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Comments
I saw your earlier posting. Congratulations on walking out when you were bait-and-switched. Good luck on your purchase.
(Everything on invoice price)
328i Seden $29,810
Apline White $0
Auto $1,210
Sport Package $1,455
Paddle Shifters $90
Premium Package $2,960
Ipod Adaptor $365
Destination Charge $775
-------------------------------------
Total $36,665
They offer me $37,900 and they said it is $600 over invoice.
However, when I added $600 to the above total, it is only $37,265.00. Then I questioned the sales manager that is not my number I add up. He said it includes Maco $380 and Training $180. (still $75 missing when I do the match at home) and those Maco & Training fee are part of the invoice price.
I am so confused now!!! :confuse:
Maco & Training are included in invoice price?
Is it a good deal?
Thanks!
- First Time Potential BMW Buyer! :shades:
I just placed an order for a 328i. I paid $900 over invoice, including MACO and Training fees ($530). So, the dealer made $370.
Hope this information helps you come up with a good number to counter with.
The invoice price does include MACO and Training fees from the dealer side. I guess the edmunds invoice price doesnt include this.
Good luck !!!
That said, I don't understand the need to break it out as a fee. When I buy groceries, Albertsons doesn't charge me a separate fee for their ad budget.
If you offer $37K for a car, then there shouldn't be any extra "invoice charges".
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first, what's the minimum credit rating needed to lease it? mine ranges from 680s to 780s from the 3 bureaus and i dunno if that's enough. would it be enough to qualify for a lease or a good apr?
second, is it advantageous to put more down payment when i am leasing? what's the typical down payment for financing for a bmw 3 series?
third, i see special lease offers with $x,xxxx amount due at signing but doesn't that exclude hidden fees?
and lastly, i live in nyc and was thinking of bayside bmw or rallye but i dunno how the experiences are. any previous experience from them would be awesome you can also email me advice if you want
thank you!
2. Never put money on a lease. Negotiate the msrp and get the money factor at the buy rate. Never put money on a lease. Ever.
3. Extra fees will pop up and ignore the "special offers." Visit leaseguide.com to get a full breakdown on leasing. You need to be fully aware of how every number plays into a lease. It's far more complicated than buying a car.
Always negotiate the sale price of a car before you move on to negotiating the money factor.
On the statement made about getting the money factor to be same as buying, what do you mean? I mean since a typically a lease is 1 - 3 years and I don't think most people would finance for that long as they would mostly do 4-5. Plus after the 3 years, then there's still the residual that needs to be paid off.
On a side note, I talked to Shelly bmw in LA and they gave me a rough verbal quote of for a 50K car. If it was a 335i, then it would be around 900/month and a 535i (@50K so base model) about 500/month. I'm sure difference is money factor.
The credit score should be fine but they also check the credit limit you have...for e.g. i had a cradit score of 720 but my limit was damn less at 2000$ ...so my credit didnt approve ..it also takes various other factors like number of years of employment and number of years at your residence etc etc...mine was 2 to 3 yrs for these which is again less...so credit didnt approve..in order to fix that(since i was smitten by the black bimmer there ) i gave a refundable security deposit of 3500$) but as much as possible dont go for the security deposit also....
money factor as my sales person said is .00190 which is out of book for the first customer..when you are a recurring customer it can be less he said..i dont think this is true but i didnt care much...i have heard better money factor rates...
the residual has to be high in order for your lease to be less...my residual was .63 since it was 36 months/36000 if you go higher miles it will go down to .61 which begins u gonna pay a high lease...
this is all i could make out from my deal...mine was also a first exp....hope this helps...
I got the buy rate on my last BMW lease...
You might want to accept the fact that other dealers might give the buy rate, and that potential buyers are free to shop around.. :surprise:
Also.. I find that the service I get after the sale, has nothing to do with how good of a deal I got, in the first place....
Of course, you are welcome to your opinions...
regards,
kyfdx
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Your personality type seems to be the one that will go to great lengths to get a "great deal".... to tell you the truth, a great deal is all based upon perception. One who perceives that they got a great deal and are happy with it, well, then they got a great deal!
Eg: I just made a big screen flat panel TV purchase. I researched my butt off, read all of the forums and blogs, then finally decided upon a model. I shopped a couple different stores, but ended up buying it from the salesman that treated me the best...and I could have bought it for $150 less at another store....but I didn't. You want to know why.....I enjoyed the salesman I worked with, he knew his product, he gave me some installation advice, and he never B/S'd me! Guess what, I am happy with my purchase! Would the $150 I could have saved been nice to have, yeah, but I felt that the deal he offered was fair, and I just wanted to buy it from him, and I let him know such!
