Subaru Legacy/Outback 2005+

aviziv · August 2004

Hi,

I am about to buy a 2005 Outback. Would anyone else have a maintenance coupon that they don't plan on using?

My email address is improziv@yahoo.com

Thanks a lot!!!!

Avi

cptplt · August 2004

16 in wheels will not clear the brakes on the GT, they will on the OB though.

as for the IIHS crash tests, while useful I don't think you can just use one result to make a truely informed decision. I have both a Ford Windstar and a Chevy Venture. The Windstar gets raves from every testing agency about its results in crash test even since it was made. The GM minivans (Venture/Silo/Transport)get the worst rating in the IIHS offset test.CR pans them mercilessly for that. However the IIHS says the fatality rate in real life claims experiences is better for the GM minivans than the Windstar. Go figure! I can't believe Windstar drivers are more dangerous than GM minivan drivers or they never have offset crash and only full frontal or side impacts!
Its like the BMW 3 series fiasco a few years back. They tried to improve their Euro crash results and ended up failing the US frontal crash! All because of some bracket in the dash or something ridiculous.
Yes, the crash tests tell you something but one bad result of one series of tests does not make the vehicle dangerous or even necessarily more dnagerous than another with similar results in other test parameters.! If numerous testing agencies are getting similar bad results then I would be running the other way, if they are not, its interesting info but hardly a deal breaker
Ultimately though, real life insurance claims statistics are all that matter. The car which does better in a crash test may also be the one you are more likely to crash for a whole host of reasons from bad brakes and poor steering to bad visibility!

leochan · August 2004

Folks,

Sorry for not responding earlier to some posts but been busy lately (of course part of the reason was driving my silver wagon all over the place to get past the break-in period). After 700 miles (could have easily reached 1k after 3 days but decided against it), here are some more observations:

(1) Filled up the tank twice and each time averaged 23 mpg on 60% highway and 40% city driving. Hope it continues to go up with each tank.

(2) The power picked up noticeably on days 3 and 4 (200+ miles driven). Then again at 500miles.

(3) Never having AWD before, I was very impressed with the feel of the car during a few days of rain as well as taking many turns harder than I would never do on my previous vehicles (not increasing the power but just steering sharply). It is very early but I don't think I ever want to go back to a non-AWD vehicle go. I just feel safer and more in control of the car.

(4) Awhile back, someone posted about the poor rain gutters on the 05 OB when one opened the door. My legacy has a few quirks I would like to mention (can't be a Subaru without a few of them).
  -- After it rains, be very careful when you open the trunk. The water does get inside the trunk which I wasn't expecting the 1st 2 times I opened the trunk on consecutive mornings.
  -- A few drops will enter the moonroof also when you open it up (never had this problem w/ my previous cars). For the moonroof, the solution is simple...just drive it on the highway for 5 minutes before opening it up!!
  -- I will have to pay more attention with the drivers door. I did get a few drops inside but truthfully I don't recall if it was me getting wet after putting stuff into the trunk. Will keep everyone posted.

(5) Besides the water situation with the trunk described above, the biggest complaint I have is the turn signal. For whatever reason, I forget to turn them off after switching lanes (never done this before). There is not enough noise when the turn signal is used and the light just isn't bright enough for me to notice the lights blinking. I'll have to find a way to adjust to this!

(6) I will most likely replace the horns in the car. I had to use to use the horn twice to avoid getting hit by a careless driver but I don't think the sound is imposing enough.

(7) I hope I am breaking in the car properly. My dealer told me to vary the driving habits but not to reach 4k rpm whenever possible. I have actually stayed under 3.2k rpm 95% of the time with all types of driving situations except hard driving of course (although I have passed many cars with a semi-gradual push of the pedal). If anyone thinks I am not properly breaking in my Subie, pelase let me know. I probably will continue this habit til 1500 miles but start being slightly more aggressive after hitting 1000 miles.

(8) Which leads me to a very unusual problem (nice problem to have with a car). This car is so powerful and I haven't even tapped into its soul yet. It looks like I am going to have to purchase a radar detector. This car easily hits 85mph around 3.2k rpm and I almost got caught twice by cops for speeding. What the heck am I going to do? LOL!!!

