Honda Odyssey vs Dodge/Chrysler minivans

aaron_t · August 2005

I was able to pick up my bathroom special order today at the orange box. I thought I may need to take two trips, one in my truck for the cabients and one for the more delicate countertop, but it all fit with the seats stored. I managed to fit a 76" marble countertop, 75" of base cabinets, 2 mirrors, and a wall cabinet, all boxed. I just needed to remove the child seat base.

How difficult is it to remove the two middle row seats on the Odyssey? How heavy are they?

sebring95 · August 2005

I dunno, never tried. We've got the grandkids carseats mounted so either way, it would be a big hassle to remove or stow-n-go. The Ody 2nd row seats slide forward (with carseats attached) and that's as much cargo space as I've needed. Probably gain 12" or more by sliding the seats forward.

dennisctc · August 2005

NHTSA office of defect investigations!!

As Reagan said may times on Iran contra. I don't recall, I don't recall, I don't recall!

You are right about the towing package for 3500lbs needing tranny cooler. I missed that one! DOH!!

funny, I went to:

NHTSA

I found dif results searching TBSs today (maybe more were added since you checked)

Honda TBS - 63 total

DCX TBS - 52 total

Hmmmm guess Clinton got what Reagan had!

socalawd · August 2005

I found dif results searching TBSs today (maybe more were added since you checked)

Honda TBS - 63 total

DCX TBS - 52 total

I looked again same results!! Are you comparing DCX minivan to Honda Odyssey or are you comparing all the models. So compare the vehicles Dodge caravan or Chrysler T&C then select components, then retrieve TSB, Now you have to look thru the TSB's by TSB number. They will both come up with 20 results(Chrysler T&C has 33 but didn't want to wade through all of them) When you take out the repeats 2005 Honda Odyssey-11 2005Dodge Caravan-17. I can never tell what your criteria is!!!

Hmmmm guess Clinton got what Reagan had!

Nope it just matter what the meaning of the word 'is' is!

socalawd · August 2005

Actually this would be better

All data.com

2005 Dodge Grand Caravan
link title

2005 Honda Odyssey
link title

They are a little different total TSB honda-16 Dodge-28

dennisctc · August 2005

Have to question the accuracy of this alldata.com information since on the Oddy link there's only mention of 2 of the 4 known recalls but it does call out the Dodge recall for the one seatbelt retractor?

Probably better to stick with NHTSA site.

dennisctc · August 2005

They will both come up with 20 results(Chrysler T&C has 33 but didn't want to wade through all of them) When you take out the repeats 2005 Honda Odyssey-11 2005Dodge Caravan-17. I can never tell what your criteria is!!!

I'll take your word for it, life is too short to wade thru any of these TBSs......there's repeats through out the files.

hansienna · August 2005

Makes the choice easy: Which is more important? Performance or Comfort.

dustyk · August 2005

A raw count comparison of TSBs is sophomoric and by itself not informative. Eight of the Dodge TSBs and three of the Honda TSBs are service information only and are not related to a specific problem. Others are relative to very simple and non-deleterious problems.

One could argue that the more generated bulletins equates to a more comprehensive support of field service personnel.

Dusty

socalawd · August 2005

A raw count comparison of TSBs is sophomoric and by itself not informative. Eight of the Dodge TSBs and three of the Honda TSBs are service information only and are not related to a specific problem. Others are relative to very simple and non-deleterious problems.

One could argue that the more generated bulletins equates to a more comprehensive support of field service personnel.

