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Transmission problems with Lexus ES?

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Comments

  • psasalespsasales Member Posts: 4
    Still having problems. They had flown in someone from Lexus to validate my problem (which they did). They are now in the process of replacing the trans. (which I do not think will work because every ES350 loaner they had given me had this problem). If this does not work or I experience any problems related to the replacement, I am going to demand a repurchase. My car only had 7,000 miles on it.
  • mbulgermbulger Member Posts: 1
    We bought a 2007 ES330 in May 2006. It blew a tranny within the first week! Lexus replaced it (after a 2 week wait) and
    in good faith reimbursed the fee we paid for the extended warranty (around $2200) and paid our first month's car payment. Now, 4 months later its in the shop again with tranny problems (now with only 7,000 miles on it). They've had it for 11 more days so far. We're hoping they'll keep it another week so it falls under the California Lemon Law. We're gonna ask for a refund instead of another Lexus. Its our first Lexus and
    definitely our LAST.
  • rggsimsrggsims Member Posts: 6
    My car missed the gear when shifting from 1st to 2nd and then from 4 th to 5th when it was cold. The dealer replaced the valve body assembly (thats what they told me) and the car shifted great for two months, until yesterday when it missed a gear between 3rd and 4th. It missed the gear when it was warm this time. Back to the shop again.
  • mojcmhmojcmh Member Posts: 2
    Follow-up on previous post. Lexus covered $1,000 for the remanufactured transmission. I was told Lexus did this based on the vehicle maintenance record. The vehicle was maintained by the dealership at regular suggested intervals ($$$). A Lexus rep admitted that the company is not happy to see a transmission go at 107,000 miles. Looking back, the car always had a hesitation and RPM flareup between 1st and 2nd on cold starts in cold weather. Still does. I am not sure if that was a cause of the early failure. I should have complained from the start and insisted that my concerns be part of the maintenance record. Given that the vehicle is 7 years old, with 107,000 miles, Lexus' agreement to pay $1,000 strikes me as reasonable. Other manufacturers would have offerred the emtpy set.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    Sorry, but most other manufacturers are not building transaxles that have control firmware that operates them in a mode for which they were not mechanically designed.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    Impossible to believe...

    Ford has the answer.....!

    From the new 2007 Ford Edge PR..

    "The electronically shift controlled transmission also features a variable displacement pump, which matches the amount of fluid that gets pushed through the transmission to driver demand, making it more efficient."

    At full lift-throttle all of the FWD Toyota/lexus vehicles begin an upshift just as the engine RPM drops to idle. With the engine at idle the upshift will exhaust/use most, or possibly all, of the pressurized ATF.

    Now if you happen to re-apply foot pressure to the accelerator pedal just as the upshift begins the engine/transaxle ECU will "know" to delay the onset of engine until the low engine "idle" RPM can build enough ATF pressure to complete the corresponding downshift.

    The most obvious answer would be to increase the volume of the fixed volume ATF pump so enough pressure/flow could be provided for two sequential QUICK shifts with the engine at idle. But then most of that added volume would be bypassed, disapated as heat, as the engine RPM rises above idle.

    Ford's answer, apparently, is to have a variable displacement ATF pump so it can be switched to high volume when quick/SOLID shifting is required with the engine at idle. Makes me wonder if that allowed them to eliminate the ATF pressure bypass relief spring/valve also.

    That would REALLY increase transaxle efficiency.

    A second option would havre been to have an ATF pressure storage accumulator (like the ABS pumpmotor asembly). But putting one of those in an already "crowded" six-speed transaxle is probably out of the question.