Enjoying the heck out of this car...if anyone is one the fence, I strongly recommend any of the 05 Legacy/Outback vehicles. The best blend of power, refinement, and value for an AWD vehicle! GO SUBARU!!!!!!!

P.S. Will be switching to a new username (SubieRules) after this post

kens · August 2004

Congrats on your purchase!

I have heard a few other owners complain about the relatively quiet turn signal. I personally find it complimentary to the quiet interior of the vehicle!

Your break-in method sounds good. It's probably fine to explore above 4K rpm for short bursts of time. Check out www.overboost.com for a good break-in article.

Ken

subierules · August 2004

Thanks Ken! I remembered you were one of the posters who previously informed me of the increase in power/turbo surge after 200 miles. How is your mileage on your vehicle now? WHat rpm band do you notice the best surge?
Do you have any specific comments/recommendations/observations since you have more miles than I? Thanks!

Leo

smokeybaer · August 2004

Have an 01 VCD with 92,000 mi and about out of extended warranty. In last 10 months have replaced at cost of nearly $8000 the following:
Front Rotors
Machined rear rotors
Brake pads
Transmission
both front wheel bearings
starter
alternator
battery
tires
radiator
both front struts
fan belt

Should be good for a long time but this amount of repairs has me worried after warranty expires. I decided on a silver GT Ltd Wagon and first thought I'd get the Auto Trans but the talk of turbo lag has me thinking maybe the 5MT might be better. Will the 5MT give much better gas mileage even though its geared lower? Can get new one for Invoice. Any thoughts on what my trade should be worth after all these repairs? Car has no rust and never been in an accident. Extras are trailer hitch, spoiler, hood protector, dimming mirror, security pkg.

Any thoughts appreciated.

Warren

saywhat · August 2004

Hi Folks;
I picked up my 05 Legacy,auto, Turbo GT Sedan today, I looked into the extended warranty and the best I can do is $1,195.00 for 8 years 0 ded. 100,000 miles "gold plan" or 7 years, 80,000 miles "gold plan, for $895.00 very few exclusions on both of these plans. I passed for now until I could get some feedback from this forum. I tried grinding the F&I guy down, but he was all prepared to show me that these prices were already discounted because on the 8 years,100,000 0 ded. SBA charges $1,995,00l What do all of you know or think, and is it worth it to get one of these plans? I more than likely will sell the car in about four years or so.
My thanks for your anticipated answers.

krzyss · August 2004

It would have been good idea to change a car before putting 8000 in repairs. Now it might be better to ride it until something major fails.

Krzys

timo1745 · August 2004

Saywhat-

I'm in about the same boat as you; am taking delivery this Friday, and really wanted an extended warranty, but the prices I'm being quoted are even higher than yours. It was my understanding the markup on these warranties is over 100%, but I, too, would be interested in hearing some of the board members' feedback on this.

I drive about 16-18k miles per year, and being that I'm stuck financing for 4 years, I'll be out of my standard warranty REAL fast.

Rgds,
Tim G.
soon-to-have '05 OBXT Ltd.

kens · August 2004

Hi Leo,

I have about 2200 miles on my Legacy now and the only thing I've really noticed since is that the tires seem to finally have broken in. Up until 1500 miles or so, the tires tended to tramline a bit. That's lessened recently (and I keep my pressures in check too).

Power comes on strong from around 3000RPM or so especially in 3-5th gears. For fun, try putting your GT in manual mode for a clear stretch of freeway onramp and accelerate in 2 or 3. You'll be grinning.

Gas milage continues to improve. I get about 23-24mpg per tank now.

Ken

c_hunter · August 2004

Warren, don't worry about lag with the auto transmission. It's not much worse, if any, than the manual transmission. Plus, the auto snaps off shifts rapidly and smoothly like no manual transmission could! I would not hesitate to recommend the auto, and keep in mind I have driven and preferred manual for the last 20 years!

Best way to decide is to try both, I suppose.

