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Honda Extended Warranties Pricing and Info

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Comments

  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    It seems the conversation is becoming somewhat personal. Let's try to stick closer to the topic and keep the discussion a bit more friendly. You can always scroll past messages you don't care to read.

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • wisemoneywisemoney Member Posts: 42
    Since people in this post seem to think I don't have experience to back my statements up. Let me just say this about my previous car.

    I owned a 1996 Toyota Corolla and up until about 120,000 miles, there were NO MAJOR BREAKDOWNS. I took excellent care of the car following the maintenance schedule, and only minor things wore down like the tires, light bulbs, and brake pads. I spent less than $400 on repairs outside of the normal oil changes, tire changes, etc. between 0 and 120,000 miles. YES, I stated that correctly. It's only after 120,000 miles that I experience my first minor BREAKDOWN costing $250 to repair, and it involved a leaking brake fluid which caused a malfunction in brake operation.
  • duke23duke23 Member Posts: 488
    Tidester, I respect you and all your posts and I am friendly. This is internet, hard to take too seriously. wise, I believe you. He who will not be named. Whatever. Darn if that wasn't the gen x, y teenager's best comeback.All insurance companies need to earn a profit, all businesses do. In every bell curve, taught more in the bs, ms degrees than the ba, ma. there is a normal distribution.If you are in the hump of the curve, good for you. Inside but to the far right, I pity the fool. Basic insurance 101. I am not reposting the Honda Accord forum for late April '04 .Moving on.
  • aspesisteveaspesisteve Member Posts: 833
    :confuse:
  • mitzijmitzij Member Posts: 613
    A bell curve (also taught in Chem I in high school ;) ) doesn't work for service contracts. There's not an even number of 'winners' and 'losers' to balance out the bell when it comes to service contracts.There is no normal distribution to be found in service contract land. As I've stated before, a vast majority of purchasers of service contracts don't see a reasonable return of their money. (and I'm going by Chevy owners, Honda owners must really not need a service contract! :P ) The benefit usually does not outweigh the cost. In the case of car insurance, the possible benefit (getting a large accident paid for) is far greater than the cost (which we are required to spend anyway).
  • wisemoneywisemoney Member Posts: 42
    A bell curve (also taught in Chem I in high school ) doesn't work for service contracts. There's not an even number of 'winners' and 'losers' to balance out the bell when it comes to service contracts.There is no normal distribution to be found in service contract land. As I've stated before, a vast majority of purchasers of service contracts don't see a reasonable return of their money. (and I'm going by Chevy owners, Honda owners must really not need a service contract! ) The benefit usually does not outweigh the cost. In the case of car insurance, the possible benefit (getting a large accident paid for) is far greater than the cost (which we are required to spend anyway).

    Nicely stated. This is what I've been trying to explain to those who have Extended Warranties. It's nice to know that another person agrees with me.
  • jet10000jet10000 Member Posts: 656
    In the case of car insurance, the possible benefit (getting a large accident paid for) is far greater than the cost

    Well there is also a possible benefit of getting a large repair paid for with an extended warranty which is far greater than the cost of the warranty. This is no different.

    There's not an even number of 'winners' and 'losers' to balance out the bell when it comes to service contracts.There's not an even number of 'winners' and 'losers' to balance out the bell when it comes to service contracts.There is no normal distribution to be found in service contract land.

    In the case of collision and comprehensive insurance, there are no even numbers of winners or losers to balance out the bell curve either now is there? By your logic, the majority of car insurance buyers don't see a return on their money. If they did, the insurance companies wouldn't be in business. If you feel that way, about extended warranties, you would logically feel that way about car insurance. But since you don't, there's where your argument falls down.

    And no state law requires anyone to buy collision or comprehensive. Just as no state law requires someone to buy an extended warranty. It is something that one does to transfer a potential future risk to another party in exchange for a fee. It is up to the individual person and the marketplace to decide if that fee is worth someone else taking that potential future risk.
  • mitzijmitzij Member Posts: 613
    Insurance is for catastrophic loss, as has been stated many times here. It's a different critter. A transmission (or other major) breakdown on a car is not catastrophic. If it is to you, you've got bigger problems than what I can fix. When my trans crapped out (at 130,000 miles) it was a hardship for a bit, but I dealt with it.

    The chances of needing a service contract are slimmer than the chances of needing insurance. You put yourself at major financial risk every time you drive. One wreck can bankrupt a person. The risk of mechanical failure is easily mitigated by proper maintenance and catching small problems before they escalate.
  • jet10000jet10000 Member Posts: 656
    Insurance is for catastrophic loss, as has been stated many times here.

    Well, that may be how you view insurance, but that is not the truth. I have a $250 deductible on collision and comprehensive so if I have $500 in damage which is hardly catastrophic, my policy will pay the amount over the $250. Automobile insurance will pay for any damage large or small, not just catastrophic losses as you try to claim.

    The chances of needing a service contract are slimmer than the chances of needing insurance.

    Sure, but the price of an extended warranty is much less than an insurance policy. Less risk=less cost. You're paying more for your car insurance policy because you're getting more coverage.

    It's a different critter. A transmission (or other major) breakdown on a car is not catastrophic.