    Anyone know if any of the newer Toyota/Lexus transaxles have either? Absent one or the other the delay/hesitation issue will undoubtedly continue.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    I heard that Automotive News has a new article about Toyota transmission hesitation. Anyone subscribe?
  • ykl2869ykl2869 Member Posts: 4
    I took it back to Lexus dealer service. They had Lexus tech. person look at it and he recommended replacing the transmission. They said the problem was not inherent to the design but from during the manufacturing process and replacing with new transmission will solve the problem. I only have 3400 miles on it. It still is a new car. I am feel reluctant but I don't know what other option there is. I will let you know the outcome.
  • rileyjrileyj Member Posts: 13
    What is the manufacturing date code for the ones reporting the transmission problem?
  • garmogarmo Member Posts: 20
    My ES 350 with 10,000 miles is at the dealer having the transmission replaced. We'll see if that fixes the problem.
  • ykl2869ykl2869 Member Posts: 4
    They put in new transmission but did not fix the problem. Frustrating... Dealer said Lexus will give me an extended warantee but don't have any details from Lexus yet. I don't know what my next option can be. RPM flares only first few minutes just after starting then goes away and car drives great until next cold start. I am not sure if Lemon Law can be applied for this situation. I don't think it's any safety issue? Maybe transmission durability issue? Any suggestions?
  • garmogarmo Member Posts: 20
    Lexus recently replaced my transmission, also. So far, I have not experienced any RPM flare between 3rd and 4th gears, which I was previously experiencing after the car had been sitting all night or all day. Check your state's lemon law. In Texas, the lemon law applies if the market value of the car is materially diminished as a result of the defect.
  • tedescm1tedescm1 Member Posts: 309
    I'm considering the purchase of a 2003 ES 300 with 15,000 miles. Did the 2003 have transmission problems?

    tx,
  • ykl2869ykl2869 Member Posts: 4
    Lexus is offering me 7/100000 extended warrantee. Dealer service manager says they have done all they could by replacing with new transmission per Lexus Tech. Specialist's direction and advise me to talk to Lexus directly for any further concern. I will talk to Lexus to see if I can get reimbursed for any diminished value. I wonder what kind of lost value can I demand? Pursuing with the Lemon Law is in my mind as last resort but...is getting an extended warrantee enough...I am not sure. Wish me luck.
  • hub23hub23 Member Posts: 2
    I want to purchase a Lexus ES350, but now I am a little leary :( because they are having transmission problems. This is a major downer. Ive checked on other vehicles, but I want this one. Q & A :What state are you in? How often do you drive the car? & When did you experience the transmission problem(cold,hot,hills,flat)?
  • carpadiumcarpadium Member Posts: 6
    I looked at a loaded '05 ES330 today with 31k on it which I think I can get for $27500. The tranny discussion has me spooked. I am wondering when this first became an issue. I might just save myself money on the front-end and back-end and buy a '99 or '00 LS400 but finding them with 40k miles or less is difficult which is the max mileage I am comfortable with. I also really like all the goodies like nav, Levinson sound, and heat/cool seats in the '05 model I looked at.

    Also does anyone know if a TSB has been issued for the problem?
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    "..I am wondering when this first became an issue...."

    I suspect the seeds were planted in about 98, with the introduction of the 1999 RX300. The earliest documented evidence was produced by Toyota themselves in a TSB issued in the spring of 2003 concerning the throttle lag, 1-2 second engine/transaxle downshift delay, new Camry owners were reporting.

    To this date Toyota has not presented any evidence, publically, that the issue has been resolved, complaints continue to be posted even concerning the 2007 models.
  • curt2005curt2005 Member Posts: 70
    On my 2005 ES330, the hesitation happens sometimes if I accelerate slowly. If I need to merge onto the freeway or otherwise accelerate for sure, I stab the pedal and it takes off just fine.

    See #1221 earlier in this forum
    curt2005, "Transmission problems with Lexus ES?" #1222, 28 Aug 2006 8:50 pm

    There are two interesting replies in the thread.

    I think that this is a side effect of an algorithm in the engine computer designed to get better mileage and/or emissions ratings in the standard tests. It has been an issue with several Toyota models for several years.