Craig

cptplt · August 2004

you should be able to get one at 1/3 off MSRP easily, go only for the Subaru one and not some aftermarket (some of the largest aftermarket ones have gone out of business)
there are some websites which offer discounts - subaruwrxparts.com and subaru-warranty.com but shopping around various dealers works too. You don;t have to get one from th eoriginal selling dealer and you have till the 3/36 B2B warranty is up but then you can't finance it. SOA do offer an installment plan on a credit card for their ext warranties.
its sort of hit or miss with an ext warranty, I had one for a 92 Legacy and nothing went wrong till after it had ended! Then my 98 has more than broken even on it (mostly a/c work). You get some freebies sometimes as the dealers tend to treat you better eg I had an oil leak on the 98 and I wanted them to change the timing belt the same time they were in there doing the warranty stuff, they told SOA the timing belt was damaged by oil and did it all under warranty! They also replaced HVAC bulbs free when its not really a covered item as a goodwill gesture. Will have to wait and see if my WRX gets problems in the future.
On my other cars, a GM and Ford minivan I have gotten my moneys worth from the ext warranty several times over already!

ryanl1 · August 2004

I thought it was just me who wasn't paying attention to the turn signal enough.Try just knudging the turn signal so it doesn't click into place or adjust your steering wheel if it's blocking the view.

Thanks to all the regulars who help everyone enjoy their GT's more.

bruce3 · August 2004

Yakima accessories have adapters for square bars, there was a pair in the bike rack I purchased recently. Thule are already square. You can pretty much mix and match. If you have any questions just call Yakima.

pato01 · August 2004

Just test drove an '05 Outback 2.5i with 4spd auto tranny to replace my again 1990 Legacy wagon for use in Colorado mountains.

I don't understand why SOA offers a 5spd auto tranny on the 250hp XT but not on the 168hp 2.5i, which needs it more. On steep grades in Drive the 4spd hunts between 2nd & 3d gear, suggesting that with a 5spd it would comfortably stay in 3d in this situation. The 4spd has the typical Subaru reluctance to kick down, making it doggy on uphills unless you manually downshift and punch the revs.

Seems to me that the less powerful the car, the more gears it needs for different situations, which s why for manual transmissions, 5spds have replaced 3 & 4 spds.

Is there a good functional (rather than just pricing) reason for SOA's offering a new 5spd automatic on the XT but only the old 4spd automatic on the 2.5i? Plans to offer the 5spd on the lower-powered models in the future? All comments appreciated.

tsy · August 2004

I find that I'm getting kinda lonely here in the MT crowd here (crowd? more like handful!) Everyone's buying the 5EAT- I thought for sure more people would be getting the MT- it's such a blast to drive, but I guess the 5EAT is that good!

I never seem to keep my cars long enough to take advantage of the extended warranty- a lot of whether or not it pays off is luck (unless it's a domestic car) I have an extended warranty through my insurance company- I pay about $20 a year, which of course increases as the car gets older. But it's a way of hedging my bet- not a lot up front, and I can easily cancel at any time (or keep it if the car is having problems).

I got my service coupons in the mail yesterday- it covers all routine service up to 30K!

Ken- interesting article on the GT vs 530i. Too bad they didn't have a MT. Thanks also for the article on engine break in- I think I inadvertently did most of what they recommended- but did you or anyone else change your oil at 1000miles? I'm not sure they gave a clear reason as to why to do this.

Just passed 1500 miles- still look forward to driving it every morning!

tom

tsy · August 2004

Pato01, unfortunately cost has a large place in dictating how cars are optioned. Why stop at a 5 sp, how about a 7sp Auto? 4 calliper Brembo discs? 20" wheels? Height and electronically adjustable suspension? These are all available today- you just need to spend 3-4 times as much. ;-)

I think the 2.5i has so much of what is good from the more expensive models that you are actually benefitting without paying as much (I think Bob was talking about 'trickle down goodness') I agree that if the 2.5i had a little more power and a better tranny, it would be a better car (but what car wouldn't?) and I might have bought it instead of the Turbo. I would also guess some of your problems are a result of your altitude (forced induction would be better there) that aren't as much of an issue for those of us down here at sea level. ;-)

I would guess that just as 4 sp replaced 3sp autos, that eventually 5 sp will replace 4 sp autos, it just might be a while. Or maybe they'll improve CVTs? (Subaru Justy?)

tom

bluesubie · August 2004

The 4spd has the typical Subaru reluctance to kick down, making it doggy on uphills unless you manually downshift and punch the revs.