Alot of this stuff is gray area. I really don't care how many TSB there are dosen't matter to me. I work field service and most PSB are to help other people with a problem someone else found. Like a noise problem that makes the generator output less power.
I don't claim that the Odyssey is perfect just better suited to my needs. Here are some places where the DCX vans make sense(I'm sure I'll get flamed for my opinion but I don't care)If you can only afford a sub $23,000 van and you want to buy a new car. If you think the honda's ride is too harsh. If stow and go is a must. If the fact some people say that the Honda has problems and get scared off easily. If you like the 7/70 limited powertrain warrenty which you have to act soon in 2006 it's gone(Honda's going to a 5/60K power train with no deductable for 2006) If you want to save a few grand on the price of a van. If VSC and standard sideairbags aren't that important. Then maybe the Dodge is right for you. There are many reasons to buy a DCX van. But the best thing to do is look at both van drive them a few miles. Maybe back to back there are places where both dealerships are in the same automall. Then if you simply love one, thought about it, can aford it, and still feel that way its probably the right choice. Now if it all comes down to price take your time. Deals change daily I thought 1000.00 off was the best I could do. But soon people were calling me left and right. Buying a car isn't something to be taken lightly. I've seen so many posts of people buying something and then getting rid of it 10 months later. I don't wanna be that guy!

jnt · August 2005

My impression on Chrysler minivan vs Honda minivan:

I currently have MY05 Honda minivan: my first Japanese product since all my previous new purchases were GMs. In my job, I drove many different minivans on long distance trips.For vacation trips, we typically rented Chrysler/Dodge minvans since we always got good deal on them. Overall, my impression on Chrysler vs. Honda as followed:

1. Engine: the Honda 3.5L is way better than any US equivalent (DC included) in terms of power and refinement. Chrysler 3.3L is similar to GM 3.4L engine overall. Ford engine (3.9L) sounds like a tractor engine.

2. Transmission: Chrysler transmission is very slow to down shift. Many times, I had to remind myself to step hard on the accelerator 2-3 seconds prior to merge onto 70mph LA traffic. They have made improvement on the 05 MY, but the response is still very lazy. GM van, even with 4 gears, does the this job way better. Honda's is very similar to GM's in nature.

3. Head Light: after many years talking about improvement, Chrysler still have the worst head light intensity in all vans that I have driven. It is scary at night, driving at high way speed in a strange road. It is to me a safety issue

4. Brake: Honda wins hand down on this department. GM is the worst, Chrysler is somewhere in the middle

5. Handling: No comparison, the winner is new Honda. GM, surprisingly is very good even for a dated design. Chrysler has a tip-toe feeling. New Ford van is slightly better than GM

6. Body Integrity: Chrysler is the best. Little Squeak and rattle. New Honda seems to suffer more of this problem in the first model year. GM's old model was a joke: the van may fall a part in highway since they skimmed on chassis enforcement

7. Ride: Chrysler is best on smooth roads. But as soon as the road got bad, it gives me the uneasy feeling of losing control. Honda has firmer feel which makes it less smooth but instead well control.

8. Radio reception: Honda radio sucks since it has windshield antenna which limit its reception range and has directionality problem. On top of that, their audio tuning allows more noise to be amplified. Those whip antenna on the front fender is the best friend of your radio. They are becoming rarer everyday however

9. Fuel economy: about even between them

10. Price: Chrysler probably has better incentive and deals

11. Seat comfort: about the same for front seat passengers

12. Interior design: I am less impressed with Honda choice of hard plastic in the IP section. The upper glove box has big gap: engineering oversight for 30K vehicle. In fact, I think new GM has the best interior design this time

So after considering all options, I decided to go with the MY05 Honda. It has some initial first model year assembly problems. But overall, I liked the Honda because of its mechanical superior design. It has more latest safety and techical advantages that no current minivan (US or Import) can match.

JT

dennisctc · August 2005

A raw count comparison of TSBs is sophomoric and by itself not informative

Agree, but if you want to feel good and not talk about recalls, then TBS comparisons are great!!!!

dennisctc · August 2005

My impression on Chrysler minivan vs Honda minivan:

I currently have MY05 Honda minivan: my first Japanese product since all my previous new purchases were GMs. In my job, I drove many different minivans on long distance trips.For vacation trips, we typically rented Chrysler/Dodge minvans since we always got good deal on them. Overall, my impression on Chrysler vs. Honda as followed:

1. Engine: the Honda 3.5L is way better than any US equivalent (DC included) in terms of power and refinement. Chrysler 3.3L is similar to GM 3.4L engine overall. Ford engine (3.9L) sounds like a tractor engine.

