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Comments
A couple of questions
1) who make the Enclave?
2) Any ides if the 08 Highlander will be larger, I test drove a Sequioa but there were so many ashtrays and wasted interior space, what was Toyota thinking? Then I drove a PILOT this works for me and I am thinking of buying one, but now I will wait to see the 08 highlander.
Well..THIS two time Highlander owner (2003 and 2005) is very glad to see that the new Highlander doesn't look like a Pacifica (shudder) or the FT-SX(or whatever it is called) show car. I LIKE the new design... from the pictures.
http://pressroom.toyota.com/Releases/View?id=TYT2007020627575
1) The Motortrend article mentions 7 air bags, but I didn't see anything on the Toyota press release regarding whether the 3rd row of seats are covered by air bages (They are not in the '07 model). This is important to me.
2) Any idea on what the prices will be?
Tks!
My initial impression is to stay with the thought of purchasing an 07. I have no trouble with the Boxy look as many call it. And I do like the fact that it has a door edge guard. It seems people just love banging into my doors in the parking lots.
At least the tale gate lifts up. Otherwise, I agree: it's a RAV 4 on steroids. Gained 500 pounds!!! I can't imagine the gas ratings being any differnt than the current generation. And NO 6 speed. FT-SX would be welcomed compared to this blob.
Need more pictures.
Oh well. Guess I'll have to go see it in person.
1- Pretty body style (Yes "a la FT-SX") with better fuel economy using new hybrid technology c/w plug-in capability
2- classic SUV body style with better fuel economy using new hybrid technology c/w plug-in capability
3- Pretty body style with better fuel economy using new hybrid technology
4- classic SUV body style better fuel economy using new hybrid technology
5- Pretty body style with same fuel economy as current hybrid version
6- classic SUV body style same fuel economy as current hybrid version
From what I can see and read, this new model barely reach the number 6 in my list.
With 500 pounds more weight to carry around, I'm not even sure that the new very conservative styling Highlander will even get the same fuel cunsomption as the model it replaces.
So that's a sad day for me. I've been waiting for almost a year to see where would Toyota push the limits of the fuel efficient 7 passengers mid-size SUV and I ended up looking at a very blend model with no hybrid technology enhancements. I'll give myself a couple of weeks to decide what will replace my thirsty 03 MDX.
The recently released updated Hyundai Santa Fe looks a lot like the new Highlander. Toyota kept the new design under wraps until the press release today, but it sure seems like Hyundai knew what was coming.
Compare:
http://www.caradisiac.com/media/images/le_mag/mag269/hyundai-santa-fe-01cb.jpg
http://www.toyota.com/images/vehicles/future/highlander/photo_1.jpg
Also, I was disappointed that the new hybrid drivetrain is basically a carryover using the old 3.3l V6.
I had hoped they would have paired the new, improved 3.5l V6 with the synergy drivetrain. Or perhaps even the Camrly I4 Hybrid for better fuel economy.
1) Only 7 inches longer than a RAV4 - so why bother?
2) Looks like a RAV4 too? Boring styling.
3) Old 3.3L for Hybrid drivetrain.
4) Limited 'utility' in this vehicle - too narrow for 4x8's and overall interior volume nowhere near best in class.
In short, I'm down to either an '07 Sienna or an '07 GMC Acadia for my next 'family ride' replacing our '97 Grand Caravan. I don't need to wait to see it live to know that I'm not interested.
I drive and enjoy a Toyota Camry Hybrid as my daily driver, but readily admit that Toyota NEVER leads in styling but lags behind. IMHO they are WAY behind the GM Lambdas in this segment now. I may become a GM owner for the first time.
Because Toyota vehicles have never been beautiful and sexy cars IMHO, the ONLY thing that matters and makes them stand out is their IMPECCABLE Quality!
If the 08 Highlander has that, then it is a good TOYOTA vehicle no-matter what it looks like!
Waiting to see it in person.....
Killerpiece :shades:
Now I live in the Chicago area so if I have time I am hoping to go to the Chicago Auto Show and see the 2008 highlander in person.
fuel economy is supposed to be same as the outgoing model, which is what? 19/25mpg?
on the bright side, if sales are slow, i wonder if i could pick up the new highlander for the same price as the new santa fe...
People who buy Toyota's (on average) are buying them because they are expecting a quality vehicle the will run forever without problems.
There are many company's that design for design's sake, and just as many people who buy them for their designs.
Toyota has never been one of those company's , so I can't expect them to be in the future!
