Ford Fusion/Mercury Milan

mschmal · April 2004

They should call it Faction, then have a Falcon trim level, a Fairlane trim level, and a Four Hundred trim level.

Peeps can ask "So what Faction are you?"

Mark

nvbanker · April 2004

I'm good with Four Hundred. I'm not good with much else mentioned. Falcon, for those of us who remember them well, conjures up the image of a stripped and really rough econobox. A Cavalier would be a good "today's analogy" for a Falcon.
Granada sure has a negative connotation- but it was a wildly popular seller, and personally, I loved 'em. Especially the Ghia models. Great interiors!

NOpe, I still like Four Hundred best.

a_l_hubcaps · April 2004

I saw that Ford recently trademarked Chroma. Could be for something else though, or just speculative. I like Chroma better than Four Hundred. A numerical name spelled out is still a numerical name, and I am sick of them. I would be fine with Fairlane, Fairmont or Granada too. Falcon should be reserved for the new subcompact that is rumored to be in development. After all, that's what the original Falcon was.

Regarding Chroma...that name has only been tossed around for a few days, and people on other message boards have already made the following jokes:

"Chroma-tose"
"Chroma-chroma-chroma-chameleon"

So I was thinking, that name should appeal to people who work with TV equipment. Because, of course, you start your Chroma with a Chroma key :-)

-Andrew L

johnclineii · April 2004

With all due respect, the Chroma name makes me sicka.

ANT14 · April 2004

I can tell you, Chroma has been ruled out. Don't be surprised if you see it as a concept's name though...

alpha01 · April 2004

Thanks for always providing awesome info. You're an asset here. And thank whoever at Ford ruled out that absurd name.

~alpha

ANT14 · April 2004

BUT, let's not breathe a collective sigh of relief just yet. As I mentioned earlier, just POST what you like and dislike on this forum, people are listening here.....

Now, whether the power that be absorb it, is another story....

nvbanker · April 2004

Which of the heritage (legacy) names most accurately fits the Future, ANT?

FAIRLANE: Once the flagship of the Ford fleet, was downsized in 62, giving way to the Galaxie - went away in 72 I think, giving way to the Torino.

FAIRMONT: Designed as a midsize/downsize replacement for the Torino in 78 - a hearty little workhorse, known for chintzy interior parts and the goofiest horn button idea in automotive history. Gave way to the second generation Granada in the early 80's.

GRANADA: With a questionable reputation, although I don't know why, this "precision sized" near luxury car was a huge hit for Ford in 75, offering really nice styling, a Ghia interior package that rivaled Lincoln for "vinyl" luxury in a Ford/Mercury product. Why it took it on the chin in later years is beyond me, I always wanted to own one, but couldn't afford one back then.

FALCON: Personally, that's the Focus to me.

So, ANT, where does the Futura fit in the lineup? I can't see it as a Fairlane...don't want to see it as a Fairmont (owned one, a so so car IMO.) Granada would work for me, but evidently, that name bears a lot of negative baggage out there, and Falcon - they already have one.

Also, I don't see much brand equity in the Fairmont or Granada names, personally.

ANT14 · April 2004

Your assessment is correct, and my feelings are the same. I believe Falcon so far has the strongest identity as far as names.

I wouldn't doubt it if some last ditch effort, Faction, or Fusion, or some other name (not used on a prior vehicle before) is used...

buckwheat · April 2004

you denigrate the 1978 Fairmont rightfully on the interior but perhaps you had a 4 or 6cyl. and therein your disappointment. I had a 302v8 rocket, don't really remember its demise. Can't recall the horn button anomaly.

johnclineii · April 2004

I believe it may have been among the first Fords to put the horn on the end of the turn signal stalk. Truly idiocy.

grbeck · April 2004

The Granada's reputation was hurt by all of those ads comparing it to a Mercedes (and later a Cadillac Seville). At that time, we knew the comparison was a big stretch. Those Maverick underpinnings were getting old by 1975. Plus, the mid to late 1970s were not a good time for Ford.

The Fairmont was a much better design, but the interiors were very plain. Maybe the perfect small family sedan would have been a Fairmont trimmed at the same level as a first-generation Granada Ghia.

johnclineii · April 2004

If those ads had only made the comparison, they might have had some credibility. But, no, they claimed the little Ford was SUPERIOR to those much more expensive and better built cars.

Those ads damaged Ford enough to those who just heard them and said "Yeah, right." The damage was far worse for those who bought the cars and discovered, to their sadness, that they were balderdash.

Underpromise and overdeliver. Something the Asian manufacturers learned to do in the Seventies and Eighties, and their market share growth showed it.

