VW Passat TDI

moparbad · May 2003

50 Cetane fuel works the best. Where to get 50 cetane diesel? Best source in my area is biodiesel blend. BP offers high quality diesel with very limited availability. It is difficult to find a reliable source of high quality diesel. My VW TDI always receives PowerService additive in every tank to improve and control cetane, lubricity and water.

The fuel YOU are purchasing in Canada may very well be higher quality than the fuel that you purchase in US. Fuel quality in Canada overall is not proven to be any better or worse than fuel in USA. Fuel quality tends to be regional as it differes from each refinery.
Personnally I've purchased Canadian diesel and the only difference was the higher price.

dieselbreath · May 2003

I haven't seen any place to get Bio Diesel in the Vancouver BC or Seattle area. Is there a web site that lists locations selling it?

Given how "green" bio-diesel is, you'd think the gov't (EPA) would support it. There's so much hype about hydrogen, but its not a source of fuel, only a way of transporting energy. If the eastern seaboard is buring coal for electricity to produce hydrogen then we aren't very far ahead.

If all the SUVs used for commuting were replaced with reasonable sized cars running off biodiesel, I'd bet that there would be no petroleum imports into North America required. But that solution is FAR too practical to get the attention of politicians ... it's not glamorous enough.

8u6hfd · May 2003

www.biodiesel.org

plaaaaane · June 2003

I have my '03 Jetta TDI. 17,500 miles since 8/02. I love it. The only problem was loss of AM radio stations a month ago. Seems theres a preamp for AM built into the base of the antenna. (I assume this could interfere with putting a CD changer or satellite radio in with an FM modulator; that is, inserting it into the antenna jack. The origianal must pass DC, no?)

Anyhow, I would trade up to a manual Passat TDI wagon in an instant. Instead I can keep my Jetta sedan and save money.

but I would love a TDI Passat wagon.

Dave

raynorshine · July 2003

I hear Feb '04 is the release date for the TDI Passat as well. I also have heard that it will not be available in a standard trans here. In Europe the 165 HP 6 cyl reportedly can be got with a 6 speed manual. This would sure make a lot of sense out west here with the mountains and trailer pulling.
We really liked the feel of the ride and appointments in '03 W8 we drove, but friends of friends are reporting poor service and lots of minor problems with their late model Passats. We are not hearing that about Jetta TDIs. So far all the news on the Jeta TDIs seems to be good. I wish the Jettas were as well appointed and as large as the Passat or that the TDI Passat Wagon was here and proven.

The Jetta TDI Wagon is built in Germany, not Mexico like the sedan and gas wagons. Has anyone heard any quality comparisons between the wagon and sedan TDIs?

danonu · July 2003

Anybody knows if the 4Motion and the TDI combination is going to be available in the US, and starting when?

buyavw · July 2003

The 4Motion will be available on the 1.8T around December. The TDI is also scheduled to arrive in December (knowing VW, expect to see them Jan-Feb). But no plans to put both 4Motion and a TDI in the same Passat for the US market.

The TDI will be available in the GL and GLS trim levels of the sedan and wagon, but only with a 5-speed Automatic transmission with Tiptronic.

dudleyr · July 2003

Too bad about auto only. Kinda misses the whole point of a diesel engine in my opinion, as it whacks about 5 mpg off.

dieselbreath · July 2003

Most hard-core diesel fans want the standard, but to me, a Passat TDI Automatic is still:
- better mileage than any gas models
- going to last longer
- will have higher resale when its old.

Plus, my wife is tired of her standard in Vancouver traffic and wants the auto.

What's the ratio of autos to sticks in the US?
I think I heard about 95% to 5%.
I see lots of white-haired ladies driving Jetta TDIs who wouldn't be driving a VW diesel if they didn't offer the automatic.

