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Comments
So, negotiations should start at the above price,
correct?
psy
thanks for your thoughts, pmcb48. i view a minivan as a necessity if i have three or more children, or an absolute need to haul six or more people around. absent those needs, i feel a sedan or station wagon is the smartest way to go from a safety/ accident avoidance standpoint. my second child will be born within the next 24-72 hours, and i plan on having no more, so until both kids are of "soccer and little league age", we will not have a need for a 6+ seat vehicle. subaru will be coming close with the tribeca (it will have an optional 3rd row, but in the mid-30's it's a pricey consideration, and being a heavy vehicle it should handle and brake worse than the legacy wagons out there.
regarding a bmw 535, it's high on my wish list b/c of its handling capabilities, but it way to expensive to purchase, and the insurance and long term maintenance takes it further out of my range. $31k is the limit for my next car purchase, and until i see something better, the avalon touring is my number one choice - but i still wont buy the avalon until the touring gets stability and traction (they're available on the camry-se no less, so i'm confident the avalon touring will get it for the '06 model year in the fall (i hope)).
when it comes to driving, i tend to drive the same in all vehicles - fairly fast, fluidly and some would say aggressively - not wise, but is why i need a better handling car. and yes, with the impending arival of my 2nd child, i know i have slow down a bit and drive in a less aggressive fashion. in most situations the touring and limited handling differences might be moot, but that unforeseen deer causing you to swerve, or the guy running the stop sign or red light, or the child or dog that runs into the street unexpectedly... you get the picture. that why i want the touring. that's when the handling will count most - if to a somewhat small degree.
as for hummers and the largest suv's they'll evolve into slightly smaller more fuel efficient and better handling creatures or go exinct as those first time buyer tire of the fortune dropped at each fill-up, and the accumulated embarrassment/disappointment with honda civics and toyota corollas being able to run circles around them. take care.
tweaker,
I believe the owners manual says that is to prevent excessive wind noise at higher speeds on the highway. For around town, open air motoring, you will in fact need to press the sunroof open switch twice.
Until you can talk to your installing mechanic, try the mode button on the steering wheel controls to cycle through AM-FM1-FM2-CD and hopefully SAT1-SAT2-SAT3 which will allow 18 presets, 3 each on your 6 preset buttons. Once you are tuned to one of the SAT's, you can use the tuning knob on your dash controls to select an XM station.
Five salespeople at the Toyota dealer couldn't figure out how to use the one in the Avalon. The one in the Acura needed no learn time in order to be used.
I find nav systems very handy locally (unexpected) and use mine frequently.
I could buy a new Garmin unit each and every year of my lease before I reach the price of the installed units.
People that have never owned an in-car GPS before should now that map updates are at the mercy of the car manufacturer and they are SLOW. My coworkers Acura and my Garmin both use Navteq maps. My map data is 2.5 YEARS more current than his.
The big advantage of the portable unit is obviously that you can move it from car to car, but more importantly, that you get to know how it operates and can maintain that as you change cars over the years.
There is a huge secondary market for portable GPS devices. Each time Garmin releases a new one, my old one goes on Ebay. Last time, I recovered 65% of my purchase price after 2 years of ownership. Not bad!
Looking forward to driving it.
I would think that the procedure is similar.
Hope this helps those of you who are considering a self-install of the Avalon kit.
I have mixed emotions about mine. It isn't real intutive to use but as I use it more and learn it more it does seem to get better.
For example, on 03/01 I went from home to a Dr's. office 69 miles away. Our normal route is to get onto I-81 about .5 mile from the house. Take 81 S to exit 315 which is Va rte 7 East. Rte 7 to rte 267 which is a toll road, with less traffic and no stops(signals), 267 to exit 13 and then the Dr is about .5 miles.
The Nav system was set for the short route, I guess. It had me taking back country 2 lane roads for about 20 miles to get me onto rte 7 East. Then rte 7 past 267 continuing on rte 7 in Leesburg which has a lot of traffic and a lot of lights. Then it wanted to wind me thru more urban traffic to the office.
I ignored the system and got on 81 S anyway, it then wanted to send me down to I-66, I skipped that and took 7.
Long story short, it was a horrible mess!
The next day we had to make the same trip, I selected quick route, told it toll roads were OK and it worked just fine. I had to learn it but it doesn't make things easy.
I bought the Nav system because my wife doesn't navigate well at all. I've had to Mapquest directions for her to all our usual places. If she had to drive somewhere new w/o me available she'd be in a real mess. I've programmed in all of our usual locations but now need to refine them and nake sure I have the best route laid out.
Right now, I'm dissapointed in the system. I'll know more in 6 months though.
MikeS.
Yesterday I pulled into the post office next to a couple in a 04 Camry with Nav. I asked them how they liked it. Both immediately responded they wished they hadn't gotten it. They used the term "not user friendly" numerous times. Their son (who owns an Acura with Nav) came over to help them. His response after fiddling with the system was the same, "NOT user friendly."
He did program "Home" for them. At least that was a start.