There should be a section in the owner's manual that addresses driving in hills. You can leave the selector in "3" and it will vary between 1st and 3rd gears. For very steep hills, you can leave it in "2" and it will remain in 2nd.

-Dennis

pato01 · August 2004

Dennis: With the selector in "3" do you really mean it will vary between 1st & 3d, or between 2nd & 3d? If the former, why won't it use 2nd as well? /pato

ateixeira · August 2004

DSC, TSC and all those methods of divine intervention are precisely that - they rob you of power and apply the brakes, amongst other evils, as they intervene with your input in order to protect you from yourself

AWD lets you have fun, and still manages to get you out of trouble. Power slide it out of a turn and the AWD shifts power to the front wheels, pulling you out of a (very fun) skid.

-juice

buddhabman · August 2004

http://motoring.iafrica.com/carsinaction/shootout/291844.htm

safetyfirst · August 2004

I mentioned a few weeks ago that my new Legacy i (2005) had an interior door handle grip with peeling paint, chipping all over the place. Well, I took the car into the dealership, and they ordered the replacement part under the warranty. So far so good. I brought the car into the dealer again yesterday and -- get this -- after having it for five hours, they called to say oops we ordered the wrong part. Now mistakes happen, of course, and I figured they'd make the redo easy for me.
     I was wrong. I asked the service manager if, when the part came in, I could bring it in first thing on a Saturday, so I would not have to miss work time due to their mistake. He said no, telling me that Subaru doesn't allow warranty work to be done on Saturday. He was also positively uninterested in rectifying the problem. I called Subaru to complain. I was told: (1) that dealers can do warranty work whenever they want (which means the service manager lied to me); (2) that because this dealership is independently owned, there is nothing Subaru can do for me.

    I've never had anything but pleasant experiences with Honda and Nissan service departments. And it's not like there's another Subaru dealer nearby that I could switch to.

      My advice folks: if you're considering buying a Subaru, think again.

outbacker2k2 · August 2004

Sorry to hear about your problems there, but that sounds like a Major dealer problem not an SOA problem. I have always had great service at my local dealer.

It would take something truely astounding to stop me from buying a GT.

tsy · August 2004

My dealer has been quite happy to fix everything on my car, even little nitpicky ones. They spent 3 hours removing and re-attatching the panel on my trunk because it was off by 2mm. They also replaced my entire door panel because of a small 3mm cut in the side (leather? vinyl?) They have given me service loaners both times.

My worst experiences have been with VW (I have had 2) who look for reasons not to do warranty service.

Unfortunately, it sounds like you need to find another dealer, even if it's farther away. You can try writing letters or calling their customer service manager (if they have one.) Certainly doesn't sound like an 'upscale' experience.

Sorry, and good luck.

tom

bolbo · August 2004

Safetyfirst: I don't know what kind of social/negotiating skills you possess, so my advice may not be helpful to you.

That said, you need to forget the service manager and go to the Dealership manager. Simply tell him your problem and then ask him " I just want to know, is this how you do business here?"

If his answer is anything but satisfactory. You politely, very politely and without fanfare or superfluous comments, ask for the the Dealership's owner's name and a way to contact him.

The only other information that I would divulge, and before asking for the Owner's contact info, would be to matter of factly tell him that you've been given absolutely no reason to bring your car to this dealership for regular service and that you'll be happy to patronize an establishment that deals with customers with a modicum of respect.

It's entirely possible that when you first talk to the Dealerships GM, he will 'usurp' the limited authority of the service manager and take care of you. Good luck, let us know. Question - is there another dealer within reasonable driving distance?

smokeybaer · August 2004

Still trying to discover if the 5MT will give better mileage than the 5EAT even through the final gearing is lower. I don't put much stock in the figures posted on the sticker.
I also wonder about the gearing down for compression braking into corners and slowing for stops ect. Seems like most automatics since the late 50's, when they took out the rears pumps, haven't provided much holding back. Thats when it started that you could no longer push start a car with an automatic. It was always considered hard on the transmissions to be shifting them manually. Have there been major improvements that now allow the manual shifting and downshifting without causing undue strains on the automatics?
I'm sure the auto trans will be able to outshift me with a manual but it also sounds like the 5MT is a better performer.
Any ideas???

