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Comments
If we are really into comparing the Avalon to high end vehicles, however, the LS is much closer in concept being a softer and less sporting ride than the BMW with some quality attributes that the Germans can only dream about these days. Is the Avalon an LS? No. Is it something that might be considered a reasonable alternative at about half the price. Yep.
Would be curious to know if you were driving the 745, why not the LS instead of the Av?
the only way i would buy a avalon or any other new car with dbw or a "smart" tranny would be an overnight test drive with lots of stop and go driving...this is the only way to determine if the technology and emmission mandates will interfere with your driving habits.
one possible solution that is quietly going away: manual transmissions; the drivetrain computers don't seem to interfere as much with a manual as they do with the auto's...just some food for thought.
This topic is about Avalons. Let's hope it continues that way.
I too can't help but wonder if the personal attacks, "too and fro" that went on in the other thread wasn't an intentional effort to close the "book" on a significant level of adverse publicity. Maybe even by a single Toyota/Lexus employee or "shill"(advertising executive??) operating under more than one login name.
So, please don't respond to this naysayer "baiting" and these conversations between those that wish can continue unabated.
I think your comments are fair. I also have had some difficulty adjusting to the FWD from the previous RWD/AWD.
The only comment I would add is that I really don’t believe there is such a thing as a sport sedan .. with the possible exception of the BWM M5. All the rest are just marketing hype IMO.
One thing I have wondered about is this: With two of us on board the ride is really very smooth, but with a couple of HD adults in the back seat, it will sometimes almost bottom out going over a moderate bump. Has anyone noticed this?
Does anyone have experience with the seats?
A 5 minute test drive may not be enough to determine the seat comfort.
Mark, which trim do you have? I will be disappointed if it's the Touring as I was hoping that trim level drove a little tighter.
I'm a 5'11 160 lb male and use the car as my daily commuter. I didn't get to test drive a limited before I purchased but drove an XLS which seats are defintely cushioned better. You can literally feel the bumps in the seatback as well as the seating surface. I've had the seat covering replaced but that only helped the raised seams in the seat and not the actual comfort of the seat. I'd get the XLS, the vented seats aren't worth the discomfort.
Has anyone heard a "ding" noise while driving? I am thinking it might be some safety mechanism being activated, since I heard this once while I was accelerating more aggressively than usual.
Laura
Laura
Any four door sedan really has too much girth to be considered a sport anything in my book. I’ve had a VW Phaeton, Audi A6 and seriously test driven M3 and M5. The BMW’s were probably the closest, but once you stepped back into a sports car, you realize it’s all just marketing hype.
Completely removing any and all filtration will only add, at the most, 10% to the engine capability and even that only at WOT and near max engine RPM. So now put the K&N back in and you lose maybe 50% of that 10% you had with no filtration.
So the bottom line is that using the K&N will add about 13HP to your base 268HP just prior to the transaxle upshifting. If you DIY clean the MAF/IAT every oil change then maybe it makes sense.
If you're a boy-racer personality type and like to beat out the other guy at the traffic light then go for it.
Yes, we will probably accept their ad money and run K&N's on our 997/GT3's at the upcoming 24 hours of Daytona but those engines are torn down and rebuilt after each race.
I don't want to spend that kind of money on a car any more, whether an LS or a 745. We're saving for two kids going to college, and I'm more interested in retiring early than driving an expensive car. In short, my priorities have changed.
When I was younger, I always wanted a high-end German car and I got my wish. It's out of my system. Now I'm more interested in cheap, comfortable, reliable transportation. The Avalon fit the bill pretty well for me.
You might be right. I never did any scientific timing on the 745i, but I always thought it was a little slower than BMW claimed. Especially at 5k feet where I do my daily driving.
The Avalon is 800lbs lighter, and that could make up the difference for a less powerful engine and a 5-speed. With better rubber, the Avalon might well be as fast, or faster than an '02 745i -- so long as you're going straight, and you don't want to go further than, say, a quarter mile .
