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Cadillac STS/STS-V: What's New for 2007?
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Comments
Agreed – hence the title of my post: V8 AWD = Gas Guzzler.
I am just a bit disappointed – particularly given the 17 or 17.5 gal. fuel tank.
And given the Jaguar XJ8 at EPA 18 / 28 and even the supercharged XJR at 17 / 24.
- Ray
Hoping to have seen 24 / 25 mpg EPA even on the V8 AWD - sigh
Click on the '05 STS and there'll be a "contact me with more info" link in there.
Just like the Chrysler 300.
Cadillac has great products and if twenty or thirty people on Edmunds dont buy Cadillac's there will be twenty or thirty-thousand (216,000 for 2003)people like me that will.
Besides all of that engine technology makes for a $high$ service bill, BMW, MB, Audi, you guys have had them.
Now I really LIKE that designation!
- Ray
"What do you drive now?"
"I drive a Sigma Heavy!!!"
Menacing . . .
(Maybe better than 'Hemi')
So now there's going to be:
-Sigma Lite
-Sigma
-Sigma Heavy
Nice..
-Paul
Sigma Lite/Sigma Mass is Zeta.
Acura SH AWD is looking better all the time, as is the Audi A6 for 05.
I've been wrong before, BTW.
Over the weekend I saw two of them on the road. A dark blue and a black one. They looked very nice. This is the first time I have seen them in person and you can definatley tell there is a difference from the CTS. The STS does have the same design but looks bigger and has softer edges. I wanted to turn around and get a better look but the better half wasn't interested.
21 built his week.
I would expect for STS's to be on dealer's lots around August.
The next step is for this thread to graduate to the "SEDANS" board.
-- Mark
Has anyone else heard that? Or anything different?
- Ray
Wondering what a V8, 1SG, NAV, HUD and a heated steering wheel will list for . . .
It certainly includes lots of stuff (Sat Nav, heated and ventilated front seats, Xenon, Limited Slip, Performance Brakes, etc) - most all I would want, but . . .
And, as Mark said, this puts even a V8 RWD 1SG over $60K.
WOW.
- Ray
WOW. . .
Point?
The Cadillac may be too expensive.
I think I'll go back to Audi and still keep my eye on the new Acura RL.
Perhaps Cadillac will just add AWD to the CTS -- one of my employees just got a CTS, and it is REALLY nice, and not even a CTS-v.
Since I had been told that the official pricing would be released on the 10th, I contacted my local dealer. Clueless.
So I sent an e-mail to my (?) Caddy Personal Assistant requesting only two things: 1SG pricing and HUD availability.
I expect that it will be on Edmunds and KBB - and on the Caddy web site shortly.
- Ray
Remembering when I could buy a pretty nice new (whole) car for $13K . . .
I did find a site with all of the options.
I am not at all happy with how Cadillac has bundled these options.
They have debundled options on both the CTS and SRX in response to criticism.
But haven't here.
Looks like you can't get the "Sport" package without buying the full on 1SC package(V6)
Can't get the 18" wheels on the V6 either.
The wood trim that they have shown in all the pics is OPTIONAL!
So I guess the base cars will have a sea of black trim on the center stack. Arrgh!
Go back to ala carte ordering Cadillac!
here is the site.
http://www.carprices.net/find_display/pricing_page.pl/Cadillac/ST- - S/STS_V6_RWD/2005/options.html?STS_V6_RWD=2005&Cadillac=STS
Exactly what GM wants. They would like to move only 30,000 Per Year of the STS world wide, push Cadillac upscale, towards the $100 K’s and make for Buick to go for low price luxury. It may be a good way to do it. You know, when you see a Cadillac, you will know what those people paid for it .. That is the Idea
standard V8 46,800
1SE package 2,845
1SF package 11,065
1SG package 13,100
AWD option 1,900
Dest. Charge 695.00
You need to get the 1SG Package in order to get the AWD option that is the only way to get AWD. Basically if you add up the V8,1SG,AWD and Dest. the vehicle comes out to over 62,500. If anybody has anything else regarding prices let us know.
2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])
I saw pricing for all seven V6 & V8 packages (3 V6 - Std, Luxury & Performance) and 4 V8 (same 3 plus a top of the line Prestige package which has everything).
