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Comments
I guess some only look for that.
you only buy a minivan for its utility. who WOULDN'T want fold flat seats?
Plus, even if you don't fold them, you have a storage compartment for kids' toys or whatever.
-juice
I do not really have any idea about this. I have no kids, so mini-vans are pretty low on my list of vehicles.
-juice
picture logic at best buy loading the big screen tv into his van, check that....TRYING to...the lost 6" in height meant he had to have it delivered instead!
Sears charges for delivery but will take your old television away for 10 bucks. I have a 36" Panasonic cathode ray tube hdtv that weighs a ton! When I get my new tv, I plan on taking outrageous advantage of Sears' offer.
oh, you mean UPLANDER, a GM product
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid99/p79cc97dc317248d514af- 4e8cb42c9620/f9f611c4.jpg
3rd row actually looks livable, and it's packed into a reasonably small wrapper.
-juice
to the general public these vehicles are unchanged, when compared to the press assault of the other real new vans.
of course its gonna need at least 4 or 5 grand to move em.
spartanmann : GM stock has doubled in the last 6 months.
With GM pulling more and more of its other vehicles out of the rental markets, even if the vans become fleet material, it could help the GM bottom line.
Over the next few years, I expect the mini-vans to be at least a small part in a larger dividend for me than the dividend I got this year.
Jan 10, 2003 stock price $39.11
Jan 10, 2004 stock price $53.81
Based on the info available at GM's web site
The problems over the last ten years had much more to do with pension and health care costs and older, more expensive manufacturing facilities.
GM has done and excellent job reducing payroll, it has largely funded pension and health care liabilities, and it is near the end of a project to update its facilities. With these cost savings, GM will be more profitable than it has been for many years.
So if GM stock was $26 10 years ago and is $53 today, how is that virtually the same? Stock also pays a very generous dividend. One of our clients (who works for Ford actually) bought 1000 @ 35 and is sitting pretty now.
Really, you can look at any stock, time frame it and say it's dead money. Look at all these tech stocks.
GM needs some barnburners in the mass market segments that compete with the same level of competence as the C6 Corvette and CTS-V do in their respective classes.
Unfortunately, GM's lineup still features too many warmed-over updates of vehicles that weren't that competitive in the first place. These "new" minivans are a prime example.
Second: 2004 Honda Odyssey EX-L/ Nissan Quest 3.5 SE (tie)
Third: Chrysler Town & Country Limited
Fourth: Mazda MPV ES
Fifth: Ford Freestar SEL/ Mercury Monterey Premier
Sixth: Kia Sedona EX
Seventh: Buick Terraza CXL/Saturn Relay/Chevrolet Uplander/Pontiac Montana SV6
Eighth: Chevrolet Astro LT/ GMC Safari SLE (unless you're towing, then the Astro goes to the top)
Did I miss a van? Agreed?
According to you.
Kia vans are crap, you must be joking! Freestar (Windstar) although new has lousy mileage / powertrain also and a 80's dash.
GM vans will easily be better than either. DC vans are tied for top spot IMO with Toyota and Honda.
The GM minivans are too narrow, a result of sharing a platform with Opel/Vauxhall models. The updated models are still at a disadvantage against competitors in this regard.
rctennis3811 : Ya, a fold flat seat.. wow.
What has saved the GM minivans is that they offer more reliable drivetrains than their domestic competitors.
grbeck : Most people I know in newer houses face the same issue. Our neighbor just bought a Quest and now realizes she can't fit it into the garage and has to park it in the cold and snow. Maybe most people do like wider but their is a niche of people who prefer a bit less width. Selling point for a segment, no doubt!
Some of my tech stock bought at the same period accelerated very quickly. Then it reversed, to put it mildly. The stock I sold before the losses were too bad did me fine. The other stock is worthless.
None of the tech shares paid a dividend.
But there is a huge difference between cost of manufacturing and incentives. GM shareholders at least for the time I have held the stock have encouraged GM to cut operating costs. The reason I continue to hold GM stock is that GM has in fact cut operating costs deeper and quicker than many thought possible. Now that GM is moving away from incentives on its new product, it is reasonable to expect greater profitability, higher dividends (which are now taxed less) and higher gains in stock price.
'Cept no one told GM that it meant fold flat flush into the floor, not fold flat 6 inches above the load floor.
Imagine the cussing and swearing with folks trying to lift heavy items up over the 'hump' in the load floor. First heavy item with momentum to snag that bump will see many annoynaces from many buyers saying, 'never again will I buy such an afterthought design'.
reg : Do you honestly think that most people will care about the 6 inches that much if the rest of the van is nice? Maybe you are right, time will tell.
spartanmann : "That is just a fact". If you say so. I still don't see how $28 in 93 is the same as $53 today though.