    Nor is a small dent in my bumper. But I don't want to pay every time that happens whether it happens a little or a lot or never. So I have an insurance policy.

    Same with my extended warranty, I don't want to pay every time I need a repair in the future. So if something goes wrong, they take care of it. That's the agreement.

    If you want to bear the risk yourself that is your right to do and perhaps you can save some money. It doesn't make you right or wrong.

    In this society, a person can save a lot of money doing things themselves, they can grow their own crops, make their own clothes or whatever. This transaction is no difference. I don't want to grow my own food, I pay somebody else to do it. I don't want to bear the risk of future auto repairs, I pay somebody else to do it too.
  • wisemoneywisemoney Member Posts: 42
    In the case of car insurance, the possible benefit (getting a large accident paid for) is far greater than the cost. -mtizij

    Well there is also a possible benefit of getting a large repair paid for with an extended warranty which is far greater than the cost of the warranty. This is no different. -jet10000

    As I've tried to explain to jet10000 many times, I'll try to summarize what I've stated before.

    The point that I'm trying to make can be summed up in one equation as shown below:

    (Car's Depreciated Value)/(Collision Insurance cost) > (Largest Repair Cost)/(Extended warranty cost)

    for newer vehicles.

    In other words, the largest potential loss from an accident (Car's depreciated value) divided by the collision cost is greater than the largest potential repair cost (Engine breakdown) divided by the extended warranty cost. As the car depreciates over time, I take away the collision coverage because just like extended warranties, it is no longer a good value.

    Mathematically, when

    (Car's Depreciated Value)/(Collision Insurance cost) = (Largest Repair Cost)/(Extended warranty cost)

    then, I have NO Collision coverage and NO Extended warranty.

    Also understand that when you buy a reliable car, an engine breakdown within the time, and mileage limits of an extended warranty is MORE UNLIKELY than a costly accident. My statement about Honda engines has been documented in a magazine talking about Honda VTEC engines.

    Please try to understand my explanation. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to do so.
    This explains EXACTLY why I have collision coverage on my 2008 Honda Fit, but I choose NOT to have collision coverage on my 1996 Toyota Corolla.
  • wisemoneywisemoney Member Posts: 42
    Extended Warranties are terrible products and should be banned forever and made illegal to sell. It is the dumbest move that anyone can make with their money. You're better off throwing money in the trash can.

    Sure, but the price of an extended warranty is much less than an insurance policy. - jet10000

    Let me just comment on that statement and say that both extended warranties and car insurance vary enormously in terms of price. I have collision coverage that is cheaper than the extended warranty that I was charged for. I only buy what I consider to be a great value. Extended warranties are generally not worth it, whereas insurance is well worth it. There are many many articles written about this based on real world surveys that prove that extended warranties are a loss. I'd say that the majority of smart car buyers would agree with my statements.

    Ask yourself why the majority of new car owners have collision coverage, but why the majority of new car owners don't choose to buy extended warranties. If they are the same thing as you claim, JET10000, then statistically the majority of new car owners would choose to have an extended warranty.

    Consumer Reports has proven that the majority of new car buyers choose not to buy extended warranties.
  • duke23duke23 Member Posts: 488
    I don't know if you and wise realize mitzi, but if there is no bell curve you are making an argument in favor of extended warranties. A normal distribution would have a minority receiving no benefit from the EW, ie 100% loss of premium. The majority would receive some benefit from zero up to but less than the cost of the warranty, ie a profit to HCOA. And a minority would expect great loss that far exceeds the cost of the extended warranty. +/- a couple of std. deviations of course. Your argument should be that there is a bell curve but because the expectation is that you will fall in normal distribution it's not a good deal to buy an EW. For me my argument has been after subtracting the cost of auto club and travel protection that my residual cost ( discount purchase price of course) amortized over 8 years is so low versus the cost possible of a statistical abnormality that it is a good deal. That's my story and I'm sticking to it. Not often I get a chance to quote Dan Jenkins.
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    Technically, there is no reason to believe that the distribution would be normal. A normal distribution is technically infinite in both directions (minor issue) and must also be symmetric and single peaked (major issues). The warranty company sets the premium in such a way that the business is profitable to them and customers concerned about their "return on investment" will opt out of the coverage thereby introducing possible bias. Also, "catastrophic" events are, by definition, rare so the payouts will be further biased toward the low end. These and other factors suggest that the actual distribution would be strongly skewed, i.e. nonsymmetrical, possibly even multiply peaked and therefore not normal. Of course, only actual data from the "insurers" can tell us for sure what the real distribution is.

    In the complete absence of any data, I suggest we drop the discussion of the (improperly presumed) technical characteristics of any such distribution and focus on useful, helpful, pertinent and correct information about extended warranties. The back and forth on baseless technicalities isn't getting us anywhere.

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • mitzijmitzij Member Posts: 613
    "A normal distribution would have a minority with no benefit from the EW"
    Exactly. My position is that a MAJORITY of buyers ends up with no benefit from the Service Contract. It's not a warranty.

