Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Popular New Cars
Popular Used Sedans
Popular Used SUVs
Popular Used Pickup Trucks
Popular Used Hatchbacks
Popular Used Minivans
Popular Used Coupes
Popular Used Wagons
Comments
http://www.audi4ever.at/tb/auto.php?auto=1612&type=0&user- - =
Click on the button "Bilder" at the top of teh page... :-)
"Damn furriners!"
;-)
Looks great. Still missing a couple doors for my tastes, but this is a car to desire, IMO!
The interior to me looks more like an A4 Cab than a regular A4 (round vents, etc...)
anyway, its a fat car and I can't wait till I get to sell 'em
What's the story?
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
I like the idea of a DSG 3.2 Sportback, but is there any buzz on a potential S3 Sportback? Sure would be fun to drop into that 5.5 sec 0-60 range.
They've got 18 months to get it here. I like the GW green with a tan interior.
Please?
Audi?
Please? :-)
Overall Length: 4286 mm
Wheelbase: 2578 mm
Height: 1423 mm
Width: 1765 mm
Width w/ mirror:1959 mm
Front track: 1531 mm
Rear track: 1515 mm
Front Headroom: 970 mm
Rear Headroom: 938 mm
Can't find the legroom measurement, but Front legroom is the same as the current Golf/Jetta, and the Rear legroom is about 2.5 inches longer than the current Golf/Jetta.
2FastDre.
I bet Audi will blame lack of sales on the fact that it is a hatchback, and we Americans prefer sedans. I've heard this song and dance before, and I don't buy it. IMO, there is a market for hatches. But they have to price it right. Bottom line: base price needs to be closer to 22k with a typically equipped version at 26-27k for the FWD 2.0T. Otherwise it will flop. And high pricing will be the reason.
Just imagine how expensive the 3.2 version will be when fully loaded with all options including navigation system. I would guess 38k or more, which is ridiculous.
Although after a year or so, the car will flop and can be had for 3-4k off sticker making it the price they should have had in the first place
The A3 should cost less than the A4 since it's on the cheaper PQ46 chassis. If it costs the same, I'd go for the A4, even though I'd prefer the smaller A3.
If it shares everything, other than the chassis, then the question really is how much does the chassis cost.
A new Audi with a 2.0T, leather, heated seats, scrap the sunroof for zenons, and DSG for under 30 does seem like a...relatively good deal. Make it 27 like the TSX and in my book there would be no comparison.
Or, a better question would be. How much more are you willing to pay for an A3 over a VW GTI?
For me, the answer is about 2k. Or Maybe a maximum of about 4k if the Audi is AWD and the GTI is FWD. It will be interesting to see how they both are priced.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
So, for me, the price tag is of less importance than the feel and the capability. Doesn't mean the observation isn't valid, just means there may be an audience that will accept a relatively small price difference between certain configs of A3 and A4; maybe even a touch of overlap.
The October issues of R&T and Automobile0 have good skinny as well as divergent views on the prospects for the A4.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
My original point was that if the A3 bumped into the A4 price margins, then the A4 being the more ‘sophisticated’ would sway me...maybe not all the way...the Sportback is nice, and like you said, if it does what you want it to do, more metal doesn't make it better
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
ALSO -- I like the Euro model tail lights more than the weird(?) USA ones. WAZZUP deZinah???
How are they different?
You could prolly get a stripper A3 in Europe for 21k Euros.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
THINK ABOUT IT. That's a good price. For 25k I could buy a Volvo V50 or The Saabaru - both are what I would consider more substantial cars. So I'm taking a wait and see attitude. BTW, I don't mind if all I get is a stripper for 21k.
The TAIL LIGHTS:
US VERSION:
http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com/pictures/V- - - EHICLE/2005/Audi/100394208/030636-E.jpg
EURO VERSION:
http://www.edv-schreiber.at/audi4ever/fdb/pics/1612_e78eda5f421e4- - - 4fa6b7be712b3b1b18e.jpg
Maybe they are different coz one's a 3 door?
Isn't it the same black three-dr. that was posted earlier in this thread?
