BMW X3

markcincinnati · April 2005

All true, all true -- but there are multiple essays, here and elsewhere, that demonstrate that is costs MORE MONEY to use regular when the car is designed for premium.

The phrase used is false economy.

The X3 3.0's on our dealer's lots range in price from $37 to $47K -- @ 1000 gallons per year, that is $200 annually.

I certainly understand wanting to pay less -- heck I applaud that. But the heck of it is it will not save money to use lower grade gas. It may even cost more.

What is for certain is that the engine will perform with less vigor, shall we say.

You will attempt to compensate for this loss of power by depressing the go pedal a bit further.

Tough it out, you can afford it. Indeed, you cannot afford not to use Prem.

beemcity · April 2005

Just use premium folks. You've spent this much on the car, why not give it the proper fuel to get it to perform like you expected. I've experimented with putting mid grade, regular and premium. Hands down I can notice the difference when I put premium gas in it, it just feels and drives better - like a BMW should.

bhitchcock · April 2005

Thank you, just what I was looking for, someone who had tried it and good advice.

Bill

x3for3 · April 2005

Anybody knows what " audio-text " is?

Is this the same as cd-text ? Is the cd supposed to show song title and artist when playing? I have tried doing this but screen only showed track number.

Can someone tell me how this is done or how this works? Or a program needed?

Thanks

beemcity · April 2005

04 X3 3.0, when I'm adjusting the bass, treble, etc, after balance and fad, there is another option that shows up : "TONE LIN?", what does this mean and is it something adjustable?

One small gripe, maybe I haven't figured out how to see this, but when playing cd's, you can't see the track minute information, meaning how long a given track is and how much has expired, etc. Is there a way to see this? I have only been able to toggle back/forth between the time display and track number display.

-Thanks,
AAP

dherzfeld · April 2005

I am preparing to order the X3 3.0i and am debating the Premium Audio option. I enjoy listening to everything from classic rock to classical Bach, sometimes at concert levels. Is the standard audio capable, or for the money, is the premium setup worth it? It's fairly expensive for what on the surface seems like minor upgrades. As I understand it, the basic system has subwoofers built in.

Any opinions out there?

beemcity · April 2005

I can't speak to the performance of the premium sound system, it was somethign I considered, since I spend a lot of time in my car and love music, all kinds, just like you do. But ultimately the premium option was too expensive for what you got.

However, I can speak to the performance of the standard system and it's very nice. Granted I came from driving a toyota camry, but at home it's bose and other high end equipment and the x3's system didn't dissapoint in terms of sound quality for me, but I did have gripes with the user friendliness and what seems lack of track information while a cd is playing - something that is standard in most cars.

You won't get too much bottom end out of the standard system but you will get great track/channel separation on the front left/right speakers if you like that type of thing. I am overall really happy with the system, love cranking it up but just wish it was more user-friendly.

markcincinnati · April 2005

Test drove one with and one without -- huge difference. The lease payment difference was about $6 per month on a 36 month 15K lease. I thought it was well worth it.

I currently have a 2003 Audi allroad with the Bose "upgraded" system.

A. I think the Audi system is better than the standard BMW system

B. I think the upgraded BMW system is better than the upgraded Audi system

C. I think they (both) cost more than they ought to.

D. We listen to lots of music and books on CD -- while it doesn't make much difference on the books, it does on the music -- hence it was worth it.

E. We ordered Sirius Sat Radio and wanted the best it could be delivered in the car.

The X3 3.0, as configured was MSRP'd at $46K and change. The difference was fairly minor -- no money down, 36 months, 45K lease, $581 per month (that includes the tax).

Ordered the car March 18th, 2005. Hope to have it sometime in June.

Every time, previously, I have "chinzted out" on a feature like an upgraded stereo, I have regretted it. My wife (me too) could really hear the difference (we always take CD's with us on the test drives).

The margin must be fairly high, since the deal was good.

We went back and added Servotronic to our order ($250) after reading how it "truly transformed" the car -- seemed too cheap to pass up if the auto journalists were accurate in their assessment of the "transformation."