    For me, the 330 has turned out to be a great car.
  • carteachcarteach Member Posts: 179
    I too am seriously considering purchasing a "certified" '05 or '06 330. I took each for a short test drive today on I95... just between exits. I'm not clear when and how this hesitation/lag shows up. Should I ask to be driving it a lot further? How can I see if the car I'm about to purchase has this problem?

    Also does a certified used car come under the Lemon Law or does the car have to be brand new?

    Thanks for any info you can give me.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    Apparently the throttle lag, 1-2 second transaxle downshift delay most commonly occurs when you re-apply pressure to the gas pedal shortly after fully releasing same.

    What apparently is happening is that in an effort to improve the overall safety of FWD or front torque biased AWD vehicles vs their RWD brotheren the transaxle shift pattern has been revised to prevent engine compression braking altogether, just as Ford has done in the FWD/AWD Escape and Mariner hybrids.

    The primary difference being, seemingly, that Ford only uses this technique if the OAT is hovering around or below freezing whereas Toyota and Lexus appear to use it all year around.

    So my guess would be that to most easily duplicate the delay/hesitation one would need to first accelerate at a high enough rate to force a downshift, then fully release the throttle, then re-apply throttle pressure, all in a relatively short sequence, time period.

    Thereby forcing a downshift(for quick acceleration), quickly followed by an upshift (so as to alleviate or reduce the level of engine compression braking) resulting from a FULL lift-throttle situation, and lastly, another downshift as a result of re-application of gas pedal pressure.

    With the engine RPM having dropped to idle on that initial FULL lift-throttle event there will not be enough ATF pressure/flow to sustain two sequential transaxle shift sequences, and so the DBW system will now NOT allow the engine to develop any significant level of torque until that second shift, downshift, has completed.

    Seemingly both Ford and VW have this same throttle lag, 1-2 second downshift delay in their FWD automatic transaxle vehicles. Ford has just announced that the new Ford Edge transaxle will be equipped with a variable displacement ATF pump to improve transaxle efficiency.

    While it will undoubtedly, NO DOUBT, improve efficiency I suspect the base reason is to have a HIGH flow rate available with LOW engine RPM without otherwise incurring HUGE losses at normal cruise engine RPM.

    A HIGH ATF pump flow rate at engine idle would eliminate the need for the DBW to intervene and delay engine torque buildup.
  • carpadiumcarpadium Member Posts: 6
    After doing a lot of research, I found that an Acura TL was comparable and seemingly more performance oriented than the ES of the same year. I ended up buying an '03, 50k miles, TL 3.2 (not the Type-S) and after tax, license, extended warranty (4 yrs/100k mi/$0 ded./bumper-to-bumper) and LOJACK, got out the door at just over $20k. That's the same as I paid in '98 for my then-new Saturn SL2.

    I have since driven the TL from Sacramento to SF and back and given a workout on some back roads. I have driven in light rain, day and night, and could not be happier with it. Okay, I could be happier if I paid less or got more features like ventilated seats, but it has lots of goodies, drives like a dream and even if it does develop problems, which is unlikely, I have them covered. :)
  • carteachcarteach Member Posts: 179
    I was all set to buy the Lexus. Smooth ride, incredible interior. But there's no Lemon Law even for a certified car; and too many people crazed because of tranny problems which affect safety of car. So like you I bought an Acura. I pick it up tomorrow.

    Good luck with yours.
  • carteachcarteach Member Posts: 179
    I received the following email from one of the certified Lexus salesmen in Westport, CT. Very personable guy, who has stayed on top of his job.I find Toyota's behavior not only unconscionable, but suicidal from a business point of view.


    Hi Nancy,

    I have an '06 ES330 that will be ready tomorrow late in the day. It is Mystic Pearl(medium green metallic) with beige interior. Is this something you would like to take a look at?

    Call me or reply to this email and let me know. I will be here from 9am to 8pm tomorrow.