    You can't spread the cost of an eight year service contract over eight years. Your first three years are covered by your Warranty. Unless you drive more than 12K per year, then you might be able to include some of that first three years. If you do drive many miles per year, the number of years your service contract is good for is pointless. Then you're stuck with the mileage limitation.
  • aspesisteveaspesisteve Member Posts: 833
    since I like to use Consumer Reports as a well respected independant research firm to back my opinion that an EW is a waste of money, I'd like to know if there are independant sources out there who would advise otherwise?

    anyone have a respected independant source out there that advises buying the EW? A source that doesn't take advertising dollars from any of the products and services they provide opinions on?
  • wisemoneywisemoney Member Posts: 42
    1. NOT INSURANCE, NOT A WARRANTY

    Many consumers think of extended warranties as insurance. That's not by accident. Marketing materials promise "peace of mind," or "fully insured," describe their business as "insurance-related," and point to their financial "strength and stability."

    But extended warranties are not insurance in most states. They're not even warranties as defined by federal law. These arrangements are most accurately described as prepaid repair contracts, also known as extended service contracts. Here's how they work:

    A car dealer usually sells a contract that is handled by independent auto warranty companies called administrators. The dealer just makes the sale, so the contract is between you and the administrator, which might be a carmaker's subsidiary or a separate company. The administrator pays the repair shop or reimburses you only for covered problems. Another company might insure your contract against default.

    "Auto extended warranty companies are not subject to the same close regulation and oversight as insurers," says Jane Cline, the insurance commissioner of West Virginia, who spoke with us on behalf of the National Association of Insurance Commissioners. That means that buyers of extended service contracts in states that don't consider them to be insurance don't enjoy the same regulatory safeguards that they get from, say, auto insurance, whose price must bear a reasonable relationship to cost.
  • jet10000jet10000 Member Posts: 656

    A car dealer usually sells a contract that is handled by independent auto warranty companies called administrators. The dealer just makes the sale, so the contract is between you and the administrator, which might be a carmaker's subsidiary or a separate company. The administrator pays the repair shop or reimburses you only for covered problems.

    That's the same way collision insurance works. An insurance agent sells a policy that is handled by an insurance company. The insurance agent just makes the sale so that the policy is between you and the insurance company. The insurance company pays the repair shop or reimburses you for covered issues.

    Works EXACTLY the same way as insurance does.


    That means that buyers of extended service contracts in states that don't consider them to be insurance don't enjoy the same regulatory safeguards that they get from, say, auto insurance, whose price must bear a reasonable relationship to cost.



    Well if Florida is any example of the "regulatory safeguards" that I as a purchaser of an extended warranty am missing out on, then I don't want the safeguards.

    Florida considers extended warranties as insurance which is why out of state dealers like Bernardi or Saccucci can't sell to Florida customers. Per reports from people in Florida, they do not sell extended warranties in Florida as low as Bernardi and Saccucci do.

    So therefore, since I live in a state without regulatory safeguards I get a much better deal on my extended warranty than the citizens of Florida with regulatory safeguards.
  • duke23duke23 Member Posts: 488
    Willing to drop this like a hot potato. But with distribution either symetric or single peaked (my argument), why would the business which presumably has actuaries offer the contract unless they had priced it correctly? Conversely, if it were indeed asymetrical, they would have to be out of their friggin gourds would they not? Unless they had built in some gigantic fudge factor, they wouldn't operate in the dark too long. Dropping it but remember you brought it up, lol.
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    Dropping it but remember you brought it up, lol.

    Oh, sure, try to draw me in with more tech talk! Nope. Not gonna do it! :P

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • mitzijmitzij Member Posts: 613
    "Unless they had built in some gigantic fudge factor, they wouldn't operate in the dark too long."

    Ding Ding Ding! We have a winner! There is a huge fudge factor in service contracts. The service contract company's rewards vastly outweigh it's risks. It's like Vegas, really. The house wins. Very nearly all the time. The handful of big winners is enough to make everyone think he can win. Service contracts have the added 'fear factor' to induce sales. SCCs don't go out of business left and right because they paid too much in claims. It's because the CEO parks a pile of your money offshore and runs like the wind after he pleads 'bankruptcy'.
  • duke23duke23 Member Posts: 488
    So your argument is that insurance 'taint a bad business at all ? How dare you accuse our ceo's of being greedy instead of fairly paid employees of the real owners.Oh c'mon tide, you know you wanna. Give in to your inner child. Aspesisteve, duke just used inner child in a post. Roll! Almost beating prices paid (in recent not total). With a little help from my friends.
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    Oh c'mon tide, you know you wanna.

