Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Popular New Cars
Popular Used Sedans
Popular Used SUVs
Popular Used Pickup Trucks
Popular Used Hatchbacks
Popular Used Minivans
Popular Used Coupes
Popular Used Wagons
Comments
The point is - the RX300/330 are NOT designed for high performance. We'll be returning our RX300 off lease in a month or two and a test drive of the RX330 revealed it's got better speed - and the old RX was already fine in all kinds of traffic.
Those of you coming to SUVs for the first time from regular cars, performance or not, will find out THEY ARE DIFFERENT - duh! After minivans and Explorers and Mountaineers - the RX300 has been a dream vehicle.
BMW built the first SUV in a performance category; Infiniti's FX35/45 are obviously designed to fit that bill and that's why their owners bought them - not to carry dogs, not to carry kids to soccer - but for performance and handling capabilities. A relative had a '01 MDX and it proved to be a reliable, fine vehicle with a fantastic residual value - but the fit and finish and interior material selection is only a "B" grade compared the to RX330's A grade.
I personally like high performance - and I get that in a '02 Mustang GT convertible that I mod - but, for us, performance in a SUV would be a total waste - so why put up with the compromises in ride, space (check the back of a X5!) luxury, fit & finish, space, dealer support, etc. that the high performance in SUVs usually mandates? Your mileage may vary.
Sorry, gotta go...out to the drag strip with the wife's RX300 and beat-up on all the slammed Exploders, Troopers, Pilots, and Not-So-Grand Caravans. And darn those Escalades!
Whoops - more oozing.
In response to gteach26, yes, I personally like to turn off the A/C if I only need heat. With the A/C on, there is more noise, the car is marginally less peppy, and because the revs are raised slightly to compensate for the A/C, the slightly higher stall speed bothers me. Unless I consciously put more pressure on the brake pedal at idle, the car will creep forward on me.
"Compared with its predecessor, the RX330 is quicker and quieter, and it provides better braking and handling."
One interesting tidbit I did not know. The tire pressure monitor does not activate any warning if all the tires are equally low.
They praised the powertrain and "car-like" handling, but I think they stopped short of calling it a high performance machine (and risking the chastisement from certain individuals within this forum!) I think they were fair with their criticism. For example, they note the pronounced body lean during cornering.
Among the competition: Although the overall score for the VW Touareg was "very good", it was ranked last among all entries in CR's Luxury SUV category. The XC90 T6 was rated slightly above the T-Reg, and the FX35 slightly above that.
I received my performance pkg/NAV from the first shipment off the boat in my area (March). Although I'm a previous Lexus owner, I did extensive study on the 330 and was convinced it would be a great vehicle for my wife (most of the time) and for me (weekends & vacation travel). We are empty nesters so I bought the 330 primarily for luxury and reliability. I added the performance package because I wanted a little spunk with my luxury.
To sum up our feelings about the 330 to date, it has met or exceeded all our expectations whether as a daily commuter or taking an extended vacation trip to Florida. The build remains rock-solid, reliability superb, and the performance has been more than enough for us.
The 330 is not for everybody. If you have several kids or a growing family, then the 330 is probably not for you. If you are seeking a high performance SUV, then the 330 will probably not fit your bill. But if you are seeking a nice combination of luxury, reliability, driveability, and prestige, then the 330 should be strongly considered.
The 330 is not a perfect vehicle, but I think Toyota understands its target consumers as well as any car maker (close to 8400 sold last month--no other luxury SUV model comes close) and the 330 touches most of the bases that folks in this vehicle segment are looking for.
As for overall performance, I would read the latest MT assessment. I think it hits pretty close on the mark (although I wouldn't characterize the transmission as "mayonnaise") and the FX35/45 is clearly a better performance vehicle. But all things considered, the 330 works best for me, and by the sales numbers a lot of other folks feel the same.
