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Comments
There is one issue I could not understand. On two separate occasions when I did not use the car for 3 or more days, Keyless failed to open or start the car. I had to use the key. Once inside, Keyless did not start the car. After the fisrt "key" start however, all was back to normal!
Has anyone else had similar experiences?
When mine did not start, it was because I forgot to put my foot on the brakd.
I will have a chance to "test" this again near thanksgiving as I will fly out of town for a few days.
Does the vehicle require frequent oil changes?
Please go back and do a little research. When FSS and the prolonged service intervals were first introduced MB WAS NOT RECOMENDING SYNTHETIC OIL. They put out a service bulletin to correct this mistake.
I'm thrilled to bits with my new SL500, but dissapointed with the sound quality on the standard (UK it's not Bose) system. It sounds "tinny" without much bass even though I've cranked up the bass in the sound control area.
I'm just checking with any other owner who has the standard non-Bose system to see whether theirs sounds un-bassy?
Ta.
J
I need to take back some of my earlier complaints on the Nav system. I realized what nags me! When going South, the pointer on the Nav system is pointing down (as if behind me)! It keeps the pointer up for North, down for South, ... This just does not sit well with me. I want the arrow to always point forward in the same direction as my travel. Otherwise, the Nav worked great. It was able to easily find the Hotels I was looking for, one of which was hidden in the mountains.
One remaining complaint is the degree of attention this car gets. In Cambria, before getting in the car, I had to wait (as long as I could - I was forced to cut in) for a family of tourists taking turns, and having their picture taken with the car. Cars next to use slowing down, going forward and back to see the car from different angles! We actually became the target of what seemed to be a professional photographer on Highway 1. He twice sped past us, only to stop by the road and take photos of us on our approach! Let's just say that as regular folks, I know we can not secure a paying job as models, so it could not have been us the people in the car. This is all cute the first or second time, but gets old fast.
Did I mention how solid the car is, specially at high speeds, and on curves?
Also, hstei, I had left the car unattended for four days before our trip. The keyless worked fine on the first attempt afterwards.
M
1. Acura NSX-R
2. Porsche C4S
3. Ferrari 575M
4. MB SL55 AMG
Is the NSX the exception? Or can we expect to see supercars from Toyota & Nissan running with the ones from Germany and Italy? I bet on the latter!
Pagani Zonda S
575M
SL55 AMG
Cooper S
I don't see how EVO would put the ancient NSX as number one.
M
That's because you don't know the difference between an ancient NSX and a redesigned NSX-R. Japan's NSX-R is a much more potent machine than our NSX & considered by many to be the purest track car in production. It's considerably lighter (sub-2800 lbs, lighter than virtually all other exotics) and is heavily stripped - no power steering, AC, stereo, etc. Thanks to revised gearing, suspension enhancements, weight reduction, etc., the revised ('02/03) NSX-R is supposed to have track handling abilities on par with a Porsche GT3. The new Type R is much more aggressive on weight reduction, has a blueprinted engine, a balanced crankshaft (first for a production car, right wishinhigh?) and ridiculous amounts of downforce.
Not bad for an "ancient" car. Besides, it showed up on the COTY list because the NSX-R is new for '02 after a three year 1992-95 run.
Nice video of what the car does: http://www.nsxsc.com/r/nsxr.wmv
Anyway, back to the SL worship...
evo agreed with sphinx: NSX might be the best track machine short of the Enzo!
WOW sphinx99 I had no idea. Thanks for such enlightening info.
mariner7,
Since this NSX-R is such THE track car it should have won over those more street oriented cars, ain't no miracle happening there. That was a given. That doesn't say much for the NSX-R to win over the SL55 and 575M both being around or over 4000lbs. Was the 911 GT2 present? If not then the NSX-R had easy pickings.
M
You're welcome.
I'm not so sure. Right now the domestics seem to be hungriest to challenge the German crowd (new Viper, new Ford GT, new C6 Corvette all in the stretch of a year or two) while Japanese automakers seem to have been focused on utility and sport sedan markets. My guess is that the last thing Toyota and Nissan want to do right now is start trying to compete at this level when they're fighting tooth and nail in the sedan and truck markets. If anything inspires Toyota and Nissan to build supercars for the U.S. market, I doubt it'll be the German competition or the American competition, but rather Mazda, Subaru and Mitsubishi. These smaller Japanese companies are adding a healthy dose of sport to their lineups, all three have had a tradition of building streetable race cars, and I'm sure at least one of them is thinking about the idea of a six-figure supercar.