Granada? Call the car formerly known as Futura that and those in my generation will snicker, dismiss it and tell all their friends, kids and grandkids...NOT a good thing.

lichtronimo · April 2004

Ford has trademarked the following names recently that could be used for the car formerly-known-as Futura:

Finalist; and,

Two Hundred
Three Hundred
Four Hundred
Six Hundred... see a trend here?

buckwheat · April 2004

John now that you mention it I vaguely remember that. That surely was idiotic..

robr2 · April 2004

Wasn't that supposed to be "euro"?? I recall Ford touting that.

Also, wasn't it the job of the Lincoln Versailles to go up against MB back in the 70's. Shiver Shiver - all I remember is baby blue half vinyl roof, carriage lamps, and a continental kit. BLEEEEECCCHHHHH

nedc2 · April 2004

The location of the horn button was the only thing about the interior ergonomics of my old Futura that didn't annoy me.

ehaase · April 2004

A few minor changes to Nvbanker's post -

1. The last year for the Fairlane was 1970. My father had a 1970 Fairlane 500 wagon which gave him almost 250,000 miles of service.

2. The Fairmont replaced the Maverick. The 1977 LTD II replaced the Torino. The Tempo replaced the Fairmont in 1983.

I loved the Granada Ghias from 1975 to 1977. I love the plush interiors that the domestic automakers had from the mid 1970's to the mid 1980's. I would have no problem seeing the Granada name be used again.

grbeck · April 2004

The Granada was a decent attempt to make big-car amenities available in a trimmer package. One reason it got poor press at the time was that Ford tried to endow the Granada with a "big car ride." Given the simple suspensions of the time, that meant soft springs and shocks, which resulted in sloppy handling. Plus, it was considerably heavier than the Maverick, but most were equipped with either the I-6 or 302 cid V-8, which made for sedate performance.

Ford pushed a smoother ride more than either GM or Chrysler, which often meant that its vehicles lagged in the handling department. Chevy, on the other hand, started pushing handling packages that included suspension upgrades with the revamped 1975 Nova.

tomcat630 · April 2004

Ford never claimed that the Granada was "superior" to Benzes, just that they looked similar.

With an I6, Granadas ran forever, like the Falcons and Mavericks before them. The Fox based Granadas with I6's lasted long, too. Too bad the 3.8 V6's weren't as durable.

Ford was all mushy handing in the 70's due to Hank II, but the Fairmont/Fox was a big break from sloppy handling cars.

alpha01 · April 2004

We really arent going to start extolling the virtues of Ford (or any domestic make's) late 70s and early 80s offerings, are we? This is a future vehicles forum, not a keep-the-unions-happy nostalgia thread.

Back to the new Futura/Falcon/Fairlane/Chroma/(insert stupid name here)

~alpha

nvbanker · April 2004

some of us think the late 70's and early 80's Ford offerings sucked less than GMs or Chryslers, and frankly back then, Asian offerings were soooooo small & tinny, I just couldn't get into them. The engines were great, the rest of the cars began rusting in the showrooms, and the plastics inside cracked or warped the first hot summer.

It wasn't until the mid to late 80's that I found an Asian car decent enough to buy one. And the Civic I bought in 89 was finally good inside, but still, oh so thin and tinny on the outside.

The big 3 was still building fairly substantial cars back then, and the Fords ran quite well, I thought.

lichtronimo · April 2004

The key is they all sucked...

alpha01 · April 2004

My point being this is a future vehicles thread, regardless of whose iron mastadons were better in the 80s.

~alpha

Kirstie_H · April 2004

Bingo. Let's stick to the Future here. There are plenty of import v domestic discussions on the N&V board, and it's been done to death.

tomcat630 · April 2004

Any news on the new name for "the car formerly know as Futura"?

ANT14 · April 2004

None, but it's coming to an end soon...

jchan2 · May 2004

has a price range been set for this upcoming and still yet unnamed Ford midsized Acccord/Camry/Mazda6 fighter?

ANT14 · May 2004

Nothing officially just yet, when they do, I'll post it. Common sense dictates it'll pick up around $16K, up to $27-28K (For the 270HP ST version).

f111d · May 2004

What are the odds makers saying, will Ford be able to pull it off?
and I take it a Hybrid is more likely than a common rail option?
Sure hope the dealers have a big training budget? OBD II is still being mis-diagnosed at the expense of the owners. And today I read the government wants to standardize side-air bags? The cost of personal/freedom transportation has or is closing in on some level(economic) where public transportation gets implemented?
Paul

ANT14 · May 2004

The Futura project shouldn't be that hard to pull of. It's important they get it right, and so far it'll have the genes to make it a great handling vehicle overall.

The Escape's Hybrid system will also be implemented as an option a year after it's introduction. Although I it would be interesting if they could implement Europe's 2.7L Diesel as well. Although the benefit of the F-named sedan will be it's base 4 cylinder engine, since majority of consumer's opt. for the smaller engine.