Given what a great secret the Passat TDI will be (meaning it won't sell many units) I can see VW not wanting to further limit sales to just those 5% buying standards.
(But I'd personally prefer the V6-TDI 4-motion with 6-speed please!!!!)

moparbad · July 2003

I see you ordered your 04 Passat TDI in March 03. How much did it cost? Are you already driving it or is it still scheduled to arrive in September?

dieselbreath · July 2003

We're still at the top of the list.
I should check and see how long it is now.
Unlike the dealers in WA state, the ones around here don't jack up prices over list for vehicles in demand.
But they do follow their customer waiting lists strictly.

jimlockey · August 2003

The Passat diesel will drive better than anything on the market to date, but this will be offset by the worse dealers I've ever delt with. The VW dealers by themselves put me out of the VW business for good. Wait for the Jeep Liberty.

profvh · August 2003

I don't know where your VW dealer experience has
been, Jimlockey, but I have had superb auto care
at DeMontrond here in Houston. Example: oil change in 1/2 hour. Even tho I have a reliable
Passat, they volunteered to replace all the coils
even tho I had no coil failure.

dieselbreath · August 2003

You're one of the lucky ones I guess.
VW has some great dealers in Canada and in the US, but the company's problem is that they may be a minority. The quality is definitely inconsistent. For example, the 7 VW dealers that I know of around Vancouver all have excellent reputations, but the dealer in Victoria is bad enough to offset all their goodness!

In the car buying decision, I think the dealer is almost as important as the car. No car can make up for a dealer with terrible service!

So, please let VWOA know how good your dealer is so that they get the recognition (And vehicle allotments) they deserve. Maybe HQ can somehow learn something from the good ones that can be applied to help improve the ones who just don't get it yet.

profvh · August 2003

Good Idea, dieselbreath, I will probably do it.
Just had the 20,000 mile inspection this a.m. with
oil, lube and filter and tire rotation. In and
out in 2 hours. Outstanding service.

dieselbreath · August 2003

I'm wondering if the dealer quality is directly related to competition. You and I are in densely populated cities with lots of dealers to choose from. Are most of the complaints coming from more rural areas? It makes sense that a dealer will be more motivated to please the customer when there are other dealers selling the same brand within 45 minutes in any direction.

I bought my newest VW in an auto mall where the VW dealer is squeezed between Toyota, Ford, & Mercedes. Honda, Infiniti, and Audi are all within punting range, and Nissan, Acura, Land Rover, Dodge, Hyundai, etc. are also on the same property. It makes for very healthy competition!

profvh · August 2003

This has to be an important component of good
service--Houston has intense competition with
other VW dealers as well as a huge number of
dealers selling other makes.

preferdiesels · August 2003

Is it possible to buy a car, ie: TDI Passat, in Canada and bring it to the USA without all the conversion stuff, etc? Doesn't NAFTA allow this?

dieselbreath · August 2003

Yes, there are no issues going south (other than speedometer in kmph). Going North there were some cars that didn't have the baby-seat tether strap required in Canada (in particular Audi wagons). But my TDI '98 Beetle is smog-legal in CA.

There have been so many people buying cars here that sell over MSRP in the US (like PT Cruisers ... for a while, and then Ford's T-Bird) that dealers started imposing restrictions like not allowing delivery till 10-days after purchase (means you can't claim back the sales tax when exported).

Ford actually refused to sell T-birds in Canada.
You could lease them, but it was impossible to buy one!

And late model suburbans don't exist around Vancouver ... they get snapped up and hauled on trailers to the US, where they sell for thousands more.

Actually, cars over 5 years old sell for about the same price on both sides of the border -- before $$ conversion -- meaning a 30% discount in Canada for most used cars.

Plus we had Synchro Passats with supercharged engines that were never sold in the US (rare though)!

preferdiesels · August 2003

Do they have TDI Eurovans in Canada? And if so, let me get this straight. I can go to Canada and buy one and drive it back to the USA with no "conversions" or whatever? Even though I live in Alabama I like diesels enough to do something like that.

mkarp · August 2003

Has anyone heard if the passat tdi is expected to be available in the wagon version? and if so, will the tdi 4 motion be available? this will help me to avoid buying an overpriced svu...

dudleyr · August 2003

I looked into importing a Canadian car a few years ago and it was far more complicated than just the speedo changeover. I think it is much easier with used cars though.