Now, don't get me wrong.... I LOVE great looking cars, but if I am looking at a Toyota, It's because I expect IMPECCABLE QUALITY not GREAT DESIGN!
Just MHO....
Killerpiece :shades:
But when I looked in detail, I came to think it is not that bad. For me, interior is more important. I belive the boring outside trimline was compromised to secure more interior space. The side line follows that of new camry design.
The good point is
- Kept the same milage with higher HP even 500 pounds more weight
- Spacious and easy access to 3rd seat
- 19 inch wheel
- sliding 2nd seat
- 3rd seat side air bags
I think it is OK for a family car, but I will wait unitl New pilot show up.
But when I looked in detail, I came to think it is not that bad. For me, interior is more important. I belive the boring outside trimline was compromised to secure more interior space. The side line follows that of new camry design.
The good point is
- Kept the same milage with higher HP even 500 pounds more weight
- Spacious and easy access to 3rd seat
- 19 inch wheel
- sliding 2nd seat
- 3rd seat side air bags
I think it is OK for a family car, but I will wait unitl New pilot show up.
=================================
Huh?
That doesn't make very much sense at all.
The sheet-metal has next to nothing to do with the interior space.
And even with that, the Highlander is already one of the smallest in its class.
The CX-9, Acadia, Outlook and Taurus X (Freestyle) are all bigger and much better looking.
They get the same or better fuel economy as well.
If the MDX is any judge, the Pilot will be as well.
If you buy a Toyota you get average design with excellant Quality. If you don't want that then you should not buy a Toyota.
If you buy a Toyota you get average design with excellant Quality. If you don't want that then you should not buy a Toyota.
============================================
You're right.
If you want both great design and great quality there are many other manufacturers out there that you can choose from instead, including Honda, Subaru, Porsche, Mazda, Mercury and Volvo as well as countless individual models from other manufacturers such as GM and Ford etc.
Not to mention Porsche, Cadillac, Buick, Acura etc.
As a matter of fact, even Toyota can perform when they need to. The FJ Cruiser seems to be doing well--very well. The last generation Celica was also good-looking, and the Camry is not so bad--neither are the Scions.
Even the Koreans are getting in on the game. They are very much into the styling race.
The three manufacturers to keep an eye on on this front in the years ahead are: GM, Honda and Mazda. Volvo is a dark horse here as well.
Nobody is going to compromise in the future, and even Toyota knows that.
BMW took off like a rocket with their styling, so Toyota worked on Lexus' styling to maintain an edge. Even the new Camry is evidence of that. We will see what the Accord brings, but Honda will not sit still.
"TOYOTA=QUALITY
If you buy a Toyota you get average design with excellant Quality. If you don't want that then you should not buy a Toyota."
is a copout, even it has some elements of truth.
Other manufacturers are providing STYLE, SUBSTANCE and QUALITY. Toyota does not by any means have a monopoly on quality...and I own a 2007 Toyota Camry Hybrid.
Toyota's had their share of issues such as numerous recalls, engine sludge problems, and fairly severe tranmission programming and hesitation issues. Contrary to popular opinion, Toyota is not immune to problems, and their CEO has publically mentioned slowing down their new vehicle release schedule to improve quality.
Other companies, including the Koreans and Americans as well as Japanese, are catching up in quality. Most now build much better looking vehicles.
And actually, I think the exterior looks like blend of the RAV and 4Runner... one that I like in pictures. If people are willing to write-off the new HL based only on styling, that seems short-sighted to me, as there are a ton of neat features available on this vehicle, for example the rear-backup camera that will be standard on Sport and Limited editions. That, and the expected increased crashworthiness, stronger acceleration, and what looks to be an interior that is HEADS AND TAILS better than the outgoing model, in styling and functionality... and is roomier.
In fact, I hope it DRIVES like the nimble RAV, which was just named by C/D as a 5 Best, winning the Compact SUV class....
~alpha
While "RAV4 on steroids" is a very apt description of the new model, the old one was very squarish, frumpy, traditional Japanese. I am glad they livened it up a bit, although it would have been nice if they had been a little more adventurous. Having said that, has anyone besides me noticed that except for the base trim, most '08 Highlanders will be running around on 19" rims? Not only do I shudder to think what the cost of replacement tires will be, but I wonder if that will adversely affect the ride. HL is nobody's sports car after all - I don't think that's really what buyers in this segment are looking for.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
The three manufacturers to keep an eye on on this front in the years ahead are: GM, Honda and Mazda. Volvo is a dark horse here as well.