2. Transmission: Chrysler transmission is very slow to down shift. Many times, I had to remind myself to step hard on the accelerator 2-3 seconds prior to merge onto 70mph LA traffic. They have made improvement on the 05 MY, but the response is still very lazy. GM van, even with 4 gears, does the this job way better. Honda's is very similar to GM's in nature.

3. Head Light: after many years talking about improvement, Chrysler still have the worst head light intensity in all vans that I have driven. It is scary at night, driving at high way speed in a strange road. It is to me a safety issue

4. Brake: Honda wins hand down on this department. GM is the worst, Chrysler is somewhere in the middle

5. Handling: No comparison, the winner is new Honda. GM, surprisingly is very good even for a dated design. Chrysler has a tip-toe feeling. New Ford van is slightly better than GM

6. Body Integrity: Chrysler is the best. Little Squeak and rattle. New Honda seems to suffer more of this problem in the first model year. GM's old model was a joke: the van may fall a part in highway since they skimmed on chassis enforcement

7. Ride: Chrysler is best on smooth roads. But as soon as the road got bad, it gives me the uneasy feeling of losing control. Honda has firmer feel which makes it less smooth but instead well control.

8. Radio reception: Honda radio sucks since it has windshield antenna which limit its reception range and has directionality problem. On top of that, their audio tuning allows more noise to be amplified. Those whip antenna on the front fender is the best friend of your radio. They are becoming rarer everyday however

9. Fuel economy: about even between them

10. Price: Chrysler probably has better incentive and deals

11. Seat comfort: about the same for front seat passengers

12. Interior design: I am less impressed with Honda choice of hard plastic in the IP section. The upper glove box has big gap: engineering oversight for 30K vehicle. In fact, I think new GM has the best interior design this time

So after considering all options, I decided to go with the MY05 Honda. It has some initial first model year assembly problems. But overall, I liked the Honda because of its mechanical superior design. It has more latest safety and techical advantages that no current minivan (US or Import) can match.

JT

Keyword being "Impression" here. JT is every bit as capable of doing a automotive review as any of those bozos at C&D, Motor Trend etc....!!!!!!! I know a few of these Einsteins, hung with them at Car Club events. I remember one bringing a brand new 96 Taurus to an event and raving about it and the STYLING!!!!! UGH!!!! Saw history of Mustang this weekend.....MotorTrends gave Mustang II COY award!! One thing I notice a lot of, when a car is new, cutting edge etc....it's the greatest, they're in love with it, few months later they drop like stones!!!

The guy who helped import the Catera (convert an Opel) from Germany raved about it, when he left GM....he traded his "Opel" for a Jetta!!!!

fish8 · August 2005

I'm curious on how you rate the AC in the vans you have driven. I have not experienced the new Odyssey. But, Honda's are notoriously poor in the power of their AC systems. I recently rented a Honda (not the Odyssey) and the AC was horrendous. It could NOT keep up with the 90+ temps outside.

The AC in our T&C works great, which has been our experience with most Domestics/Semi Domestics (GM, Chrysler and Ford). We had a '98 Honda Accord and the AC was the achilles heal of that car!!!

I am just curious about your experiences.

aaron_t · August 2005

With LATCH it takes 3 seconds to remove my car seat base, and another 10 to reinstall. I just got a convertible car seat which takes a little longer, but still under 30 seconds either way.

aaron_t · August 2005

What trim level is your Oddy?

sebring95 · August 2005

With LATCH it takes 3 seconds to remove my car seat base, and another 10 to reinstall. I just got a convertible car seat which takes a little longer, but still under 30 seconds either way.