As for strippers, there's no market in the US for Euro-style strippers
with no air, cloth upholstery, stamped steel wheels, minimal safety features etc. so we won't get one---ergo $25k base (and those will be hard to come by cuz dealers won't order 'em.
I don't consider MT a very reliable source for automotive info.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com/pictures/V- EHICLE/2005/Suzuki/100377752/028784-E.jpg
do you get the joke?
I too have been comparing against the V50 (the Sportback). For an accurate comparison (not meaning to start a VS thread), you'd have to choose the T5 vs the 2.0T DSG to get a comparable performance (0-60 high 6's) and then add the 'extras'. When I option the V50 out I get just over 30K (not choosing many opts). Though you can do the ED with the Volvo; not sure why Audi hasn't developed this.
The A3 may not be a bad value at 25K, it all depends what standard features it comes with; as it should be well optioned being an Audi.
The real question is why not buy the new Golf instead?
Golf instead? That was my question...I would have liked to see a small bump in the 2.0T rating for the A3. Nothing substantial, 5-10hp, but it would have distinguished it from the VW line; distinguished from a drive train perspective, not styling/interior appointments.
I suppose Audi assumes that people will move up to the 3.2 or S3 if they preferred/needed more output. Perhaps the 2.0T will have similar aftermarket modifications as the 1.8T did.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
Golf V 2.0T 5-door is called Golf V GTI 5-door in the rest of the world. VW considers North America to be the least crucial world market. However, Audi seems to pay more attention to USA than VW. As a current Golf TDI owner, I am waiting for either Golf V TDI or Audi A3 TDI. I think that my wait will be over in 2007.
BTW, if money was no object - 2005 A8 TDI V8 with every option would be my ride! This is why it's important for Audi to not screw up the A3 and TDI strategies.
2FastDre.
Just my 2 cents worth
And that's exactly why it interests me. The G35 is huge, and has sparked a competition for bulk in that segment. The 3-series, A4, IS300, are all on track to add bulk, and are thus moving out of my field of interest.
Enter the A3, which potentially is exactly the compact, nimble, fits-like-a-glove zip-about that will replace my IS300 SportCross. If it's half as good as it appears to be, price up to about $33K is not really an objection, IMO.
It will be, however, somewhat a niche car, from where I sit.
There is absolutely no way we Americans are going to pay that much for an entry level hatchback. If they are not going to make the base price about 22k and have well equipped versions (AWD, tiptronic, premium pkg, heated seats and metallic paint) for 28 to 29k, then Audi should not even bother bringing the A3 here.
Give me a Quattro 3.2 DSG with full leather or leather and Alcantara, NAV, sport suspension and assorted goodies, and you've got an AWD replacement for the RWD IS300 SportCross I now drive which stickered at $35K and is as close to perfect as I've found.
Much of the perfection of the current IS, IMO, is in its size, which as Road and Track put it, in a comparo, is like: "...(going) from a Thunderbolt to a Spitfire, or a Stearman to a Pitts, to put it in aviation context. The IS 300 is really the sports car of this group, and it feels small, taut, nimble and fun. As one driver noted, you 'wear' this car more than any of the others."
John Q has shown he doesn't fully understand a car like that (unless it's a roadster), so therefore, in part all y'all are correct: a base model would have to be in the mid 20's or thereabouts to be a volume car. Why bother then? Why shop it over a Golf or Jetta? It certainly will not be typical "entry level", competing against things like Mazda 3s (which would be tough competition). If it's going to be a true entry-level, count me out; I'm looking for a touch of lux with a lot of sport, and in true compact form.
I think it'll be niche, when all is said and done. It will start just a bit below the A4 in base trim, and overlap in full regalia. I believe that's how the structure works in Europe, if I'm reading those numbers correctly...
35k would be OK for a fully loaded 3.2 with every available option. However, I suspect the actual pricing for this configuration will be 40K.
Also, when I said entry level, I meant entry level in the Audi lineup. Not entry level compared to Mazda 3's or Honda Civics, etc.