I don't know if it'll happen, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Mazda or Mitsubishi near-exotic concepts at auto shows two years from now. Depending on who does it and how it's received, perhaps we'll see a glut of Japan-sourced supercars five years from now. Until then, however, I think the NSX will continue to be Japan's sole exotic "supercar."
Is Mercedes thinking about building a stripper SL55 as a track-oriented car, or are they leaving everything to the SLR (or whatever it's called)?
As far as the Japanese doing anything, Toyota is the one to watch. There maybe a SC500 to truly challenge the SL500. Toyota also has a V12 or V10 supercar on the drawing board, has for some time now. I can see Nissan doing a twin-turbo 350Z eventually, and the next GTR is coming here also. Mitsubishi, I doubt it. Then there is the next NSX to ponder, as secret as it's engine and specs are.
The true "sportscar" or supercar from Mercedes will be the SLR. I doubt if they'd ever strip down a SL55, thats not their game.
Of course the Euro crowd isn't sitting still either. The new Lamborghini Gallardo will be unveiled in March at Geneva. The Ferrari 456 replacement is also due in 2003 as is a facelift for the 360 Modena. Aston-Martin has the DB5 coming. A mild facelift of the 911 is due in 2004 (997). The Carrera GT, Pagani Zonda, and a rumored BMW V12 supercar are all due in the 2003-04 time frame. The Japanese aren't going to be able to keep up with this. Only Toyota has deep enough pockets and they can't take on the whole continent.
M
"Toyota also has a V12 or V10 supercar on the drawing board, has for some time now."
They do?
I doubt if the detroit Big 3 have it either. Vette still has OHV, for Chrissake! Ford GT probably will leak from whichever holes, and they can only build 3 of them next year.
The real supercar battle will be fought over by the Germans and Japanese. I'm very interested in that super beautiful SLR. The Italian makes, including Ferrari, may be foreign owned before too long, just like the British.
For now, the Japanese do not seem at all interested in putting super engines in their sedans, undoubtedly because their premium makes are not well established like the Germans. But that will probably change in the future.
The new RS6 & E55 are more powerful than the M5 but still trail the Bimmer in handling & finesse, by all accounts. So are some German makes emphasizing hp too much, and not emphasizing enough the really hard arts of handling and balance?
M
Fhill1
M
I currently own an 2002 M5 and my nearest neighbor owns a 2001 E55 which we have traded on several occasions. Neither of these cars, with a mere 350 to 400 horsepower, are lacking for power. But, with all due respect to the E55, it's chassis and (subjective) handling feel are stretched to the limit. Some would say beyond.
merc1: Please explain what, pray tell, makes you think the E55 is a "better all around car" than the M5? I trust you have put both of these cars through the paces yourself? IMO, the E55 achieves it's improved handling through a considerably harsher ride compared to any other E or S class Mercedes. For normal driving, the E55 is not as smooth as the M5. Under more "spirited" driving, the E55 performs well, but still feels considerably heavier and less nimble than the M5 in spite of both being 4,000 lb cars. That's not just my opinion, but my neighbor's as well. The ONLY reason he bought an E55 is that his wife doesn't drive a stick. So if an automatic transmission and bigger back seat are what make the E55 a better all around car, they are the only reasons I've identified in driving both.
Across the board, AMG had already raised raised the bar on horsepower and torque. And, as far as automatics go, the AMG units are the best in the world. But the idea of further increasing horsepower seems to be almost an affront. It suggests that those that can afford an AMG are basically of the same IQ level as the motorheads that drag raced GM and Ford muscle cars in 1/4 mile sprints in the 60's. Which, by the way, would still beat the newest E55, if 1/4 mile bragging rights are really that important.
I certainly wouldn't buy a 15,000 square foot MacMansion because it is "bigger" than my neighbors. Give me a 4,000 square foot Frank Lloyd Wright arts and crafts home that uses real stone and real wood. I hope some of the AMG engineers are old enough to remember the 300SEL 6.3 and hold themselves to a higher standard than simply jamming the most horsepower and torque humanly possible in a 4,000 lb sedan (or worse yet, a 4,300+ lb 2-seater).
Maybe if I lived at the Bonneville salt flats I would feel differently. But I actually drive my M5 the equivalent of 20,000 miles a year and some of those roads have curves.
