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Comments
I grew up driving a RWD Olds station wagon from the 70's in the snow belt of northern WI. Never got stuck in the snow with that old battleship. So having the tail wag a little doesn't bother me much.
Yes, I absolutely agree. It is easy to get the car to tail wag, but you have to want to make it happen. I found it to be far easier on my MT Outback with the 50/50 split than the AT, at least at speeds greater than a slow 90-degree turn, but either transmission type will allow it. The manual, with the rear LSD, was sure a lot of fun.
Anyway, the point is that there is not an instability issue created that would come into play during an emergency maneuver. These cars are highly controllable in emergencies: VDC or none.
They keep complaining about this issue with Legacy and Outback, though they do say the new VDC helps (but also that it's slow to respond).
People have different expectations of cars. I drive a GM or Toyota and it feels numb and unrewarding yet these manufacturers sell millions of cars to people who actually prefer that. My brother drove my '08 Outback while we were on a whirlwind trip to Lake Tahoe and back two months ago, and his first statement was that the steering felt stiff and the ride was a little rough. 30 minutes worth of driving later, and he did not want to give up the driver seat! After driving his own car again when we returned to his home, he said his car made him feel "isolated." He has a 2001 Hyundai XG300. I just smiled; his car sure is comfy, though.
I am sure the VDC is slow to respond in a similar fashion as reactive AWD is slow to respond. It is a reactive system. Something has to happen before it can correct it.
No sure of the actual increase but it will be on the tribeca platform/footprint, so I would think it'll be bigger than 190 in, I certainly hope so.
The current 08+ Impreza is just about the same size as the current legacies/outbacks so it would be kinda dumb for them to keep it the same size.
-mike
Makes sense.
I hope the Impreza gets some tweeks in the second half of '08. If the WRX gets a 5 spd auto and a power seat option (ala the Forester premium pack), that would be enough for me.
So Subaru leans towards what C&D would prefer, as opposed to CR. It's more enthusiast friendly.
I wouldn't call it right or wrong, just a preference.
Subaru does specifically state that they let the AWD systems act first, before stability control intervenes.
C&D had a comparo of four AWD vehicles, one being the Outback VDC, the first year it came out. Back then it didn't have an "off" switch, and it was tuned to intervene more aggressively.
So in C&D's test, they hit the off switch on the other 3 cars and ran all the cars around a snow course.
Get this - they crashed ALL 3 OTHER CARS, and not the Subaru. The VDC Outback was the only one of the four with no body damage. And with stability control active. Coincidence? Doubtful.
Any how, they proceeded to put the Outback in dead last place, and still complained about the intrusiveness of the stability control. :mad:
It's a true story. Go to a library and search back issues if you want to read about it.
CR wants the safest possible tuning, even if it's boring. C&D wants to have fun drifting with no intervention from the electronic nannies, even if they wreck every single car in the fleet in the process.
How fun would it be do drive and trash vehicles that you are not responsible for?
Thanks so much. Best - MM
-mike
$350 was right in line with the estimate that the Edmunds Maintenance Guide kicked out for my zip code.
any ideas?
thanks
Did they check the alternator if it is giving 13 volt or better charge to the battery?
-Dave
Last Sunday my daughter came home w/ car, I plugged the fuse in, and now the noise is gone. I checked on alldata website, and thought it mite be the keyless buzzer since there is a tech bulletin out on that for years 03MY & 04MY (MY must be mfg site), but that buzzer is located behind the grille, driver's side. This was a similar noise, but wrong locale. If it comes back, I will inform this group, especially if I find a answer. Thanks, jeffmc!!
I'm using a Haynes manual to R&R the engine. Decent information, but it's the first time I've been past the timing cover on a Subaru, and it's all pretty new to me. The last engine I swapped was a 400M in a 4X4 Ford pickup.
What are your recommendations for essentials to replace when I put in the new (to me) engine? Any way to verify actual mileage on the replacement engine? Any gremlins or hiccups I need to watch out for?
Thanks for any help you can provide,
TB
You got to turn the key to accessories position to turn power on.
-Dave
The Haynes manual is useless as it tells nothing about automatic locks & windows...