Lastly, you state that the A3 in base trim will be just a bit below the A4 in base trim. All the reports in the car mags seem to back this up as the A3 is estimated to start at 25k, while the A4 starts at 26k. Audi should easily be able to put a 4k difference between the two because the A3 is built on the less expensive golf/jetta platform. The A4 is on same platform as the A6, which in V8 trim can list for over 55k. It seems to me that this latter platform would be much more refined and expensive than the golf/jetta platform. Therefore, why would anyone buy an A3 when they can have an A4 for only 1k more? I bet BMW won't price the 1 series and 3 series only 1k apart. Likewise, VW won't price the new golf/jetta and the new passat only 1k apart. Audi won't be able to get away with pricing the A3 and A4 so close together either IMHO. Especially in the USA where hatches are perceived to be inferior to sedans by the majority of people.
This car won't be a volume leader. It's a hatch/wag, and folks here just don't get that in the first place. Consider my car, for example. It's everything the A3 is, less Quattro, and plus RWD, which I personally consider advantageous. No one knows it even exists (regardless of trim level: base under 30K). It'll be pricey, but worth it where it counts, yet the average customer just won't get it, I'm thinking. Exceptional customers like me will!
BMW obviously knows what it's up against with the 1-series, which is why we're not only getting it late, but potentially not as a wagon, hatch or even sedan at all. Last I heard, it's the two-door for us, and they dropped the idea of the hatch. Is there more news there?
Reality is I'd probably be better off upping the ante and pulling the trigger on the S4 Avant, which intrigues me greatly from a sleeper perspective if nothing else (and there's plenty "else"!).
Interesting...
The A3 platform is smaller, less expensive, most likely will be less refined in ride comfort and NVH characteristics, and probably will offer less crash protection compared to the A4/A6 platform.
I repeat, almost no one will buy the A3 at a virtually identical price to an A4. At their pricing structure, Audi would have to make more profit on an A3 than a comparably equipped A4 due to the A4's more expensive platform. And a loaded A3 3.2 DSG at more than 40k is ludicrous. This list price is at least 5k too high.
while underestimating the price of the A4. I believe there will be around a $4k difference between a comparably-equipped A3 and it's A4 cousin.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=6&article_- id=1578&page_number=1
That's a link to a R&T article our friend Iceman gave me. They're predicting the base A3 at just under $25K with the Quattro 3.2DSG at around $30K. Now at $30-33K, I like the package quite a bit.
Wish they were here now.
For the record, I still don't see it as a volume unit. I'd like to, but I don't. Experience says that as a country, we're not always the savviest of automotive consumers...
Until now, there really hasn't been anything that fits my needs. The Mazda3 is an impressive car for the price, but IMO it's missing too many features (upgraded stereo, only one intermittent wiper speed, no seat heaters or power adjustments, black is only interior color offered...). I wouldn't touch a Focus, the Matrix/Vibe are woefully underpowered.
Motor Trend just tested a 2006 GTI, and praised the new 2.0 turbo, calling it a jewel of an engine. And of course Audi is the best in the bizz when it comes to interiors.
I'd buy an A3 over an A4 even if they were priced the same. I prefer the sporty image and smaller package it offers. Plus, I'd be less likely to see one on every corner.
Let the masses keep buying bloated cars, and us small hatch lovers can remain more exclusive.
And, the car mags seem to think highly of it. In the MT issue that drove the 2006 GTI, they also test the upgraded A4. Also with the new 2.0, again high praise. But the editors seemed put off that the A4 isn't available with the DSG tranny that the A3 gets.
Back to the GTI.... they also give it really favorable reviews with regards to handling and drivability. They compare it to cars such as the Pontiac GTO, stating that although the GTO can out-run it in a stoplight race, the GTI is the better car all around, more well rounded and a blast to drive. Now, with a "sport suspension" being offered in the A3, I'm interpreting that to be an Audi GTI with four doors. Yeah, I can't wait.
The 3.2 is a far superior engine to the old 2.8 I'm used to, not so much because of the additional power but because it's rev-happy. I never liked the buzziness of the 2.8 on my A4 when rpms went over 5200 or so, I assume the 3.0 (a derivative)
is much the same.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93