Honda Element

ateixeira · June 2006

We're all sized and shaped differently, I find the seats just fine.

As for the "cheap" comment, you might say that about the Elements side-impact protection after the weak IIHS results. And here they blamed all the extra weight on a supposedly reinforced side structure...

http://www.iihs.org/ratings/summary.aspx?class=58

Forester is right on top. Element is way, way down the list.

Ironic choice of words, "cheap", because Subaru uses exotic metals, Boron steel actually, in the B-pillar, to protect the occupants. Fire fighters complained about them being impossible to cut through even with their jaws-of-life tool.

Here's a cut-away. Note they had to use industrial tools to cut through the exotic, expensive Boron steel Subaru uses.

I'd rather know they were spending the money where it protects lives vs. lumbar support in the seat (at least they have it).

-juice

ateixeira · June 2006

Note the rear protection is rated as POOR because of the seats. Oh, the irony... :P

-juice

ateixeira · June 2006

Autoweek had a tidbit about the SC, they say it'll make production and agree about the 10hp bump.

The best part is the new front seatbelt - they were integrated in to the front seats, addressing the issue of letting someone out that's in the back without having to remove the front seat belt. Subtle yet important improvement.

-juice

mattchalmers · June 2006

My wife and I are considering trading in our beloved Aztek for a 06' Element (I know, one ugly car to another). We drove one for the first time tonight. I did not notice a ton of road noise, but the reviews I have read mention the road noise as being a significant drawback. This vehicle will serve as a commuter and for road trips. Any advice? We also want something that can grow with us when we start having kids. The back seat seems to be sufficient for a car seat. Does anyone here use their Element for carting the kids?

1racefan · June 2006

Easy there....

I don't think he was calling the Forester cheap in general...he was simply referring to the mechanicals of the seat. Obviously the Forester has one of the best AWD systems in the world, and does have great safety elements (I used the word element to stay on topic

) One could probably find something on ANY car (even a Maybach) and label it as "cheap".

That's the beauty of the automotive world...everyone has different tastes/preferences/concerns. The seat probably works well for you, but caused him great pain, so he decided to bash that one particular aspect. Some will sacrifice other aspects in order to drive a vehicle that ranks high in crash test results, while others could care less about crash test results.

ateixeira · June 2006

Ask if they'll let you test drive it on the highway for a while. Turn the radio down and see if the noise levels seem tolerable to you.

-juice

ateixeira · June 2006

Perhaps I reacted too strongly, but it seemed like a cheap parting shot. Just position the lumbar support all the way back and pretend it doesn't exist...

-juice

wamba2000 · June 2006

The Element is a short wheelbase vehicle and the stock Goodyear tires have been much derided on the message boards. Noise is average for a smaller vehicle. some tires lessent the road noise. My Element is tightly put together, no wind noise in the A-pillar, and comfortable for my wife and two teenaged kids to get around in.

As a commuter car, it does work: easy to park and manuever, gets mileage in the 20-23 mpg (depending if a/c is on) and I've gotten 28 mpg on a trip where I had myself, 3 teens and the back end loaded with gear and clothes.

As to carting the kids, here is where you need to change behavior. With the rear doors, you have to not put on your seat belt and wait to close your door until after th rear door is closed. Not impossible, just a change in behavior. If your kids are very young, it is a long reach back to hand them their bottle, toy, wipe a nose etc. Try it for size before you buy.

Good luck, I think the Element is one of those unsung hero cars/SUVs that will be in demand by teens as a used car in the future because of solid construction and usability.

1racefan · June 2006

I own an '06 Element, along with an '03 Mitsubishi Outlander. My in-laws have a current generation CR-V that I drive a lot. To my untrained ear, I don't notice the Element being any more noisy than the Outlander or the CR-V.

I can tell you that there is no way I would own an Element if I regularly had people riding in the rear seats - the door setup just isn't practical. In my case, my wife drives it to work, and we have no kids. We do have dogs, and I am looking forward to being able to haul landscaping supplies in it this fall and next spring without having to worry about getting carpet dirty like I do in our other cars. I can't justify owning a truck, so the Element is a good compromise for us.

ateixeira · June 2006

the door setup just isn't practical

What about the new seat-mounted belts? Would that change things?

-juice

1racefan · June 2006

"What about the new seat-mounted belts? Would that change things? "

No (well, partially) - here's an example of why I say impracticle....

