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Honda Element

1171820222393

Comments

  • diploiddiploid Member Posts: 2,286
    Here's a close up pic of the Element. The gap tolerance for the headlight housing is not very good.
  • diploiddiploid Member Posts: 2,286
    Just went to the Honda website. Funny how they still show the blue interior pics from the pre-production model as opposed to the boring gray we've been seeing.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Where's the pic? no link?

    -juice
  • diploiddiploid Member Posts: 2,286
    LOL...see what happens when you visit TH late in the night because you can't sleep?


    http://www.vtec.net:8080/news_files/39513/03element-01.jpg
  • chris777chris777 Member Posts: 126
    but it is still a preliminary site with several buttons not ready yet


    http://element.honda.com

  • clayman1clayman1 Member Posts: 41
    I just posted some numbers about the Element on the Element/Aztec forum from a nice article in AutoWorld Magazine.

    I think this is going to be huge seller.
  • ropedartropedart Member Posts: 163
    Whadda we have here:
    0-60 times
    9.6 sec for 2wd
    11.4 sec for 4wd YIKES!
    MT or AT?

    Autoweek estimated 8.7 sec for MT Hmmmm....
    The truth still out there.....
  • dindakdindak Member Posts: 6,632
    It's not suppose to be a huge seller and I doubt it ever will be. It's a niche vehicle just like the Aztek.
  • hurler4hurler4 Member Posts: 104
    Has anyone heard if Honda will offer a cassette player as an option on the Element? I still have many cassettes, and notice that many cars don't even offer a cassette player as an option anymore.

    Also, has anyone heard about the exterior and interior colors offered?

    I had been considering the CR-V or the Outback, but am intrigued by the Element.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The target is reasonably low, so success is likely. It won't sell in CR-V volumes (120k/year), more like 50k per year or so.

    -juice
  • himilerhimiler Member Posts: 1,209
    You could always buy a cheap CD recorder and put your cassettes onto CD. I'd be willing to bet that route is cheaper than getting a dealer-installed cassette player, if it's even an option.

    You're considering the CR-V and Outback, but not the new Forester? I drove a 2003 5-speed and found it to be a really nice package.
  • hurler4hurler4 Member Posts: 104
    himiler, I considered the Forester, since I do a ton of outdoors stuff, but I have trouble getting by the looks of it, which I realize is pretty shallow! Also, it doesn't seem to have as much room as the CR-V, Element, or Outback. How does it handle? Is the acceleration decent? I rented a Protege5 in San Diego during the summer and loved it--great handling and decent torque. If only it had AWD and a bit more cargo space...
  • himilerhimiler Member Posts: 1,209
    Yes, it does fall short on passenger space (although there's decent cargo room) when compared to the CR-V and Outback, but it's built on the rugged Impreza platform, so a stretch limo it ain't. I thought the acceleration was fair with the 2.5 H4 and 5-speed (it moves out smartly, but loses steam after 5000rpm), and the handling is very entertaining with the manual's 50-50 torque split. Four-wheel drift, anyone?

    When Subaru decides to offer the Forester with the turbo 2.5, I might have to seriously think about trading my 2.5RS sedan.

    I also like the P5, and am eager to see the Mazda 6 wagon with the AWD option.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Subaru definitely gave cargo space a priority, but if you put kids in the back seat, that works out better. Payload, tow capacity, and roof rack capacity are slightly higher than the Hondas.

    Acceleration should be similar to the Element, until the turbo arrives next year, then it'll dominate the sport/cute class.

    Ride and handling are better but that's the benefit of the lower ride height/center of gravity. It doesn't give you the up-high feeling of sitting on a throne, though, so take your pick.

    -juice
  • ropedartropedart Member Posts: 163
    This is from global auto net:

    http://www.globalautonet.com/pages/roadahead/092302.html

    "Acura is also looking seriously at its own companion to the Honda Element, aimed at affluent younger buyers. This small, funky all-wheel-drive model is said to be inspired by the cute Acura RDX concept from this years Detroit show. What is not known is whether the production version will pick up the hybrid gas-electric driveline from the RDX or whether it will use a conventional powertrain as in the Element."


