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Comments
first, our service writer has no reason to lie to me. second, i post on here for my enjoyment and knowledge. none of you will likely ever buy a vehicle from me, so there is no monetary reason for me to be here. i do it simply to enjoy myself, as do all the other pros in these boards.
if you have such a dim view of dealer personnel, then you have the problem, not me.
you asked what i drive...look at my profile.
did i pay for it? yes i still do.
i dont doubt that you have problems. i never said that. my point is that you cant be objective because it IS your money. try to take a step back and be objective. the dealer isnt out to get you. they dont want to have problems with vehicles either, especially ones they cant fix.
indy...
all i said is that noone here has experienced the resonance. i have no reason to lie. its not like im going to sell a car off these boards.
I took my Armada in to get the roof glued and it didn't fix the problem with mine either. Did yours have a really bad odor when you got it back? mine did. They told me it was the smell of the epoxy glue that they used.
I also am having a problem with a metal popping sound from underneath when I first drive off. They changed out the rear mounts, that was suppose to fix the problem but the problem still exist.
I have also developed a really loud rattle in my dash and a slight ticking sound when I accelerate.
I know to some people this may all seem minor, but if you have experienced the resonance problem you might understand. On my vehicle it is really bad and I just feel like this is way to big an investment to be playing guinea pig with. I really don't think they know how to fix the problems. I have taken it in four times and gluing the roof and changing out the rear mounts were on the TSB. That was suppose to be their fix and it didn't work!
After having all these problems this early on I am afraid of what the
future may be like. I am not having any rotor problems yet but I just hit 2000 miles.
I would really appreciate any tips or advice you can offer.
You personally may not sell a vehicle off this board. However, this board has cost Nissan sales. I for one didn't buy after what I read here and experienced for myself after test driving the Armada. I really wanted one too. I'm sure there are others who have done the same.
i wont say any person, specifically, is lying. but i do have doubts of some. i dont, however, doubt anyone who has posted recently.
BTW...the resonance issue has actually INCREASED the number of people who test-drive the armada. many want to experience it for themselves before discounting the armada as an option. our closing ratio has not changed since day 1.
No, it's the problems with the vehicle that cost them sales. If anything, these boards encourage the company to fix the problems so they can improve their sales.
tidester, host
So far, I have had my window go off track 3 times, the front two make loud clunking noises, the back two groan, the front passenger door was loose, the front passenger seat makes an extremely obnoxious screech when I turn, both sides of the floor in the front pop slightly up and down (making an annoying popping noise whenever you move your feet), my roof liner started to fall off in the back, the resonance issue drives me crazy between 20 and 45 mph, not to mention the minute problems that are probobly more complaints than issues.
She is a joy to drive, her control and acceleration are excellent, but I'm starting to doubt if the pleasure is worth it - I almost liked driving the '04 Grand Prix as much...
step 1 -- complain to nissan and start a claim file reference number. step 2 have the local dealer attempt to fix the problem. step 3 field inspector. step 4 (assuming the inspector approves) buy-back proceedure begins. in the event the inspector does not reccomend buy-back, then you can always persue the lemon-law avenue.
i have no one to blame for MY SITUATION but myself. i refused to accept the first armada delivered by my dealer back in december because of the excesive noises and the ROOF viberating like it would fall down any second...so when the second one came in (and after they already had my deposit and were pushing me to buy) i dumbly accepted the second vehicle. in the back on my mind i assumed that nissan would issue a recall and fix the damn thing. just like offroadnarmada said in his post --She is a joy to drive, her control and acceleration are excellent. but like so many other people on here the ROOF is not the only problem. the driver's side window is about to fall out...or sounds that way. i pulled up to mcdonalds to make an order and the thing made so much noise that the girl taking my order asked over the speaker "did your window just fall out?" the second row seat behind the driver must be folded up to keep from rattling as much as the roof. there is a "ticking" sound just left of my left shoulder while driving. and some kind of noise from the dash when no one is seated in the passenger's seat!
there is an aftermarket dvd/stereo business in st. louis that has created/invented their own fix for the roof that i have seen pics of...composed of brackets that are mounted to the roof. i asked my local dealer and nissan corporate "why not just send my armada there and have these people fix it?" they said that nissan would void my warranty if i did that. so....i sit here with my home-made post holding my roof in place....and still putting up with all the other problems when i drive the truck. but not for long....law-suit-city right around the corner.