Day 2 of our Element ownership, we go out to dinner with another couple. When we arrive and exit the vehicle, one of them tries to close the rear door after closing the front door (instead of closing the rear door, then closing the front door). The rear door made a loud "thud" against the front door. We cringed as they did this...but luckily there was no damage to the front door. If the doors could all close independantly of one another, coupled with the new seatbelt setup, that would improve the overall practicality.

goltgo · June 2006

The workings of the rear clamshell doors can take some getting used to once your family consist of more than just you and your wife, but I will say this: The Element and CRV have a great deal of rear legroom, which came into play when my parents were deciding which car to use as the babyhauler for their new grandchild. In my dad's Outback, a rear-facing car seat would only fit behind the front passenger seat, and the seat had to be rolled all the way forward in its track and tipped forward in order to accomplish that, making the Outback effectively a two-adult, one baby vehicle. In my mom's Element, the rear-facing child seat fit in no problem without touching the front passenger seat and without it being full-forward in its track. So it's a three-adult, one baby vehicle. Not a big leap over the Outback, but a lot less awkward. Of course, your child will spend less than a year in a rear-facing seat, and you'll own the car much longer than that, but it sure shined during that period.

mattchalmers · June 2006

Thanks for all of the responses.

I think I am going to request a 24-36 hour test drive in a demo model tonight. We are making a short trip from Fort Worth to Dallas tomorrow and that would give us a great idea of the feasibility. If we don't get the Element, we will probably get a Civic. I know they are not comparable, but the Civic was the reasonable choice to begin with. If my wife really wants the Element, we will get that.

micweb · June 2006

One of you needs to sit on the rear seat for a portion of the trip. That stopped us from getting one. The ride in the back seat, which is located right over the axle, is just too harsh. We had a CRV before and didn't have that problem. We ended up getting a large passenger car (Impala).

ateixeira · June 2006

The rear door made a loud "thud" against the front door

Yeah, I know what you mean. We have a shuttle van at work and people actually have damaged the front half of the dutch doors.

goltgo: how was loading the baby in the rear facing seat? Do the suicide doors open wide enough, i.e. out of the way so you can load from that side? Or did you just climb in from the other side, carrying the baby?

1racefan · June 2006

When we shopped the Element, we considered it a 2 door SUV for all intents and purposes. We don't have (nor do we want) kids, so the door design wasn't an issue for us.

Our decision to buy it boiled down to the versatility (great for hauling), combined with the value (especially with all the stuff you get with the 4wd EX), and Honda's reputation for reliability.

mattchalmers · June 2006

Well, I am starting to think that we will not get the Element. Last night I went to the dealer and negotiated a little bit. We settled on 20,700 for an 4WD EX-P with window tint. That is a pretty good price, but I am just hesitant to pull the trigger. We don't like the CRV, so we are looking at the Pilot, and that is a lot more money than I wanted to spend right now. We shall see... :confuse:

goltgo · June 2006

The nice thing is that, once both doors on a side are open (rear one opens to about 90 degrees, I think), there is no B pillar in the way, and it's an easy enough thing to put the little guy in his seat.

His car seat is behind the passenger seat, and when he was an infant, you could reach in on the passenger side to put him his seat while still standing on the ground, even though the rear seat is recessed a bit from the door opening. If it was raining, we'd usually bring him in on the driver's side, sit down in the rear passenger seat next to his car seat, and then strap him in. By the time he got big enough that you might not like hefting his weight back into the seat from the right side, it was time to switch him to a front-facing seat, and that made the job easier.

I will say that the clamshell doors make it challenging to get rear passengers situated when you are parked next to another car in a parking lot since you both have to crowd into the arc of the front door in order to get the back door open.

Also, there are only two sets of seatbelts back there, so it's four occupants max in the E.

taky · June 2006

I just bought a new EX-P. From the warranty manual, it said to have oil change every 5000 miles. My dealer sent me a coupon card for 4 free oil change but indicated they are need to be done on each 7500 miles. I'm confused. How often all of you take your E to oil change?

thanks

Taky

ateixeira · June 2006

Just wait 'til they're in booster seats, then things get real easy. We even let our older child buckle herself in.

Both kids even open their own doors (this ruled out the XTerra/Armada for us with the high door handles), but not out, since we use the child safety locks.

-juice

bigfur · June 2006

These doors are designed the same way extended cab pick up trucks have be designed for years. Takes a day or two to get used to but then its just second nature. If your on the drivers side right hand then left hand closes the doors. Maybe i have had my truck too long but it seems pretty simple to me.

lewisinbecket · July 2006

First, I would say that you are switching from one unique vehicle to another!

The Element is a GREAT commuter car: excellent visibility, easy to park and good rear legroom for adult-sized passengers.

Like you Aztek, the Element has great, usable storage space. The rear seats are also light weight, so if flipping them up and out of the way does not leave you with enough room, they are very easy to remove.

Considering that the car has the aerodynamics of a brick, I think that some wind noise is expected. Factor in an interior shaped like an open box (lined with non-sound deadening plastic) and you find that the road noise has not place to "go". For that reason, I would not add a roof rack, except temporarily when needed. I found that the most of the road noise came from the tires. At about 30K, and after reading several Element-based blogs about replacement tires, I switched to Yokohama Geolanders HTS.
The car MUCH (not slightly, but MUCHO) quieter with these tires. Plus the handling is somewhat improved.