In fairness, perhaps the 05 Avalon nav system is much different, and perhaps the couple I talked to are technologically challenged. Then again, so is my wife. I can just picture her driving a hundred miles with only the "DISCLAIMER" page showing on the nav display.
I've made arrangements with one of the local Toyota dealers (Fleet sales of course) to sit down with the Nav manual as well as hands-on application in a new Avalon and spend whatever time I need to hopefully finalize our decision (Nav or Not).
I did just that recently in an 05 Odyssey. At that time I had a Garmin Street Pilot 2620 for comparison. The Odyssey nav is a well integrated system. I did find my arm getting tired though after about an hour reaching out for the touch screen. The resolution should have been better, but the 8" screen is nice and in a good location. A remote control like the Garmin has, would be really nice.
Other than the screen size, voice command (which I'm not sure I'd use that much) and overall integration of the Odyssey nav I prefer the Garmin. I second Jeff's additional comments.
The 2620 is very intuitive and takes very little time to master. I actually used it for several days before reading the manual. And, it is easy to take in the house and play/program on the kitchen table. My wife might like the Zagat review in the Odyssey nav though.
They both give voice instructions, although the 2620 speaker is at the 12V plug-in.
So, is Nav (adaptive cruise control is also included in the package) worth the $2500 invoice price? We'll see. I will be taking a cardboard template (2620 dimensions) along to see where the optimum mounting position might be IF I deem the Avalon nav undesireable for us.
Thanks Jeff for your fine post.
Regarding headroom: At 6'1", I have no issues what so ever in the Limited. Before I bought my Lexus GS300 two years ago, I the runner-up was the CTS, but I could not find any position where I felt comfortable with head room on any of the CTS's I tried. I still find it a bit odd at the number of people that realize the headroom issue only after they purchase a car with sunroofs. The good thing is that it is not an issue for most people on most makes and models.
pack8398 - Regarding XM: My wife has it in her Accord and although we used it for several months, we discontinued service because we found ourselves not using it (to each their own). On the Limited, I have the SAT button on my radio, but I will not be purchasing the kit (antenna, hardware). I am a bit dumbfounded why your mechanic would install the XM Kit without confirming your radio had the XM feature installed. Perhaps there is some way you can use XM without hitting the SAT button or perhaps your dealership just blew it and sold you something before thinking. If so, they should replace your radio, at no charge, with one that has the factory SAT button. Good luck and let us know how you make out.
Regarding Egress: No issue at all. I do miss the feature on my Lexus where the steering wheel would raise on egress and ingress. Neat feature!
Regarding gas octane: Yes, the Limited will work OK with 87 octane, but as the manual states, the recommended octane is 91 or above, so that is what I will use. Yes, we all know the 91 octane will cost more, but with a car that list for $38K+, I am not going to sweat the extra few hundred dollars a year to keep my car running at manufactures recommendations. Again, to each their own.
Well, I'm on my way for a ride to the beach in Boston, where I'll sit in my car for a while and spend more time reading the owners manual.
Regards: Dan
2005 Limited
- Blizzard Pear/Perforated Light Gray Leather
- Nav
- Remote Start
- VSC
- Spoiler
No self-install for me; but, I did check with my local "Best Buys". They'll do it for $45 plus parts. It'll work through the existing audio controls on the Limited. It'll be a professional installation with all components hidden. And yes, the antenna does not have to be mounted on the trunk lid. Can anyone confirm/deny this "promise" by "Best Buys" or any other after-market installer?
Thanks
Any thoughts?
Wher did you buy it and what color did you get Good luck with your new car!
http://www.canadiandriver.com/testdrives/05avalon.htm
I think Im going to look into a small windows ce handheld or very small tablet computer and gps options. I know this can be done alot cheaper than a factory nav and be much more useful and hidden under the arm rest. Hide the gps unit in a out of sight area and cable it up to the computer of choice.
I know alot of people are doing this to the gm system... northstar. They unhook the gps unit from the near worthless northstar unit, then they change the pinout and plug to fit there laptop or machine of choice.
This will give one all sorts of options, with the right cell company there could be your moble internet connect, dvd play back and all sortd of goodies. In the Tulsa area I could even do a wireless connect with cherokee wireless.
Being a computer geek of sorts,, this could be big fun!!!
psy
I could be wrong but go again to that site, click on winter tires and then see if they try to sell you steel wheels. I do remember them doing this and it is in their own interest as well.
Alternatively, call your local Toyota dealership, albeit very expensive, and ask them how much a Toyota (not really made by Toyota but OEM) steel wheel would cost for your Avalon.
In addition, do a search on ebay. I am sure you will turn up steel wheels in 16" diameter, not sure about 17".
Let me know.
abfisch
My past experience with Dealers is that advertising is very negotiable--depending on salesperson, salesmanager, supply, demand, etc. I also have found that if you offer a reasonable amount above dealers invoice, e.g. $1000, the advertising charge will disappear. In otherwords, so long as the final number allows the dealer to make a reasonable profit, he/she won't worry about ancillary charges, e.g advertising.
