't have one third the space to cool as this van. If it can keep it cool in Arizona, it should be able to freeze you out in the North and East.

    My favorite trick if the van has been sitting outside in extreme heat.....as I'm approaching the van, I open the power hatch and doors to vent all the hot air instantly...it works great!!! and it cools down even faster.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    I have a 2005 DGC and my Sister has a 2006 Chrysler Minivan, both with stow-n-go seats. She and her husband came out here (Arizona) from Ohio and my brother went back with her for a vacation. He rode all the way back in the second row stow-n-go seats and said they were fine. He did say they were firmer than on his 1999 Plymouth minivan, but said they were comfortable. That is a two and a half day, 2,000 mile ride.

    Now I wouldn't doubt one bit they are not as soft as the middle seats in the Honda, but I bought my minivan because they had stow-n-go seats and couldn't be happier. If you want a people hauler, you can't do better than a Honda. But if you use your van to carry a bunch of other stuff and like to keep stuff hidden, stow-n-go is the neatest thing to hit the market. They are well worth a little more firmness for the convenience of being able to carry anything you can get in a minivan on a minute's notice. Your always ready no matter where you go or what you do. I gave up a two year old truck to get this van because of stow-n-go. I have never regretted it one bit. All depends on what you want to use your van for.


    Exactly. If you need the seating AND cargo convenience of stow-and-go, you can't beat the flexibility of DCX. If you need flexible seating and cargo is a secondary priority the majority of the time, you can't beat Honda (8-passengers in a pinch, 2nd row buckets or bench option, some of the best seats for comfort out of all the competitors).

    A 2000 mile trip certainly sounds like the perfect opportunity to test out comfort!

    Haven't seen you around lately, marine2... you've been missed! ;)
  • mrblonde49mrblonde49 Member Posts: 626
    I disagree. I do think that DCX sacrificed seat comfort to achieve Stow N Go. I challenge you to sit in the DCX vans (leather or cloth) then sit in either the Odyssey or Sienna second row seats back to back to back. It is noticeable and that is why it shows up in all the reviews.

    I am not knocking Stow N Go, but in my case, I do not need the extra space. The Odyssey has built in storage in the floor and I have not even used it yet.. The seats fold flat down and I have no problem carrying large items. If I really needed to, I can take the 2nd row seats out pretty easy, but too be honest, I do not see myself needing to do this anytime soon. I am not so sure that other manufacturers will be so quick to go the Stow N Go route if it sacrifices comfort. If Honda would have gone this route and the 2nd row seats were less comfortable, I would have purchased a Toyota or Hyundai. "

    I've said it before, and I'll say it again. The percentage of minivan owners who transport adults regularly in the 2nd row is very small. It's a non issue for most. This point is driven home resoundingly by the success of stow and go since it was introduced
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    In my case, the 3.3L V-6 actually saved us money, as my wife and I both agreed that it might be prudent to purchase a Grand Caravan with the 3.3 E85 compatible engine vs the 3.8 due to its ability to burn E85 should that become popular/widely available and cost efficient. We keep our vehicles 9-12 years so hedging our bets on E85 might become important 5-12 years from now.

    Also, the 3.3L V-6 is EPA rated 1 mpg better both city and highway than the 3.8. Not a big deal but every little bit helps. This van is not going to be drag raced anyway, so the 3.3 will be fine power for us.

    The 3.3 is standard on the SE version GC vs the 3.8 standard on the SXT GC. So, we gave up a few bells and whistles, and went with the SE, but did not give up the important ones (the Stow and Go as an option and the three zone AC with an option package), to "gain" the 3.3L V-6. This in turn saved about $1K-2K in purchase price compared to the GC SXT.
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    We just picked up our GC SE with 3.3L V-6. After reading the manual, I found no mention of E85 compatibility with any Caravan. Puzzled, I called Dodge Customer Service and found that only some 3.3L V-6's are Flex Fuel. Mine is not. :cry:

    I am a bit upset, as salesman apparently did not realize this, and I had mentioned we wanted the 3.3 because of its E85 capability several times.

    Apparently the VIN code for 8th character has to be either an E, G or 3 for a Flex fuel version, per website I found promoting E85. Mine is R, as is virtually the inventory of every dealer in my area. Even checked all the dealers in and around Chicago, and found all 3.3L Caravans in stock had R, so no luck.