Here's the details on the V6s:
Standard; MSRP: $40,995. Expected to account for 10% of V6 sales, 7% of total STS sales. Includes:
- Stabilitrak
-17" painted wheels
- 5 spd auto stick
- Express power windows (all 4)
- 8 way pwr seats
- Leather
- Keyless access with pushbutton start
- Remote start
- Bose w/ CD & 8 speakers
- Only a la carte option is Engine Block Heater
Luxury: MSRP: $43,470. Expected to account or 60% of V6 sales, 42% of total STS sales. Includes above plus:- Memory settings
- 6 disc changer
- Heated front seats
- Rainsense wipers
- Homelink
- XM Radio
-Wood package
- Only options Sunroof ($1200), 17" polished wheels ($600) & engine block heater
TOTAL PAACKAGE PRICE = $2,475
Luxury Performance; MSRP: $49,560. 30% of V6 sales; 21% of total STS sales. Includes all the above plus:
- Bose 5.1 surround sound, DVD & navi
- Rear heated seats & heated steering wheel
- Ventilated seats
- Performance brakes & lmtd slip differential
- Decklid spolier
- Uplevel wood trim
- 17" polished wheels
- Sunroof
- Only option is engine block heater
TOTAL PACKAGE PRICE = $8,565
The V8 started at $46,000 for base and went up to $61,995 for Prestige (which initially will be the only way to get AWD).
Don't know about you guys, but with a CTS Lux Sport running $41-$3K, this seems like an incredible price for this vehicle.
Sign me up!
I believe that the prices posted are an accurate reflection of MSRP. What these cars will actually sell for, after discounts / rebates, who knows.
Although I have not yet driven one, my sense is that this will be a very good car. (Whatever the opinions of the testers, once published, I expect to drive one or 2.) But even with the apparent success of the CTS-V, I am not convinced that many people will pay these prices for this car – yet.
Caddy clearly does have a long established reputation. But it is NOT in the high performance sedan arena. Caddy deciding to go up against the best (the standards) in the world (today) like the BMW 5, the new A6, the MB E-Class, etc. is going to be difficult for many reasons, really – but for Caddy, there is the added problem that many people in the market for a sedan of similar specifications will not even look seriously at the Caddy, because it has not yet established an ownership base in this class. If the pricing is also perceived to be rather high for the value received, sales will be even more difficult.
And decisions like only offering AWD with the V8 1SG will mean that the minimum list price will be in the $62K range. An AWD Caddy sport sedan may be of interest to some, but the number interested at that price is likely to be smaller than if base / 1SE V8s and V6s were also available with the option.
More aggressive pricing, at least to start, would be one way to raise awareness and better balance the value perception. And then, pricing could be adjusted.
We’ll see.
- Ray
No marketing wiz – but a potential buyer . . .
The car was very nice -- Audi did, however lower the price and increase the content over the next few years.
I know there are a lot of Audi naysayers -- but at this time, Cadillac has about as much chance of getting me to shell out $62K for a first year STS as VW has of getting most of us to shell out $66 to $96K for a Phaeton.
The Lexus approach, as I have heard it called, is to convince the market by offering value and then move the price point upmarket.
The CTS seems like a pretty good car, maybe even a very good car -- the current other Caddys do not impress most Euro Premium buyers (and probably not many Japanese Premium buyers).
To put it into perspective, the Chrysler 300C may prove to be a bad value (a year or so from now). But, itintially, the 300C Hemi with all options seems to be "according to others, who write this stuff for a living" a lot of car for the money (I've read reviews of the 300C that claim it feels like a car $10,000 more).
The new Cadillac looks great and I might be a customer if I could order the V8, AWD and cherry pick an option or two to get the price (MSRP) in the low to mid 50's.
I guess I'll just say "too much $$$ too quickly" -- and this coming from a guy who thinks the Phaeton (if leased) is a heck-of-a bargain compared with t Mercedes which is subtantially more $$ and is only RWD.
I hope they, Cadillac, unbundles the options a bit, so that ordering AWD does not automatically add $11,000 - $13,000 in bundled options.
Hey, maybe it IS the bargain of the decade -- the issue, to repeat, is that without any history, this is too much money. I'll stick with the Germans and possibly the Japanese. And, who knows, perhaps the 300C SRT-8 might be the "steal of the decade" if you can stand entering a Chyrsler dealership.
At least the Cincinnati Cadillac dealers have learned how to "act" like the German Premium brand dealers. Not so the Herb Tarlicks that still populate Chryco dealerships -- plaid pants, white shoes and belts and all. . . .
C'mon Cadillac, throw us a bone, let us order the V6 with the AWD option or the V8 without the kitchen sink!
For the time being, Cadillac, your reputation (the one that you want) does NOT precede you.
From the Audi A8 forum, regarding availability of the SWB A8: “The A8 has a manufacturer’s suggested retail price of $66,590.”
Does this make the 2004 A8 at this list price 'a bargain' - relatively speaking???
And with he new Caddy STS V8 AWD (1SG) apparently to be in the $62K range, does this mean that the STS will turn out to be a bargain?
- Ray
Rhetorical questions, I suppose . . .
No, if you factor in the time value of money, I do not think it a bargain....