Warren

rsq798 · August 2004

Wow I would give the dealer low marks on the Purchase Experience Survey that SOA mails out after purchase. One of the sections is, "Please rate this dealership compared to other dealerships you have visited," with marks for "Overall customer service."

My salesman made it a point to let me know that, on a scale of 1 to 7, anything below a 7 counts against him/them. Of course, that does make you wonder why they have 7 ratings. Wouldn't 5 have been silly enough? 3? 2?

c_hunter · August 2004

I've never had anything but pleasant experiences with Honda and Nissan service departments. And it's not like there's another Subaru dealer nearby that I could switch to.

Some of teh worst service I ever had was at a local Honda dealer. I drove 25 miles to another dealer for all my service after that, and continued to drive Hondas.

Don't judge Subaru solely by their dealers. There is only so much Subaru can do! It sounds like you should find another dealership if you are unsatisfied with the current one.

Craig

aussie outback · August 2004

Thanks to all for thoughts and feedback. My OB 3.0R has just hit 1300 miles. Mileage is still about 14mpg in town, but has improved to 26mpg on the open road.

In addition to an earlier poster asking this - does anyone have any thoughts?

1)How much benefit is there to changing oil earlier than the 3000 mile recommended limit? Why?

It would seem odd for Subaru to recommend 3000 if it really should be changed at 1000 or 1500.

2)Because it is winter here in Australia, I drive with the headlights on during the day as well. I only just discovered that if you hit the "bright" button next to the trip computer, the lighting for the stereo/heating becomes legible instead of too dull (great discovery!). However, does anyone know if there is a way to set the brightness so that it automatically starts up in bright mode?

Finally FYI - although my OB is the latest version, it is officially an 04 OB rather than 05. Looks in the USA that they it took about 8 months to tool up on the assembly line, so when they launched, they launched as 05 models.

So they have just launced the 05 models here in Aus. They have added a 3.0R Legacy sedan, with 5EAT and a 6-spd MT. There is also a 3.0R-B which has got an even sportier suspension. All these models are within $1-2k of the Legacy GT turbo with similar equipment levels.

So you get plenty of choice, so long as you want to pay that amount for a car. Expect those models to hit the US soon (I don't think you have them yet).

- Aussie Outback

tsy · August 2004

On the Subaru Global website there is a movie featuring a JDM Legacy Wagon in search of a worthy driver in So California. It's funny, the wagon (without a driver) chases down a potential owner and even jumps over a wall to follow him. ;-). Then they see a mugger and the guy jumps into this car (right hand drive) and they chase down the thief. Dennis Hopper even does a little role as the CHP who arrests the thief.

Quite entertaining if you have a few moments. ;-)

tom

safetyfirst · August 2004

You guys are great! Thanks for all the advice. I will definitely call the dealership manager; great idea.

I could go another 10 miles to a different dealership, I suppose, but because I live in a gridlocked city, that might take an extra hour! I'll keep you posted.

lmacmil · August 2004

"How much benefit is there to changing oil earlier than the 3000 mile recommended limit? Why?
It would seem odd for Subaru to recommend 3000 if it really should be changed at 1000 or 1500."

Look at this this way: the car manufacturer wants you to have a trouble-free experience with its product so you'll buy another one in the future. The maintenance schedule is created (including a different schedule for severe service) so the owner knows how to maintain the car to make it last a long time. It would be counterproductive for the manufacturer to recommend a maintenance schedule that might allow the vehicle to deteriorate prematurely.

The need for a 3000 mile oil change interval is a myth propagated by oil companies and dealer service departments. If you driving is primarily highway, you could easily go 5-10,000 miles between changes. If you're driving in sub-freezing temps and the car never gets warmed up, you'd probably need to change the oil every couple of thousand miles.

You can't go wrong following the manufacturer's suggested maintenance intervals.

bluesubie · August 2004

When you stop, it will go into 1st gear with the selector in "3". If the selector is in "2", it stays in "2". Have a look in the owner's manual at the dealership.