    Apparently Chrysler does have this flex fuel 3.3L V-6 as an option, but rarely builds them, or dealers rarely order them for stock.

    My recourse? I guess not much unless I want to try to return the vehicle, doubt if we will go thru the hassle of trying. Would then likely have to keep the old one, probably a couple years until more FFV vehicles are available.

    Still, it was a great price, MSRP was $26640, out the door not including sales tax and $65 title/plate transfer was $19555. To put this in perspective, our 1996 short wheel base Caravan SE Sport cost us $21,900 ten years ago!
  • bobw3bobw3 Member Posts: 2,989
    Of course the owners aren't going to admit the seats aren't comfortable, nor will polite passengers sitting back there, so let's get real. Plus, real passengers sitting in the back aren't jumping in different minivans to compare the differences. I've never sat in the stowNgo seats, but the low but high knee position doesn't look as comfortable to the other's horizontal chair position.
  • cpsdarrencpsdarren Member Posts: 265
    On the flip side, buyers who were concerned about seat comfort at the time of purchase would presumably rule out those they found unacceptable. That would lead to a group of owners who honestly believe their seats are comfortable, regardless of outside opinions. Everyone has different preferences so it's good not all seats are the same. Sure, some owners may rationalize and passengers may be polite about things like this, but that isn't always the case.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Member Posts: 1,168
    Of course the owners aren't going to admit the seats aren't comfortable, nor will polite passengers sitting back there, so let's get real.

    My father who owns a Sienna finds my stow n go seats quite comfortable, and would be the last person to be polite with his honest opinion. Of course owners of Minivans without Stown N Go aren't going to admit the seats aren't comfortable, even if they've never sat in them and have only looked at them. I was in my friend's Stow N Go seats many times this week while we were camping and thought they were firm and comfortable, and yes I've sat in my father's Sienna seat many times and also Ody seats (2004).
  • wolverinejoe80wolverinejoe80 Member Posts: 337
    i briefly read the car and driver? july issue comparing 4 minivans and the result was

    1. odyssey
    2. sedona
    3. quest
    4. caravan

    also, it was kinda weird comparison because they used low end sedona(no leather) and no siena.

    anyway, i can't seem to find the online link..
  • 1997montez341997montez34 Member Posts: 202
    That's because it was a review in Motor Trend.
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    In my garage right now is our 1996 Caravan SE Sport with second row captains seats ("Quad Seating" option) and our new 2006 Grand Caravan SE with Stow and Go.

    Note the 1996 Caravan's second row seats are very similar to all the Caravan second row non stowable captains seats in all model years since, and in our 96 are not worn out or broken down in the least bit.

    I can honestly say that the second row seats in the new GC feel about the same in comfort and would be fine on a long distance drive. Different, yes, a bit firmer but not appreciably less or more comfortable.

    If you are grossly overweight, the Stow and Go second row seats might be less comfortable as they are a bit narrower. Otherwise, very little difference.

    The third row bench is a different story, however. The third row bench in our old van is much more comfortable. However, since we use that very rarely for passengers, it is less critical.

    The ease of use of the stow and go feature in both rows is a real standout selling point. It is the main reason we bought a long wheel base version this time rather than the short wheel base version. And hard to match the price. $19,555 plus tax, title and license transfer, over $7K off MSRP. Price was actually over $2k less than we paid for our 1996 ten years ago. Also the three zone A-C/heater, part of an option package on the van we bought, is also a great feature.
  • hansiennahansienna Member Posts: 2,312
    Driver seat comfort in my 2002 T&C LX was the primary reason I now drive a 2006 Sienna LE. (Driver's seat in 2006 Sienna and 2006 Odyssey are equally comfortable for me and each is more comfortable than the 2006 DC minivan driver's seat). The 96 Caravan Sport and ALL 2005/06 Caravan, GC, and T&C have more comfortable seats then the "high back" driver and front passenger seat of my 02 T&C.

    I liked the comfort of 2nd row Quad seating and 3rd row 50/50 split fold and tumble 3rd row in my 2002 T&C but the T&C driver seat was NOT as comfortable as the driver's seat in my 2006 Sienna LE or my son's 2001 Ody EX.