    LoL! Thanks, but I've said all I want to on this topic. And please don't follow up with something so outrageous that I'd be compelled to jump in. :shades:

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • duke23duke23 Member Posts: 488
    tidester, I am trying. After careful consideration from the wiser souls who have convinced me of the lunacy of buying Honda Care I have decided to drop it and receive back 117/ 120th of my premium back (contingent). Too late for a full re-imbursement,all I require is for a current detractor to indemnify me for all the parts, labor, rental reimbursement and travel insurance (daily benefit )in the current contract. To make it especially appealing, I will pay said underwriter 1/2 of the premium I paid HCOA. So in my calculations , I have paid out $940 and will receive back $916.50 less $470 which will be $446.50 ahead of my current status. Since this is an essentially riskless bet on your part, everyone knows nothing will happen on an '08 Accord before 120,000 miles, this is your opportunity to step up and steal my money . I will expect collateral assignment to illustrate your good faith but still, what an opportunity to stick it to me and grab some free cash. The initial collateral assignment will be for $23,000 but go down 7.5% per year for 8 years ( it is a new car, so for three years, err 33 months, you are sitting on high cotton) Please respond with your acceptance and let's make a deal! As an added inducement I will pay aspesisteve, mitzi or wise $471 and a 1 year subscription to CR , a $26.00 value !
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    Too late for a full re-imbursement,

    Does that mean you're more than three years into the EW?

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • duke23duke23 Member Posts: 488
    Nein, Mein Hoster ! HC gives a full re-imbursement in the first 60 days. After that all re-imbursement is pro rata.
  • mitzijmitzij Member Posts: 613
    My reference is to service contract companies, which can (and do) go out of business leaving customers holding useless contracts, with little recourse. They take the money and run. It's happened many times. The owners of these dirtbag companies skate off and start up new companies and soak a whole new line of people. There's a sucker born every minute and they take full advantage.

    Insurance companies, on the other hand, operate under some heavy Federal laws that protect customers. Service contract companies have no such limitations. Except contract law. Go talk to a victim of Warranty Gold about how their class action lawsuit is going. (whose former owners have a new SCC up and running, having magically found funding)
  • duke23duke23 Member Posts: 488
    I can't agree more. If you do buy an EW, buy it from the manufacturer.The only 3rd party company I considered was Warranty Direct which is NYSE listed and has a substantial cash reserve.Their advantage was that the work could occur at any ase credited facility. Their disadvantage was that their coverage was not as good as HC, their price was higher, though they later sent emails and left phone calls offering to match the price or go a tad lower.But in the end they had lower coverage and no freebie auto club or travel insurance. If work needs to occur, I would prefer it to be handled by a Honda technician who will use Honda parts and has no incentive to misdiagnose or misrepresent the problem. In my experience, with an older car when you find a mechanic you can trust you hold on to them for dear life but unfortunately there are many independent shops that want to make up for not funding their retirement off of you.The trial and error method of finding a good mechanic can be expensive.
  • adam25adam25 Member Posts: 8
    I live in California and went to all three listed websites and saw the message that

    "Due to state laws, residents of Florida, California and Washington state
    are not eligible for these contracts"

    I bought a new 2008 Odyssey Touring back in February and was told that I better get HondaCare as Touring has lots of electronic moving parts and any of them can break down easily. What are my options now as a Californian? Do I have to get it from a local dealer or should I just not buy any extended warranties and hope that nothing major will break down.
  • aspesisteveaspesisteve Member Posts: 833
    "I bought a new 2008 Odyssey Touring back in February and was told that I better get HondaCare as Touring has lots of electronic moving parts and any of them can break down easily"

    gee, what did the guy say who was selling you the car? Did he tout the Odyssey for tops in quality or tell you that you'd better get an extra waranty because there's all kinds of expensive things that can break?

    total fear based selling. Just say 'No thanks' , take good care of your car and keep your hard earned cash in your pocket.

    If you do opt for the warranty, and I advise against it, please tell us what the cost is. I'm curious as to the price increase due to this new rule that says you can't go out of state to shop for the EW.
  • wisemoneywisemoney Member Posts: 42
    In the case of car insurance, the possible benefit (getting a large accident paid for) is far greater than the cost. -mtizij

    Well there is also a possible benefit of getting a large repair paid for with an extended warranty which is far greater than the cost of the warranty. This is no different. -jet10000

    As I've tried to explain to jet10000 many times, I'll try to summarize what I've stated before.

    The point that I'm trying to make can be summed up in one equation as shown below:

    (Car's Depreciated Value)/(Collision Insurance cost) > (Largest Repair Cost)/(Extended warranty cost)

    for newer vehicles.

    In other words, the largest potential loss from an accident (Car's depreciated value) divided by the collision cost is greater than the largest potential repair cost (Engine breakdown) divided by the extended warranty cost. As the car depreciates over time, I take away the collision coverage because just like extended warranties, it is no longer a good value.

    Mathematically, when

    (Car's Depreciated Value)/(Collision Insurance cost) = (Largest Repair Cost)/(Extended warranty cost)

    then, I have NO Collision coverage and NO Extended warranty.

    Also understand that when you buy a reliable car, an engine breakdown within the time, and mileage limits of an extended warranty is MORE UNLIKELY than a costly accident. My statement about Honda engines has been documented in a magazine talking about Honda VTEC engines.