-Dennis

saedave · August 2004

I hope the 3.0 is added to the U.S. Legacy offerings. Perhaps it would be a 2006 model here. The H-6 is far more pleasant in heavy traffic than the turbo 4 unless my test drives were not typical cars. If the price differential is $1-2k of the GT turbo, they should sell very well here. At those prices they would be $2-4k less than a Passat six cylinder with AWD. When my Passat W8 gets near the end of its warranty I may return to Subaru...if the six is available in the right model.

fkozil · August 2004

Thought the same as you until I tried the auto tranny...The 5 speed manual is a lot of fun and offers greater control but the automatic is a fair compromise.

I had it in the back of my mind that I wanted the manual but after trying out the auto (I have the 4spd version) I was pleased. The misses can not drive the 5spd manual so I figured it was a fair compromise even though the 5spd is more performance oriented.

With respect to fuel mileage, the difference between the two are really not noticeable and fuel economy can better be attributed to driving habits vs. gear ratios.

bat1161 · August 2004

Tom-

Thanks for the info. Nice brief movie. It reminds me of what BMW did a couple of years ago. They did a series of movies revolving around their cars by various directors. They were all around 3-5 minutes long.

Mark

kens · August 2004

pato01:

The reason why SOA doesn't offer the 5EAT in the 2.5i is probably cost and product positioning. The 5EAT is a more complex and expensive unit than the 4EAT. While the 2.5i is a great vehicle, Subaru also needs to keep certain "premium" features for their higher-end models.

Also, keep in mind that Subaru's automatics do have an "adaptive" nature to them. Over time, the units learn your driving style and the response changes quite a bit from when you test drive a green unit at the dealer.

Ken

kens · August 2004

tom: You're welcome on the break-in info. And yes, I did change my oil at 1000 miles. It was free and it gave me peace of mind.

aussie outback: I'm sure Subaru choses their oil change intervals for a balance of engine longevity and minimizing customer hassle. There certainly is no drawback to changing one's oil more often than recommended.

Keep in mind that the service intervals in the owner's manual are "recommended" based on normal usage. There's a footnote saying that under heavy or extreme usage, more frequent changes should be followed.

Warren: A manual transmission will always let you tap the full potential of an engine. It's simply the nature of it's design. However, the 5EAT does bridge the gap between traditional autos and manuals. With electronic control of both the throttle body as well as the transmission, the 5EAT can smooth out gearshifts to minimize shock.

As for gas milage, the 5EAT top gear is taller and therefore achieves the same 19/25mpg as the 5MT.

Ken

aussie outback · August 2004

Here are 2 roadtests comparisons of the above two Aussie variants. In my last post I said they were $1-2k more expensive than the GT - it appears that should be $1-2k cheaper than the GT.

Note in the first article: Legacy sales in Australia are up 58% on previous model, and Legacy GT selling 3x as quickly as expected!

http://carsguide.news.com.au/news/story_page/0,8269,10388006%255E- 27286,00.html

http://carsguide.news.com.au/news/story_page/0,8269,10410311%255E- 27286,00.html

Also - a note for Karen. Some older roadtests that you may not have:

3.0R Outback
http://carsguide.news.com.au/news/story_page/0,8269,9204535%255E2- 7286,00.html

3.0R Outback Towing Test
http://carsguide.news.com.au/news/story_page/0,8269,9549578%255E2- 7286,00.html

Outback H4 and Outback 3.0R VDC
http://carsguide.news.com.au/news/story_page/0,8269,8471565%255E2- 7286,00.html

rsholland · August 2004

Aussie OB, thanks for the postings!

We really appreciate it. BTW, you guys are lucky to have the 3.0 6-speed.

Bob

tsy · August 2004

Thanks for the reviews, I'm glad the car is selling well there. It's interesting that you blokes got the Macintosh stereo, but still no nav. We got the GT 5MT, but no 3.0R version. Does the Aussie version of the legacy come from Japan? Is it the JDM version? It seems our 2.5 GT is a US only model, I don't see that it's available anywhere else in the world, where they get the 2.0 Turbo.

I also noticed you have sheepskin seat covers as an option. Are they popular there? ;-)

tom

bookemdano · August 2004

Actually, the increase in sales are attributable to the same trick I used on my wife. I got her to test drive it! About one test-drive is all it takes. The GT grabs you!.

Regards,

Dan.

moutback · August 2004

Wow, the 3.0R-B looks really sweet at www.subaru.com.au. I guess the right-side drive markets get it first.