Happy New Year to all.
I find the E55 far more user friendly in the real world, as some of you have pointed out, my biggest complaint about the M5 or the 5 series is the lack of rear seat leg room. For me, it is an important issue as the reason why I needed a performance sedan was the 4-passenger space.
Sure, the E55 has a bigger trunk too, it can fit two of my large Hartmann suitcases while the M5 cannot. I also feel more confident taking long road trips in the E55 as it has the spare tire and the M5 doesn't.
I personally find the E55 more nimble with its lighter weight, I enjoy the M5's more precise steering but find the E55 much faster than the M5 for daily stop and go driving between office and home, phone calls, radio, etc. Yes the autobox has something to do with it too, just so user friendly, point and shoot with the massive torque.
For spirited driving up the mountains, one may find it hard to believe but I find the SL500 more enjoyable than the M5 or the E55. It's not unlike a video game with its flat cornering it has less body roll than the M5 and the E55 if you put the ABC in the sports mode. It's the heaviest car of the 3 but somehow, the active suspension makes it kind of fun perhaps I'll grow out of the novelty testing the ABC's limit.
I hope the new E55 will handle as well as the SL500.
Just kidding, but I am surprised as to how many times I hear from some E-class owners (and Mercedes sales people) size being a deciding factor in their choice of an E. It's a bit bigger for sure, but to hear it described, you'd think they were comparing an 3-series coupe to an S-class. I suspect that for 95% of the buyers out there, the decision to go with and E over 5 or vice-versa is based upon another factor, whether they realize it or not. Namely preference for luxury vs. performance. AMG blurs those lines, but still maintains the basic Mercedes values. And in spite of the unexpected luxury upgrades the M5 offered over my previous 540i 6-speed (interior dash, door, headliner materials, standard navigation, unbelievable "M" sound system), I still wouldn't have bought if it only was offered with an automatic transmission. (The next M5, purportedly to be offered only with an SMG, will not likely be on my future shopping list.)
Back to the SL500, I must give the AMG engineers credit for maximizing the handling capabilities of a 4,300 lb 2-seater. That's not an easy task. It's hard for me to objectively compare the SL500 to an M5, since it's a different category, quite a bit slower, and I really do prefer a manual transmission for a (almost) sports car. But for those who have traded up from the previous SL, I have heard nothing but high praise. It certainly looks beautiful and I congratulate anyone who is fortunate enough to own one.
P.S. My 2002 M5 (and previous 540i) came with a full size spare standard. Fortunately, they've never been needed.
http://www.bmwm5.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=25548&highlight=spare+tire
Regarding the SL500's handling, I'm curious whether it's the center of gravity, the active suspension setup or whatever that resulted in a car that handles in my opinion, better than the W210 E55, considering that the car is almost 500 lbs heavier!
I think most M5 buyers pick it over the W210 E55 for the manual transmission, I would have picked it for the superior steering response and higher interior finishing.
Going purely by the few reviews of the new E55 I would find it to be a better all arounder than the M5. It's bigger, rides better and is faster for starters. The M5 only beats it in the corners. The new E55's air suspension will undoubtedly give it a better ride than the M5. Don't get me wrong about BMW and their M products, they're great, but I don't hear anything nice about them when it comes to actually "living" with them. There are too many engine issues with most M products as of late, things I don't hear about AMG products. Yes, BMW gives you the ultimate track car, but out in the real world I think AMG products are easier to live with. There is a reason they BOTH sell so well.
As far as AMG increasing HP, they have too don't you think. They aren't going to be competitive with M products and their manual transmissions unless they offer greater hp/torque to overcome having a automatic.
We've had this conversation before about AMG and M cars and I fully understand where you're coming from, but Mercedes just has their philosphy about cars, as does BMW and those views are even more pronounced in their tuner products.
M
One problem I had recently, however, involved the battery discharging after the car sat for about six weeks during a rough winter month in New York. Is this a usual occurence?
My reason for asking is I ordered one, and yet to hear date other than 4th quarter this year.
Thank you.