The releveance of this last comment was to suggest how we had initially felt that Servotronic was just a way to get another $250 out of us -- reading about the feature changed our mind (the dealer didn't even push it, but when we said we wanted it, her eyes lit up and she told us how it would improve the drive of the car.) Of course we ordered the Sport Package which the early tests of the X3 poo-pooed. Later tests were much more favorable about the SP (after the recalibration of the X3's suspension post May 2004.)

dherzfeld · April 2005

Every time, previously, I have "chinzted out" on a feature like an upgraded stereo, I have regretted it.

I agree. Years ago I decided no matter what to order the biggest engine and best stereo in whatever car I was buying. Here I am again re-thinking that position. By my calculation on an outright purchase, the upgraded audio makes an $11/mo. difference. Not really a huge deal.

idagorn · April 2005

Hi
I must be the only non north american bmw driver on this forum-very interesting by the way-;I chose to answer your message because it dealt with gas mileage
I drive an X3 Diesel (yes I know diesel isn't exactly popular in the US)
I get 30mpg out of the 204HP turbo diesel 6 cyl engine (over a period of 20000km) considering the price of the car ($60000+) in France -and just about the same in most european countries- I think you Americans are lucky when it comes to buying automobiles: big choice of models, "cheap" gas, and reasonable prices if you take the wage/price ratio into account
just hope this little note helps bring an outsider's view about what I consider a great SUV

markcincinnati · April 2005

I think we would love to have the current crop of turbo diesels that are avail elsewhere -- our poor fuel quality is about to come to an end and I would suspect that our soon to be $3.00 per gallon gas will be a heafty motive to move to diesel.

BTW, I read that Europe actually exports gas to the US because it is more profitable than selling it to EU customers. I also read that minus taxes we pay more for the PRODUCT than some of the European countries that export gas to the US. Is this true?

You do, since a dollar is a dollor or a Euro is a Euro pay more out of pocket for petrol than we do -- but I suspect we are on the cost rise more steeply than some other countries. And, all in all that may be a good thing to allow us to have access to all the cars that we can only look at when we visit Europe.

I, for one, would love to have a super high torque medium HP diesel (turbo) car -- I drove the Audi A4 2.5TD with a 6speed manual -- "only 180HP, at the time" but the torque was waaaayyyy more impressive.

Color me envious of your diesel X3.

haakon · April 2005

Could X3 owners please share their experience on gas mileage for "pure" city driving and "pure" highway driving? It would be helpful if you could specify whether you have the auto or stick and 2.5 or 3.0.

Thanks.

vmerch · April 2005

I own a 2004 X3, 2.5. I get 28.6 on the highway (no stopping), and 18 in the city. I live in Chicago, so the city mileage reflects a lot of gridlock.

On a separate topic - I am considering getting the Ipod accessory cable to play through the stereo. Does anyone have any experience with this? Do you have to go to the dealership? Cost? Worth it?

Thanks!

haakon · April 2005

Vmerch:

Thanks for the info. I'm surprised that you get that good mileage as it is higher than the estimates (which I believe are 17mpg and 23 mpg). Do you have auto or stick? Have you been happy w. the car?

Thanks.

vmerch · April 2005

I was pleasantly suprised also. I have the steptronic automatic. I am very happy with the car. I have 13K on the car, and have only had the passenger cupholder fixed (wouldn't open) and a rattle checked out in the back (the jack was loose). Other than that, it's been great. I always stayed away from buying a SUV because of the bad mileage. My X3 gets better than the Mercedes C230 that I had before!

whchan · April 2005

'05 3.0 AT

City Only: 14.5 to 15.5 mpg
Highway Only: 24mpg at 60 mph, 21 at 70-80 mph

haakon · April 2005

Thanks for the info. Have you otherwise been happy w. the car?

want2have1 · April 2005

Is anyone aware of BMW plans to bring their diesel versions to the US Market?

markcincinnati · April 2005

. . .I have not clue one. However, I keep reading about the new US fuel standards that will apparently be in effect in 2006.