I'd be interested in other views.
and 1/3 tank used I average 26 mpg so far
I think the one we test drove was the darker (although not dark), more grey Graphite colour (the exterior was black), and that the "Ivory" was lighter and a bit closer to a "tannish" colour.
Maybe dshimkat if you would post some pics of your Ivory interior, it would help me.
Thanks again,
Mikeroch
That is one of the few complaints I have had about my '02 XL Avalon. There is a buzz in the dashboard area on cold days, until the interior gets really warmed up. It mostly occurs during start and low-speed acceleration, and is not very loud. Mostly it's just a curiosity, particularly given that Toyota is so good at careful design and construction. I hope my new Limited doesn't do that, but we'll see (at least three more weeks to go...I am getting impatient).
Generally, the fit and finish of the car were good but there were a few significant interior disappointments. One of the "little doors" which conceal the audio and navigation controls, specifically the lower one containing the navigation controls, did not work in that it would not open without pushing/tapping it numerous times and even then would not completely open without manually being pulled forward. I can see where these things are going to be problematical. Ergonomically, I do not like them as they delay access to vital controls, especially if they do not work properly.
On the subject of the navigation system, the screen is too small, does not have a touch screen function, is non-intuitive and generally is inferior to some others on the market, particularly that on the Acura TL.
As for the JBL Synthesis audio system, while not a bad system it is also not an exceptional one. The speaker clarity could be better and the "surround sound" digital signal processing feature in my opinion does not compare to a true 5.1 surround system. I was generally disappointed in the quality of the audio and expected better.
Otherwise, the interior is a pleasant place to be.
As the model choices for the Avalon in Canada do not include the Limited, a number of the interesting and useful features of that car are simply not available, such as the laser cruise control, acoustic windshield, ventilated front seats with driver's seat cushion extension, power rear sunshade, and the Smart Key system. HID headlamps are not available on the XLS, although they are on the Touring model, but then you lose both the vehicle stability control and the traction control. What Toyota could have been thinking when they omitted these essential safety features from the Touring model I do not know.
Price wise, both the Touring and XLS models are overpriced when compared to their US counterparts when taking into consideration the exchange rates in the two currencies. The comparably equipped XLS is US$34,430 which is at current exchange rates, the equivalent of CDN$42,460. Yet, the Canadian XLS retails for CDN$46,825, which is more than four thousand Canadian dollars more! To my thinking, this is an excessive differential.
Just threw this in to let you know, there is help available.
In the above photo (front view of 2005 Avalon), what is the black rectangular shape next to the fog lamp on the passenger side? Note it is only on this side of the car.
WOW stopped by our Toyota dealer in SD. I bought the first Avalon in SD 3 weeks ago. They got 2 in last week - already sold and gone. They have pre-sold over 80% of their next allocation, and they say they are primarily selling LTDs. They have a black touring on the floor. They sold a grey one last week. I loved the gunmetal exterior with the grey interior lighter and dark wood. I do not like the black on black on this touring. Remember I choose black on tan in my LTD. I think Tourings and they confirmed it, are selling slower due to lack of heated seats and than lack of VSC.
Overall, I am happy with my deal.
Still love this car everyday.
Why no coin holder?
Admittedly, I'm just guessing.
First I was shopping for a limited, and the dealership had the color I wanted Phantom Grey. It looks great in that color. However, a few things.
1. I test drove the car and pick up was smooth and fluid. On a real curvey road (Lots of S turns, I found for me I had to watch out because the car was so floaty/responsive, based on what I was used to, that it was easy for me to over steer.
2. The NAV system was less than desirable. You had to keep hitting control buttons on the console to direct input and selection on the screen. The NAV had trouble in finding Columbia SC, and reported it with a region name in paren's, and it took the salesman an I about 10 minutes to realize you had to select the little tab arrow to scroll the line over to see the state.
3. The price for the car was 37,500.00 no deals no reduction. With state tax it would have come in delivered at 39,000.00. I asked the dealer if he would take a deposit and hold it over night until I could make it back with my wife.
He said I would have to buy the car, and then if my wife did not want it they would refund my money because I had a 3 day return right.
I left and went down the road to the acura dealership and test drove the TL. It certainly had a different feel, and though responsive did not have that floatyness of the Avalon.
Also the difference in the NAV is night and day, touch screen, easy controls, found Columbia SC right away. Mapped a different route, 1 hour shorter than the Avalon, the NAV was was thumbs up better. Price delivered with tax, 35000.00
In thinking about it I did not need rain sensitive wipers, or a electronic shade screen for the back window, or enhanced lighting around the moonroof. All things considered the sound system was comparable. Very comfortable, but not as roomy in the back, or trunk.
My earlier question about the size of the Avalon, In a back up test, I did find that with my reduced depth perception it was a problem. Luckily I stopped just short of breaking out a window panel of the show room.
As you can guess I went with the Acura. It had proven quality, and fit me better. This forum definitely helped and I thank everyone for their posts.
Thanks,
pricecutter