    More power please! What engine would that be?

  • diploiddiploid Member Posts: 2,286
    Was hardly cute.
  • AnakinAnakin Member Posts: 410
    I thought it was cool, but in a spaceship-looking kind of way.

    Still, if they say "based on" the RDX I'm sure it will be FAR more conservative than the concept was. I mean, this is Honda, after all.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    What if they kept the 2.4l but added Integrated Motor Assist? In other words, make it a hybrid?

    Imagine having electric power to boost torque at low rpm.

    -juice
  • varmintvarmint Member Posts: 6,326
    Juice - That is exactly what the RDX had. IIRC, the 2.4L engine was supposed to crank out 250hp with another 50hp coming from twin electric motors driving the rear wheels.
  • aquaswimmeraquaswimmer Member Posts: 30
    That would be very interesting juice, the IMA would essentially serve sort of a supercharger function.

    I predict we will see many hydrid vehicles soon, both car and SUV that are set up more for GOOD performance and DECENT fuel economy rather than POOR performance and EXCELLENT fuel economy as most hybrids are now.

    With the 2.4, perhaps an Integrated Motor assisted Element might have 200 horsepower and get better fuel economy than the current non IMA 2.4 Element due to hybrid advantages such as regenerative braking among others.
  • hurler4hurler4 Member Posts: 104
    I assume that everyone has seen this link. But for those who haven't, the picture of the Element on the beach in that color scheme is enough to make me buy one the day it comes out!
    www.element.honda.com
    I have another question: The black materials that are used for the bumper, fenders, and roof--are they the same material used for the bumpers on the CR-V, or might they be stronger? I'm amazed at seeing every other Camry, Civic, Outback, etc. on the road with a huge 6-inch deep pockmark on the rear corner of the bumper from a little fender bender. I assume these bumpers are much better quality than the flimsy bumpers on Japanese cars?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    OK, then realistically a combined 200hp would be possible, even with the stock engine.

    The "Acura" label would help to justify the higher price tag, plus you can take a $3000 tax deduction (not a tax credit, but still).

    But yeah, slightly better performance, slightly better mileage too. They're already talking about a CR-V and Escape hybrid.

    And hybrids are sort of on the fringe, so styling like the Element may be more acceptable to that target market.

    -juice
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    Varmint, RDX's K24A pumped 200 HP, with additional 50 HP coming from electric motors.

    IMO, a very efficient way of making AWD vehicles. It could add couple of hundred pounds to a vehicle's weight, but so does a coventional AWD system. But what IMA would do with that additional weight is that it will produce power, a conventional AWD system 'consumes' power.

    A 50 HP electric motor could add well over 100 lb.-ft at low end. We never saw the torque rating of the K24A-IMA unit in RDX, but my guess is, about 260 lb.-ft under 2000 rpm, almost half of it coming from the electric motor.
  • miata94miata94 Member Posts: 17
    Quoting from Ropedart first...

    >#864 of 970 POV by ropedart Sep 06, 2002
    >(12:31 am)

    >I am trying to look at the situation from a GenY
    >point of view(ultimately resale value). If you
    >are an active GenY guy sitting around talking to
    >other GenY guys about cars and trucks the
    >discussion will come around as to who has the
    >most capable vehicle. Who has more power and who
    >can really go offroad. A lot vehicles can beat
    >the Element at that.

    Hah, you have no idea how right on you are. I'm Gen-X, and I sit with a bunch of Gen-Ys at lunch. When it comes to cars, performance, handling, and sex appeal are what's important. The fact that they have more invested in their cars than in savings doesn't seem to bother them, even in this economy.

    I don't care about the Element being a relative slug as long as it offers a lot of utility and does not trash the environment. The only thing I'm cocerned with are the suicide doors (will there be side airbags?) and the low fuel efficiency. (23 MPG on the expressway?) That seems very low for such a small car. The similar Vibe gets 34 MPG on the highway, and the superfast WRX get 27 MPG.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Was the RDX's AWD a through-the-road system?

    If so, it's not IMA (by definition it's not integrated at all, only the road links the two axles).

    If so, I doubt that's what the Element would get. It would be more like the Civic hybrid's IMA.