It is our fuel (both gas and diesel) that seems to be a problem -- e.g., we can't actually take full advantage of the Fuel Stratified Injection (FSI) technology currently offered by Audi -- so we have the FSI name, but we change it to Fuel Straight Injection because technically we can't fully utilize the true capability of FSI. Major good diesels from Germany keep being produced -- engines that are cleaner than ever, quieter and less detectable than ever and with enormous power and torque -- with diesel reliability, longentivity and economy.

We clearly have some problems here -- Bush says we need more oil from the Saudi's -- they, in turn, correctly point out that pumping out extra supply will not create gasoline at the pumps unless we increase our refining capacity. We apparently can't (or haven't yet) produced the cleanest possible gasoline and diesel so we can't take advantage of both the economics and the technology that apparently is available elsewhere.

We have GM losing over one billion dollars and then finding themselves recalling almost two million cars -- then there are the Chinese, the Japanese, the Koreans and anyone in the EU that cares to produce a car competing with our beleaguered automotive manufacturers.

It would be simple to say let Adam Smith do his thing (which ultimately "he" will do, after all) -- but this is starting to become serious. GM all by itself is 1% of the US economy. And, I heard that for every 1 GM employee there are 9 jobs that are "not GM" in the US.

The LA Times publishes an apparently less than hunky dory review of the new Pontiac G6 and GM pulls $10M in advertising and on and on.

I, for one, am getting worried.

OK, so our fuel is cleaned up -- what next? Will the big 3 (or 4) Germans bring their diesels to the US -- I sure hope so. But, does Detroit have some diesels that will play in a Cadillac like a BMW diesel or an Audi diesel will play in one of their cars?

Who knows.

I'll bet that German diesel cars are coming soon to North American, FWIW.

idagorn · April 2005

diesel X3
Hi!
I bought an X3 turbo diesel here in France in March 2004 ;3.0L 204HP engine. so far I've done 17000miles without any problems at all and I get 30mpg which is about twice as much as you get with your gas guzzlers; most people here wouldn't dream of buying a SUV with a gas engine;and now you can get your X3 with the smaller 2L 150HP turbo diesel (4 cyl) for a more reasonable price.Of course the noise is just a bit higher at idle but hardly more noticeable on the road, and the toooorque!
hope diesel engines some day make it to the US market;they are now far from being as "dirty" as some people would have us believe! and so much more economical to run!

djx3 · April 2005

Hey there folks,
I'm a new member from Montreal. Changing my 2001 Acura MDX for a X3. Have ordered a blue 2005 X3 3.0. Expected delivery date is end of May. Have been reading everything I can get my hand on with regards to X3. Recent article published in Montreal says that BMW is expected to introduce diesel models in 2007. On Europeen market, most BMW's (except two models) are produced with diesel. I think BMW will recognize the great opportunity of the north American market.

rob34 · April 2005

I can't decide between the 2 colors. If money was not a consideration what would people out there choose. i could hardly tell the difference seeing the colors in person but maybe it was the light. Will one look better over time? Any thoughts would be great.

markcincinnati · April 2005

We first ordered the Sapphire, then when we were about 20 feet from the car, which was parked next to a Jet Black version, we said, the difference in look was minimal, and it wasn't a no charge option. So, it was a no-brainer.

kyfdx · April 2005

I like the Sapphire, because of the metallic paint.. It just looks better to me, and also doesn't seem to show dirt as well.. but, you'll get a bluish-purplish look sometimes, depending on the light.. I like that, but some people don't..

regards,
kyfdx

ccdbb · April 2005

The dealer in NJ is promoting 05'X3 3.0 for $299/mo at 10K/yr with $3500 cash down on top of bank fee, 1st payment, tax and deposit. The sales person reconfigured the payment structure for me as following,

For 15K/yr, upfront payment $1965 ($450 deposit,$261 1st year MV fee, bank fee and 1st payment), $453/mo including tax. The vehicle available is in Grey Silver Metallic, with heated front seats. Not sure if it has Steptronic.