Honda styling is every bit as boring as Toyota. The next Pilot will be very conservative again. Don't keep on eye on Honda for too long.....it might get a little red
GM styling? All this hype about the new styling of their SUV's, who are they kidding? I think they tried to make them uglier. The only improvement are the interiors (which was so easy to improve upon).
I believe the disappointment in the new Highlander comes from what most peoples' expectations were. I don't know why anyone expected anything different than what Toyota delivered. Toyota's success has come directly from marketing to the mainstream. Toyota could care less if someone doesn't buy the Highlander due to styling (they probably wouldn't buy it regardless of styling anyways). They have plenty of customers who will line up to buy it.
...blend of the RAV and 4Runner
Anyone can see the RAV. But the 4Runner? Besides having 4 wheels, what the heck are you seeing that I don't?
If this is so then when all other models have to revise their FE reults downward beginning in Sept that the new Highlander will benefit by comparison.
But this remains to be seen.
Honda realized that they needed to do much more in terms of style.
So the first volley--if you will--was fired with the new Civic; especially the European one.
Then, if you look at the Accord Concept they showed at Detroit, you will see they're continuing this. Honda is not to be underestimated:
New Civic (American)--
New Civic (Europe)--
Honda Accord Coupe Concept--
GM doesn't only make SUVs; and what they are putting out these days is brilliant. Much better than what they have been doing in a fairly long time:
The point here is that nobody is standing still anymore. It is an exciting time for car and car styling.
There are going to be ever more choices in an expanding market, and all the better for us to choose from.
No company can afford to "only" offer quality (and even that is not true of Toyota--they have a lot to offer elsewhere too).
Toyota's lineup is fairly nice-looking right now. I like this:
And so do a lot of people.
Many people think the new Tundra is ugly, but I like it.
Even so, the Highlander is disappointing so far in what I have seen. It doesn't tug at the heartstrings like it could. It is not very well styled at all, seeing as how we know what Toyota is capable of.
Why should we have to compromise? Toyota is the richest car company in the world.
Lastly, I do not know why people are fretting over the weight. I think it'll do just fine in the fuel economy department.
Besides, it'll have a hybrid version too!
I was similarly disappointed by photos of the 1st gen Highlander, the 4th gen 4Runner (2003), and even the current RAV4. I was unsure about those designs at first, but eventually I grew to like them, especially in person.
Minor things I was expecting like projector-beam headlights and LED tails (looks like the Hybrid has them) don't appear to have made it to the features list, but there are a lot of other things I'm looking forward to trying in the showroom and on the testdrive.
Edited to add: I watched the introduction video on Toyota's web page and I have to admit -- the B-footage of the Highlander in motion looks pretty nice. I can't wait to see it out on the road (in person).
refusal to give FE any priority. I think unless the
Feds mandate some type of strict FE standards this trading off extra weight/size and features at the expense of what could have been increased FE will continue.
Having said that I noticed two switches in the 2008 HH
pictures in the Toyota website.
One in the EV mode that lets you go one mile at below
25mph on Electric only provided battery is topped off.
The other is the "Economy mode". Any idea what this is?
If this is used during city driving and maybe EV mode
for the first mile, any chances that FE will be greater
than 31 in the city for city based daily commute of
about 25 miles round trip? (max speed < 45 mph)
Seems a lot of people don't like the Rav4 styling. Rav4 sales have doubled.
It's as if Toyota can't win. I'm glad they didn't make a Pacifica.
Don't see why it needs 500 lbs. or 19" wheels, doh? :confuse:
DrFill
~alpha
Unlike previous years where it seemed the only game out there was the Highlander or Pilot, 2007 brings us many, many other new CUV options like the Acadia/Outlook, CX-9, Veracruz, Edge, etc, all priced similarly to the HL.
I personally think the front end of this new HL is a bit chunky, as compared to the CX-9 or Veracruz, so I guess we'll just have to see if the competition can steal sales away!
As for the '08 Pilot, we don't have a lot of info yet, but this is also a chunky-frumpy-styled vehicle, so neither the Honda nor the Toyota is setting the world on fire. And it also has fairly lousy fuel economy.
Having said all that, weight gain is completely out of control in these crossovers, and minivans too. The quickest route to fuel economy increases for Toyota would be to keep weight DOWN in revised models, but instead they have emphasized power, speed, and sporty dynamics (with corresponding weight increases) as design priorities. :-(
Seeing the specs of the '08 HL, I would be in a Sienna instead - much easier access with the sliding doors, more cargo and passenger space, and better fuel economy. Where's the downside?
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)