So, trade the Aztek, ask the dealer for either the new tires(they go for about $100/ea) (or to split his cost with you on the new tires). You will be very pleased!

lewisinbecket · July 2006

I agree. While researching online for a Hybrid Element, I saw that the 07 CRV will be offered as a Hybrid. Since the link was to a Japanese website, I could not tell if a 5SP would be offered, so I looked at some '06 CRV brochures to see if a manual transmission was offered. Apparently, it is. However, your news about the 07 model is disappointing.
(Maybe Honda will have a last-minute change of heart!)

ateixeira · July 2006

USA will get neither a hybrid nor a manual tranny, as far as I know. You sure about the 07 date for a hybrid? You mean calendar year 2007 (MY08)?

-juice

applejf · July 2006

Thinking very seriously about buying a 2007 Element, my first Honda since buying a new 1988 Prelude. The various owner review sites, one in particular, talk about what seems like significant numbers of people having problems with the windshield cracking, most due to rocks. Some say it's the high angle of the windshield that contributes. Any comments from 2006 model owners? (Hoping the problem has somehow been addressed and/or was an early models problem)

thanks in advance

stever · July 2006

Please report on your gas mileage in the Honda Element: MPG - Real World Numbers discussion. Thanks,

Steve, Host

kyuss · July 2006

I am an '06 Ridgeline owner and my wife has an '01 Accord. She is interested in both the CR-Vs and Elements (not for the looks). She basically wants a bike and dog (2 dogs) hauler. The Accord is only a two door. Has anyone bought a CR-V and wished they had gone with the Element or vice versa? If so what's the reason? The wife and I can't really decide especially since the reliability history seems to be about the same. Thanks for any input.

honda67 · July 2006

KYUSS - I have two dogs and a bike that I haul around myself. I had an 05 CR-V EX and ended up trading it in for an 06 Element EX. The CR-V's interior was a NIGHTMARE to keep clean! The cloth seats could double as a lint roller and show any and all dirt, After loading the bike or dogs in and out for even a quick trip, I ended up doing a major clean up job. The Element has waterproof seats and for my purposes loads more room and is much more functional. The back doors may not be the best if you are loading a baby seat, but works great for dogs, bikes and even a fully assembled Gas Grille. I would recommend the Element for functionality and durability hands down.

ateixeira · July 2006

Along those lines, if you want a combination of the two, i.e. a non-carpeted cargo area but conventional doors a la CR-V, check out a Forester LL Bean Edition.

You can even get a factory dog guard/compartment divider. I would be fine for small/medium sized dogs, but not Dobermans.

I believe the Matrix/Vibe also have a non-carpeted cargo floor, but those may be too small.

-juice

cwalti · July 2006

My darling wife insisted on the '05 CR-V EX 4WD over the Element. I would say that the Element is much more functional then is the CR-V. Mechanically they're nearly identical. The only difference being the 5-speed automatic in the CR-V over the 4-speed in the Element. The Element EX has a super sound system and much more cabin space and lateral freedom of movement and cubies and storage allover. The EX is a bargain over the LX, check the honda website or earlier postings for details. The CR-V being built in Japan is considered a quality plus too. For the purpose you are stating, it is the Element hands down!!!

extech2 · July 2006

A consumer group asked their members to vote for the best car for dog owners. #1 was the Honda Element EX 4wheel drive, #2 the Honda Element EXP 2wheel drive, and 3rd was a Chevy Suburban. I can't remember the rest. The Element is the ultimate status symbol for people who don't care for status symbols. I plan to get mine a week after we paid off our Accord. We have a V6 4 door Accord, and that car feels small and cramped after I drove the Element twice. My dogs hate to get in the Accord because every time I brake hard they slide off the leather seats and bark like dogs gone mad. Viva the Element.

dweiser · July 2006

Like many, I had heard the urban legend that you could just hose out the interior of the Element. Don't. I didn't thank goodness. The water will run down into the chassis under the floor and rust everything out down there. You all probably know this but a heads up for those who don't.

ateixeira · July 2006

Leather is better for dogs that shed, though. The hair doesn't stick all over the place. Just put the seats up.

We've had both (leather/cloth), fortunately our dog is small enough to ride on laps.