    Please try to understand my explanation. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to do so.
    This explains EXACTLY why I have collision coverage on my 2008 Honda Fit, but I choose NOT to have collision coverage on my 1996 Toyota Corolla.
  • duke23duke23 Member Posts: 488
    Some adage about money and mouth but going forward.Since you have already purchased your vehicle and since HC has great coverage of sensors and electronics, why not try going to or better yet emailing 7-8 dealers and asking them for their best quote on a HC warranty. As a guideline you should use what you would pay online with if you lived in a state other than California.
    Here is what an online dealer would charge:
    http://www.hondacareextendedwarranty.com/?gclid=CMaVtvP7oJACFQZegQodRwELrg
    Available coverage for your 2008 Honda Odyssey with 1000 miles.
    Coverage Level $0 Deductible $100 Deductible
    5 years/60000 miles $415.00 Not Available
    5 years/80000 miles $580.00 $480.00
    5 years/100000 miles $695.00 $595.00
    6 years/80000 miles $640.00 $540.00
    6 years/100000 miles $835.00 $735.00
    6 years/120000 miles $935.00 $835.00
    7 years/80000 miles $725.00 $625.00
    7 years/100000 miles $1,020.00 $920.00
    7 years/120000 miles $1,120.00 $1,020.00
    8 years/100000 miles $1,100.00 $1,000.00
    8 years/120000 miles $1,195.00 $1,095.00

    Bernardi Honda was the same, but also check Hyannis and Saccucci Honda. While they do not have to match the online price, it is additional profit if they do and though working thin it is a sale they wouldn't have otherwise. I'd make it clear that this is what you are willing to pay and see who bites.Btw ,I own my home free and clear yet I still pay my homeowners insurance depite the fact that my home has never burned down and I'm underwater vs premium paid and actual damages that have occured. Those of you with mortgages might try soliciting your mortgage company with the statistics of homes burned down in 2007 (San Diego need not participate) and the money in your pocket by foregoing this poor probability product and get their opinion.
  • wisemoneywisemoney Member Posts: 42
    In the case of car insurance, the possible benefit (getting a large accident paid for) is far greater than the cost. -mtizij

    Well there is also a possible benefit of getting a large repair paid for with an extended warranty which is far greater than the cost of the warranty. This is no different. -jet10000

    As I've tried to explain to jet10000 many times, I'll try to summarize what I've stated before.

    The point that I'm trying to make can be summed up in one equation as shown below:

    (Car's Depreciated Value)/(Collision Insurance cost) > (Largest Repair Cost)/(Extended warranty cost)

    for newer vehicles.

    In other words, the largest potential loss from an accident (Car's depreciated value) divided by the collision cost is greater than the largest potential repair cost (Engine breakdown) divided by the extended warranty cost. As the car depreciates over time, I take away the collision coverage because just like extended warranties, it is no longer a good value.

    Mathematically, when

    (Car's Depreciated Value)/(Collision Insurance cost) = (Largest Repair Cost)/(Extended warranty cost)

    then, I have NO Collision coverage and NO Extended warranty.

    Also understand that when you buy a reliable car, an engine breakdown within the time, and mileage limits of an extended warranty is MORE UNLIKELY than a costly accident. My statement about Honda engines has been documented in a magazine talking about Honda VTEC engines.

    Please try to understand my explanation. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to do so.
    This explains EXACTLY why I have collision coverage on my 2008 Honda Fit, but I choose NOT to have collision coverage on my 1996 Toyota Corolla.
  • duke23duke23 Member Posts: 488
    Hmmm, deja vu' .We understand the insurance portion all too well.
    The Accord has an ITEC for the 4 cyl, VTEC for the 6 cyl. Agreed a complete engine failure most unlikely. But here are some other parts priced at hondapartscheap.com so rockbottom for the shadetree mechanic and without tax , labor and all of the supplemental parts required. These are for a 4cyl 2005 Honda Accord out of warranty.The first price is list, the second their price.