    Look forward to hearing from you.


    The following is my reply to him. (for all the good it will do.)Hi______

    The Lexus sounds beautiful. Just what I would have wanted. But I decided to purchase an Acura which I'm picking up tomorrow.

    Frankly, and you can pass this on to the powers that be, all the discussion of the Lexus tranny issues on every board made me nervous. A number of people had been given replacement cars. (These were new car buyers.) A number of people with new cars were invoking the Lemon Law. And many others were just saying that they'd always bought Lexus; but this was going to be their last one and that they couldn't wait to trade it in.

    I was very sad to give up the idea of buying a Lexus. I think they are beautifully appointed with a smooth, smooth ride. But transmissions that hesitate when you're trying to merge far outweighs the beauty of the car. As a matter of fact, I've heard there are unhappy customers with the 350.

    Maybe salespeople aren't supposed to talk about the transmission problems, even when asked. But it would make more sense if you all would be able to admit there's been an issue and then offer some kid of reassurance that the car you're selling had not been turned in for that reason... etc. etc.

    Sorry for the length of this. In no way am I flaming you. Just a word to pass on to Toyota who seems to have this problem in many of their Camrys, Avalons, etc.and has from what I've heard still not found a fix for this problem.

    I wish you well, (Wish Toyota/Lexus had made the improvements so I would have been able to purchase one of your beautiful cars.)

    Nancy
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    Nicely written making good points.
  • tedescm1tedescm1 Member Posts: 309
    Yes...good message that should apply to all manufactures who tend to dismiss problems by telling you "it’s normal”.

    I’m thinking of my poor Acura experience which eventually ended up in a law suit.
  • garmogarmo Member Posts: 20
    Probably a good move to buy the Acura. Wish I had. Lexus replaced the transmission in my 2007 ES 350 a couple of months ago because of an "RPM flare" between 3rd and 4th gear when the car was driven in the morning after sitting overnight. Things were OK for awhile, but now the problem seems to be coming back. Sewell Lexus in Fort Worth, Tx has been great, but Lexus has a problem with which they need to deal.
  • curt2005curt2005 Member Posts: 70
    I think wwest may be on the right track in linking the hesitation to reducing the level of engine compression braking to improve safety.

    Would you please explain the "ATF" and "DBW" acronyms?

    Thanks.
  • user777user777 Member Posts: 3,341
    ATF = Automatic Transmission Fluid; that would be the hydraulic medium in the transmission that transmits motive forces to linkages and surfaces as various passages are permitted to flow, the valves commanded by solenoids under the direction of the TCM (Transmission Control Module) / PCM (PowerTrain Control Module) and ECU (Engine Control Unit).

    DBW = Drive By Wire. Traditional systems implemented a cable linkage between the accelerator pedal and throttle body valve. Newer systems do this "by wire" or electronically. By doing this, the request from the pedal and also the command to the throttle body valve can be monitored, augmented, and commanded through the ECU (Engine Control Unit) to achieve higher fuel efficiencies and other system objectives like those, not limited to safety and operability.

    For what it's worth (FWIW), a fairly active discussion of Hesitation in the 2007 Camry is ongoing in the 2007 Toyota Camry Woes forum.

    For instance here:
    toyotacarfan, "2007 Toyota Camry Woes" #2544, 30 Nov 2006 9:18 pm
  • david1998david1998 Member Posts: 3
    Our 2007 ES 350 started slipping after 750 miles. Around 38-40 mph this would happen intermittently. Now at 1500 mi it happens regularly at 38 mph but also at 25 mph on an incline. Not feeling very good about this purchase. David
  • ecnirpecnirp Member Posts: 20
    I posted this in another forum but maybe this is a more appropriate place.