Can one of you lease experts let me know if this is a good deal or I should be able to negociate a better one even without this promotion?

Thanks.

ccdbb

markcincinnati · April 2005

Someone else willing to take this? Without knowing the MSRP (at least) -- it is hard to say this is a good, OK, great or not good deal, sorry.

Our deal was 15K/yr; 36 months; $250 down; sec dep of $600 and first month payment (including Ohio tax) of $581.00. Plus 35 additional payments of $581 of course and theoretically getting the sec dep back.

MSRP was $46,350 or $46,550 as I recall, I don't have the paperwork in front of me. Oh yea, this was for an "ordered" car -- the deal, so says the rep was better because we ordered it, since there would be no "floor plan" costs. It sounded -- like it was a reasonable concept, and besides they didn't have the X3 3.0 with all the stuff my wife wanted anyway.

Point being we need to know the MSRP to determine the quality of this deal. While you're at it, can you get the cap cost reduction (the discount) too?

tidester · April 2005

You might want to post that over in BMW X3: Prices Paid & Buying Experience.

tidester, host

rob34 · April 2005

I love music so I want the best stereo possible regardless of price. I read that the X3 upgrade is a 500 watt Harmon Kardon system. I ordered it. Will I love it? Does it sound great?

What does DSP offer? Or what is it?

Is it true that you can't get the BMW factory installed Ipod adapter with the upgraded system? That's what is says on www.ipodyourbmw.com/.

ccdbb · April 2005

Thanks for the comparison. Here is what I got from another sales person today. He suggested I put in all the options I want and order it.

MSRP: $40755
Offered price $38755

$2211 opening cost include 1st payment, security deposit of $500, doc fee, tag fee, acq fee. For 36 mo term with 36K mi, residual is 62% off MSRP, money factor is 0.012. Monthly is $499.

I feel I could ask him for at least another $500 off the offered price. Do you think that's reasonable?

ccdbb

PS I did post in Prices Paid & Buying Experiences but under the title Re: any comments on the BMW lease deal listed in the incentive section?

markcincinnati · May 2005

This sounds like a great deal IF the miles would be 45K rather than 36K. As you state it, it seems a tiny bit too high considering your upfront money.

We are probably talking about relatively small differences, say on the order of $20 - $25 per month, as a guesstimate. But worth fighing for, methinks.

biketrouble · May 2005

Hi, a few days ago I took delivery of a 2005 X3 3.0i steptronic, and am generally very happy so far, but I have been doing some highway driving and have noticed a background "drone" that appears between 100 and 110 kph (I live in Canada, sorry - roughly 62-70mph.) Above that, it goes away.

Doesn't seem to matter what gear (I have tried this in M4 and M5 as well) but you do have to be on the gas, and appears to be coming from the back of the car. It's not loud, but loud enough that I noticed (not on the test drive though.)

My first guess is that this is from the exhaust and is the "irritating drone" mentioned in many reviews, but I was a little surprised that a) it stops after 110kph and b) that it's connected with speed and not engine revs - I really have not heard this at other speeds (at least below 130kph - I am running in, after all.)

So, anyone have any insights on this one - is it normal and I can stop caring, or do I need to shout at someone?

markcincinnati · May 2005

My wife's new X3 ordered just 7 weeks ago -- made in Europe, not "located" in the US -- has arrived.

I would not have believed a car could be ordered, built and delivered from Europe to the US in 7 weeks.

We are impressed.

We pick it up in 3 days -- our scheduling difficulties not BMW dealer's.

ccdbb · May 2005

I just ordered mine today. The dealer told me it could take up to 8 weeks. I guess they were right from your experience. For me, after all the excitement from picking all the colors and options as well as finding out if the deals was good enough, a 7-week wait seems long. But I am sure I will be excited again when I get it.

Did you get a production number and track it on the BMW website? Was that helpful?

ccdbb

markcincinnati · May 2005

We didn't even try to track it -- we were expecting a 12 week wait. The final final wait will be 7.5 weeks from order to drive away!

