Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!

BMW X3

1235765

Comments

  • bpraxisbpraxis Member Posts: 292
    Happy holidays everyone and I hope that you are having a great day. At the car show there were very few people looking at the new X3. The new Mazda RX8 was drawing a great deal of attention as were some of the concept cars.

      As many have mentioned here my first impression of the exterior of the new X3 was a less expensive vehicle than the MSRP. The black bumpers are simply terrible, worthy of a inexpensive Japanese SUV, even the CRV has nicer looking black bumpers.

      And the interior is very pedestrian, not worthy of someone who is looking for something more upscale. Why has BMW made a vehicle 10 percent cheaper than the very attractive X5 that is not 50 percent as attractive. Why would someone buy the X3 over the X5???

      And are you all aware that the X3 is not made in a BMW factory. It has been contracted out to another company.

      I do not own the Infiniti FX35 but I do not see any contest between the two vehicles. The FX breaks new styling ground and the X3 is nothing new. And of course the FX offer so much more for the money, there is simply no contest.
  • erickplerickpl Member Posts: 2,735
    Forget em. Just get a Jeep! :)

    *ducking and running for cover*

    I've been pretty happy with my Grand Cherokee (2000). It's had a few issues, but eventually got them taken care of (pinion seal leaks). The interior is nice enough considering it is a SUV. It handles the highway quite well, handles offroad and adverse weather quite well, and they know how to do real 4wd and AWD. The new Xdrive is a LOT like Jeep's Quadra drive in concept.

    The only thing I plan to do with the GC to make it handle better is some sway bar installation (7/16" hollow standard - upgrade to 1" solid).

    -Paul
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    "Why would someone buy the X3 over the X5"

    1. I like the vehicle.
    2. I like the interior.
    3. I love the way it drives.
    4. It fits my needs. It's not about buying more than you need, it's about buying what fits your requirements.
    5. I'm betting the gas mileage is going to be better than the competition.
    6. I don't need to be the fastest SZV(no typo) on the block.
    7. The panaramic moonroof is cool.
    8. My wife loves it.
    9. My kids love it.
    10. It's my money.
  • ksomanksoman Member Posts: 683
    are you paid by the company?

    ksso
    sometimes you are the windshield
    sometimes you are the bug
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    ksso. Yes I admit it. I am on BMWs payroll. Every post I write on Edmunds that says something positive about the car, they pay me a $100. There is one more opening, would you like a job application? :)
  • ksomanksoman Member Posts: 683
    A recent book reviewed on NPR yesterday talks about walmart shopping middle class people buying BMW cocoons. Interesting concept. The book talks about how luxury used to be something for the top 2% of the population 30 years ago and is now for the top 60% of the population. We have come a long way, in some good ways, some bad ways.
    The bottom line is that whether X3 is good, bad or ugly, useful or not, it will sell well because of the entire middle class in america wanting to ride in the lap of luxury and they will make other compromises to make do that monthly BMW payment.

    ksso
    sometimes i'm the windshield
    sometimes i'm the bug
  • ksomanksoman Member Posts: 683
    please email me the appropriate links/forms/contacts and the joining bonus check :)

    ksso
  • ksomanksoman Member Posts: 683
    i just counted all your pro-bmw posts all over edmunds (including topics not even remotely related to BMW) and i think you must be a multi-millionaire by now? no?

    :)
    ksso
    sometimes you are the windshield
    sometimes you are the bug
  • clpurnellclpurnell Member Posts: 1,083
    KD - I bet you if BMW put that vaunted propellor on a daewoo you would like it. :) Do you work for BMW or something.

    The FX has plenty utility. For nine months it was my primary family hauler of 2 adults a seven year old and an infant. It handled a 2600 mile cross country trip in style and comfort and all of our stuff. It also did fine on several shorter weekend getaways with the family. Will it haul a 4x8 shet of plywood no but neither will an x3. It has just as much utility as the X3 and more than the X5. Also the FX with it's 20" wheels have done better in the snow than X5's. So unless you are going off road I see no way the X3 offers more utility. If you are going offroad skip the FX's and the the X's and get a touareg or cayenne for that.
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    cj- give me a break. :) To each their own. I already have a 7 seater hauler. I don't actually need anything bigger than my 3 series. But I need to accomodate the potential for 2+ feet of snow. For that task I picked the X3, not the FX35, for reasons discussed in previous posts.