    Recently talked to a dealer who is selling a 07 ES350 where Lexus bought it back as part of a voluntary recall. The transmission has been fixed or rebuilt and the car only has 3k miles on it.
    1. Was this an actual recall/buyback offer when the cars were first being sold?
    2. Would this be a good car to purchase since it's still under warranty?
    3. Has anyone else seen these cars available for sale - and at what price?

    Thanks.
  • bear64bear64 Member Posts: 17
    My car is starting to have the same transmission problem that you describe. Did the new part installed by your dealer solve the problem?
  • garmogarmo Member Posts: 20
    Lexus replaced the transmission about 2 mos. ago and at first it seemed like the problem was fixed, but lately I've noticed that the same problem exists when I first drive the car in the morning after it has been setting overnight. Also, the transmission seems to slip when I accelerate. It just doesn't feel like the transmissoin is right. I plan on contacting Lexus about buying the car back from me and then buy an Acura TL.
  • carteachcarteach Member Posts: 179
    I would be sitting in the seat of a "returned" ES freaking out right now if I hadn't come to this board. What a great place to share.
  • exploder750exploder750 Member Posts: 159
    Very smart move. Toyota/Lexus has a HUGE problem on its hands with this transmission flare issue, and it appears that there is no fix in sight. Buyer beware on ANY Toyota product with V6 and automatic transmission. Just check the Toyota Camry Problems & Fixes threads, you'll see many with problems same as those in this thread.
  • carteachcarteach Member Posts: 179
    I'm curious. I was reading a glowing review of the Lexus LS460. So I went to the LS board; and there was no mention that I could see of transmission problems. Does the LS have an eight cylinder engine?

    Why isn't there more about this in the newspapers? Maybe some negative publicity would help. It seems this has been going on for years and yet Consumers says Lexus is the most reliable car. What gives?
  • garmogarmo Member Posts: 20
    Yes, the LS has an 8-cylinder engine.
  • exploder750exploder750 Member Posts: 159
    Consumers has been giving Toyota the benefit of the doubt for years, but they are quietly admitting that quality issues are starting to come thru. There have been spotty reports of Toyota issues in the newspapers, but again, not enough for people to take notice. Toyota has huge momentum going for them right now, problem being that they are now cranking out problems in record numbers, and the word of mouth is going to kill them.
  • voicemailkingvoicemailking Member Posts: 83
    99-03 Acura TL's also have a tranny issue..I owned one and had 2 transmissions put in that. Not a difference from Lexus.
  • exploder750exploder750 Member Posts: 159
    I'm seeing that Honda Odyssey is having big time tranny issues as well. Buyer beware!
  • tedescm1tedescm1 Member Posts: 309
    I have a 04 tl that has been nothing but problems. Are the Japanese cars losing their quality advantage?

    You can buy a Buick for half the price of a Lexus or Acura and almost as good!

    Of course, it's not a Lexus!
  • lsilvalsilva Member Posts: 3
    I bought a 2007 ES350. I regret this purchase. The transmission had to be repaired. At 9000 miles the direct import injector rattles when the car is accelerating in the morning. My car sounds like a car from 1990. I am told that this noise is non repairable and normal. I would expect a smooths sounding car. Do not buy this car.
  • david1998david1998 Member Posts: 3
    I have been going back and forth with the dealership ofr 4 weeks now. First visit "There is NOT any problem." Second visit "We have reproduced the problem, but that's the way the car rides. Adding your wife does NOT know how to drive!" That sure made her happy.Now we are attempting to hear from the 'regional', 'district' or some other tech-type person. We sold our BMW for this PROBLEM and dealership. We regret it deeply.
  • tenpin2007tenpin2007 Member Posts: 3
    I took delivery of my 2007 ES350 in July. Noticed shortly afterwards that the transmission shifted rough between 3rd and 4th gear. Waited until my 5000 mile oil change and was told that a service technical bulletin would fix the problem. The dealer then called me after they put in the service bulletin fix and said that they had to replace the transmission. Drove the car and that transmission was also defective. The car is now on its 3rd transmission with only 7000 miles. During all of this I contacted Lexus customer satisfaction. They were useless. I told them that I wanted the car replaced. They took a wait and see what happens position. I then filed a claim with NCDS ( lemon law booklet came with the car) and was told it would now go thru arbitration. In the meantime, I saw a commercial on TV about a law group in Pennsylvania that handles these types of cases. It was thru them that the right person was contacted at Lexus and I now have a new replacement car. Love the car but it seems that Toyota is having problems with the new 6 speed CVT tranmissions.
  • user777user777 Member Posts: 3,341
    The Lexus website has this to say about the ES 6spd transmission:
    >>
    Electronically Controlled Transmission with intelligence
    (ECT-i)
    ECT-i uses electronic controls to adjust hydraulic pressure gradually for even smoother shifting. The ECT-i computer can also adjust for wear in the transmission, and even learn and respond to a person's driving behavior.
    >>