tdi01 · August 2003

I will have to disagree with a previous post regarding "DeMontrond here in Houston". I was terribly disappointed and furious with the buying process. I cannot comment on their service, probably because I refuse to go back. I had various questions regarding the purchase only to be deferred to "the next station". After about 5 or 6 stations and "Just Sign Here", I was enraged to find unreal interest rates! But I really wanted/needed this car (Jetta/TDI/Fa2001)... Regardless, when I went to pick up my car (I was working two full time jobs) The sales man could not wait 5 minutes past closing, left my car out back with the key behind the tire!!! THAT IS NOT WHAT I WOULD CALL GOOD CUSTOMER SERVICE... Austin's Charles Maund was about as bad... Said I would not be able to find a Sivler TDI, once I called to let them know I found one in Houston, they said they could have one in 3 days, despite my 3 weeks of patience to have them find one! (I let him order it anyway ;-) I have had much better service, scheduled and unscheduled, out of Georgetown's Don Hewlett Dealership! Sorry for the venting!

profvh · August 2003

My favorable comments on the Houston VW dealer were in regard to service. TDI0l, I'd be mad
about your buying experience too. I have, as said
before, been very happy about the service; the
buying experience was OK. I have noticed that they seem to have a big turnover of salespeople.
My salesman was gone about a month after my purchase. Don't know if this is an industrywide
problem, or one more with VW.

I have owned at least one Mercedes for many years
and it is easy to be spoiled with first class wait
rooms, helpful service people and classy customer
events such as cocktail parties, etc. VW certainly doesn't do this well but when I buy a
Benz I know this is part of what I pay for.

Overall, I'm sure VW needs to work on their dealer
network.

vwmanjimb · August 2003

The TDI Passat will be available 1st quarter of next year. VW isn't talking about anything as far as have 4MO in it. The Touareg will have 4mo in it obviously. But nothing has been said in the Passat.

ezshift5 · August 2003

.....if manual transmission will be available...ez

moparbad · August 2003

No manual transmission. No 4Motion.

mkarp · August 2003

moparbad: do you know if the tdi will be offered in the wagon? and not just the sedan?

moparbad · August 2003

Yes the Wagon is expected. Both Sedan and Wagon to be available in GLS trim only.
below are some of the changes for 2004 Passat
2004 Passat Sedan and Wagon GL, GLS, GLX and W8

* New 2.0L TDI  134 hp, 247 lb-ft of torque with advanced unit-injector technology available later in model year (preliminary figures; subject to change)
* 4MOTION also available as option on 1.8T GLS later in model year
* New exterior colors later in model year:

o Wheat Beige replacing Mojave Beige

o Stonehenge Gray replacing Fresco Green

o Samoa replacing Colorado Red

o Shadow Blue replacing Indigo Blue

o Blue Graphite replacing Blue Anthracite

o Northern Green replacing Pine Green

* New interior colors later in model year:

o Pure Beige replacing Sonnenbeige

o Anthracite replacing Black

* Wood trim available as an option with Leather Package on GLS later in model year
* New velour standard on GL and GLS later in model year
* New leatherette (Black, Beige, Gray) optional on GL and GLS later in model year
* New style 15 steel wheels standard on GL
* New style 15 alloy wheels standard on GLS
* New style 16 alloy wheels standard on GLX
* New style 16 alloy wheels standard on W8
* ESP now also standard on GLX
* Telematics optional on GL and GLS, standard on GLX and W8
* Homelink now also standard on GLS
* Monsoon now also standard on GLS
* New seatbelt reminder and fuel cap seal warning
* Side mirrors with integrated blinker later in model year

dudleyr · August 2003

I realize that the manual tranny won't be available w/ the diesel, but given that you can now special order pretty much anything you want on a VW, will you be able to special order the manual tranny? I think the way it has worked is you still have to pay for an item that is deleted, but I have no problem with paying for the automatic, but getting the manual. As long as I can get the manual. I also have no problem with waiting.

Any insight VWguild?

moparbad · August 2003

I've only heard of ONE person who has had any success with special ordering VW's. That is Peter (vwguild). And this has involved slight changes in equipment that was already being offered.
Stating "but given that you can now special order pretty much anything you want on a VW" is more of a dream than reality I expect.

If VW does not offer the manual in US then the only way you will get the manual is to obtain one from Europe and have it installed in North American Passat TDI.

dieselbreath · September 2003

unfortunately, all current Eurovan (passenger vans) are VR6 powered. The diesel was an option only in the past (like the synchro 4WD). But the commercial vans (called Transporter here) come with the turbo-diesel (I think its the old 2.5-L 5-cyl like the early Eurovan, Transporter, and Audi cars rather than the TDI found in Jettas, etc.)