    ksso I don't buy that stuff. For the same money, there are many other vehicles floating around. NPR does not know what they talk about sometimes. There is luxury like and then there is luxury. An ES330/3 series for almost the same money are luxury like. My house is luxury like. I cannot afford the 20-30million that I really need make it pure luxury. There is nothing wrong with luxury-like.
  • clpurnellclpurnell Member Posts: 1,083
    There is nothing wrong for being a fan of a particular brand make or sports team (unless you are a packers fan there is no excuse for that). We just enjoy giving you a hard time. The FX is only my second import ever. My first was an oddysey which I owned for 4 months because it was what I needed than traded it on the FX because that is what I wanted. Luckily Oddy's are extremely popular and I actually made 100 bucks in the process. I am warming up to BMW my brother has owned 3 different 3 series when I was growing up and he loves them. He now drives an sc300 and is amazed at how solid it feels with 120k on the clock. The reliability and service costs of the Beemers and mercs scare me away each time I consider one. After the problems I had with my last domestic and the laaging german reliability keeps me from closing the deal on any future domestic or german vehicle.
  • ksomanksoman Member Posts: 683
    sorry to disappoint you and sorry i misstated. NPR did not review the book, they just invited the author for a chat. now hmmm.

    as a family that has a jaguar s and bmw 3 convertible, and an exceptional one, i'm not a bmw basher, but the fine line between balanced reporting and fanaticism has to be respected.

    ksso
  • ksomanksoman Member Posts: 683
    because the dollar is getting cheaper against the euro and will stay cheap for a few years. When I was in europe much of last year, i was actually getting a euro and some euro-cents over for every buck in my pocket. on my recent most trip, i felt raped.... that 18 odd % drop they been talking about translates to a lot of "cost" in real life.

    ksso
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    "fanaticism has to be respected"

    ksso - If you knew me personally you would know I am not a BMW fanatic. I enjoy cars in general, especially am fond of manufacturers of all brands that managed to get it "right". BMW is one of a number of brands of manufacturers that managed to get it "right". The it is different depending on the manufacturer, but having said that, I am a big fan of BMW.

    cj - for years I have heard a mixed bag about BMW reliability. I knew several people a while back with the top of the line BMW that was always getting repaired. JD and Consumers have had something to say about BMW reliablity or lack thereof. I have personal experience with several satisfied owners. Mine has been ultra-reliable. But I'm waiting for the shoe to drop, though it never may.
  • doneby2010doneby2010 Member Posts: 27
    Guys, you're going off the deep end. The purpose of this thread is not to bash each other or to get defensive. But to share one's experience and opinion, so others can make a better decision. I think the facts are on the table and I, for one, know what I need to know to make my decision.

    kd, you love the car for the reasons you mentioned. More power to you and good luck with your purchase. I tried really hard to see it the way you do. I really wanted to buy this puppy. Oh well!
  • tps3tps3 Member Posts: 17
    OK, easy fellas... regardless of your qualitative opinion, there are enough folks that have said they've placed orders so that we can hopefully collect some quantitative data. Has anyone placed an order for a price other than MSRP (higher, lower, and by how much) and what delivery timing are you being offered by the dealer?
  • ksomanksoman Member Posts: 683
    i did not mean to argue, i just wanted to say, people will buy the X3, irrespective of good or not. personally i loved the ride, i am not so gravy about the looks.

    ksso
    today i'm the bug
    yesterday i was the windshield
  • xsfoxsfo Member Posts: 17
    Do you have a link to that NPR book review about luxury? Or what book was it?
  • wwenzelwwenzel Member Posts: 4
    My dealer offered me, without much negotiating, $1000 off MSRP. However, since I ordered my 01 325Cic, a GREAT car, from him, I'm a preferred customer with preferred pricing.

    I'm still trying to decide do I want the X3, despite the interior issues, or an Audi Allroad, or do I want to wait for the 05 Passat Wagon. I drive an 01 VW Passat GLX 4Motion wagon now and we love it. I just have the new car itch that needs scratched badly! I love my cars you know:
       2001 BMW 325Cic Convertible
       2001 VW Passat GLX 4Motion Wagon
       2002 VW Golf GLS
  • bodble2bodble2 Member Posts: 4,514
    Do you have to spend a lot of time thinking up that little jingle (and its variations) you put after your signature?

    bodble2
    I want to squash you like a bug on my windshield yesterday today and definitely tomorrow

    j/k :)
  • bretaabretaa Member Posts: 130
    I would also like to know the title of the book mentioned on NPR about the luxury phenomenon...