We picked up the Sony Ericson T637 phone last night -- anything anyone care to comment about this phone and the BMW bluetooth arrangement?

ulep · May 2005

You guys are lucky. When i ordered my x3 3.0 in november 2003, it took 3 1/2 months of waiting before i can drive it. fyi i still love the car.

ccdbb · May 2005

I just noticed in the X3 accessary catalog, the bike racks for X3 don't look very convenient. You either have to take off the front wheels and secure the bikes in the cargo space or lift the bikes up to the roof. There is a rack that goes to the back but it doesn't look so steady ($398 for carrying two bikes). Otherwise, you need a towing hitch which cost even more.

I have a very steady rack which was for my previous Explorer. It goes into a square socket at the tail of the truck. I would like to know if this can still be used on the X3 somehow.

Anyone has any suggestions? Thanks.

ccdbb

pipo · May 2005

I give the premium system a B+. Decent bass response, reasonably dynamic sound, a bit harsh in the treble. DSP means digital sound processing. It allows you to choose between church, jazz club and rock equalization settings. I find this feature mostly useless except on rock material that is not recorded with a full sound.

haakon · May 2005

Do you have a feel for whether there was a premium for a "custom made" X3? Did you have any special/unusual combination of options?

markcincinnati · May 2005

It is possible to get a better price on an ordered car due to the fact that the dealer gets some benefits and costs savings that may not accrue to a car that he/she orderes for "inventory."

The car we ordered was both not in the system and certainly not on the dealer's lot.

2005 X3 3.0 6 speed manual

Jet Black Gloss/Terracotta Leather/Birch Wood Trim

Packages:

Premium
Sport
Cold weather

Audio upgrade
Servotronic steering
F+R Parktronic
Sat Nav
Sirius Radio
Xenon Adaptive lights
Chrome Tail pipe tips
Accessory Floor mats

~ $46,000+ MSRP before discounts.

$250 cap cost reduction (we prepaid for the Servotronic in cash after we struck the deal)

Up fronts:

Sec Dep+First month (left a deposit to put the car on order in this amount)

36 months / 15,000 year BMW lease

$581/mo (tax included)

There are several additional options and accessories that I am sure could drive the cost (MSRP) to over $50K easily.

The dealer had quite a few X3's on the lot -- none with sat nav, for instance and if they had sport, they had a black interior, and -- you get the idea.

So, we negotiated our deal, put our money down & filled out the credit app -- and 10 minutes later we had a deal and a "promise" of a late May early June delivery.

We pick up the car tonight at 6:30PM -- 7 weeks.

kyfdx · May 2005

Hey.. I drive right by there at 6:20PM on the way home.... I'll honk my horn as I go by on I-71...

markcincinnati · May 2005

We'll be sure to wave if we hear you!

harplayr · May 2005

"I just noticed in the X3 accessary catalog, the bike racks for X3 don't look very convenient. You either have to take off the front wheels and secure the bikes in the cargo space or lift the bikes up to the roof."
Actually I have the interior bike rack, and am very happy with it.
Just put a quick release on the front wheel, the wheel will come off and go on in seconds.
This option was one of the main factors in my decision to go with the X3.

markcincinnati · May 2005

. . .took delivery of my wife's X3 last night. Including the set up of bluetooth, Sirius, programming the BMW Assist and learning to use the Sat Nav system, the delivery took 2 hours and 2 BMW delivery people: one knew about bluetooth and sat nav, the other went over the entire rest of the car and Sirius and we drove off into the sunset.

First impressions after 70 miles of driving: very smooth, quiet, nimble, Sirius radio is fantastic -- the bluetooth system works as advertised and it is so cool to start the car and have the sat screen auto rotate up and open and display a moving map (set to 1/2 mile range).

This thing feels like a car -- remembering we have premium, sport, 3.0 and 6spd manual (and upgraded audio).

I have personally driven 18 of the 70 miles and the thing is dangerously easy to run along in 6th gear at 80 MPH with the Sirius radio filling our heads with music.