But notice the their RX 330 (one that was not provided for the press by Lexus) only did 0-60 in 8.8 seconds. That confirms that the MDX is more than a half-second slower than the MDX. To put it in perspective, the MDX is slower than the FX35 by about the same margin. So if you won't notice that the MDX is slower than the FX35, you probably won't notice that the RX330 is slower than the MDX. But if you DO notice that the MDX is slower than the FX35, then you will also notice, as both my wife and I did, that the RX is slower than the MDX.
What's more troubling for the RX330 is that the 45-65mph passing time is about a full second slower than the MDX. To put this in perspective, the MDX was only a half-second slower than the FX35 for passing. So passing improves quite noticably moving from the RX330 to the MDX, but not as much so moving from the MDX to the FX35.
The consumer's report does exactly what it should do. It give the RX330 a best-in-class rating while still noting the downsides of the vehicle. The also recommend the RX330, MDX and FX35 (but not the X5, XC90 or Toureg) and then make statements like: if sportiness is important, choose the FX35.
Note that consumers like BMW and Infinti best for steering feel. MDX did well, but not as good as Infiniti and BMW. RX330 steering was described as a bit dull.
So the RX330 falls down in some areas but more than makes up for them in others - rightfully earning right to be called the best. (Now let's just figure out how to reprogram that air conditioning.)
Also I need to ask, are you buying regular grade fuel? I wonder if the acceleration would improve if you tried premium? Our dealer recommended at least mid-grade (90 octane) for better performance.
Or for more convience you can add a switch in the same line. The A/C ECU is mounted just under the passenger side glove box.
THere is a definite danger involved in allowing the A/C to operate without the owners knowledge in the wintertime in defrost mode. ONce you leave defrost mode the accumulated mositure will oftentimes quickly eavaporate into the airstream and suddenly fog the cold windshiled over again.
If the interior of your windshield should fog up during cooler weather, even slightly, turn up the heating level dramatically and then activate the defrost function.
Regretably your Lexus service managers are correct. THe bottom line is the fact that Lexus has improved the MPG rating by restricting exiting airflow from the vehicle.
With little "conditioned" airflow leaving the vehicle the A/C compressor doesn't have to cycle as often and the blower can run much slower and the A/C condensor functionality also becomes more efficient.
But all that also results in the mositure from human body functions and the many other sources remaining within the vehicle for extended periods. Lexus' answer (NipponDenso, Denso US, really) is to "supply" extraodinarily "dry" incoming airflow by dehumidifying it via the use of the A/C.
Sound like a "Catch 22"? IT IS!
The other dilema, much more serious, is that they truly believe the A/C system can ALWAYS be used to defog the windshield when the laws of physics clearly define that it cannot.
My procedure, LS400 and RX300, is to disable, completely, the A/C during the winter months. If I happen to need windshield defog/demist functionality (much less likely without massive amounts of moisture being accumulated within the A/C plenum by the condensor) I first turn up the heating level and then activate the defog/demist function.
My 92 LS is equipped with a switch just by my right knee which adds a resistor in series with the cabin temperature sensor making the climate control "think" the cabin is COLD, which I flip just before activating the defog function. That same capability is available in the RX with a quick clockwise twist of the temperature setpoint knob.
THe 92 LS also has four 12 volt muffin fans mounted within the rear truck quarter panels to serve as airflow extraction fans when the system is switched to defog/demist or when the rear window defog is on.
Happy motoring...
I'd like to repeat my question from post #1235, since it was not directly answered. At the risk of appearing incredibly dense, why not turn off the A/C button on the center console? You know, the one located next to the air recirculation button. Or is the A/C button omitted if you have the NAV option??
And, additionally, it's really something of a task to always remember to turn the A/C off each and every time the system turns it back on.
"set it" and forget it I say!
In most cars with climate control, the system will decide when to turn on (engage the clutch) the compressor based on the temperature selected by the driver and the actual inside temperature. There is also usually a button, "econ," "AC", or something similar, on the dashboard that gives the driver the ability to prevent the compressor from ever being turned on automatically.
From what I have read here, it sounds as if there is no way to disable the compressor on the RX330 short of hard wiring in some sort of in-line switch.
Is that true?
In an earlier post on this list, I believe I read that you can ask the dealer to program the climate control computer, or whatever, so that you have the ability to turn off the compressor.