-juice

applejf · July 2006

Potential Element purchaser here. I am embarrassed to ask this of people on this excellent forum, but ask and I might receive. Just drove one for the second time. First test drive I may have been moving my head around looking at things in the interior; I definitely got a light case of motion sickness (which I know I am subject to - can't ride as a passenger on curvy roads, etc). Today I test drove a manual transmission Element and was absolutely delighted with it. The shifter was not as far away from me as the pictures seemed to indicate it would be..........I love the way it handles.........it is plenty peppy............and of course I love the carrying capacity. I know they are making at least one improvement on the '07's: the front passenger/driver seat belts. BUT I had another (less severe) case of icky feeling motion sickness after the drive. Am I imagining this? If it is happening, I could see how the short wheelbase and fairly stiff suspension AND the location of my head in all of that could add up to something. Has anyone had any problem like I am describing?

cwalti · July 2006

...just wear a life preserver, throw an anchor in the back and you will feel better within less than 250,000 miles... :-)

applejf · July 2006

Durn I never thought about that! And I do need one cause I can't swim :-)

dweiser · July 2006

......... your fear of heights?

applejf · July 2006

Fear of heights! I love this forum!!! You guys are geniuses (genii?) !!

Seriously, this forum prepared me really well for my visit to test-drive the Element. Probably would have bought that one today if had been an EX-P, motion sickness and all......

cwalti · July 2006

....naaahhh, - just breaking in a new arrival! :-)

applejf · July 2006

Good, I feel broken in already

cwalti · July 2006

Ok, then; -- we can return to the original concern about motion sickness. No, I have never had any such sensations. The wallowing motion of my Lincoln (RIP) would have much more likely induced motion sickness. The wheelbase is short, with no overhang to induce additioanl sloppyness and the underpinnings are stiff enough to have the ride closer to 'choppy' than to 'sloppy'...

With that said the conclusion would have to be, its you; -- taka a Dramamin and grin ear to ear as your whooozy head is bobbing down the road... :-)

stever · July 2006

I'm curious about your present ride and why it doesn't bother you. I suppose the tire pressures could have been off on both your test rides but that's a stretch (often the dealer techs forget to air down the tires to recommended settings - they usually are over-inflated so they won't flatspot while being shipped to the dealer).

So you may want to see about a third test and make the salesperson check the air first, but if that doesn't help, look elsewhere. I get queasy on some boats and chairlifts and I couldn't tolerate a car that did that to me.

Steve, Host (checking the expiry date on my scolopamine patch Rx right now. :shades: )

applejf · July 2006

Steve wrote: I'm curious about your present ride and why it doesn't bother you.

Well I am sorta curious too. The rides are a Volvo S70 and a BMW 330ci. I was in the Volvo yesterday thinking about this, and that car has a pretty soft suspension that absorbs the high frequency bumps and maybe the Element's doesn't. The BMW suspension is very stiff and doesn't absorb much so things don't add up there. Haven't had this icky feeling in either car as long as I'm the driver.

I'm really drawn to the Element although my wife isn't. Well, she did say she likes the rubber easy-to-clean mats. You never know what the other person will think when he/she is not a car person. She's given the OK to purchase, but I guess you are right it would really be annoying to spend a bunch of money on a car that I can't drive; I suppose I need to take one more test drive and really focus.

Thanks for the thoughts.

cwalti · July 2006

OK, here is the prudent thing to do....

You have permission and funding secured, select the 4WD EX-P and have at it! Stay in touch and report your findings. If the experience becomes unbearable within the first few weeks, simply drop it off in my driveway. I will take good care of it for many moons to come and it will be in good company with the other three Hondas already populating the driveway...

applejf · July 2006

Sorry, if I get one it'll be a 2WD. Sure don't need 4 here in Alabama, and 2 might get a little better MPG. Maybe someone else would make me this "take it off your hands" deal......

I am making progress though, I did a third test drive of a Forester XT, quite a different car but one I was trying to also consider - and as of now am not making a move till I see the 2007 Element. Probably dreaming but (in addition to them fixing the front seat belt problem) I am hoping they will offer a power driver's seat. I can't get comfortable enough in the manual one to consider a long distance trip, and I'd like to. Guess I better not hold my breath.

cwalti · July 2006

...just saw on www.honda.com that they offer 2.9% for 36 months if that is a motivator. Maybe the car does not fit but the financing will... :-I

applejf · July 2006

Yep that would be a motivator. That's low!

Hmmm. I don't ever visit Honda.com, guess I ought to do that. I did sign up for their late breaking news notice or whatever they call it.

cwalti · July 2006

Here is the direct link... Good luck!!!
http://automobiles.honda.com/tools/current_offers.asp?Function=new

cwalti · July 2006

Actually, my local Honda pusher offers 2.9% for 60 months...
Go to Specials, and current ad...
http://www.ochondaworld.com/

1racefan · July 2006

"Probably dreaming but (in addition to them fixing the front seat belt problem) I am hoping they will offer a power driver's seat."

Don't hold your breath. If they start adding stuff to the Element like power seats, power sunroofs, etc... the Element starts to become a different animal than it was originally intended.

Honda Element

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