Back to the topic at hand.....we all want a "good deal", including myself. I applaud you for your efforts and advice to all that read these boards, but remember one thing, if someone could have gotten a better deal somewhere else....let it go, and let them be happy with their purchase.....the last thing we want to do is ruin somebody's Happy Day!
This is my last post regarding this topic, I hope everyone out there is enjoying their BMW's....I would like to see some feedback regarding the new models BMW is releasing...The new M3 (wow) The new X6 (gorgeous) and all new 1 Series....you guys let me know what you think, I am excited to see how the market accepts these new models!
Safe motoring all!
PS I am based in South Louisiana.....GOD's other country
2. MSDs are a fantastic way to cut your lease payment. Dealers that say MSDS don't help are lying. Dealers that refuse to do them are a good indicator you should move on. You can't find an ROI like an MSD. Especially in this climate.
3. Always negotiate from invoice up. This is huge in a lease deal. Huge! Check leaseguide.com.
4. A dealer telling you 1-2 years at a company or 1-2 years in your current home impacts their decision to lend to you...something is fishy.
5. Emailing BMW dealerships with your offer does not cost you time. Avoid salespeople and go for the internet route.
6. Salespeople can be useful but this is a car, remember it's just an appliance and it will be replaced (especially if you're leasing, which is just a longterm rental) . Work via the internet/phone. No need to go into the dealership until you've got to pick up your car. On my last BMW purchase I used the internet, phone and fax until the moment I had to come in for them to copy my passport.
7. Get everything in writing. And watch that they don't jack you with bogus doc fees ($250 for documents) or tell you something untrue like GAP is needed on BMWFS leases.
BMW FS is pretty good to deal with. But they screw up. I got rid of a 2006 E90 in April 2007 - BMW still reports that lease to credit agencies as an open account! :surprise: Yes, this has been going on for months. It'll get worked out eventually.
Welcome to the board. It will be nice to have a BMW dealer post valuable information here on Town Hall. Also be sure to check out the "Stories From The Sales Frontlines" thread. I'm sure you've got some good stories (and some really good ones) about some of your customers.
I'm sure the uninformed consumer pays the .004 bump on the money factor and doesn't even know what a money factor is or the super rich person who walks in, picks out a car, and says they want to lease it for XX months and don't care what the payment is or that they're mf is getting bumped.
There are a lot of middle class and blue collar workers who are intelligent, very well informed, and with a little bit of research are willing to save the $25 or $40 per month and get the buy rate.
Once the deal is done, Its done though. You are right in the fact that it doesn't matter if you've got a 335i for $500 per month and I got one for $600. They are both BMWs and great cars to drive and enjoy.
My family has gotten the buy rate on all 5 BMWs we've leased since 2004 including my Dad's former '04 X5 3.0iA and his current '07 X5 3.0si, my Mom's former '05 530iA and her current '08 328xiA, and my wife's '07 X3 3.0si.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
It's just kind of upsetting when folks on these boards look at a client advisor as an "order taker". I work long, hard hours for you....you being my customers! My number one goal is "COMPLETE CLIENT SATISFACTION" it's more work than some may think....I take the time to get to know my client and develop a professional business relationship....I am not going to go on and on about all of the little things that client advisors do, but I believe that you get back what you put in.....Let me tell you what has kept me in this business for almost 11 years now, 5 years with BMW, it's your smiling face as you drive away from my center in your new BMW, the sense of pride knowing that I had a direct impact in that customer's happiness. It doesn't matter if it's their first or fifth BMW, it's always rewarding to know that I just delivered some "JOY".
I hope that all of you shopping end up working with a good client advisor, one that is looking out for your best interest......
I am open for any questions, and I wish you all a Great Weekend!
I doubt you mean teach the owner to hit the apex correctly. I spent a grand total of about 5 minutes with my salesperson for the delivery of my first e46. My e90, I talked with the smartly dressed German guy at the ED center for maybe two minutes. Anything I need to know I get from reading the manual. I have zero interest in listening to someone tell me how to tune a radio.