    I do not believe there is a continuously variable transmission in your vehicle.
  • garmogarmo Member Posts: 20
    Would you share the name and contact info for the Penn. law group? Thanks.
  • nik8nik8 Member Posts: 9
    First off, my apologies for asking here what is very likely a stupid question(I come from the school of thought which says that no question is stupid :) ) BUT how exactly is a 5 speed automatic transmission to be used.

    I have a 2000 Mazda 626 auto which I always drive in one gear regardless of weather/city/hwy/speed. On steep inclines I use a lower gear and when I need power I switch off the overdrive.

    So with a 5 speed automatic do the gears need to be changed while driving (what then is the use of an automatic) AND does the transmission problem on the ES300/330 occur when gears are being shifted OR does it happen regardless?

    Also, I see several threads where the poster says "gear changed from A to B, etc". Is this comment based on actually changing the gears OR is the driver sensing what gears are being engaged.
  • user777user777 Member Posts: 3,341
    i come from the same school being an engineer... the only really stupid questions being those that aren't asked, perhaps because one is instructed to follow blindly.

    i believe you were driving your Mazda w/AT as it was designed. i cannot imagine any owner's manual for an AT vehicle regardless of make or model suggesting that the AT is supposed to be operated manually all the time.

    this has been one of the more dubious suggestions reported by a few owners who were instructed to do so by the dealership.

    for 5spd automatics, one SHOULD be able to leave the vehicle in "D" most of the time and the gear selection will be done for you in a smooth and efficient manner most appropriate for conditions.

    exceptions would be towing, incline, needing extra power for passing etc. with respect to the latter, ATs that i'm familiar with will down-shift when you command lots of throttle.

    i cannot help you w.r.t. if the transmission problems exhibit themselves if the AT is manually being shifted since i don't own one of these vehicles... but i suspect it would mitigate (but probably not eliminate) a lot of problems as you are manually commanding the transmission...