Here's a funky diagram that may help.
Heading down an 8% mountain grade for several miles, I shift down to 4th to take advantage of engine braking and the temp gauge steadily drops all the way down to C. At the bottom of the grade, I shift back to 5th and the gauge rises back to its normal position. This happens every time I downshift to go down a mountain grade. Outside temp is in the low 60s. Car runs excellent otherwise, including going up mountain grades.
This may or may not be related: A month ago at the start of a 3,200 road trip, the car started heating up going up a mountain grade. The Subaru dealer diagnosed the problem as a bad radiator cap and replaced it. I also had the dealer replace the drive belts. No problems over the next 4,000 miles – including mountain driving – until the problem above crops up this weekend.
Any ideas, Subaru gurus?
Tim
Is this normal or should something be done to reset that. (How?)
So I am wondering if that is the case for 2008 Legacy? and if yes how to get out of Valet mode?
I am suprized if it is normal for this light to blink all the time - but i guess anything is possible...
The security indicator light deters potential
thieves by indicating that the vehicle is
equipped with an immobilizer system. It
begins flashing approximately 60 seconds
after the ignition switch is turned from the
“ON” position to the “ACC” or “LOCK”
position or immediately after the key is
pulled out.
If the security indicator light does not flash,
the immobilizer system may be faulty. If
this occurs, contact your SUBARU dealer
as soon as possible.
In case an unauthorized key is used (e.g.
an imitation key), the security indicator
light comes on.
NOTE
Even if the security indicator light
flashes irregularly or its fuse blows
(the light does not flash if its fuse is
blown), the immobilizer system will
function normally.
I am a little stuck on what to do. I have a 2007 Subaru Legacy, last January my car stalled out. I couldn't get my brakes to work, I could not stop, until I hit my dads truck
First thing to do is contact Subaru Customer Service:
1-800-SUBARU3 (1-800-782-2783)
Hours of Operation:
8:30 a.m. - 7:00 p.m. (EST) Monday through Thursday
10:30 a.m. - 5:00 p.m. (EST) Friday
They can start a case number for you, recommend how to proceed, and at least it's all documented with Subaru of America, not just the dealer. If some major warranty issue or vehicle replacement is considered, the decision will likely come from these guys anyway. They can also apply pressure to the dealer, if necessary to resolve problems.
It sounds like two separate issues to me, though, and the stalling problem has not happened since the sensor replacement, right?
Anyone else here comment on the AWD issue pulling out of a slick uphill driveway? Can you tell us which Legacy model you have, and if it's manual or automatic transmission?
-mike
Motorsports and Modifications Host
My experience with SOA customer service has always been nothing but great, unlike several other manufacturers I have had to deal with.
Patti used to work there and I swear her effects are still felt.
Michael
I have an engine from a salvage yard, and have doubts about their claimed mileage on it. How many places are the serial numbers stamped?
Thanks.
TB
"I'll start off this post by saying that the dealer's service department that I have been using acknowledges that they have never seen a series of Check Engine Light (CEL) problems like the ones they have seen with my vehicle. I'm hoping that that is not simply a diplomatic way of saying I have a lemon (perhaps the only one on the roadways of Colorado).
Let me give a little history of these problems so that I can get your collective thoughts on whether they are all related and symptomatic of a larger or missed problem or simply unfortunate isolated incidents.
My 2002 Outback Wagon is the base model with a standard 4 cyl. engine, automatic transmission. It currently has approx. 93k miles on it.
Back in late 2005, when I had approx. 51k miles on the vehicle, I started getting constant Check Engine lights. The dealer pulled a Code P0420 and started off by replacing a Fuel (or Oxygen) Sensor. (The dealer indicated that these were the same things.) When the CELs persisted approx. 2500 miles later, and the same code reappeared, the dealer replaced the catalytic converter. I went 15k more miles and the problem resurfaced - same code. The dealer cleared the computer and told me to drive on it some more. At 73787 miles, when the CEL and same P0420 code came back, the dealer replaced the same fuel/Oxygen sensor. Then, at 76874 (now February 2007) -- same code came back and the dealer put in a new catalytic converter.