    In my opinion, the 1999-2002 Odysseys had THE most comfortable 2nd and 3rd row seats but the 2003 and later Odyssey seats are not quite as comfortable as 1999-2002 models. :cry:
  • hansiennahansienna Member Posts: 2,312
    I owned a 2002 T&C LX and now own a 2006 Sienna LE and I have written more than once that the 1999-2002 Odysseys had THE MOST comfortable minivan seats in all 3 rows. :shades:

    I will also admit that the 2nd and 3rd row seats of my 2006 Sienna LE are NOT as comfortable as the 2006 Odyssey 2nd and 3rd row seats.

    Although the Sienna driver's seat is much more comfortable than the driver's seat of my 2002 T&C LX, there are many things I like better about the GC and T&C than my Sienna or the 2006 Odyssey.

    Most important, a buyer gets MORE nice items for the actual prices paid with a GC SXT than with either a Sienna or Odyssey. :blush:
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    I owned a 2002 T&C LX and now own a 2006 Sienna LE and I have written more than once that the 1999-2002 Odysseys had THE MOST comfortable minivan seats in all 3 rows.

    They HAD to have the best seats to counteract the "sporty" suspension tuning! It does drive like an Accord though!
  • dennisctcdennisctc Member Posts: 1,168
    Most important, a buyer gets MORE nice items for the actual prices paid with a GC SXT than with either a Sienna or Odyssey.

    My number 1 "nice item" is my power hatch by far!!!! I purchased mine off the lot because it had the tow package in needed. The $400 stand alone power hatch wasn't of any interest to me. Now that I have it, I can't live without it!!
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    I do have to agree that my 02 Odyssey does drive a lot like an Accord and that it doesn't feel as big as it actually is.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    Yes, and the new 2005+ Odyssey drives even crisper than the 1999-2004 models (the 2005 has less of a numb on-center feel than our 2000 model had).
  • cpsdarrencpsdarren Member Posts: 265
    I still haven't found much difference in the noise, handling and comfort of our 2006 compared to our 2001. Marginal improvements in those areas, IMO. Granted, the handling and comfort were quite good already.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    The ride was similar IMO, just had the steering tightened up a little in the newer models.
  • k203206k203206 Member Posts: 20
    First, I think this board is fantastic! I'm in the process of purchasing a new van. I'm will hold onto a vehicle for 10 years. Here's my question.
    The Mazda MPV and Toyota Sienna has the highest consumer ratings on this board, both are (9.1). I can purchase a new MPV LX (rear air) for 16.7K (not including Tax, title, and license). It will have a 48 month or 50K miles bumper to bumper warranty. Or I can purchase a new Toyota for 26K with the same options. The Mazda is smaller but we have a small family. What would you do? Purchase a lower cost vehicle that is not as dependable or can I justify the 10K for the Toyota. Ten years down the line, I may have decided to go with the Toyota?
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    Um, Dodge Grand Caravan has a consumer ratings on Edmunds of 9.2........

    Check them out. If you keep the bells and whistles down to a reasonable level, you can get a DGC SE with Stow and Go and with three zone air in a package for under $20K (MSRP of $26740), or an SXT standard with the above plus with a few more bells and whistles about $1K-2K more, not including tax title and license.

    More storage space than any of the others, though it may be less "refined" than the Sienna.

    Between the two you listed, the MPV is a bargain, though it is soon to become an orphan, as I read somewhere Mazda is to discontinue the MPV.
  • jipsterjipster Member Posts: 6,244
    What would I do? Well, I was in a similar situation as yourself 2 years ago. We bought the Mazda MPV, over the Sienna, as we preferred the smaller size for our family of four, the sportier and more attractive styling,price, and the car like ride and handling. Our MPV has been extremely reliable in the 2 years we have owned it. (knock on wood). Getting an LX that stickers at 23k for 16.7k though is a real steal. You could keep it 3 or 4 years, then sell it for around 10-12k and be out very little money.