Is that true?
I know there are times when you would like to run the compressor AND the heat at the same time... I would like to be the one to make that decision. If the temperature is 70 degrees in and out; I don't want the compressor to be running.
Does anyone know for sure how this all works??
Thanks in advance.
Al Jennings
a. There was a lawsuit against Lexus about 10 years ago - and the plaintiff lost in court over his claim that the windshield fogging in a LS400 was a deadly design fault and We All Were Going to Die If We Were Dumb Enough to Buy a Lexus etc etc
b. Since that time the same plaintiff has purchased several more Lexus models with essentially the same exact Denso HVAC system - including two RX models; he also claims he is buying a third RX, a 2004 RX330, in the near future
c. Each Lexus vehicle that this plaintiff buys he then modifies with various little electrical bits of this or that, a relay here, a resistor there.
d. Meanwhile, back at Lexus Central, the RX is selling at an all-time record pace with the new 330 model. It's the only current Lexus model selling at or near MSRP at many dealerships with waiting lists.
e. Along with thousands of other long time RX300 owners that watch these boards, I've had not a single problem with my windshield fogging to any degree beyond what all my other vehicles have done in the past and continue to do today.
f. I will give you my Secret Plan - ready?
When it fogs up, I turn on the A/C, set the fan at high speed, hit the button marked Windshield -and guess what? In 20-40 seconds...the fog is gone! A miracle of modern automotive science - how DO they do it?!
Bottom line? If you're interested in saving $20 a year on a $42k vehicle and cutting-up Home Depot furnace filters to replace the factory recirculation one behind your upcoming RX330's glove box, then you have found your leader.
Gosh, sure hope someone can write a post asking about the RX Nav system and then the RX AWD system and the "poison air that will kill us all" - that's the reasoning behind a recent post on this board that "Lexus wants to improve fuel economy so they don't pull enough fresh air into the vehicle so I had to install several muffin fans to get the job done." Inquiring minds have got to know - blueberry or banana?
So next time you read about the Lexus Killer Fog or the Lexus Killer AWD or the Lexus Killer Air Trapped Inside...remember, this same plaintiff has purchased what, 4?...5?...6? Lexus vehicles?
Judge for yourself the likely validity of the fogging complaint... aginst the 300-400,000 RX owners since 1999 that have had no problems.
We all bring our cumulative biases and experiences into any discussion including you! Everyone knows how to filter that out so it doesn't require broadcasting. :-)
Let's stay on topic and not discuss each other.
tidester, host
How often, roughly, would you say you have to switch on the A/C, not for cooling purposes, but solely to defog the interior? I guess to make my question easier to understand, maybe I should word it this way: Do you find that you have to have the A/C on almost all the time -- for cooling in the summer, and for defogging in the winter?
And in reference to your post #1257, with all due respect, I think it is not surprising that the "problem" with the HVAC does not generate a lot of negative reaction with the buying public. The reason is that for most people, when they buy a vehicle with auto climate control, they have no problem just dialing in their preferred temp, set the system on auto and just leave it for life. But there are some people (I'm one, perhaps Mr. Jennings is another) who don't like the compressor on all the time. The marginally higher fuel consumption doesn't bother me too much. But when the compressor is on, it does dull the car's response slightly, but noticeably, along with a bit more noise and vibration. And that bothers me.
So even though most will say "So what" when they hear the A/C has to be always on, I don't think this issue should be dismissed as only wwest's whimsical fantasy.
I remember years ago a vacuum operated switch that would shut off the A/C compressor during acceleration because the vacuum was much less in that mode. This may help the owners who don't want to give up their performance when the A/C compressor is on. Do you remember this switch? I didn't see one in my latest JC Whitney catalog, and my brief web search failed to turn up one.
lampen: Are you really sure about this? I would sincerely wish it so. I would like nothing more than to have the dealer be able to turn the HEAT up when I activate defrost/defog/demist on colder days when the incoming airflow is already colder than the A/C condensor is allowed, HARD programmmed, to go.