As for service, I don't and never will contact a salesperson about service as he has nothing to do with it. You call service for a service appointment, not a salesguy.
take the time to get to know my client and develop a professional business relationship
My SA on my first 3 series spent two test drives with me - first a 325i 5MT ZSP. He called me a few weeks later when they got a 330i with 6 MT into stock. We unwrapped what would end up my 330i 6MT ZHP and drove it. The deal was done in about 1.5-2 hours including the detailing/prep of the car. I brought my bro-in-law to him, they drove a 325i 5MT ZSP and it was all done in under 2 hours. For my ED, I called him, got the price and that was that, In total I've spent maybe 5-6 hours around Jim. That's a perfect professional relationship...I come to him, tell him what I want, get it and pay him.
I don't call him about service, about issues or really anything. I call him if I need to buy a car or if I am helping a friend buy a BMW. And now that he's retired, I'm stuck trying to find a decent SA for my next purchase. If I go ED again, I will probably call a guy from Bimmerfest as I know I can get the fast, no hassle, no "so what do you do for a living?" junk.
I think your approach is a great one; just realize that while some customers absolutely need the attention and hand holding - and in that case, they should pay for it in a higher price - others don't. Everybody's different. Keep up the good work!
wouldn't it be best to try for approval from BMWFS rather than going to the dealership and getting a rate from there?
i just don't want to go there maybe get rejected or them trying to sell me another car that i wouldn't want.
is BMWFS strict on the credit rating?
1. Get the final price of the car negotiated before you EVER talk payments
2. Get the exact fees they're charging you
3. Get the MF, residual, etc all settled before giving them your information
All of this can be handled by phone/fax. #1 is super important when leasing. You negotiate just as if you were buying the car.
4. You may want to consider Multiple Security Deposits (your internet sales rep should be able to explain them) as nothing currently can offer that same ROI. If the sales rep says MSDs are no good, come back here and we'll explain them to you. MSDs offer you 7+% ROI, which clobbers everything right now.
Finally, BMWFS is pretty easy going about credit. 700+ and you're golden with them.
The argument I've heard from BMW CAs is that the dealership can sometimes get you approved, if you fall just under the line... but, if you've already been rejected by BMWFS on-line, then they can't do anything about it..
So.. even if pre-approved, you'll still have to fight with the dealer for the best rate, so you might as well go through them, first.. That way, if your credit score is borderline, then they may be able to help.
Good luck!
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i think i can do better, get another 1k. anyone have any comments or help? need to get a car on monday....
comments welcome!!!!!
Good Luck!
"stvroy",
Based on a $46,000 328cv
Money factor with 7 extra deposits- .00236
The .00245 rate you have is the invoice price from BMW and not available to the
public.
7 multiple deposits- $5800
With 6932.84 due (deposits and 1st payment and fees) payment is $682.80.
Of course at the end of the lease you would receive $5600 back.
Please let me know if you have any other questions. Looking forward to wrapping
this up for you.
*************************************
My response.....
"Mr. Dealer"-
Thanks for the information. I understand the .00245 is from BMW, but multiple sources I've found on my research say this rate is available. As your saying it's not, the 1.32% bump on the rate seems a bit high. So is the best deal on the spread? If it helps, I have a 792 FICO Score.
I do lke the MSD option, but why is the secuity deposit $800 each? I thought it was in $50 increments based on the payment. If I put cash down to lower the payment, wouldn't the security deposit go down as well? I do like this model as I'm buying down the rate.
I saw you based your numbers of a $46,000 328. As your coming into the deal now, here's what I'm interested in specifically as this number effects the residual and purchase price, and ultimately the payment.
328i CONV
Alpine White/Creme Interior
*6-speed STEPTRONIC Auto
*Cold Weather Package
*Comfort Access
MSRP - $46,500
Invoice - $42,870
What would I expect in terms of price when ordering the vehicle? I know the going rate on the coupe and sedan is $500 or so over invoice from a lot of people on the BMW forums. I know the numbers you provided were just on a generic $46K 328 selling at MSRP, but I would be interested in learning the specifics of the vehicle if I were to order.
******************************************
So, what should I feel comfortable is a fair price. I'm thinking $44k on the purchase price and the bye rate of .00245. Is this realistic?