    That said, if you really like the Sienna significantly more than the MPV...I would buy the Sienna. Good Luck.
    2020 Honda Accord EX-L, 2011 Hyundai Veracruz, 2010 Mercury Milan Premiere, 2007 Kia Optima
  • hansiennahansienna Member Posts: 2,312
    Yes if you consider having one control do everything to adjust bass, treble, fade, and balance where I must scroll thru a menu on my 2006 Sienna LE instead of having a separate control for each of the 4 functions on a GC or T&C. :shades: I do not like this feature on my Sienna as well as the 4 separate controls on my 02 T&C LX.
    The "refined" Sienna LE has no separately controlled temperature for the driver and front passenger that most GC minivans have.
    The 06 Sienna LE has a more attractive interior than the 06 GC SXT but I miss the better stereo controls on the T&C, the separate controls for rear windshield wiper and washer, and the separately controlled temperature for driver and front passenger that the more expensive Sienna LE does NOT have but were contained on my 02 T&C LX.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Member Posts: 1,168
    First, I think this board is fantastic! I'm in the process of purchasing a new van. I'm will hold onto a vehicle for 10 years. Here's my question.
    The Mazda MPV and Toyota Sienna has the highest consumer ratings on this board, both are (9.1). I can purchase a new MPV LX (rear air) for 16.7K (not including Tax, title, and license). It will have a 48 month or 50K miles bumper to bumper warranty. Or I can purchase a new Toyota for 26K with the same options. The Mazda is smaller but we have a small family. What would you do? Purchase a lower cost vehicle that is not as dependable or can I justify the 10K for the Toyota. Ten years down the line, I may have decided to go with the Toyota?


    The MPV is due to die here shortly, so resale will die with it. After owning or using (company) minivans over the past 8 years, I'd opt for the Larger minivans. You may have a small family but that extra space really comes in handy on vacations and home depot runs :)

    If I were in market, I'd look at all the major players...DCX, Honda, Toyota and Kia. Ford is killing their Freestars next year, and GM is killing off the Buick and Pontiac minivans also. I personally love my DCX GC SXT.....2005 with Stow N Go, 13,000 and never an issue, plus 25 mpg on trips/19 in town. You can probably get a nicely loaded DCX van for $20k
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    Well, I am talking about 2006 models, not 2002. Also, it is difficult to compare nickel and dime features from one brand to the next and from one generation to the next of the same brand. For example, the 2006 GC SE we just bought has the base radio and you do have to scroll through a menu to adjust the treble, base, balance and fade. However that is a minor inconvenience to most, as once it is set it is very rare that most people adjust them much after that.

    Likewise DC has changed the rear wiper/washer controls, so the feature is now only intermittent and with the washer switch built in to the on off switch. The intermittent frequency now increases with vehicle speed, which is a good feature. We rarely used the continuous feature on our 1996 van as the moisture never built up fast enough to need it.

    The heated windshield zone under the wipers is gone, however now our outside rear view mirrors are heated to defrost ice. Which is more useful? Probably the heated mirrors.

    The option package we have on our new GC SE which included the three zone A-C/heater with second row overhead controls on our new GC SE is definitely a significant improvement over past ventilation systems, and the separate temperature control for left and right driver and passenger, even on non-automatic climate control version we have is a nice extra. Of course, Stow and Go is a really big "wow" feature.

    It still amazes me that we just purchased this new 2006 GC SE for about $2K less than we purchased a new 1996 short wheel base Caravan SE Sport. Ten year interval, and significantly less out of pocket.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Member Posts: 1,168
    It still amazes me that we just purchased this new 2006 GC SE for about $2K less than we purchased a new 1996 short wheel base Caravan SE Sport. Ten year interval, and singificantly less out of pocket.

    As an electrical connector supplier to Automotive and PCs, I [non-permissible content removed] and moan when they want "productivity" reductions on prices. 15 years ago, we were selling 9 pin D sub connectors with gold plating for $1.50, now we're lucky to get $0.15 for them!!! But I don't [non-permissible content removed] when I can buy a new PC for $500!!! :)
  • jipsterjipster Member Posts: 6,244
    so resale will die with it

    K203206 stated he would be keeping the van for 10 years, so resale value wouldn't be an issue. The fact he would be paying almost 10k more for Sienna than the MPV with same options... would obviously be an issue.

    You may have a small family but that extra space really comes in handy on vacations and home depot runs.