If it takes under 10 seconds for you to install a carseat, you're not doing it properly. Maybe just one of the bases, but a properly installed convertible can be a lot of work even with Latch. I just switched the youngest out of her infant seat into a rear-facing Britax. Run the rear tether under the seat, install the extendable rear-facing support, plus deal with the carseat pads. Repeat for the other carseat, it's forward facing but still takes a bit to get all the attachments. It may only be a couple minute ordeal, but in 95ºF and 90% humidity it's a chore. Then you've gotta find somewhere to stick the seats. I'm sure stow-n-go is great for some folks, but I didn't even give it a second glance myself. The 2nd row sliding (didn't even notice that when I was shopping) has been very useful though. I can leave the full 3-passenger 2nd row in place and others can get to the 3rd row just by sliding the 2nd row forward.

bobw3 · August 2005

What vehicle do you have that has a 2nd row 3 pass bench that you can slide forward to allow access to row 3?

sebring95 · August 2005

The '05 Ody EX-L. The 2nd row is not a bench, it's two captains seats on outboard and a middle seat that can be stowed in the lazy susan. Or you can remove the middle seat and slide the two captains seats together which sets you up like most other minivans. If you don't have carseats installed in the 2nd row, the backs will also fold forward and the seat will slide up (like a coupe) to allow even greater access to the 3rd row. With the carseats installed, you can just slide the seats forward. The middle-seat on the 2nd row also can be folded down and used as a console.

bobw3 · August 2005

But with carseats or booster seats in row two, can you access row 3 just by sliding row 2 forward? Also, can you attach a car seat to the middle seat? I just don't like the minivan setup where you have 2 captain chair in the 2nd row, because my wife sits in row 2 on road trips to be close to our baby, so with the 2nd row bench they can both sit back there (with the front pass seat folded) and there's still space for some stuff in the 2nd row bench.

sebring95 · August 2005

But with carseats or booster seats in row two, can you access row 3 just by sliding row 2 forward?

Yes, not something a large person could do, but kids/teens can quite easily. If you just had a booster seat in one of the 2nd row captains chairs, an adult could easily access the 3rd row because the captains chairs fold forward and slide individually allowing plenty of room to get to the 3rd row.

There is no latch anchors on the middle 2nd row seat. You could install a carseat, but I wouldn't recommend it. It's not a full-size captain seat, more of a modular seat that can be folded up, popped out, etc.

We have two child seats installed in both outboard 2nd row seats. One is rear-facing, the other is forward facing. My wife routinely switches from the front to the 2nd row and sits in the middle seat to care for our 6mo grandchild. Or she gets in before we leave, there's enough room to easily access the 2nd row middle seat even with a forward facing carseat installed.

The Ody setup was perfect for this which was one of the big reasons we liked it. We had a Tahoe before and while there was a bit more room in the 2nd row middle, it was nearly impossible to get to it with carseats installed on the outside seats.

aaron_t · August 2005

If it takes under 10 seconds for you to install a carseat, you're not doing it properly. Maybe just one of the bases, but a properly installed convertible can be a lot of work even with Latch. I just switched the youngest out of her infant seat into a rear-facing Britax. Run the rear tether under the seat, install the extendable rear-facing support, plus deal with the carseat pads.

It is very easy and quick to attach a car seat base for infant carrier. Two clips on the anchors, knee on the base and pull the belt. Detaching takes a couple extra seconds. There is no tether for the back of the base.

I have yet to use our Britax Marathon, but test fit it in our vehicles in rear facing position. I did not connect the rear tether, but the front LATCH connectors only take a couple seconds each to attach and tighten. The extra time over a car seat base is to walk around the vehicle to reach the inside belt. Admittedly, it took longer than a minute the first time, but after a little practice, the convertible seat was a snap to secure. I'm not sure what pads you speak of.