But you may find a used one. There is a Blue Eurovan here in Ladner with the turbo-diesel, factory alloys, and rear "barn doors". They're rare, but they exist.

Plus, there are camper conversions based on the diesel commercial vans. They also have the advantage of the long wheel-base compared to the Eurovan. My former director of marketing has one, and she's driven to Mexico from Canada 3 times in it!

Some of the Eurovan passenger vans in Canada have the longer wheel-base plus the dual sliding doors.
But VW discontinued the dual sliding doors (the same year that Dodge "invented them" on their mini-vans) citing safety concerns with children exiting into traffic. There's a burgundy Eurovan that I see around town occasionally with both sliders plus the long wheel-base. I don't know if its a diesel or gas.

I know a guy importing VWs and parts from Germany.
He's getting a container now with many parts plus a TDI Transporter truck. He may be able to import a diesel van that you could buy.

gan1812 · September 2003

I just heard from Peter Savale of VW Guild that TDI's are not available for sale in CA and the North East for 2004. So all diesel fans, better get your TDI's right now, they are flying off the lots, fast..

dieselbreath · September 2003

The local dealers are getting ready for the onslaught of Taxi companies once the TDI arrives.
Imagine: the space of a Chev Impala, better handling, over 40 MPG in town, less maintenance, longer life, and better resale value. Every Taxi owner/operator will be lining up for these cars!

ike3 · September 2003

Not sure about the whole Northeast as the previous
author has indicated. Certainly NY, MA, VT, ME.
Bordering states might be affected, but that is up to
VW, not due to regulations. Same in the West, CA
for sure, as well as states that share a border with CA.
So for 2004-05, certainly they will not be sold, unless
  the CA observing state grants a waiver...which has not
  occurred to my knowledge.
    Also, I am not so sure that maintenance would be
cheaper with the use of this engine. I have spoken
to VW service in the Rochester area. They claim that
by 40k miles, the engines were filthy with deposits and
that gaskets in some cases had to be replaced. The
deposits due mainly to the high sulfer content in the
fuels here in NY state. Diesel engines operate under
a harsher environment...at higher pressures. I am
speaking of the TDI's in Jettas and Golfs, the 1.9 eng.
    So, while MPGs are going to be higher, thus saving
the user $$ in fuel costs...remember that higher costs
of maintenance could negate those savings over time.
Perhaps the hybrid may be the way to go. Why not
a hybrid VW? Perhaps these issues with the TDI will
go away with the introduction of low sulfer fuel, which
will be phased in by 2006.
   Then, and only then will the TDI perhaps be legal
again in those CA emission states, including mine.

corvette · September 2003

Don't hold your breath. The current Golf/Jetta/Beetle TDI only gets 34 MPG in town with an automatic transmission. We'll see how the Passat fares in the EPA test. Given VW's reliability ratings, and my own personal experience, I would suggest that in exhange for less required maintenance, VW owners spend more on repairs (not necessarily related to the extended maintenance interval).

mkarp · October 2003

When are the diesel passats expected to hit the show rooms? I tried to find info on the vw site but could not find any mention of it. And to verify, they are being built in Germany, right?

moparbad · October 2003

Late Deceber 03. Built in Germany.

dieselbreath · November 2003

from people that I've talked to who have driven new Passat TDIs in Europe. I asked why just the 5-spd tip and not the 6-spd or CVT (I thought the CVT would be ideal with a TDI) and they say that the 5-speed tip just works very smoothly in combination with the new engine and they're a great match.

RE mileage not as good with an auto: ALL taxis around here are automatics, and the only useful comparison is the Passat TDI against a chev Impala (which is the only popular taxi vehicle).
Also, Jettas have the old 4-spd auto.