It creates a lot of noise in the car - shaking seats - anything that is loose starts to rattle - and the low frequency rumble is very tiring.
Does anybody else have this?
Many thanks
Richard
rparnall - what you're explaining sounds a lot like the notorious resonance issue. Sometimes it builds up so bad that I get a slight headache from the constant pressure.
also, you can use this site to find all available options, or you can go to nissan's own site.
www.nissanusa.com
this can also have the effect of making people stop considering the armada. how is THAT an informed decision?
The internet certainly makes it easier to do the research but people have been researching the vehicles they purchase since well before the internet became widespread. Ultimately, however, it is the vehicle with all its pluses and minuses that sell it - or not sell it. You may have been turned off by some particular aspect but another may not have had that same concern and was convinced to buy based on something else he/she read.
In the end I think it's a wash.
tidester, host
I asked her if I could have the dealer pad the underside of the roof with dynamat and a liner (I already purchased enough to do it) without voiding the warranty. Worst case, even if the glue doesn't take, the dynamat and extremeliner (available on ebay) will most certainly kill the resonance.
Otherwise, I'm really loving my Armada. I would submit that if you're shopping for one, go and drive it (preferably on some rough road) around 40 mph and see if it even bothers you. Although I can hear it, it isn't so bad that I get headaches. I think some folks are probably more sensitive than others. I haven't had any other problems (other than a squeak and loose mirror) and the power, ride, and towing ability (wow!) make the vehicle well worth it, even with the resonance, to me.
Bewoke, an informed decision should be based on knowledge learned about a product. I've learned enough about the Armada to know that I wouldn't purchase one due to the problems it is having. Perceived or not. To me that was an informed decision.
thats fine, but my point is that, for those who make that decision without even seeing or driving one, they are NOT making a fully informed decision.
take adjmcloon, for example. he thinks the positives ouytweigh the negatives. he knew of the problems, but went to drive one anyway, and made a FULLY informed decision to buy it. people who make decisions based solely on an internet message board are doing themselves a GREAT disservice.
I spoke with my rep Megan (x.3854) at Nissan today, and she informed me that the glue fix is the only fix. There are no other parts being developed. In addition, she stated that apparently some dealers that have done the glue fix have used the wrong adhesive, and that is why the fix hasn't worked in those instances. The resonance TSB was released on April 20th.
well that is simply not true because i had both glues put on the inner roof and they didn't work so nissan is blowing hot air again, and they must really be stumped on this resonance issue for sure, sad you have all these high paid engineers and they cant solve this serious problem, i fear that all that have the resonance issue will have to have nissan buy back your armada's because i doubt this glue TSB is going to work, to me it looks like the have to totally redesign the roof
This particular board has served as a useful source of information for me...but it can also be quite confusing as to what is really going on with this vehicle. There's a group with resonance and rotor issues and such, there's a group that's seemingly quite satisfied (me included) and then there's bowke refereeing the whole thing, while stating that his dealership has never even heard of these problems. I don't know what to tell those of you potential Armada buyers, other than to say soak in all of this information..and possibly misinformation...but do yourself a favor and get out and drive one or more for yourselves. I've got 4500 miles on mine and the only complaint I have is that the local auto parts stores have never even heard of the thing (for filters and such). There's a bit of a frenzy that seems to be generated here. People start tossing out abstruse statements about how this thing is the lemon of the century when we don't even know how widespread the problems are. Maybe it is, who knows. Maybe I'm just living on borrowed time with mine. But until I hear how many of the 14,000 are affected, I'm not drawing any final conclusions. I certainly don't think we have a representative sample here.
14k in 5 months is 2800 per month
2800 times 12 months is 33600. looks like they are on target.
also, the first 3 months were WAY behind, so they must be flying out now, relative to the 1st 3 months.
i know weve sold about 14 in the last 2 months, but only sold 4 in the 1st 3 months.
its in the best interest to do buybacks for these things, but its not mandatory.
Would the noise be a distraction and could it be sufficiently distracting that it would contribute to an accident?
tidester, host
boy...you REALLY want to get the SUVs off the road dont you?
The state defines a new motor vehicle as a lemon if it has one or more defects that are not fixed after three attempts to repair them, or if the vehicle is off the road for a total of 20 cumulative calendar days. The defect must “substantially impair the use, value or safety of the vehicle.” The Lemon Law does not cover defects that result from accidents, vandalism, abuse or neglect. In addition, it does not cover defects that were caused in the process of trying to fix the defect by any person other than the manufacturer, its agent or an authorized dealer. Under the Lemon Law, in order to qualify the consumer must write the manufacturer to give them one last shot at fixing the defect.