    Vibe and WRX are smaller than the Element. OT: have you guys seen the face-lift of the WRX? Looks good.

    -juice
  • varmintvarmint Member Posts: 6,326
    Thanks for the hp correction Robert. My memory aint what it used to be. =)

    Miata94 - I think it's a matter of which Gen Y people you meet. I'm a corporate trainer and work with many new hires who are straight out of college. Being one of my favorite subjects, we often talk about cars during breaks in my classes. Since most are still driving clunkers from their college days, they are often shopping for new cars (now that they have a good job). I've found that their tastes in cars are as diverse as their tastes in music.

    I've also found that most do not buy the car of their dreams. They may admire and lust after the WRX, Celica, RSX-S, and Mustangs, but the majority end up with a Civic, Corrola, or something similar. There have been three exceptions in recent months. One bought an Xterra (for the looks), another an Eclipse (financing deal), and the last is weighing the merits of the Hybrid Civic vs the Prius.

    I do know several people who are interested in the Element. Most have kids and all are older than Gen Y.
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    RDX and DNX (Dualnote), both used IMA (Integrated Motor Assist) to control the electric motors. I've not seen the poweretrain layout of RDX, but this picture shows that of DNX. Electric motors are mounted on the front wheels, and the IMA sits alongside the 3.5/V6 DOHC iVTEC to synchronize the gasoline and electric motors.
  • ropedartropedart Member Posts: 163
    The Element will use a new material for the bumpers. Its an improvement over standard materials. Lets hope it works better than the CRV bumper ;) They still look kinda small though.
  • ropedartropedart Member Posts: 163
    juice- you mean with the new headlights. Y'know I kinda like the bug eyed look now. I got used to it. Now it will be a collectors car. Talk about a GenY car - the Impreza wagon. Its so cheap here in Canada I should buy it for the fun of it. Not lots around-offbeat look-respectable real AWD-wagon payload-cheap. GenY to me.

    The new look is more normal but seems a letdown. I expected more.
  • oldsargeoldsarge Member Posts: 1
    I don't care what the marketing dreamers think, the only thing specifically Gen Y about the Element is the entertainment electronics. I'm a Year-2-Boomer and this little jitney looks like just the thing to drive into retirement. Easy to maneuver, fairly cheap to feed, loads of room for the bird dog and the shotgun, fly rod, etc. and I can sleep in it. The 4WD should take it as far as I think a vehicle should go and my feet will carry me on from there.

    Then let's talk about raw practicality. Unless someone is planning of pulling a horse or feeding hay to one, this is the country-car in spades. Load up the back with soil amendments, garden tools, hardware, groceries . . . shoot, where has this idea been for Heaven's sake? Oh, I forget. It used to be called a Volkswagen microbus.
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,435
    A firend of mine is quite interested in getting an Element. She's 40, married, not kids, but 2 dogs (labs), and she kyaks. Looks like a great vehicle for that type of situation, especially getting dogs in the side doors. Should be lots of room for them with the seats folded up.

    I have 2 younger kids, and something like this (if I could live with the styling) would be a very useful car for me. Great for hauling around dirty sports bags, home depot runs, etc.

    Just have to give it 40+ more HP, and better handling, a moonroof, and a few other things to be determined.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • thekingtheking Member Posts: 107
    Seeing pictures of Element on Honda's site I am afraid that the blind spots over your right and left shoulder will be very difficult to adjust to. Any person interested in the vehicle..DRIVE IT FIRST...do not order one with a binding deposit to a dealer...I just hope Honda has not created the 2003 version of "The Thing by Volkswagen"
  • AnakinAnakin Member Posts: 410
    if your mirrors are adjusted properly, you shouldn't have any trouble.

    I see too many people driving around with their side mirrors aimed straight back, however.
  • mildnessmildness Member Posts: 1
    miata94:
    > The only thing I'm cocerned with are the suicide
    > doors (will there be side airbags?) and the low
    > fuel efficiency. (23 MPG on the expressway?) That
    > seems very low for such a small car. The similar
    > Vibe gets 34 MPG on the highway, and the superfast > WRX get 27 MPG.