As for public transportation, too many cities, with too much mess, and not enough money makes it almost impossible to tame the beast of the american consumer.

I myself live in Miami where we have the 3rd worst traffic in the nation, and #1 in rudest driver's, and are public transportation system is a joke. A light rail system that hasn't paid off in 15+ year's since it opened. Going into neighborhood's no one would dare want to be in.

mazda6iguy · May 2004

I remember there was talk a few years ago around Dearborn that Ford was going to bring the Fairlane name back, and that was before the 427/Futura and the Mazda6 was even a glint in the designers and engineers eyes. So my guess is Fairlane.

ANT14 · May 2004

Yes, Fairlane was the name applied to this "mysterious RWD sedan" that Ford was designing. But this was maybe 3 year's ago, and much has happened since then. At least, that's what rumors stated. For all we know, they could have based this on having the Australian Falcon around, and the media just took it another way....

mschmal · May 2004

anyone know if they are working on diesel hybrids for the next generation? would seem to make sense.

Mark

ANT14 · May 2004

If they wanted to, they can bring over the Euro 2.7L Diesel that's used in the Mondeo, X-type, etc. As for a larger one than that, there's the new International Truck(the manufacturer) 4.5L V6 that was just implemented on the cab-over versions of the F-series. They could implement that into the regular F-series, Expeditions, etc.

Just recently their was an article stating how Ford was looking for a diesel partner, possibly Cummin's. (guess they aren't too happy with International's diesel products).

Kirstie_H · May 2004

Mark, we've got a fairly new discussion about that very topic:
Hybrid Diesels

jchan2 · May 2004

ANT14, what's your guess on pricing for the F-named sedan Hybrid version?

ANT14 · May 2004

Too early for a guestimate, when they haven't even named the damn vehicled, heh...

Actually a few factors will have to take place. How well the Hybrid Escape sells, question customer's (in these consumer clinics) what features they expect out of a Hybrid "F-named midsized sedan". If they go the way the Hybrid Escape is going, I'm guestimating around $24-26K.

Traditionally, these Hybrid vehicles were primarily economy cars (since that's who you expect would want to save gas), taken to a higher level of options and trim levels. And mainly you were always looking at vehicles under or around $20K.

Now Lexus, will be introducing the RX400, and push their hybrid techonology upon consumer's that CAN afford to pay it. Which is pretty nifty. The only reserve in that equation is, would someone in that price bracket, care to save a bit on gas...Although the equation of can they aoffrd it, is resolved.

Now you have Ford in the middle ground, offering it on high volume vehicles, right inbetween those 2 demographics/markets.

jchan2 · May 2004

although the Accord Hybrid should be priced more like an Acura TSX. (according to guesstimates on the Accord Hybrid board)

alpha01 · May 2004

"The only reserve in that equation is, would someone in that price bracket, care to save a bit on gas..."

This is precisely why Toyota is introducing a new variable as a selling point for the Lexus RX-h: Performance- the hybrid RX will trounce the standard 3.3L in terms of acceleration (the base is still pretty quick- AWD at 7.8 to sixty by C/D's watch). So if the added MPG isnt enough for said consumers... more power just might be...

~alpha

jchan2 · June 2004

the difference between a dealer earning $40,000 on a base RX330 and the same dealer and salesperson earning $44,000 on an RX400H.

johnclineii · June 2004

Earning? I think not.

Profit is what counts, not sales price without regard to cost...

jchan2 · June 2004

but the Lexus dealer can give a discount on the RX330 but demand for the RX400H will be almost certainly higher, so they can charge more above Invoice than the standard RX330.

tomcat630 · June 2004

The are looking to expand Escape Hybrid productiuon due to high numbers of orders. So "How well the Hybrid Escape sells.." will be a very well indeed.

Ford must be waiting for the 2005 Detroit Auto Show to announce the name for the CD338 "Futura".

jchan2 · June 2004

and they're keeping us agonizing here.

johnclineii · June 2004

Given Ford's recent naming experiences, I suspect it is the Ford attorneys who are in the most agony, with the marketers only being slightly behind!

ANT14 · June 2004

Reason they can't expand much of the order's is because Sanyo just can't produce more battery packs for the hybrids. So they'll have to increase assembly, or look for another supplier.

lichtronimo · June 2004

The name of the "Futura" may just end up being like the Focus story - where Jac Nasser didn't tell anybody the name until the night before the debut. The marketing people had to work overtime to get all the press kits ready. Notice how the first glamor shots of the Focus had no badging on the car?

jchan2 · June 2004

no I didn't notice.

johnclineii · June 2004

Me neither. I really didn't focus on the Focus launch at all....

Ford Fusion/Mercury Milan

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