Lease Proposal
2008/2009
BMW
335i
Base MSRP $38,900*
Invoice $35,790**
Alpine White
Black Leatherette
Brushed Aluminum
Cold Weather Package
Sport Package
Comfort Access System
Destination & Handling
Total MSRP as Built $42,875*
Invoice $39,475**
Proposal
Sale Price = Invoice + $750
Base Cap Cost = $40,225
Acquisition Fee = $625
Down Payment = $2000
Net Cap Cost = $38,850
Residual (64%) = $27,440***
Money Factor = .0021
Term = 36 Months
Miles / Year = 10,000
Monthly Lease Payment = $464.60****
*According To BMWUSA.COM
**According To EDMUNDS.COM
*** Residual Calculated - MSRP $42,875 x .64 = $27,440
**** Monthly Lease Payment Calculated
[Base Cap Cost $40,225 + Acquisition Fee $625 - Down Payment $2000 = Net Cap Cost $38,850 - Residual $27,440 = $11,410 / 36 = $316.94 (Depreciation)
MSRP $42,875 + Residual $27,440 = $70,315 x Money Factor .00210 = 147.66 (Lease Charge)
Depreciation $11,410 + 36 Month Lease Charge $5,315.76 = $16,725.76 / 36 = Monthly Lease Payment $464.60]
I am in the market to buy a 2008 328i 4 door sedan. I've received a quote for 42,000 (+ tax, etc) for the following options:
metallic black paint, premium package, sports package, NAV, auto tran, Xenon headlights, comfort access, heated front seats, ipod adapter & usb, 417 window shades, metallic black paint
Is this a good deal?
- Sa
What is the MSRP?
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MSRP is 44,175. Invoice is 40,645. Edmunds lists TMV pricing as 42,575.
How close to invoice should I expect ?
...why do you need heated seats in So Cal...
Putting a down payment on a lease is not recommended.
If you were to total your leased vehicle as soon as you drove off the lot, you would lose your entire down payment..
Question: Given that the dealer that will sell me the car isn't incurring any of the normal costs involved in keeping a car on the lot until it sells, should I be able to expect to drive a hard bargain, like say $500 over invoice? There are four dealers within reasonable driving range, so shouldn't I just find which one will do a deal which as far as I can tell is pure profit to them, outside of the employee cost of filling out a little paperwork?
Premium Package
Automatic
Nav.
Cold Weather Package.
On Edmunds it comes out to $40,968.
One guy gave a quote of 42,676 for which i said bye
The other dealer stated a quote of 40,652
Any input for you guys about the price.
Thankyou,
true heated seats aren't essential in Southern California.....
To take advantage of owning it for 3 yrs while the warranty is still in place ?
I've read leasingguide.com and I understand that leasing vs. buying a car is an individual decision, but, I wanted to get you guys' input.. Is the 328i a car one would rather lease than buy ?
- Sa
From a buyer vs. lessor point of view.. Any experience with long term reliability of the 328i beyond warranty period ?
Do buyers typically get an extended warranty ?
My current car is a toyota camry which I bought new & have driven for the past 10 years. I'm now ready for an upgrade and a more fun car to drive!
I like the idea of being able to turn the car in after a lease and enjoying it while it's still new. Do the dealers try & get you on any damage beyond wear and tear ? Excess miles ?
As for extended warranty - if you buy a CPO 3 series it'll have an extended warranty. From what I've heard late model e46 and e90 cars are pretty darn reliable. I was sorta unlucky with my 3 series cars but I still look back fondly on my 3 year lease of a 2003 330i ZHP.
There's little reason to believe a properly maintained 3 won't last you well over 6-7 years. A coworker has a 2001 325i that's still going strong.
Thanks,
- Sa
How does one go about finding the MSRP/invoice for an 07 at this point? The price they quoted me was $38000. What should I be offering for this 07 car which is a prior model year but has never been driven?
MSRP for a similarly equipped 08 on Edmunds is $40,895 including destination. I figure if this were an 08, I could find this vehicle for about 1k over invoice which would be $38,610 or so.
I got it for $24500. I feel like it was a good price because the car drives and handles like it's new...nice and tight with very few if any creaks. Paint is still glossy with 2 or 3 nicks in the hood, but evey place else is above average for a 3 year old car. Interior is in great shape. The back seats and passenger seats have almost no apparant wear Actually, it will be in service 3 years in December.
I took it to my local BMW dealership during the test drive to check out the maintenance records and while there I tried to give them a shot at my business. But, all of their preowned 3 series were "plain jane" and quite a bit more because they were certified. The salesman tried to "sell" me on a BMW being certified, but even if they had one I liked I couldn't see paying $2500-$3000 more. The only problem I have found is that it appears that the windshield washer fluid pump doesn't work. No problem there since the original warranty is still intact. Almost forgot...there's no spare! Did the ZHP come with one? The tires aren't run flat.
It's a real joy to drive...as usual with BMW's. It's my fourth...'00 328i, '02 530i, '05 Z4...I'm a BMW man!!!!
Thanks!