    when you see posters indicating their vehicles were changing gear, it is safe to say they are indicating this based on observables like changes in engine RPM, engine sound, seat of the pants feel, etc, etc, but NOT because of the operator manually commanding a change in the gearing.
  • corrigancorrigan Member Posts: 3
    On Sunday, July 9, 2006 at approximately 3:30 P.M., I decided to stop at the grocery store. I pulled into the parking lot from and was driving slowly with my foot on the brake to enter a parking space. The parking space was located directly across from the entrance and I turned left and eased slowly into the space with my foot on the brake bringing the car to a stop. The moment I stopped, I reached over to put the car in park and all of a sudden, the car engine surged enough to move my front wheels over the car stop in an instant with my foot still on the brake. I was totally shocked and wondered what in the world was happening. Why was my car doing this? I still had my foot positioned on the brake and pushed down. The car continued to accelerate and the back tires came over the car stop. At this point, I removed my foot totally from the brake to see if the engine would slow down naturally without any action at all by me. The engine continued to surge just as fast totally on its own. I tried the brake again and the car still did not stop. I lifted my foot from the brake again and at this point realized I was going to go into the road. I looked to the left (North) and saw a car coming down the road a fair distance away. I then looked to the right (South) and saw a silver Toyota with a lady driving it. I knew at that point I was going to hit her. The collision then happened and I put the brake on again and the car finally stopped. The police cited me for failure to control. As I was waiting for my husband to pick me up after the accident, he called me and told me that he had talked to my brother and that while my brother was working at Lexus, another lady had a similar accident, only hers happened when she was pulling into her garage and her engine surged and her car ran into the garage door. I thought this was kind of a big coincidence and I decided to look into it further on the internet when I got home. The information I found out about was shocking, unbelievable, and also made me very angry. The complaints are still being made on an ongoing basis. Since the day of the accident, I went to court for my ticket.I had to hire an attorney to defend myself. The charges against me were reduced to driving an unsafe vehicle and I entered a no-contest plea. I have incurred psychological trauma and other physical injuries as a result of this accident. I would like to get out of my lease with Lexus, but Lexus won’t allow it. If Lexus acknowledges any problem with my car, they will have to acknowledge all of the other problems reported by Lexus drivers. The economic consequences would be devastating to Toyota/Lexus.

    I have since had a second sudden acceleration incident on Monday, December 4, 2006 under the same circumstances as the first. When pulling into a parking space at work returning from lunch, I had my foot lightly on the brake controlling the speed of the car as I was turning left into the parking space. Just as I gently applied more pressure to the brake to stop the car, the engine surged and the car took off again. I thought, “oh no, here we go again”. This time I was prepared and jammed the brake with all of my strength to the floor and held the brake down to the floor. The car stopped in time just short of running into the tree that was in front of my parking space. My foot was never on the accelerator pedal the whole time I was entering the parking space. I contacted Lexus customer service for the second time and they sent a tech out to inspect the vehicle. Of course, they say the vehicle is operating normally and there is nothing wrong with the vehicle.
  • guestguest Member Posts: 770
    I feel as if I'm sticking my nose in where i don't belong because after reading many of these posts, I decided not to get a Lexus though it had originally been far and away my first choice.

    I'm wondering whether all of you who've had trouble (and it seems like a lot) have tried contacting Consumer Reports which always gives glowing reviews to Lexus, or J.D. Powers or whatever government agencies might be appropriate. There is something outrageous about selling unsafe cars and continuing to do so since the redesigned '07 Lexus and the '07 Avalons etc. still display the same issues.

    (My Acura is not as smooth or quiet a ride as a Lexus, nor does it have as luxurious an interior; but so far it's been reliable.)
  • user777user777 Member Posts: 3,341
    there will be those that are most certain you touched the gas pedal, thinking you were on the brake, or perhaps you had a floor mat stick the accelerator pedal to some non zero position.

    there are others who believe it's possible you have a problem with one of the DBW (drive by wire) components in the vehicle (like the accelerator pedal mechanicals or sensors, the throttle body mechanicals or sensors, the valve positioning motor, the engine control unit, etc).

    unfortunately, this is going to be one of those cases where you are considered at fault unless you personally invest the $$$ in systems forensics and they are able to determine the problem is with a part of the vehicle, not you.

    how would that help you in terms of your accident or your insurance rates? probably it wouldn't. but, if you had independant analysis that was sound and pointed to a system problem, you could probably get favorable terms with the manufacturer, but you'd probably be bound not to release any of the information you uncovered.

    if more and more people report issues to a site like the NHTSA, one would hope a government entity would review the design / implementation and then have an independant testing laboratory attempt to get to root cause.

    people experience flakey and infrequent problems with complex systems all the time, and yes, after the fact, a most superficial review by others often cites human error and "nothing is wrong" with the system.

    we often blame ourselves for a program that errantly produces some unexpected result, when in fact, it's a programming bug which we've just experienced...
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