    Regarding the X3, I just saw it recently and my views fall somewhere in the middle of those expressed here. It's really like any BMW, in that if you like the package and have the money, you really can't loose. If you like the styling (I really do, although I'm not a fan of the black bumpers), like the handling, like the interior (I like the design, but I hope the materials appear cheaper because they are "SUV tough"...), and have the money, it's probably the best of its class.

    If I were to buy an SUV (which I probably wouldn't, but...), it would for me come down between the X3 and the Infinity models. I'd consider the Volvo X90, but the supposedly soft handling would probably put me off.

    Just my $0.02...

    -Bret
  • ksomanksoman Member Posts: 683
    hmmm, sometimes you are a louiville slugger, sometimes you are the ball
  • bodble2bodble2 Member Posts: 4,514
    sometimes you are a Louiville Slugger, sometimes you are Saddam (or Osama).
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    I named one of my cats "Beemer" and got $1,000!

    I named the other one "Mac" but Mr. Jobs did squat, so I still drive an Intel box.

    Sign me up for the bonus checks too :-)

    Steve, Host
  • ulepulep Member Posts: 63
    we ordered an x3 3.0, metallic paint, heated front seats, premium package and automatic trans (my wife's driving it) for $40,800.00. i now most of the people in this thread dont like the x3, but me and my wife really love it. you dont feel driving an suv, it feels like a car. and i think the design is pretty good. and the plastic bumpers, well i think that's why they called it a sports activity vehicle. the interior is nice and much better looking if you get the black leather. we ordered it because its the right car for us. the important thing is knowing what you want...
  • ulepulep Member Posts: 63
    we ordered the x3 at the last week of nov. the papers said "to be delivered on or about feb 1st 2004." anybody got a lower price than what i got it for?
  • saugataksaugatak Member Posts: 488
    If you think I'm wrong to compare the interior materials of the X3 to Altimas, Santa Fes and Escapes, think again.

    I have looked and sat in all four of these cars recently and I can tell you firsthand that BMW is using cheaper or as cheap interior materials than those 3 cars.

    It's all about value. I am not going to complain about a cheap interior on a $20k car, but I would be pissed about a cheap interior in a $40k car.

    BMW seems confident that they can get away with using cheap interior materials as long as they provide the BMW ride. Maybe they're right.
  • jjmanjjman Member Posts: 77
    I questioned saugatak comparison(and maybe his sanity) of the X3 to a Yugo because that is a gross exaggeration. The interior looks and feels just fine. If you want to compare the x3 to the fx then that interior isn't so great either and the price of that car can hit 41 - 42 k too. Perhaps everybody is looking for the interior to be more like a Touregs but then for the same price you get more refinement but you definitely don't get the handling or the speed.
    I guess it all comes down to compromises and despite some interior shortcomings I like what the x3 has to offer
  • tps3tps3 Member Posts: 17
    ulep and wwenzel. So it sounds like you guys got $1,000 - $1,400 off sticker as early adopters. Any other experiences out there? Dealers who are holding firm at sticker, or asking for a premium over sticker? Enquiring minds want to know...

    Thanks!
  • ulepulep Member Posts: 63
    i actually shaved off $1650.00 on my order.what we did is we emailed all bmw dealerships here in nj and asked for the qoute. before you know it, they were bidding. we actually did business w/ the internet dept of the dealerships. we didnt have any problems. as for the vehicle it's just perfect for ME and my WIFE...
  • erickplerickpl Member Posts: 2,735
    I like ulep's approach - go with what is best for you. :)

    Here is my spin on this:
    BMW markets the x5 to a more upscale clientele who want an SUV as a grocery getter and trip taker. The x3 is geared (no pun intended) to a younger and more active crowd. These people are wanting the storage and space of the x3, along with the performance of a 3, which nobody is disputing. The x3 is geared to an active lifestyle, so I can understand why the lower grade quality is there.

    -Paul
  • ksomanksoman Member Posts: 683
    so you are suggesting bmw borrowed the plastic concept of the honda element.

    interestingly bmw just announced a special lease on the X5 3.0.

    i wonder if there's anything behind the timing here... a X3 is likely to be even with the X5 on a lease, considering 3.0 models for both.
  • doneby2010doneby2010 Member Posts: 27
    Has anyone here test drove both the X3 and X5. I am curious to hear if there is a difference in handling and performance. I'm assuming the X5 will be a bit more sluggish due to the extra 600 to 700 pounds in weight.
    If the difference in handling is not so great, considering the little difference between the two (only $4K for the X5 3.0) I think you get much better quality workmanship with the X5.