I only have one child so far, 3 months old. I probably won't have this minivan for the next child because we are leasing. Two rear-facing seats in the middle row on a DCX w/ StoNGo would not allow passage to the rear seats. I have not tried to mount the convertible seat forward facing yet, so I cannot comment on how to get to the rear. I don't believe one can get to the back seat without either folding/flipping a 2nd row seat or walking between the 2nd row seats. I keep the second row seats all the way back. Keep in mind that I need the front seats to be able to go all the way back as I am tall w/ long legs. That limits how much comfortable movement the second row can have. With my wife driving (9" shorter than me), I understand there could be more opportunity to move the 2nd row seats. I will try moving the 2nd row seat forward to see if there is enough clearance to get to the 3rd row w/o folding/flipping. My guess is there is not enough clearance between the back of the door opening and the back of the second row seat, but I can check tonight.

If I had another child with this van, I'd put the older child in the 3rd row. That leases either the other 2nd row seat or 3rd row for an adult to tend to the children with the other 2nd row seat stored. Personally, I find the PlusOne seat uncomfortable and could not imagine sitting between two large (Britax) child seats.

sebring95 · August 2005

We put pads like this in under the seats:

Keeps the seats from deforming and helps keep kid slop to a minimum. They also help with a more secure fit IMHO. I usually put all my weight into the seats when tightening, they basically don't move once I'm done which is why I'm not fond of removing/installing on a regular basis. If I need other passenger space, I'll drive something else but that's a luxury other folks probably don't have. The rear tethers are a bit of a headache, but much easier on the ody. With our Tahoe, the rear tether mounts were about impossible to reach without acrobatic moves.

I'm tall as well and have my front seat all the way back and there's still plenty of room to go between 1st/2nd rows to get to the middle 2nd row seat. I can still slide the 2nd row seat all the way forward without touching the drivers seat. The only problem we've had is with the rear-facing seat. It's a rather compact design when forward facing, and I had bought it to haul my older grand-daughter in my ext. cab truck. We moved it to the Ody for the baby and it's huge when reclined back for rear-facing. My wife had to move her passenger seatback up a bit (she usually has it reclined pretty far) to fit this seat. It's a Britax Galaxy I believe. The forward facing seat is a Britax Marathon. So now the one captains chair can't slide forward because of that carseat.

bobw3 · August 2005

Thanks for the info. I saw on the Honda site what you were talking about. The Toyota Sienna looks like a better 2nd row bench to me, as it's three full seats across & the middle row can be moved up http://www.toyota.com/sienna/interior.html This part I like becaues I can have the baby car seat in the middle, another one on the left, with my wife sitting in the back behind the front pass seat. I'm not in the market right now for a minivan, but just looking at the future options.

Right now I have a Ford Freestyle, but it only has the 2 across in the 3rd row. It's fine for now, but I'm looking in the future. Last week my wife went with her friend and had 2 car seats and a booster in the 2nd row, my wife and her friend up front, and lots of stuff in the back with the 3rd row down. I know that in a minivan with the split 3rd row we could have put the stuff back there with one of the kids, but I like the extra options of three across car seats in row 2. We did it in the Freestyle which is not as wide as a full size minivan and we like that option.

The option of putting the additional seat between the 2 seats in row 1 would be nice though, so you could carry 9 if you had to. It would be nice to be able to replace the center tray with a removeable seat like in the Odyssey in row 1. Again, I like to have the option.

aaron_t · August 2005

Any more information on that pad? I don't need it for the minivan w/ cloth (besides, it's a rental, err lease), but our truck has leather I'd like to protect.

sebring95 · August 2005

Yes, the Sienna also has a similar setup, probably better since it slides. Not sure how hard it is to get out/store if you don't need it. I didn't look real close at it either because the 8-passenger Sienna is only available on the lower-end models. I'm sure you could put a booster in that 2nd row middle seat on the Ody. Not sure how well three full-size carseats would fit, but a booster would work fine.