I just completed the class on Aug 9,2003 in Wisconsin and the only word to sum it up is FUN.
http://www.lexusdrivingschool.com
My interpretation is that we can turn off the compressor via the A/C Button -- much more simply than modifying the wiring. The caveat is that this button may need to be pushed each time we start the car, if we want to turn off the compressor. To me, no big deal. Another caveat is that the compressor is automatically engaged if you hit the Defog control button. As Jeff mentioned, you can avoid the defog button by setting airflow direction to the windshield and manually adjusting the fan speed.
My wife and I have owned nearly a dozen different automobiles with auto climate control. None of them automatically engaged or disengaged the compressor based on differences in inside/outside air temperature. I guess I am one of the "buying public" who doesn't see a significant problem.
We drove 400 miles from Oxnard to San Francisco without any doubt this is the best long cruiser vehicle I've ever driven after my 1989 MB W124 (300E).
In my previous climate control cars (MB280 and Ford Taurus) I would set the interior temperature between 68 and 70 and generally be comfortable during the day time regardless of outside temperature. With the RX330 system, I find that I need to set it between 76 and 80 to get the same level of comfort.
Does anyone else have the same problem.
jjefmust2: Shame on you. You don't understand that we all want to hear about a 1992 LS400 and all of the master mechanical wizardry about pressure switches and added interior fans. Don't you realize that everyone on this posting is concerned about the model that we clicked on to get into this message board. Remember it was RX330. There are a couple of posters here that are trying to outdo each other and trying to impress us . They are boring. Get with the program. We don't care about you guys and your "dueling wrenches" to see who can try and impress us. Most of us don't even know how to open the hood of a RX 330 and don't care to learn. Some of us do know what end of a "Snap-ON" to pick up as those guys do also. But, go away and stay on topic. You win. We're impressed. Get a life. What we are attempting to resolve is the disastrous climate control system on the new RX330. Not what you did on a '92 Lexus that's probably "Wrecker Bait". Every time he drives past a tow truck the trucks lights start flashing!!!
Back on topic. Does anyone have the E-mail address or phone number for Lexus Complaint Department? I'm tired in getting the run around at the dealerships with; bring it in and we'll make some fine tuning adjustments but the AC will stay on. If I push the AC button off, then there is no AC. I want to be able to set the temperature at 72 degrees with the auto on and the AC on and just drive the vehicle. When it's warmer than 72 then the AC comes on. Cooler, then the heater warms the cabin up!!! Why doesn't it do this. Look at American built "junk" (Escalade, Navigator, or even other European SUV's) They all work the way they are advertised. Not this 330.
Hey jjeff2, I'll probably get my butt busted too.
I have asked previously if anyone is having trouble with rock chips on the front (Bamboo Pearl). I have 5 and my RX has 5500 miles on it. I have never had this happen on any vehicle I've owned before. The RX is not my daily driver and has been professionally waxed. Any takers??
One more thing. The passenger seat belt buckle is driving me crazy hitting the side of the pillar. Any suggestions to fix this. It will not stay up and will only go so far down. I thought about a cloth, girls pony tail holder, but would that look ridiculous on a near 50k automobile?
My Lexus dealer is having a hard time keeping up with servicing owner's cars. 3 wk wait to get in!!
Ray
I do agree that in the winter using Auto will turn on the AC and the heater, so I turn off the AC.
All of this is kind of weird, but its something I guess I adjusted too. I am looking at getting a 330 next January, so I am curious if this is the same or if it is changed in the new model.
I have noticed a few other quirks with the vehicle as delivered relating to the door locks, navigation and DVD entertainment. As a whole, though, the RX330 is excellent and to be recommended.
Safety is an additional factor for considering the RX330, as the MDX does not yet have head-protection curtain airbags. That seems to be quite an oversight for a 2003 premium SUV! Meanwhile, the RX now has 7 airbags. Also, Consumer Reports just recently reported that the MDX's stability control system does not intervene as effectively as the system in the RX330.
I had previously favored the MDX over the RX300, but now I favor the RX330. I think Lexus did a terrific job of redesiging this model while adding some desirable features.