    Thoughts??
  • jamesw7jamesw7 Member Posts: 23
    I never owned a brand new BMW but I heard some horror stories about the oil change costs $100 so BMW can warranty the car. Is this true? Anyone?
  • tps3tps3 Member Posts: 17
    I drove both side by side, both 3.0 liter automatic with premium package. (Ok, before somebody gets all anal about it, I admit, I drove them sequentially not literally side by side. Anyway.)

    X5 was definitely a smoother, more supple ride. X3 suspension was stiff, "sporty" if you're of that mindset, "haywagon" if you're not. X5 interior was same materials as 3 series and old 5 series, X3 interior was lower-grade plastic. I could tell that although the X3 was smaller in weight and exterior dimensions the interior was set up more sensibly to optimize storage, i.e. lower load level and so on versus the X5 so I could see why the interior volume would be the same.

    Acceleration-wise, to get to your question, the X3 was a bit zippier although there was a weird off-the line lag on the X5 with the automatic that I didn't experience with the X3, which could bias things somewhat. (Lot of people complain about this... doesn't matter to me, I'd get the 6-speed stick either way). I thought both, for trucks particularly, performed quite well. But I thought the X3 was more car-like overall, and you could notice the lower weight.

    Word is that residuals on the X3 are lower than the X5, which means on a lease basis yes they'll come close similarly equipped with the same engine. (Depending on where the X3 actually sells, which is the reason for my price questions... should it sell for sticker when one could get a deal on an X5, the 5 might even be cheaper on a lease.) Build quality (*not* interior materials quality which is another topic and is readily apparent once you look at 'em) is probably a push. I understand the Spartanburg plant had trouble early which they've since worked out. Magna Steyr - who knows?

    X3 does have the newer gadgets though, such as the panorama roof, the adaptive xenons, and the "sensotronic" (sensormatic?) steering. Found some slippery roads which both handled very well.

    All in all from a marketing perspective this one puzzles me. Too bad for BMW that they weren't able to bring in the X3 for $3-5k lower than they did to create some real distance away from the X5, as it is there'll be some meaningful cannibalization one way or another.
  • tps3tps3 Member Posts: 17
    Sched maintenance is included (free) for 4 years 50k miles. The car tells you when to go in. Oil changes are far apart on the schedule, 15k miles under typical driving. They load the car up with synthetic and seem to believe this is sufficient, despite what your friends at Jiffy Lube might have you believe.

    I would imagine once the free maintenance is up, yes it would be pricey. But that's 4 years away for any prospective X3 owner at this point.
  • bretaabretaa Member Posts: 130
    Regarding the X3's interior, while I don't think it's quite as high quality (material wise) as the current 3-series, for the X3's price and position in the market, I think the current quality level is "just fine" and what is expected.

    The problem BMW has (and for that matter, *all* other automakers makers have, especially the luxury brands Cadillac and Infiniti) is that Audi/VW (and Lexus to a lesser extent) are really raising the bar on interior design and materials. While the Toureg doesn't quicken my pulse styling-wise inside or out, I can't deny that its interior looks and feels like a million bucks. Same for the Phaeton and, to a lesser extent, the A8 and new Lexus RX. I have a gut feeling that the next Passat is going to do the same thing to the Accord/Camry/Altima class.

    BMW and the rest are eventually going to have to rise to the challenge. For now, the X3 interior is OK, but they'll have to keep upgrading it...

    -Bret
  • doneby2010doneby2010 Member Posts: 27
    Has anyone here test drove both the X3 and X5. I am curious to hear if there is a difference in handling and performance. I'm assuming the X5 will be a bit more sluggish due to the extra 600 to 700 pounds in weight.
    If the difference in handling is not so great, considering the little difference between the two (only $4K for the X5 3.0) I think you get much better quality workmanship with the X5.

    Thoughts??
  • saugataksaugatak Member Posts: 488
    "questioned saugatak comparison(and maybe his sanity) of the X3 to a Yugo because that is a gross exaggeration. The interior looks and feels just fine. If you want to compare the x3 to the fx then that interior isn't so great either and the price of that car can hit 41 - 42 k too."

    jjman, you need to take the beer goggles off when looking at the interior of the X3. maybe kdshapiro should give you some of the "cheerleading" money he gets from BMW, LOL!

    also, when you say the FX is merely a "G35 on stilts", come on! The FX is a very nice car and by all accounts, handles just fine (never test driven it myself) and the interior is a whole lot better than the X3, no contest. Also, the FX sells for a lot off MSRP so you can get it a lot cheaper than the X3, plus the FX35 has 280 HP!

    so jjman, while you may question my sanity for comparing the interior materials of the X3 to a Yugo (and really, the comparison is very fair), I'd question your sanity for the way you have dissed the FX, which is a very fine car.