    AC compressor 3 38810-RAA-A01 COMPRESSOR No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 540.77 389.35
    38900-RAA-A01 CLUTCH SET No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 178.85 128.77
    38924-RAA-A01 STATOR SET No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 140.45 101.12
    a/c condenser
    3 80110-SDA-A02 CONDENSER No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 219.40 157.97
    3 80110-SDC-A01 CONDENSER No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 421.95 303.80
    alternator
    31100-RAA-A05 ALTERNATOR ASSY. (CSC29) (DENSO) No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 293.90 211.61
    Electronics
    at solenoid
    6 28260-PRP-014 SOLENOID ASSY., LINEAR (B) No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 241.32 173.75
    at servo body
    6 27405-PRP-J00 BODY SUB-ASSY., SERVO No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 463.25 333.54
    at regulator
    7 27200-RCR-000 BODY ASSY., REGULATOR No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 197.38 142.11
    1 28015-RCL-305 SOLENOID SET A, SHIFT No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 225.58 162.42
    2 28015-RCL-306 SOLENOID SET B, SHIFT No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 150.40 108.29
    3 28015-RCL-307 SOLENOID SET C, SHIFT No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 309.25 222.66
    4 28015-RCL-318 SOLENOID SET D, SHIFT No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 279.10 200.95
    starter motor
    31200-RAA-A52 MOTOR ASSY., STARTER (SM-61209) (MITSUBA) No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 513.18 369.49
    5 31207-RAA-A51 ARMATURE ASSY. No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 216.38 155.79
    31220-PPA-A01 GEAR SET, REDUCTION No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 216.85 156.13
    oil pump
    1 13410-RAA-A00 SHAFT, FR. BALANCER No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 166.05 119.56
    5 13450-PNA-004 TENSIONER, BALANCER SHAFT CHAIN No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 55.47 39.94
    15110-RAA-A01 HOLDER SET, PUMP No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 203.98 146.87
    control unit engine room
    11 38250-SDA-A22 BOX ASSY., RELAY No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 259.68 186.97
    Contol unit ( cabin )
    3 37820-RAD-A54 CONTROL MODULE, ENGINE (REWRITABLE) No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 548.95 395.24
    combination switch
    06350-SDA-A32 CYLINDER SET, KEY No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 404.82 291.47
    2 35100-SDA-A71 LOCK ASSY., STEERING No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 228.10 164.23
    Fuel injector
    10 17050-RAA-A00 BASE, INJECTOR No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 176.52 127.09
    16 36281-RAA-A01 VALVE, AIR ASSIST No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 99.98 71.99
    13 17146-RBA-004 GASKET, EGR CHAMBER No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 32.80 23.62
    3 16620-RAA-A01 PIPE, FUEL No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 79.73 57.41
    oil pump
    1 13410-RAA-A00 SHAFT, FR. BALANCER No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 166.05 119.56
    5 13450-PNA-004 TENSIONER, BALANCER SHAFT CHAIN No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 55.47 39.94
    15110-RAA-A01 HOLDER SET, PUMP No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 203.98 146.87
    ps pump
    1 06561-RAA-505RM P.S. PUMP (RMD) No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 314.17 226.20
    1 56110-RAA-A02 SUB-PUMP ASSY., POWER STEERING No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 612.17 440.76
    ps gear box
    13 06536-SDA-505RM RACK ASSY., POWER STEERING (RMD) No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 430.52 309.97
    13 53601-SDA-A04 RACK, POWER STEERING No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 572.07 411.89
    oil sensor
    37260-RNA-A01 HONDA ACCORD OIL PRESSURE SENSOR ( No Color ) 2008 ACCORD 111.85 80.53
    clutch torque converter
    5 26000-RAA-315 CONVERTER ASSY., TORQUE No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 507.22 365.20
    abs modulator
    57110-SDA-A22 MODULATOR ASSY. No Color 1 2005 ACCORD 1164.03 838.10

    Will anything go wrong in 8 years ? No idea, that's what insurance is for. I don't think anyone buys hc for catastrophic failure.As stated ad infintum my discounted price less ancillary benefit's I'd pay for regardless yields a low cost for 5 additional years of protection after std warranty. If I decide to sell ( no intentions at this time) I can get a much better price after std warranty than someone who doesn't offer the benefit.
  • aspesisteveaspesisteve Member Posts: 833
    "If I decide to sell ( no intentions at this time) I can get a much better price after std warranty than someone who doesn't offer the benefit. "

    Sure you can get more, but are you netting more in the resale of your car?
    It's not like the EW is going to appreciate...you know?

    You can list all the parts and costs to replace you want. The one item that I'd like to point out is the profit made by the EW provider and the commission made by the person selling it to you. The EW provider knows full well that these things rarely break down...that's why they are making a handsome profit. A profit that now stands to increase because they're shutting down EW sales over the internet.
  • duke23duke23 Member Posts: 488
    Ah, you're back. I was afraid I had scared you off with my challenge. How much more would I get on a resale. Difficult to know since I lack the personal experience.But perhaps someone will post who has done a resale and transferred the EW for $50. I may never sell, and drive this Honda until metal fatigue sets in. But to hypothesize a theoretical, If I were to sell a 4 year old Honda Accord with 48,000 miles then the new buyer would have 4 years and 72,000 miles with great coverage . I'd say $1,000 over average retail (non dealer). Mileage and extra age would determine the value. How much did you say you were paying for full collision per year? My point in the long price list was that you do not need catastrophic failure , just an expensive non powertrain mechanical part plus tax and labor.I don't think a pump or starter motor would be indicative of a poorly made car but they do cost don't they? A large enough statistical sample ( tide are you out there? ) is necessary for any insurance to post premiums and expect a profit. Bottom line, sucks to be in the greater repairs needed than average in the distribution. So far all the old names haven't upwardly adjusted their discounted EW's.

    Apologies for "bub" . It was designed to evoke a pavlovian response.Glad you thought it funny too.
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    tide are you out there?

    Present! :)

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • beancounter121beancounter121 Member Posts: 4
    I just made the mistake of overpaying on an EW when purchasing a new Honda. We are going to exercise our right to cancel. We were going to wait 30-60 days & repurchase through another dealer, however when I spoke with Honda Care yesterday, they said we could never purchase another Honda Care warranty if we cancel the current contract. Have you heard of other people having issues with this?
  • aspesisteveaspesisteve Member Posts: 833
    so you think the EW would appreciate or hold it's value?

    If you think the value of the EW should hold it's value, then you are just limiting your pool of buyers. You will have to find a buyer who feels the same way as you. I don't think the majority of car buyers opt for the EW. If someone wants to throw it in with the car - I'd take it. But I'd never pay face value for it plus the fee to transfer it into my name.