Thanks
The SL55 is faster than light! It is almost too fast until you get used to all the power. The ultimate luxury is too much power. The brakes feel much better in the SL55 than the SL500. Note sure if AMG did something or if one year more manufacturing practice at Mercedes made a difference. I can honestly say that I now like the brakes and in the SL500 I hated them. The handling is other worldly- it feels like you are on a cushion of air and gravity has been eliminated. You have a sense the car can do anything. The ride quality is excellent- perfect compromise of comfort and performance. I like the seats better in the SL55. The SL55 feels like it weighs half of its 4400 pounds. It really feels completely tossable and fun to drive. I cannot tell you how much better I enjoy driving the SL55 compared to the SL500.
The negatives are minor but there are a few. The brakes squeak- I know they squeak on every Mercedes but it just seems less appropriate here. The fuel pump makes a crackling noise behind your head- the SL500 made a similar noise and this time it is less noticeable, but it is still there. My dealer pulled out the fuel tank and replaced the fuel pump in my SL500 and nothing improved. Seems that this may be a design flaw of some sort. To use the manual shifting buttons on the steering wheel, you have to push a button next to the shifter and put the transmission into manual mode. The buttons do nothing unless you make this change. This is a hassle and renders them sort of useless. The Porsche Tiptronic allows you to use the buttons whenever you want although it will return to automatic mode in 12 seconds if you don't place the shifter in manual mode. I think this is a much better system. Lastly, the fuel economy is seriously bad, but I suppose if I spend $120 large and complain about the fuel economy, there is something wrong with me, not the car.
I love it! I strongly recommend it. The only other car I considered was a Porsche 911 Turbo tiptronic and I feel that car is too strongly biased towards performance and is uncomfortable 90% of the time when you just feel like cruising. The SL55 is whatever you want it to be whenever you want it to be.
A few final thoughts- the exhaust sound is very 1960's muscle car, which I like but maybe not everyone will. I had mine de-badged which makes the car look very snarky with the four pipes sticking out the back and no label besides the discrete Mercedes symbol. Most people stare appreciatively- the look of the car is really elegant and aggressive at the same time.
M
Yes, I still have the CLK500, although it seems a lot slower to me lately. I also picked up a C32, so I own three black Mercedes.
M
You might wonder, can AMG really transform a Mercedes into something different? My answer is emphatically yes. In the case of the old model E-55 (1999-2002)I thought they seriously compromised the ride. However in the case of the C32 and the SL55, the cars are transformed into something special. The C32 for example, is as quick as an M3 but has none of the harsh ride issues. It is perfect for slicing and dicing traffic in the city.
The SL55 fixes all the flaws I suffered in my SL500. Frankly, it is possible since my SL500 was one of the very first produced for the US (I took delivery on April 10, 2002), there were a number of production teething pains. There were an abnormal amount of rattles and strange noises plus the brakes were very hard to modulate. Besides that, the SL500 felt ponderous and somewhat slow. The driving experience was nowhere near fun.
The SL55 is better built, very fast and I even like those electronic brakes better than the hydraulic ones in my C32 and CLK500. The SL55 is the best Mercedes I have owned (it is number 10) and the best vehicle I have owned (number 86).
M
I have an opportunity to buy an excellent condition 2002 C32 w/ 30k miles from a private owner in our neighborhood for $35k. The mileage is high for a 2002, but the car is used to commute between DC and Pittsburgh 2-3 times per month.
It's been 18 months since I previously test drove a C32 and then elected to keep my current sedan and get an S2000 instead. I also test drove an M3 at the time and have driven an M3 several times since.
Here are my questions: When I test drove a new C32 18 months ago I was very impressed. When I test drove my neighbor's used one, it didn't seem quite as quick as I remembered, nor did it handle quite as well as I remebered (i.e. compared to my S2000 or the M3). From your experience, how would you rate the handling of your C32 to the M3? Also, do you think that some diminishment in performance over 30k miles is normal? How "durable" are AMG cars - i.e. is it reasonable to think that if I got the C32, I could get 150k miles out of it without extraordinary maintenance and repair expenses? I am going to try to test drive a new C32 again for comparison, but I'd like your opinion.
Thanks in advance for any insights / comments.
Not sure I can help on the C32 issue since I only have 1,000 miles. There is no doubt that the car is quick and I like the handling and the ride. There is a comparison on the C32, S4 and M3 in the new Car and Driver and they placed the C32 last for exactly the reasons I would place it first- it is easier to live with and the trade off is less extreme performance (like the harsh ride they cite for both the M3 and S4). Maybe your priorities are different. For me, there is no way I can depress that heavy clutch on the M3 day in and day out.