One thing I like about the minivans is you can use the 3rd row and still have a lot of cargo space. That was the mistake when I bought the Tahoe, I should have gone for the suburban. Most SUV's don't have much space behind the 3rd row.

sebring95 · August 2005

It's a prince lionheart seat saver or something like that. We ordered from babiesrus.com When we traded our Tahoe, the seat was quite deformed and marked from having the carseat installed. And covered in all kinds of snacks! I suppose they could take issue with it on a lease return. Ever price a new seat??!!

I like how the lower portion of these covers extend down the seat. Keeps their feet off the leather.

marine2 · August 2005

Of course, people who already bought the Chrysler vans with stow n' go aren't going to complain! I've heard this from my customers on more than one ocassion and I agree, having tried them myself.

I don't think they are **horrible** but they don't begin to compare with the super comfortable Odyssey seats!

We don't complain about the seats because we tried them out before buying them and found them to be alright. Plus we are sitting in the front seats 100% of the time. But I have had adults sit on them and they never complained they were uncomfortable and I have asked. The only ones that say they are uncomfortable are Honda owners that have never ridden in them. Now I will grant you they are not as comfortable as the Honda seats, but being able to fold into the floor makes that expected. They are not as thickly padded because of that feature. That would be like me saying the Honda seats aren't any good because they don't fold into the floor. Well they do fold down, it's just that they don't fold flat and have that bar across the back. You can lay some stuff on them but not as much or as heavy a stuff as you can put in the Dodge. All depends on what your going to use your van for.

Another great feature of stow-n-go seats that no one else has, is it you only carry six people or less, you can fold just one middle seat and have greater excess to the third row than with any other van. Or it gives you room to put in a stroller already set up.

marine2 · August 2005

I dunno, never tried. We've got the grandkids carseats mounted so either way, it would be a big hassle to remove or stow-n-go. The Ody 2nd row seats slide forward (with carseats attached) and that's as much cargo space as I've needed. Probably gain 12" or more by sliding the seats forward.

There is no hassle stowing the Dodge seats at all. I can do it in less than a minute. Those seats also move forwards and back.

sebring95 · August 2005

There is no hassle stowing the Dodge seats at all. I can do it in less than a minute. Those seats also move forwards and back.

So now the Dodge seats can be stowed with a child seat installed? AMAZING STUFF!

marine2 · August 2005

Sorry, I guess I didn't really understand what you said. It would be a hassle to take the car seats off and stow them, although you could put car seats on the third row. and stow one. Grandma would have plenty of room to get up out of front seat and walk back to third seats with one stowed.

socalawd · August 2005

Works great for me. Went to sedona thru phoenix in june. Temp outside 110. Temp inside 72. Two weekends ago went to Palm Springs 110 outside inside great. My 2001 Caravan only had the front A/C but that was good enough to always make it cool enough blew really cold. My Subaru is only now acceptable since I installed tinting. The Dodge did have hidden warrenty on the A/C evaporator core. I replaced one(Well no me my local mechanic big $$'s) of these on my Intrepid. Then it went out again at 100K.

marine2 · August 2005

Works great for me. Went to sedona thru phoenix in june. Temp outside 110. Temp inside 72. Two weekends ago went to Palm Springs 110 outside inside great. My 2001 Caravan only had the front A/C but that was good enough to always make it cool enough blew really cold. My Subaru is only now acceptable since I installed tinting. The Dodge did have hidden warrenty on the A/C evaporator core. I replaced one(Well no me my local mechanic big $$'s) of these on my Intrepid. Then it went out again at 100K.

I live in Phoenix so I know what that 100 degree plus, is like all summer. My 2005 DGC easily keeps it cool inside. Couldn't say as much for my 2001 Dodge Dakota I use to have. It had no recirculating switch on it and it never got cool enough.

aaron_t · August 2005

I checked it out last night. One cannot fit (even a child) between the back of the 2nd row seat and the side door opening to get to the rear seat with the second row seats in place on the DCX vans. With one seat all the way back, though, there is plenty of room to get around the seat through the middle, especially with the middle seat all the way back.

marine2 · August 2005

I checked it out last night. One cannot fit (even a child) between the back of the 2nd row seat and the side door opening to get to the rear seat with the second row seats in place on the DCX vans. With one seat all the way back, though, there is plenty of room to get around the seat through the middle, especially with the middle seat all the way back.