    The Element has side air bags for front seat passengers.

    The reason it gets worse mileage is that it is much larger than the Vibe and WRX. One should expect worse mileage.

    If I get 23 on the highway I will be tickled pink. I get 14.9 in my Xterra and this is one reason why I'm looking to replace it.

    Cheers,

    Bill
  • diploiddiploid Member Posts: 2,286
    "The reason it gets worse mileage is that it is much larger than the Vibe and WRX. One should expect worse mileage."

    And it's basically a box on wheels. The word aerodynamic is completely foreign to it.
  • himilerhimiler Member Posts: 1,209
    It's a brick. Should be very entertaining to drive in crosswinds.
  • diploiddiploid Member Posts: 2,286
    It's wider than the CR-V, but also taller, so I really don't know if that extra girth will make it more stable on crosswinds.
  • varmintvarmint Member Posts: 6,326
    Yep. It's a brick.

    Diploid - (getting picky here) It needs a wider track, not just more girth. That's something I wish they'd done for the new CR-V, as well.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    LOL, I can't decide which comment on its shape was funniest.

    -juice
  • ropedartropedart Member Posts: 163
    Hey wait a minute. There are supposed to be 70 million GenYers. That means 35 million males. How many are actually active? I think 90% are inactive. Let's see the range would be:
    1. Total couch potato: Addicted to Nintendo.
    2. Seldom active: Walked to beer store once.
    3. Somewhat active: Low range used once.
    4. Total nature freak: This guy has no time to even shower. PU

    I think most inactive males want pointy little cars with big rims and tailpipe.
  • diploiddiploid Member Posts: 2,286
    I think it's less than 35 million male Gen-Yers. Females account for close to 51% of the population, I believe.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    It's a contender, and looks like it's in the top 5 for the Most Significant Vehicle of the Year award.


    The Best Cars of 2003!



    Steve

    Host

    SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards

  • bigdaddycoatsbigdaddycoats Member Posts: 1,058
    Pretty good review in new issue of Car and Driver.
  • shado4shado4 Member Posts: 287
    In the November issue, page 89, when describing the Honda Element:

    "An easy-care interior allows for Internet access, MP3 capability, and satellite radio in addition to its basic AM/FM/CD/cassette audio package and optional DVD-based navigation system."

    Navigation system? On the Element? Can anyone confirm this? I know Honda makes their nav system available on the Odyssey, Pilot, and new Accord...but this is the first I've heard of it being offered on the Element.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Bummer, C&D still lists an estimated 0-60 time. We'll never settle our gentleman's bet! I still say well under 10 sec.

    Get a Garmin GPS, they are portable and cost half as much. That means if you have 2 cars, you save 75% of the cost! I have 3 so that would save me, uh, someone got a calculator? ;-)

    -juice
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    100%? ;-)
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    4WD Elements won't be available at the start. They won't be arriving until sometime this spring. Seems odd that they introduce this vehicle in the dead of winter, in just FWD models...

    Bob
  • aquaswimmeraquaswimmer Member Posts: 30
    I believe you will be able to get the auto AWD model right from the start. It is the stick AWD that will have to wait till May 3rd.
  • ropedartropedart Member Posts: 163
    Trying to determine how people generally feel about the Element up to this point. I scanned some polls over the net. This is what I interpreted in percentages. U may get something different. Undecided not listed. (-) means really hate it.
    cars.com audience
    +57 -18

    honda.ca
    +65 -17

    C&D
    -18.7 thinks it will bust

    compare this to
    Aztec on cars.com
    +24 -70

    CRV on cars.com
    +68 -25

    This is the way I see it. 1 out 5 people U meet will hate the Element. 3 out of 5 people thinks its OK. 1 out of 5 don't care. Of course this is not very scientific, just some fun. Some forums belch some real awful venom about this car. I mean some people really hate this thing. I think it is normal that about 5 to 10 percent of the population will hate any car at any given time.

    Also it will outsell the Aztek :)
  • nitschkenitschke Member Posts: 2
    Where's the spare and is it full size?

    Why isn't the mileage better in the two wheel drive version with the standard transmission?
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