    Really? We(family of 4) just got back from a trip to Panama City Beach. We had more than enough room and then some for all of our "junk". Unless you're into hanging drywall...MPV can make the home depot runs just as well.
    2020 Honda Accord EX-L, 2011 Hyundai Veracruz, 2010 Mercury Milan Premiere, 2007 Kia Optima
  • dennisctcdennisctc Member Posts: 1,168
    Really? We(family of 4) just got back from a trip to Panama City Beach. We had more than enough room and then some for all of our "junk". Unless you're into hanging drywall...MPV can make the home depot runs just as well.

    Every family is different. What if you take a bike and stroller and a few coolers? What if you have 1 kid and 2 grand parents? What if...... You can't add additional space somewhere down the road if you need it. It also makes packaging a lot easier.
  • jc9799jc9799 Member Posts: 70
    What if...... You can't add additional space somewhere down the road if you need it. It also makes packaging a lot easier.

    Well, true, but then why not just buy a Suburban for that extra space down the road. If you have alot of stuff to be carried around, then maybe the bigger van would be better. Still, this family of 4 has only had one experience where the MPV was not big enough. (OTOH, the Sienna would also have been too small for this occasion.)

    If price were not an issue, then I would choose the Sienna. Since price is an issue, we went with the MPV, and we've been real happy with it so far. I wouldn't argue with either choice.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    Well, true, but then why not just buy a Suburban for that extra space down the road.

    All of these minivans have more interior cu. ft. than a Suburban. (I know the Sienna, Odyssey, and DCX vans do, and imagine the others do also).
  • dennisctcdennisctc Member Posts: 1,168
    All of these minivans have more interior cu. ft. than a Suburban. (I know the Sienna, Odyssey, and DCX vans do, and imagine the others do also).

    Exactly!!!! Better MPG, more space, better ride and comfort
  • sebring95sebring95 Member Posts: 3,241
    Having come from a full-size SUV before the Ody, I can mostly agree that the Suburban isn't more roomy. I do believe the Suburban to be better at carrying cargo behind the 3rd row. It has less depth, but more length. In our case, if we have the grandkids, the double-stroller fills the Ody cargo hold which means we have to load stuff around it or strap it up against the 3rd row. a 'burban is better in this regard because the stroller can be laid flat to one side (long ways) and still leave plenty of room to load cargo around (instead of on top).

    But vans are far better at carrying people which is what we do more of anyway. The ride is questionable. A subruban with the autoride suspension is tough to beat and a lot quieter than any minivan I've been in. MPG is a given, but so is tow capacity. Really comes to personal preference. If you buy a Suburban because you might someday need a little extra space....that doesn't make much sense. Of course there are folks that think a family of four driving a minivan is quite a waste as well....
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Member Posts: 1,565
    Tow capacity and a more rugged structure capable of some moderate off road abuse, and more rugged four wheel drive trains are about the only logical reason to buy a large SUV over a minivan.

    But the downside is the Suburban is about 18-20" longer than minivans, and mileage is pretty abysmal, no matter what the brand.

    Unless your self esteem is so lame that you don't want to be caught driving a minivan, it is pretty difficult to justify a large SUV. I prefer the about 50% better fuel efficiency available in minivans, at about 1/2-2/3 the purchase price as well.
  • cpsdarrencpsdarren Member Posts: 265
    "A subruban with the autoride suspension is tough to beat and a lot quieter than any minivan I've been in. MPG is a given, but so is tow capacity."

    Most large SUVs seem to be quiter and have a smoother ride than the Odyssey. Not saying much, really, so do most other minivans. The tradeoff is the Odyssey's superior road feel and emergency handling.

    Like badgerfan said, I'd buy a Suburban only if I needed to do heavy duty towing, heavy duty off-roading or had a family of 9. Otherwise, I'd be in a minivan or a Highlander Hybrid if I preferred an SUV. It still puzzles me how they manage to even sell the full size SUVs these days without 4WD or trailer hitches.
  • jc9799jc9799 Member Posts: 70
    Cursed interior space!