Try stowing one of those middle row seats and see how easy it is to get in and out of that third seat. I have three grandkids I pick up after school and two set in the third seats and one likes to set in the second seat. They can run in and out of that third row with one seat stowed. Unless your the one that has the babies in the car seats. You still have room for seating six and plenty of room moving around inside. I keep one seat stowed all the time. A lot of stuff I carry, I find it's easier to put in the side door than the rear hatch.

aaron_t · August 2005

Yes, the 2nd rows seats slide front-back, but there is not enough clearance in the forward-most position to get to the back without tilting the 2nd row seat like Sebring says he does the Ody. I was just providing a comparison for him. Yes, one can tilt the seat forward without the backrest folded, but I don't know about with a forward facing carseat in place. I just haven't tried that. I don't know if there would be enough clearance.

My solution as I've posted would be to always have an adult in the back with the kid(s), so keep one 2nd row seat open for the adult or stowed for easy access for the 3rd row. There is zero need for an adult in the front passenger seat when there is an open seat in the rear with kids. More time entertaining the kids (or is it they who entertain us?).

Regardless, I only have one child who rides in an infant carrier so far. She is long (25" at 3mo) and has almost outgrown the carrier. We'll be switching that out for the Marathon in another month, I think.

I find the back storage more useful than the side w/ one 2nd row seat down. I switch back and forth between 3rd row down and up, to utilize the bins or to carry a large stroller and other baby gear. I'm tall, so the rear loading height is no problem for me.

marine2 · August 2005

The great part about it, is the versitility you have to do it anyway you want and the storage space it gives you no matter how you do it.

bobw3 · August 2005

I guess with the Sienna or Odyssey you can slide the two 2nd row captain chairs together on either side to access the third row easily, similar to permanently stowing one of the 2nd row stowNgo seats, so you don't need to go between them. So in a way with the Odyssey you can slide the two 2nd row seats together and push them to one side and you can put car seats in each of them because you won't have to move them anyway to access row three. That seems like the best combination for me.

hansienna · August 2005

Buy a Grand Caravan SE with 2 built in child seats in the 2nd row. No more hassle with child seats.

You would still have ALL the extra space under the floor between the 2nd row and front seats which is MUCH more than the miniscule space of the donut gimmick in the Odyssey. :P

bobw3 · September 2005

I like the idea of the stowNgo space, but can you slide both seats in the second row all the way to the right or left to make a two person bench and make it really easy to get into row 3?

aaron_t · September 2005

No, cannot slide any seats sideways in the DCX vans. The DGC SE has the middle row bench seat, still has the storage bins in the center and the same rear folding seat as the SXT StoNGo. You just cannot fold down the second row bench seat, and equipment/options are limited.

hansienna · September 2005

As stated, NO seats in the 2nd row of any DC minivan will slide side to side. My son has NEVER changed the 2nd row configuration of his 2001 Ody EX from being 2 separate bucket seats to being one bench seat. Most people prefer having separate bucket seats in the 2nd row to keep children apart so they do not fight with each other.

However, for people with 2 small children, the 2nd row bench seat of the 2005 GC SE with 2 built in child seats is JUST RIGHT and also provides the 2 large storage compartments under the floor where the 2nd row "Stow-N-Go" seats of other 2005 DC minivan seats would go when folded.

socalawd · September 2005

As stated, NO seats in the 2nd row of any DC minivan will slide side to side. My son has NEVER changed the 2nd row configuration of his 2001 Ody EX from being 2 separate bucket seats to being one bench seat. Most people prefer having separate bucket seats in the 2nd row to keep children apart so they do not fight with each other

They're so easy to move I do both. Apart for long trips(anti touching mode)together during the week when my wife drops off my boy. :P

However, for people with 2 small children, the 2nd row bench seat of the 2005 GC SE with 2 built in child seats is JUST RIGHT and also provides the 2 large storage compartments under the floor where the 2nd row "Stow-N-Go" seats of other 2005 DC minivan seats would go when folded.