Almost a car in terms of handling -- perhaps because it is a bit taller than a 3 series the word "almost" must be underscored.

The sport, 3.0 engine and 6spd manual, too, probably contribute to the car-like feeling. It feels every bit like a sports sedan -- and if I had never driven a BMW or Audi sports sedan previously I would probably think this was THE best handling car ever. My exuberance is only slightly dampened, though, by my sports sedan experiences. This is a very nice "car."

More impressions as time and miles pass.

The delivery was pretty cool -- car had a ribbon on it when we pulled into the dealership. Gloss Black, Terracotta leather and a lime green bow -- a Kodak moment for sure.

My wife is grinning from ear to ear.

Now, what excuse can I come up with to drive it?

kdshapiro · May 2005

My wife is grinning from ear to ear.

That sir could be two of the biggest problems with the vehicle.

1. That stupid BMW grin and,
2. Trying to pry it out of her fingers, (assuming she doesn't hide the car keys) when she's not driving it.

I did not get the same feeling when I test drove the M35. No ear to ear grin.

Good luck on working out your future. :P

rayainsw · May 2005

"The delivery was pretty cool -- car had a ribbon on it when we pulled into the dealership. Gloss Black, Terracotta leather and a lime green bow -- a Kodak moment for sure. "

Congrats!

And - we will see a pic posted here?
Right?
- Ray
Thinking the Lime Green Bow might be a bit over the top . .

motorcity3 · May 2005

Hello everybody. I think I had read something about this and I believe that I am having the same problem. It has been exactly 7 days after we picked up our 2005 X3 2.5 and all of a sudden, the keyless entry stops working. The funny thing is that it will work when I am standing right behind the car. I move a couple of feet away towards the driver's side or anywhere else and it stops working. After praising BMW quality to my in-laws and many other people who are hard core American car buyers (by the way I live in the Detroit area) I will be forced to eat my words. Shoot!

markcincinnati · May 2005

I have taken three Infinitis out for test drives -- two x's and one non-x (M35).

Frankly, I had the grin on all three of them, even though I ended up ordering the x -- one of the cars I tested was Liquid Platinum with the Bourbon interior, which is what I ordered.

Sure the car has an automatic, but so does the Audi, my second choice -- and the BMW 530xi for another $10,000 over the M might have been a contender -- but I just can't find the $10K.

And fuggetabout the STS, at $63K with AWD.

For that money, I'd go with the Audi A6 4.2 even with the autotrans.

But at this point, if I'm gonna pay much more than $50K, I'd better be able to get a manual transmission.

Getting harder all the time. . .

Sorry the M didn't do it for you.

1% thinking a second X3 would not be at all hard to live with. . .

There that's passed.

stever · May 2005

Congrats on the new arrival!

Maybe you can do us a favor and copy your purchase details to the BMW X3: Prices Paid & Buying Experience discussion? Thanks!

Steve, Host

kyfdx · May 2005

Terracotta leather... that must be stunning!! Congratulations...

markcincinnati · May 2005

Day 3 300 miles.

Stunning is right for the terracotta interior with the sport seats.

Biggest pleasure -- Sirius and more specifically Sirius channel 16 "the vault" -- we took a drive today to Columbus -- what a pleasure.

Car handles like a CAR.

Car rides like a sports suspension equipped CAR.

Car handles like a BMW -- check that, I do not have enough experience with BMW's to be that broad.

The X3 handles like an Audi -- but it has less understeer and body roll.

It is darn near a $50K car -- it is NOT a $50K car based on my Audi experiences.

It costs -- to lease -- less than a $50K Audi by almost $200.

My wife's TT was $709 per month the X3 which cost more is $581. The TT was bout $4K less than the X3.

The X3 almost would qualify as a LPS as far as I am concerned.

Underscore the word ALMOST.

It is still an SAV, I have not lost my mind, completely.

With a 6 speed manual and the prem and sport options, this thing is Premium that is for certain.

Sirius sat radio is -- thus far -- amazing.

BMW X3

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