The Acura RL, which I see is being presented "as if" it is in the same class as the Cadillac (July Automobile magazine, FWIW) and it will be maxed out at $49,650 w/SH AWD and a 300 HP [V6] engine -- bargain?
Who knows -- my point is that the STS at $62,500 equipped the way I would want it, just got about $8 to $10K too high.
What on earth makes Cadillac think the other $8,500 worth of stuff should be foisted upon the customer who wants, essentially, a V8 + AWD STS (which on the SRX is $1,900 -- that seems reasonable).
The STS must "cost" about the same as the SRX, wouldn't you think?
If they are cruising around in a cheap Benz and you have an STS worth $62K, they will get the message..... At these prices, you are beyond bargain hunting, you are essentially buying prestige.... Lutz calls Bargains in this Segment, Mass Luxury will leather, he want to move Cadillac away from that segment and let Buick take it, Hence the higher prices Cadillac is asking for.
Base Model Prices
Model...Model Description......................MSRP(c)...........Destination
6DW29...STS V6 Luxury Sports Sedan.............$40,300.00.........$695.00
6DC29...STS V8 Luxury Sports Sedan.............$46,800.00.........$695.00
Option Packages
Optioncode......Description.............................MSRP(c)
1SA.............1SA Standard Package....................$0.00
1SB.............1SB Luxury Package......................$2,390.00
1SC.............1SC Luxury Performance Package..........$8,595.00
1SE.............1SE Luxury Package......................$2,845.00
1SF.............1SF Luxury Performance Package..........$11,065.00
1SG.............1SG Premium Lux Performance Pkg.........$13,115.00
PCR.............Premium Upgrade Package.................$730.00
QAF.............Performance Handling Package............$795.00
Additional Options
OptionCode...Description................................MSRP(c)
K59..........Adaptive Cruise Control....................$2,300.00
MV3..........All Wheel Drive............................$1,900.00
V03..........Performance Cooling Package................$150.00
K05..........Engine Block Heater........................$100.00
29U..........Red Line Premium Color.....................$995.00
98U..........White Diamond Premium Color................$995.00
R8E..........Gas Guzzler Tax (w/MV3 AWD)................$1,000.00
IL3..........Premium Tuscany Leather Seats..............$1,200.00
U2K..........XM Satellite...............................$325.00
CF5..........Express Open/Close Sunroof.................$1,200.00
__________________
Given that this is the 1st level package for the V8, any list of what options are included?
No link I have seen specifies what this includes.
Must be some of what is included in 1SF and 1SG - but $2,845 to $11,065 seems like a BIG jump to me. . .
Thanks,
- Ray
Curious . . .
Looks to me like 1SE includes:
Memory Pkg – A45
Heated Front Seats – KA1
Heated Rear Seats – KA6
Sound System – YQ2
Leather Heated Steering Wheel – NR7
Homelink – VG1
Wood Trim (some) – B19
Electrochrome rearview mirror w/compass – DD7
Not a sunroof.
Plus ability to order some additional options (sunroof) separately.
But some (LSD) you still cannot order with ‘just’ the 1SE.
Interesting. (Sort of.)
But this is really still a guess.
- Ray
Still waiting for “Build My Caddy” / STS to be added to their web site . . .
- Ray
Thinking that (at least) is pretty reasonable . . .
This makes the ‘real’, current minimum base MSRP for the V8 = over $50K.
- Ray
Not understanding this marketing strategy . . .
2005 Cadillac STS luxury performance sedan will start at $40,995, including a destination freight charge of $695.
4.6L Northstar engine with 320 horsepower and 315 lb-ft. of torque, will start at $47,495 (including DFC of $695.
I think the prices are priced just right..Cadillac does not need to be looked at as a good value budget luxury car like Acura is....Any valet will just to a Cadillac before they jump into a bland Acura. So what if they seem pricey then don't buy. Cadillac keep up the good work!!!!!!!!!
I could have been more specific - I was referring to Options / Packages pricing and availability.
- Ray
Yeah, Cadillac had automatic high/low beam back in what, 1955?
My 1985 Lincoln Continental had it too.
BMW owners won't trade in their Bimmers for Caddies because the Caddies don't have the blue and white rondel on the hood.
BTW, CTS is outselling the 3 series these days.
The new system uses a computer sensor to make some judgements on whether or not an oncoming car is resposible for the approaching light, or whether or not it is something else. The system will hopefully have a fast reaction time than the previous systems.
Though its a Pushrod its also a very advanced engine. Its not the so called Small block of the 60's. Its completely redesigned and engineered with all the electronic wizardry of the new milinium....
No wonder M3 foreign car owners are quickly dissapointed when they try to light a candle in the precense of the Z06