But seriously, I'm not going to quibble over a tenth of a second. It just doesn't matter to me.
Seems this business of "you're not supposed to say that" is being taken to extremes!
Also, if memory serves Pat, didn't you rule that we should email you if we object to something another person says, and NOT say so publicly??
EMAIL me if you have comments to make about what I am saying. Further posts that include any of these things will be removed without notice.
Here's a clip from a Transport Canada website (one of the first ones listed) that talks about stopping distances:
"Is the stopping distance shorter with ABS?
No! From early commercials, it may have looked like you could stop on a dime. That instantaneous stop is not realistic. When braking on dry or wet roads your stopping distance will be about the same as with conventional brakes.
You should allow for a longer stopping distance with ABS than for conventional brakes when driving on gravel, slush, ice, and snow. This is because the rotating tire will stay on top of this low traction road surface covering, and effectively "float" on this boundary layer.
A non ABS braked vehicle can lock its tires and create a snow plow effect in front of the tires which helps slow the vehicle. These locked tires can often find more traction below this boundary layer."
-if notasnowcar gets broadsided by that truck, and the reason is arguably because his car shut down due to 'safety' system intervention.
- or we can not avoid an accident because a stability control system shut things down.
- or as happened several years back (and I assume continues to happen), children get injured because of airbags.
etc. etc.
Doesn't the manufacturer of the vehicles with these systems have some liability even if these systems were functioning as they should? Probably a big ole can of worms, but maybe one that Toyota (and the rest of the industry) should open?
Here's a clip from one of the many articles on this subject:
" TRACTION CONTROL
Definition: An enhancement of an existing ABS system that prevents wheel spin while accelerating on wet or slick surfaces. It uses the same wheel speed sensors to monitor wheel speed during acceleration, but requires some additional control solenoids and a pump to apply braking pressure to control wheel spin. The traction control system brakes the drive wheel that's starting to spin to shift torque to the opposite drive wheel that still has traction. Most traction control systems only operate at speeds up to about 30 mph. Additional control strategies that some traction control systems use to limit wheel spin include reducing the throttle opening, upshifting the transmission, retarding spark timing and deactivating fuel injectors."
A word of caution about ABS, VSC, and Traction Control.
These systems are generally great, but don't expect miracles in certain conditions--especially on snow or ice.
Many drivers place ultimate faith that they will be saved from every conceivable condition with these systems.
Not quite so!!
ANTI LOCK braking systems help vehicles to be more controllable in a skid--ie, maintain a straight line instead of slewing or spinning, or being able to maintain some steering control whilst in a skid. A VERY definite safety advantage!
Back in 1992 when I bought my first Lexus, a new 1992 LS400, I quickly learned to turn Trac off each and every time I started the car. By applying the rear brakes to alleviate wheelspin whilc simultaneously fully dethrottling the engine it left me dead in the water if far too many hazardous circumstances.
By 2000 Trac firmware had evolved wherein engine dethrottling was delayed a few hundred milliseconds to give the driver time to react and feather the throttle in order to "ease" forward.
Because of the greater potential danger from loss of traction on a FWD vehicle the firmware will still instantly dethrottle the engine.
Presumiably the dethrottling in both cases is to prevent brake rotor over-heating and sunsequent warpage.
Somewhere in our future I suspect, hope, that ABS will be coupled to the VSC's yaw sensor and stearing wheel position sensor such that ABS does not activate unless the vehicle fails to follow directional commands during severe braking.
The new AWD GS and IS models already use that method to quickly remove engine drive torque, leading or lagging, from the front wheels if directional control is threatened.
ABS can control brakes individually to compensate for whichever wheels have the most braking force available. You would need 4 brake pedals to do this with your foot.
I agree that Trac-cntl is great in regular driving, but sometimes you have to smoke the tires to thru the obsticles.
My complaint is not having the option to turn it off.