The Passat's cost of ownership will be MUCH lower, and resale is MUCH higher than anything coming from Detroit. And complaints about VW reliability? Compared to what? One of my employees is driving a GM sedan less than 2 years old and the front end is falling apart already!
He's already had the windshield replaced under warantee because you couldn't see out at an angle ... the quality of the glass was so bad (all wavy). VW complaints come from VW owners because they are very picky. They'd complain a lot more if they had to drive something else...

fdanna · November 2003

Sulfur in American diesel fuel is a real problem. I wonder how the engine will be modified to operate on the low quality American diesel fuel without adversely affecting performance and reliability.

moparbad · November 2003

VW has a particulate trap ready for the Passat TDI. It is being used in Europe. Will it be used in North America on the 2004? Time will tell.

aroneng · November 2003

Does anyone have more information about the engine? Timing belt/timing chain, unit injectors/common rail, maintenance intervals/maintenance costs. Anyone had a chance to drive a passat with this diesel engine?

moparbad · December 2003

dieselbreath Mar 26, 2003 1:54am

Did you get that Passat TDI that you ordered in March of 03?

stampmetal · December 2003

I rented the 130 HP Passat TDI Wagon in Germany. It had the 6-spd tranny. Amazing acceleration (the turbo lag was not too annoying). I topped it out at 137 mph on the straight and flats. Combined autobahning and urban stop and go, it avg'd right about 30 mpg (also amazing). I'd buy one in a snap. Fabulous vehicle. Haven't yet driven one with the auto tranny.

ottawa_tdi · December 2003

I think that bringing back the Passat TDI is excellent move by Volkswagen. Here in Canada we will soon be having to live by the regulations set out in Kyoto accord. While a hybrid car looks good on paper in terms of fuel effiency they do not have the "real world experience" Try this, I have a 1999 Jetta TDI with 285,000 kms on it. These were not easy ones either. This was the first car that both my brother and I drove and as you can imagine there were some hard miles put into that car, being teenagers and all!! (racing home to make curfews!!) All we have done is replaced the timing belts (as scheduled) and changed the engine oil at our local Canadian Tire store (They keep a small amount of filters on hand that fit the TDI) Hybrid technology although it has potential is still much too complicated. Now Volkswagen is bring back an excellent option in a beautiful car!! The only thing else that I could ask for is that they put the 6 speed option and 4 motion on it as well!!

motownusa · December 2003

I doubt diesels are going to be good sellers in North America where gasoline is cheap and people prefer smooth quiet ride and strong acceleration. How can you stand the puttering noise of a diesel engine?

jrct9454 · December 2003

Sounds like someone who hasn't tried the latest generation of diesels. The Passat with the new engine will deliver all of those things: smooth, quiet ride, strong acceleration, and no extra noise. You really need to experience the difference in the last few years worth of technology advance. Anyone who has rented one overseas in the past couple of years can tell the difference.

ottawa_tdi · December 2003

I'd have to disagree with the member who thought that diesels wouldn't be good sellers. I think that once people drive them or more of them get out there that many of the misconceptions about them will be erased. In fact, when we drive up many people are supprised that our Jetta TDI is in fact a Diesel car. I think people view Diesels as the crappy unreliable ones that were brought out by GM many years ago, the truth being that they couldn't be farther from the truth. Now my dream would be to have BMW bring one of their diesel engines over to North America and put it in one of the 3 series cars! Now that would be amazing!!

profvh · December 2003

jrct9454 is right on the money concerning diesels.
The common rail diesel engine which is a heavy
seller in Europe is smooth, quiet, powerful and
not smelly. Of course, European refineries are
ahead of US refineries because they have removed
the sulfur problem. 2006 US regulations will
bring us up to European diesel standards. I have
traveled extensively in Germany, Switzerland and
Austria. In Munich or Vienna, for example, I have
not been aware of diesel soot or noise problems
at all. These diesels are light years ahead of
the GM converted diesels of the late 1970s and
1980s in the United States. I can speak from
experience: I owned a 1978 Olds 88 diesel for 1
year. Fortunately, I dumped it as reports came
about them blowing up. GM used a regular gas
engine block for the diesel. I may buy a VW or
MB diesel, but will wait until US diesel fuel
improves.

motownusa · December 2003

Even the best diesel engine cannot match the refinement of a comparable gasoline engine. I know diesel technology has come a long way in the last twenty years. In Europe diesels are popular because gasoline costs more than 4 bucks a gallon. Fuel efficiency is a bigger factor in Europe than in the US in deciding what type of car to buy. Besides, most pumps in the US don't even carry diesel fuel anyway. A lot has to change in this country before diesel becomes truly popular.

VW Passat TDI

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