    I don't know why you insist on comparing auto insurance with an EW. If the guy selling the EW asked me if I planned on getting Collision on my new Honda and used that as a reason I should buy the EW, I'd break out laughing at him.
  • aspesisteveaspesisteve Member Posts: 833
    "however when I spoke with Honda Care yesterday, they said we could never purchase another Honda Care warranty if we cancel the current contract"

    I guess you'll have to read the fine print to see if that's true. If not, it's just another fear tactic to help them hold onto your cash. I wonder how many people change their mind after hearing that!

    Please let us know how that turns out.
  • bug4bug4 Member Posts: 370
    I made a detailed post about using EW as a marketing tool for resale some time back. I have a brother who is an expert at selling newer, used vehicles [he seems to have to have the next big thing every year or two - and he has 2-3 cars at any time]. He swears by the extended warranties! He has sold everything from BMWs to Mazdas. He has never claimed he will get extra money because of the EW, but his experience confirms that the EW allows you to get the full market value out of the car and 2) generally leads to a fast sale (not a lot of time from the first advertising until it is sold).
  • jet10000jet10000 Member Posts: 656
    "however when I spoke with Honda Care yesterday, they said we could never purchase another Honda Care warranty if we cancel the current contract"

    I canceled my Honda Care when I sold my old car and got a prorated refund. And when I bought my new Honda I bought another Honda Care.

    So what they told you was not true in my case. I'm not sure why you called Honda Care anyway, as the cancellation is done at the dealer (they send in the cancellation to Honda Care.
  • wisemoneywisemoney Member Posts: 42
    The point that I'm trying to make can be summed up in one equation as shown below:

    (Largest Claim = Car Value)/(Collision premium) is much greater than
    (Largest Claim = Largest repair bill)/(Extended warranty cost)
    for newer vehicles.

    For any particular vehicle, you need to analyze the above equation very carefully. This equation is the mathematical explanation and proof of my argument.


    I'm sorry, but speaking as a mathematician, that's hardly a mathematical proof... if you've ever seen a real proof, you would know what I mean.

    While I get the gist of what you're saying, you've over simplified it and weighted it to greatly benefit the collision ratio. I won't hide the fact that I'm a pricing actuary for an EW producer, so some of you may think I'm biased (maybe), but to really compare apples to apples, you would need to:

    1) use the premiums over a comparable time period: If you have a 5-year EW, you would also need the premium paid over 5 years for the collision coverage.

    2) use the average value of the vehicle over that same time period.

    3) use total claims, not one time greatest claim. While the largest claim on the collision would be a one-time occurrence, the largest repair bill does not preclude more of the same large repair bill(s) in the future (ask your shop how long it guarnatees replacement transmissions and rebuilt engines).

    4) use frequency of claims. While I don't specialize in auto collision pricing, I had had been told in the past that the chance of a total loss claim is about 1% a year; that amounts to about 5% over a 5 year period. Compare that to the approximately 30% chance of a powertrain claim over $500 (based on my company's data, ~3M contracts) over the same period.     - riskadverse

    I somewhat agree with statements 1 and 2 and 3, but not 4. Let me first explain statement number 1. When I wrote the equation, I implied collision premium means the total cost of premiums during the time in which the extended warranty coverage applies. Keep in mind that when you buy an extended warranty, it only covers the time after the factory warranty to the end of the extended warranty. The rest of the time you have double coverage, so the factory warranty is good enough.

    For example, most car manufacturers have a 3 year 36,000 mile factory warranty, so if you bought a 5 year 80,000 mile extended warranty, the extended warranty would only cover year 4 and year 5 or 36,000 miles to 80,000 miles, whichever comes sooner. In other words, the extended warranty covers the full 5 years or 80,000 miles, but you're really paying for year 4 and 5 or 44,000 miles.

    Therefore, in order to make an apples to apples comparison, in this example, you would need to compute the collision premium paid during those 44,000 miles, and the average depreciated value during those 44,000 miles. Let me clarify my equation for this example.

    (Total Collision Claims Paid during EW period)/(Collision Premium during EW period) is greater than
    (Total Repair Claims Paid during EW period)/(Extended warranty cost)
    for newer vehicles.

    The EW period in this example is (44,000 miles after the factory warranty ends) or (2 years after the factory warranty ends) whichever comes sooner.

    In response to statemnt 3, the largest claim on the collsion coverage is NOT a one time occurance. A car can be totaled many, many times, and each time that it is totaled, most insurance companies will give you the depreciated value of the car to buy another one. Some even give you a new car replacement, NOT the depreciated value. So you're paying the collision premium to have this coverage.

    I totally disagree with statement number 4.

    4) use frequency of claims. While I don't specialize in auto collision pricing, I had had been told in the past that the chance of a total loss claim is about 1% a year; that amounts to about 5% over a 5 year period. Compare that to the approximately 30% chance of a powertrain claim over $500 (based on my company's data, ~3M contracts) over the same period.

    First let me state that a Honda VTEC engine has NEVER had a warranty claim since the inception of VTEC technology. This is based on proven statistics and has been documented in many magazines and articles. In general most powertrains are not likely to breakdown between year 4 and year 5 or 44,000 miles in this example. Total collision claims are larger than the total cost of repair claims.