While nice the built ins have considerable short comings. First they are only for 22lbs to 50lbs. So for the first 2 years it's a no go. Then after 50 lbs or 47inches you have to get them out. For seat belts to work properly the children have to be tall enough approx 57 inches. This is the time when the seat belt doesn't go across the neck and their legs are long enough to bend at the seat edge. This keeps them from slouching and the belt being across the belly. This area is very weak in most toddlers/small children. So you still end up buying 3 seats baby/convertable/booster just that you only use the convertable in the rear facing mode. That said, it's almost impossible to engineer a seat good from 0-8 years old. I wouldn't waste my money!!!

marine2 · September 2005

With their new hi tech engine that will cut out three cylinders and their new five speed transmission, it seems like C.R. says it only got 12 MPG in their test and not the EPA number of 20, stated on the window. I can imagine the Dodge can do as good or better than that with their old six banger and four speed. My wife's 2004 Honda Civic does better than Honda Civic's Hybrid.

hansienna · September 2005

Just read of the difficulty Edmunds had when their 2005 Odyssey Touring had a tire with a nail in it.

DC is not using their buyers to test a new, questionable tire. The tire testing should be completed before putting them on new vehicles and equipment to repair the new tires should be readily available. :shades:

socalawd · September 2005

With their new hi tech engine that will cut out three cylinders and their new five speed transmission, it seems like C.R. says it only got 12 MPG in their test and not the EPA number of 20, stated on the window. I can imagine the Dodge can do as good or better than that with their old six banger and four speed. My wife's 2004 Honda Civic does better than Honda Civic's Hybrid.

So your saying the SXT hit the EPA numbers. Please also put the Odyssey hit the 28 MPG on the highway. Let's be fair once in a whil. BTW if CR is the king what was the overall MPG SXT VS Ody??

marine2 · September 2005

So your saying the SXT hit the EPA numbers. Please also put the Odyssey hit the 28 MPG on the highway. Let's be fair once in a whil. BTW if CR is the king what was the overall MPG SXT VS Ody??

CR does not show the Dodge, only the Odyssey. It also does not show highway miles. Only city driving. It's on page 20 of the Oct. 05 issue

dustyk · September 2005

I seem to have the grave misfortune, according to Honda lovers, of riding in a Caravan or T&C occasionally and I've never felt the seats were uncomfortable in any way, including those rearward of the driver. Now I have never been in an '05 Ody, but I rode with my neighbor yesterday in his '04 Ody and the phrase "super comfortable" most certainly is exaggerated. In fact, I'm not sure they are even as comfortable as a Chrysler mini-van.

But then again this is one of those areas that is highly subjective. Body porportions, size, and weight of an individual make all the difference in how one judges seat comfort. And if your an overzealous salesperson, then whatever your selling will be the "best."

Dusty

jipster · September 2005

That would be correct. Though Consumer Reports indicated in that article that all results from their gas mileage(actual vs EPA) study will be available on their web site for free Sept. 7-Nov. 2. The tests from 303 vehicles will be avaiable. So, we will be able to see how the rest of the competition stacked up against Ody's weak 12mpg city. CR says to expect a 30% decrease in actual city mpg as opposed to EPA's number for minivans.Ody's was a 40% drop from EPA's listed 20mpg.

marine2 · September 2005

CR says to expect a 30% decrease in actual city mpg as opposed to EPA's number for minivans.Ody's was a 40% drop from EPA's listed 20mpg.

What is so amazing about it, is it get's that bad with all that hi tech on it.

Honda Odyssey vs Dodge/Chrysler minivans

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