But what's with the rear bumper and exhaust tips with the US Outbacks? Why don't we get the cool chrome tips and the cut-out bumper that the Asian and Euro Outbacks get? Strange

Mark

aussie outback · August 2004

Tom,

We get the 2.0 turbo Legacy (5EAT only), but the same 2.5XT Forester that you guys get. In the UK they only get a 2.0XT Forester. I assumed the US got the 2.0 turbo GT, so thanks for correcting me on that, but I did notice you get a 2.5XT Outback when we don't. All of these cars are assembled in Japan, so apart from local variations (eg we can't use Isofix kiddie seats) then I guess ours are JDM.

Having driven the 2.5 turbo Forester and the 3.0 in my Outback, I think the pick of the bunch would be a 6MT sports suspension Legacy 3.0. But of course you don't know if SoA will make that one. Maybe someone should ask? Or can someone from SoA tell this forum?

I think Sat nav is not considered a market norm here. Most Australian cities are pretty easy to navigate around as we make 'em big flat grids. And because people don't really drive city-to-city (too far) then we don't really need it as much (maybe in rental cars it is a good option, but each one is different and they seem to take a while to work out how to operate them). Better to get the stereo!

Otherwise Ken - thanks for the oil change feedback. I don't drive very hard so I'll wait until 3000 miles.

And Tom - re sheepskins. Surprisingly popular given that the seat coverings are pretty good. Anyway, after you are finished with your sheep, what else are you supposed to do with the skins?!!!

- Aussie Outback

pato01 · August 2004

What experience do you have with gas mileage (post-break-in) for the 2005 2.5i (non-turbo) Outback with 4EAT (auto) trans? What about for the 2003-05 non-turbo 2.5L Forester with 4EAT (auto) trans?

tsy · August 2004

AO- (Can I call you that?)

I wonder if your made in Japan cars are better assembled than ours? It probably makes them more expensive though. I for one would be glad to pay the difference.

If the 3.0 6MT had a little more torque, I'd say it's the one to get. It's just shy of the surging torque we get with the 2.5 Turbo (it's what puts the grin on your face!) I wonder if the 2.0 is the same?

I was thinking the sheepskins looked really comfortable- they sit only on the middle of the seat. I guess it's a regional option, since I didn't see it available here. But my question is, what do you do with the sheep before you turn them into sheepskins? ;-) They look like they'd be nice to have here in the colder climates during the winter. But how do you get gum out of them? ;-)

tom

rsholland · August 2004

I assumed the US got the 2.0 turbo GT, so
thanks for correcting me on that, but I did notice you get a 2.5XT Outback when we don't.

Aussie OB, a further point of clarification: Our 2.5 Legacy GT and 2.5 Outback XT turbos put out 250 horsepower, whereas the 2.5 Forester turbo puts out 210 horsepower.

The 250 HP is the same as that found on the new H-6. However the torque is also 250, whereas the torque on the new H-6 is only 219. So our 2.5 Legacy/Outback turbos feel more powerful than the new H-6.

Bob

krzyss · August 2004

ft-lb for torque or Nm ?

Krzys

PS HP are similar but ft-lb and Newton*meter are not. Some use W (Watts) for engine power too.

aviziv · August 2004

Hi,

I see that the XT Limited comes with "perforated leather". This means that it has many small holes in it - right? Any opinions as to how easy it will be to clean? My current car has solid leather that is very easy to clean - a requirement to traveling with kids... Any experience our there?

Thanks,
Avi
p.s I guess the closer I get to making the purchase, the pickier I get. Maybe I should just get it over with?

kens · August 2004

tom:

My opinion is that the assembled in Japan vehicles probably have the small minor details done better like carpet tucks, panel gaps and the like. Keep in mind that the major parts (engine, drivetrain) in our US-assembled cars are directly from Japan.

I would also be one to pay a premium for an import, but so far I've been fairly impressed with the build quality of my Legacy GT wagon. There were a few items that I thought could use a little more attention, but overall it's a rattle/squeak free tight ride.

Avi:

We have a 16 month old daughter so I'll let you know how the perforated leather cleans up! I would imagine a soft brush or a vaccum would get "stuff" out of the perforations.

Ken

Subaru Legacy/Outback 2005+

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