Substantial. The word has to be quantified - that's actually my job, the conditions I report on, and the sole reason I testify. If you can still use the vehicle, it's not impaired. Value damage comes from replaced engines and transmissions and 14 visits for brakes. Safety is only affected if you can't stop, turn or go to avoid an accident.
Noises, regardless of how annoying, and with respect to those annoyed, generally don't constitute a substantial impairment in any of the three areas.
Lemon laws in most states don't allow for your time, nerves, frustration, etc - it's a product warranty situation, and nothing more. The cases have no allowance for pain and suffering, and all the other overly-litigious notions brought on by too many personal injury lawsuits and too many TV shows.
I was asked a few posts back about the service manager recommending lemon law action - I was a service manager and made that statement to customers, too - mostly to get them on my side instead of yelling at me - I didn't make the danged thing, we just sell them and service them.
99 times out of 100, service managers have no idea what truly goes on in a lemon law case - and they shouldn't, I'd hope.
So bottom line: test drive one and see for yourself. Resonance is a serious issue in some Armadas, but if you don't hear it and if you don't feel the overhead console in the second row shaking at highway speed , then go ahead pull the trigger....the truck is worth it and a steal if you can buy at invoice. And don't forget to try moving the rear luggage rack crossbar all the way forward...made a huge difference for me!!!
You mean the resonance will still be there too?
Just kidding.
Do you have some advanced notice about these things? Most manufacturers change something even if it's cosmetic such as, tail lights, front grill, trim, etc. Something to distinguish the 05 from the 04. I'm holding off for the 05 in hopes that Nissan will just add retractable rearview mirrors. Is that too much to ask for?
I have been having the resonance issue since day one. I have been in contact with Nissan's consumer affairs department since the week after I bought it. I have done what they asked and gone in for their Guinea pig repairs. I am convinced that they don't know how to fix the problems.
I don't know if you have experienced the resonance problem or not but in my vehicle it is very bad, and it does not make a sound or noise at all it is a lot of pressure that you feel! in your head and ears that causes your ears to pop like when in a airplane. It's enough to drive you nuts. I have had people say that it gives them a headache. Sometimes I have ringing in my ears after driving for a while on a day when its really bad. So that causes me to wonder if it could have some sort of long term affects in my ears or more importantly on my three children.
Now that sounds like it would "substantially impair" the use and the "safety" of it to me, and as far as the value I have heard that once the word really gets out about all the problems that they are having they are not going to hold their value very well.
LoL! Just trying to be helpful!
tidester, host
(Someone wanting to buy an Armada or 05 Path)
Lizzie - I'm not saying you have to live with anything - I've seen stranger things happen than a vehicle getting lemon-lawed for a vibration or noise - I'm just saying there's no legal basis for it. The manufacturer can do what they want, but usually won't step up until they're sued.
There are laws in place in every state that allow consumers to contact the manufacturer and report their recurring problems and get relief under the law- it happens VERY rarely, actually, and usually when a lawyer is involved.
Ironically, it was the unions representing the manufacturers that wrote the Magnusson-Moss Warranty Improvement Act, which is the basis for most state lemon laws - this act allows that the manufacturer of ANY product with a warranty (not just cars, we're talking toasters and TVs here) to give the consumer relief - unfortunately, although those laws are in place, it takes an act of Congress to get a manufacturer to do something about your problem.
Most people tend to scream, holler, freak out, make threats, etc, and by the time someone with authroity looks at your complaint letter, they assume you're off your rocker.
Stay calm, even though you're annoyed, don't mess with trying to get this resolved at the service advisor/service manager level, and document everything. Your best contact is the regional warranty rep - they're the first person in the chain with true authority -
Remember also, the dealer DID NOT make the vehicle and DOES NOT warranty the vehicle - they are simply a sales and service point for you. trying to get the dealership to buy your vehicle or the service manager to handle things for you is NOT reasonable.
I'm in the market for a new one and am thinking an 04 may be a better choice, made in Japan and not a first year vehicle and right now probably can get a great deal on a new 04.
I have a 97PF with 104k previous to that a 92PF and an 87PF all have been very reliable vehicles.
I guess for a first year/ brand new vehicle you expect to to have some problems/growing pains although my 87PF was a first yearer and had very few problems with it.