Up to this point, I simply got constant CELs and it did not really affect driving performance in any perceptible way. That changed this past fall, when I noticed that the vehicle would sputter and I would get intermittent engine vibrations, usually at idle or low RPM. Occasionally, the vibrations and sputtering would get more intense and sometimes at higher RPM (e.g. 2k). I also noticed that I would typically see the problems when the weather turned colder and in stop-and-go traffic or at higher altitudes (in the mountains at 9000 feet and above). The CEL would blink for 20-30 seconds and then turn constant.
When I brought the car to the dealer in November with approx. 89k miles, at first they could not pull a code, and simply cleared the computer. The problem reappeared and technicians were able to pull a code: P0302 (cyl. 2 misfire). I was up for my 90K service, so that was done, replacing the spark plugs, and I also had them do a fuel injector flush at their recommendation.
My problems came back in about 2 weeks and less than 2000 miles. This time the technicians pulled a P0420 code. They cleared the computer, told me to drive it some more, but warned that if the code came back I would be due for my fourth catalytic converter.
The same symptoms persisted but when I brought the vehicle back to the dealer in late January, with approx. 93k, the techs pulled a P0302 code (the cyl 2 misfire) again. At their recommendation, I had the ignition coil assembly and ignition wires replaced. Although it was not documented, the technician also told me he did a comprehension test, which came back with normal results. They told me to use better gasoline and drive on it.
The same problems -- engine sputtering/engine vibs, blinking CELs, etc. - came back within a week and less than 200 miles (using the better grade gasoline). The tech who worked on my car confessed that he was not sure whether the new coils and wires would solve the problem but all that the dealer can offer at this point is the recommendation that I continue to drive on it and keep putting in better grades of gasoline. Otherwise, they are out of ideas. (The service manager confessed that he did not think gasoline quality was really the issue.)
So the short questions I have following this long post are these: Are the problems interrelated? Has something been overlooked? (A friend mentioned that loose connections with the air filter may be a culprit.) Any thoughts on what steps to take next?
I would be grateful for any suggestions or advice.
Thanks. "
I don't suppose you are fortunate enough have a 100k-mile extended warranty? :sick:
First, I am always befuddled by dealers' insistence that the catalytic converter needs replacing when a P0420 code pops. P0420 is "Catalytic Converter Below Threshold." Basically what this means is that the measured differential between the oxygen content in the exhaust upstream and downstream of the cat is not great enough. This could be caused by several things, not simply a result of the converter not doing its job.
The fact that this code continues to recur quickly even after oxygen sensors and the converter itself are replaced leads me to believe that the primary problem is due to something upstream of the catalytic system; maybe even a slight coolant leak into the combustion chamber(s).
Tell us, who has thus far paid for all these parts randomly thrown at the problem?
I am tempted to say that the rough engine operation may be a separate issue. In the absence of spark or fuel as the cause, I am leaning toward a knock sensor or mass airflow sensor as the primary culprit.
As for the financial burden of all of this, I wish in retrospective that I did have an extended warranty. However, over the course of time and with some haggling along the way, the way this breaks down is that I paid for one catalytic converter and sensor and the dealer or Subaru covered the other catalytic converter and sensor. I took the hit on the fuel injector flush; they took the hit on the ignition coils and wire -- and the comprehension test -- if that was in fact done.
Thanks again for your views on this.
See if you can talk the dealer into a loaner ECU to see if the problem reside with your ECU. Make sure it's for the AT and not manual. An ECU for manual in an AT car.... a kid with skateboard will beat you off the line and pull ahead with 2 cars length :sick:
If a loaner ECU is not available, then make arrangement with the Dealer to take your vehicle in at moments notice. You need to drive the vehicle and take it straight to the dealer the second the symptom(s) occur, not tomorrow or when you get off work; straigth away. When you get to the dealer, leave the engine running. Do not turn it off. They should have an AccessPort like tool to register the engine's performance where it will help them determine a more precise area to look at and/or proof that the ECU is the culprit.
I'm guessing they'll find that the engine is running lean.
-Dave