    OK, I stand corrected. :blush:

    My point was that bigger is not always better. The Sienna is very nice, but, at least for our family, the MPV is better (for the $$$ anyway).
  • allison5allison5 Member Posts: 130
    I can speak from hands on experience about whether there is more room in SUV or minivan. I went from a minivan (2000 Odyessy) to a GMC Yukon (not the suburban, though I almost bought it. Anyway now after having a SUV for a few years I truly MISS the interior space in a minivan and now I am planning on going back to a minivan. YOu can't beat a minivan for the space!! In the SUV there was never enough room behind the 3rd row and when you don't have the sliding doors with a minivan you find you really miss them at least I do. It is also such a pain for kids climbing in and out of a SUV, squeezing by etc. Just suggestions!
  • dennisctcdennisctc Member Posts: 1,168
    I truly MISS the interior space in a minivan and now I am planning on going back to a minivan.

    Another good point....Ease of Entry!! Not just talking sliding doors, but also not having to climb up and in, and over seats, thru narrow spaces. Maybe the new GM SUVs with their flip and fold seats are a big improvement, but I haven't seen one up close.

    I love my van for camping!! I'm not one to "pack" it properly, especially on the return trip. I just toss everything in and worry about it when I get home. Thats why I love a minivan over any SUV.

    I also have a decent tow capacity of 3800 lbs with DCX's factory tow pack that includes tranny, oil and HD radiator coolers, auto leveling suspension and HD battery and electrical
  • bobw3bobw3 Member Posts: 2,989
    It's pretty easy to get in the 3rd row of my Freestyle, and there is also pretty good space behind the 3rd row too. But it's true...nothing beats a minivan for max space if you need max space.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    I'm sure the MPV is fine for those families who don't need the space that the Sienna and Odyssey provide and/or do not want to pay the severe price premium for the Toyota and Honda.
  • marine2marine2 Member Posts: 1,155
    Of course the owners aren't going to admit the seats aren't comfortable, nor will polite passengers sitting back there, so let's get real. Plus, real passengers sitting in the back aren't jumping in different minivans to compare the differences. I've never sat in the stowNgo seats, but the low but high knee position doesn't look as comfortable to the other's horizontal chair position

    My brother road for over 2,000 miles in our sister's middle seats, believe me if they were uncomfortable, he wouldn't have a problem telling us. He has a 2001 Pymouth minivan. He was going to buy a new 2006 when I talked him into waiting next year for the 2008. They should have a six speed trany, new engine and new design.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Member Posts: 1,168
    I talked him into waiting next year for the 2008. They should have a six speed trany, new engine and new design.

    I'm seeing more and more of them driving around, here in Auburn Hills, MI. For some reason, they look smaller? Maybe its the camo on them.

    I'm hearing good things....independent rear suspensions, cup heater/coolers, power "Stow N Go", quieter, greater tow rating. The Tranny is suppose to be a 6 spd with overdrive even! We'll know a lot more about the Engine/Tranny when the 2007 Pacificas come out this August...should be same drivetrain.
  • marine2marine2 Member Posts: 1,155
    Let me for once and for all put an end to these people who think just because the middle seats of the stow-n-go are firmer, then they have to be uncomfortable.

    The Honda Ody has a firmer ride than the Dodge/Chrysler does. Does that mean the Honda's ride is uncomfortable? I rest my case on the comfort of those seats.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Member Posts: 1,168
    The Honda Ody has a firmer ride than the Dodge/Chrysler does. Does that mean the Honda's ride is uncomfortable? I rest my case on the comfort of those seats.

    Take a ride in any German automobile and you'll notice firm seats. Take a long ride in those seats and say they're not more comfortable than "cushy" seats.
  • guestguest Member Posts: 770
    I have driven MANY miles in a VW Beetle and VW Bus and the firm seats were more comfortable for me than the "cushy" seats in my 2002 T&C LX.
    The more firm seats of my son's 2001 Ody EX and my 2006 Sienna LE are also more comfortable for me than the softer seat of my 2002 T&C LX.
    The contour of the seat cushion and seat back is as much or more important than whether the seat is cushy or firm.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    Why is Hansienna's username hidden or "unknown"? I know it's hans, based on his story. Is it a technical glitch?

    I also agree with him on his point...firmness doesn't make comfort; contour and shape are most imporant. I could sit on a firm park bench, but it doesn't make it comfortable. As far as seat comfort, there is a compromise in getting stow and go, at least to my rump/back. It's not unbearable, but the Sedona, Sienna, and Odyssey certainly feel better to my 6'4" 185 lb body than the stow-and-go. It's a compromise that is worth having to a lot of people obviously, which makes it a feature worthwhile to a lot of people, however.
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