    Also jjman, if you look at my review of the X3, you'll notice that aside from the price and the interior materials of the X3, I'm very complimentary about the car.
  • saugataksaugatak Member Posts: 488
    I haven't driven a 2004 X5, but I've driven a 2002 (maybe 2003, can't recall) X5 so I can give you a comparison between those two.

    Main thing is, the driving position is a lot higher off the ground, so I felt that the suspension was a little looser on the X5 and there was some sway when going hard into turns with the X5 that I did not feel with the X3.

    I think that's to be expected. When the car weighs more and is higher off the ground, it isn't going to handle quite as well.

    That being said, the X5 still handles great and is definitely the best handling SUV in its class (handles a lot better than my Acura MDX).

    Maybe the 2004 X5 with x-drive will handle better, don't know.

    Also, in terms of space, the X3 feels just as roomy than the X5, so I don't think the X5 uses interior space as efficiently as the X3.

    With respect to interior materials on the X5, it's no contest -- X5 hands down.

    I just want to say one more thing about cheap, had plastics and then I will refrain from beating on the X3 interior (feel like this topic has been done to death already). I hate 'em bad because my exp. in the Northeast is that they shrink in the cold and expand in hot weather and after a while the car starts developing annoying rattles everywhere.

    With regard to the X3 being manufactured by Magnum Steyr (not sure if spelling is right?), I wouldn't worry about it. It's a company with a great reputation and I think the Austrians have the same attention to detail and quality that the Germans are famous for (I mean, aren't they ethnically the same?).
  • ksomanksoman Member Posts: 683
    thanks for one of the few sensible posts anywhere on edmunds lately.

    ksso
    sometimes you are the windshield
    sometimes you are the bug
  • ksomanksoman Member Posts: 683
    having lived and worked in germany, i can tell you, they are a unique breed in a good way. if their employment contract says work is 9-5, they will be at their desk before 9 sharp, past coffee, past coworker chat, past everything and you will hardly ever find anybody run out the door at 5.

    all that said, within germany itself, the northerners and southerners are different, very different (i'm resisting to use the words such as bavarians) and the austrians fiercely pride themselves to be austrians, so i'd never make the mistake of every equating the two, even though from 5000 miles away their language sounds remotely similar.

    all that said, i wonder if the recent spate of "issues" with german built 3's is due to east german labor... hmmm ok i'll shut up

    ksso
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    "All in all from a marketing perspective this one puzzles me. Too bad for BMW that they weren't able to bring in the X3 for $3-5k lower than they did to create some real distance away from the X5, as it is there'll be some meaningful cannibalization one way or another."

    The problem is the price points for the 3-series. They have to price the X3 to be in line with the 3-series. How can you have an X3, which handles similiarly to the 3-series and costs less?
  • bodble2bodble2 Member Posts: 4,514
    "How can you have an X3, which handles similiarly to the 3-series and costs less?"

    By putting in a cheaper interior, which they did.
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    It doesn't cost less though. There might be several classes of BMW interiors coming down the pike.
  • doneby2010doneby2010 Member Posts: 27
    Thanks for the informative post. I agree with your comments on every aspect. I like X3's agility, better use of space, lower to the ground and size (and new gadgets). At this point though, I'm leaning toward the X5 even though, at first, I was dead set on buying the X3 (that is until I sat in one!)

    What did you mean by "But I thought the X3 was more car-like overall"? I thought X5 had a smoother, car like ride, vs. the sportier ride for the X3.
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,373
    Which dealer in Jersey did you end up ordering the car from?

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

  • saugataksaugatak Member Posts: 488
    The new 3-series is supposed to get xdrive so maybe you should wait to trade in your current 3 series for the 2005 3 series if you want the X drive and don't need a bigger car.

    also, interesting to see that people are already getting below MSRP on X3s.
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    You're spamming - time to cease!

    tidester, host
  • xsfoxsfo Member Posts: 17
    Since no one has bothered to reply to my question, I did some digging around to figure out what book was mentioned before. Best as I can figure, the review was about the recent book "Trading Up: The New American Luxury" by Michael Silverstein and Neil Fiske. You can find it on Amazon.
Sign In or Register to comment.