    A 30% chance of a powertrain claim over $500 seems very inaccurate, unless you're looking at Land Rover, GM, and Ford contracts.

    Take a look at Toyota, Lexus, Honda, Acura contracts, and I guarantee you that the chance of a powertrain claim over $500 during the EW period is less than 1%.
  • nautica35nautica35 Member Posts: 11
    Hi all,

    I just purchased yesterday a new 2008 Honda Accord Sedan in California. I did not do my research on Extended Service Warranties because I wasn't going to purchase one.

    Unfortunately, he was able to sell the 7-year/100,000k Extended Service Warranty from Honda Care. The salesman told me that if I were to purchase it later, it would be $2,295. But if I bought it on the spot, I would get the special internet price of $1,601. I eventually got him to package the warranty with the alarm system ($695 Retail) for $1,795.

    I am looking now and seeing some online prices for under $1,000 for the same policy from Honda Care. I am really upset now because I feel I got duped on the Extended Service Warranty.

    So my question is, would I be able to cancel my Extended Warranty from Honda Care? Will it depend on the dealer? They did not go over any cancellation policy, so I don't know if there is one.

    Does anyone think this is a bad deal? or decent deal? I just feel like he tricked me on the pricing of the warranty. Any thoughts or suggestions would be appreciated.

    Thanks,

    Alex
  • jet10000jet10000 Member Posts: 656
    They did not go over any cancellation policy, so I don't know if there is one.

    Yes, Honda Care has a 60 day cancellation policy. You will have to cancel through the dealership you purchased it from. But you will get a full refund check from Honda Care.
  • nautica35nautica35 Member Posts: 11
    Thank you. I will go cancel it tomorrow, as I don't think it is necessary and it was quite expensive. I can't believe I got tricked into purchasing it.

    I have another question though, how does it affect the alarm system that I also purchased? They told me $1,795 for the both and they priced it at $1,601 for the Extended Warranty and $194 ($695 retail) for the alarm system.

    Will they ask me to reimburse the full amount for the alarm system?

    Thanks,

    Alex
  • brian2780brian2780 Member Posts: 4
    I actually purchased an overpriced warranty a couple of months ago and was able to cancel it directly with Honda Care. I was paying on the monthly bank account deduction plan and had only made one payment. I received a refund pretty shortly after canceling. Sorry but I don't know about the alarm issue.

    When I went to purchase another extended warranty online, I found that the places selling it online actually would not sell to California. (https://www.myhondawarranty.com/pricing.php) So right now I am without a warranty, which may be fine and I may stop looking. But if you find somebody that will sell you the Honda Care warranty in California, PLEASE post the dealer and pricing info here.

    Thanks!

    Brian C
    San Francisco, CA
  • nautica35nautica35 Member Posts: 11
    Brian,

    If you don't mind, do you have an email I can contact you at?

    I will try to cancel directly with Honda Care (I don't really want to go into the dealership and see them again).

    Alex
  • aspesisteveaspesisteve Member Posts: 833
    nautica,

    last I checked, you can buy that EW just before you hit the end of your factory warranty for under a $1,000. But that was before Honda locked out Californians from going out of state.

    My best advice for you is to avoid the EW altogether unless you stay up at night worring the car will break down 3 years from now. The Accord is one of the most realiable cars ever made on the planet. Take good care of your new Accord and keep that money somewhere more useful.
  • beancounter121beancounter121 Member Posts: 4
    Alex,

    Same thing just happened to us last week. We didn't research extended warranties & paid $1470 for ours. We were also told we could not purchase after we left the dealership. We are going to go ahead & cancel. According to the Honda Care contract, you have 60 days to cancel & will get a full refund. If you financed the extended warranty through Honda, they will apply the refund to your principal balance. We are hoping once the cancelation goes through, we can repurchase through another dealer. The dealers that sell on-line are telling me that you can repurchase through them after your cancelation is processed through Honda Care as long as you have less than 6,000 miles on the car. I spoke with Honda Care to just ask them general questions & to see if I could repurchase a contract at a later date should I reconsider. Honda Care told me no, you can't purchase once the car is off of the lot. I'm not sure who is correct, but we are so annoyed at being duped by the dealer, that we're willing to take the chance that we cannot repurchase at a later date.

    Has anyone else recently canceled & repurchased? I know Honda is clamping down on it.

    Lynne
  • jet10000jet10000 Member Posts: 656
    Honda Care told me no, you can't purchase once the car is off of the lot.

    Well that's just plain ridiculous. You can purchase Honda Care right up until the time you pass the factory warranty (either in miles or time.)

    You have to purchase before 6,000 miles to get "new pricing". After 6,000 it's a different scale with different time periods and deductibles.

    Contact one of three dealers that display common low prices for Honda Care. If they tell you they can sell it to after your cancellation goes through you can believe them.

    They've been selling to people on this forum for awhile and we haven't seen a complaint that I know of.

    Dealers are:

    http://www.bernardiwarranty.com/

    http://www.myhondawarranty.com/

    http://www.hondacareextendedwarranty.com/

    You can get instant price quotes from them. Usually they are very nearly the same, but sometime they'll give you a coupon for their parts website.
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