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VW Jetta TDI

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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    If we're anywhere near close on the facts here, then it seems that the immediate solution is a re-designed pump. Diesel cars have been around since the 1930s, and German diesels have led the world in technical competence, so I see no reason why VW can't engineer a proper fix.

    This reminds me of a similar problem that Alfa Romeo had in the American market. They had a fuel injection pump that would destroy itself if you ran out of gas.
  • longo2longo2 Member Posts: 347
    "If we're anywhere near close on the facts here, then it seems that the immediate solution is a re-designed pump"

    Mr S' you are right on on this one.

    VW would love for all of us to go off chasing our tails about "contaminated fuel" when the 'contamination' is actually ground up pieces of the fuel pump!

    I have seen pics of the offending parts of the new HPFP and can't imagine how the thing got off the drawing board, much less, into production.

    Seems the piston that runs on a roller following the cam lobe can turn sideways in the bore and the result is the cam lobe is now applying full pressure to the pump cylinder on a single tiny area of the roller...what could go wrong with that!
  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    I wonder how much it would cost to replace the fuel pump on a mass recall versus fixing the mess the offending ones make? Or is it admitting the screw up in the first place the hold up?

    With the internet, VW blaming people for using bad fuel is going to go nowhere. It may have worked 20 years ago but not now.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Do you know if this design bears any resemblance to the HPFP used in the BMW 335, which is also apparently causing big problems?
  • shriftyshrifty Member Posts: 255
    Well, this doesn't give me a warm and fuzzy feeling, that's for sure! When I take my car in for its 60K service I'll have to ask them to check to see if all is well in the fuel system. I've already had to plunk down about $500 for an exhaust flap, if they say I will need to have this repaired as well, I think I'll be migrating away from VW in a heartbeat.
  • vinchenz61vinchenz61 Member Posts: 12
    This is sme serious stuff. What dealership in NJ are you using
  • farmertullfarmertull Member Posts: 14
    If you read the newest edition of Motor Trend you find out the tax incentive for diesel is gone in Europe and now gas and diesel are the same price. We have lived with higher then gas prices since 2005. I live on a farm and the only gas engine is a lawn mower. I have been torn about my Jetta Sportswagon since I bought it last fall. It was no replacement for a SUV on my gravel snowy road. It is a race car that is heaven to drive on the highway. I have a feeling the great diesel engine is going to have trouble if Hybrids improve. I feel like getting out of this car while I can. The 35-39 mpg I get hardly overcomes a 35 cent disadvantage. If the Tiguan had the diesel I wouldnt feel so torn but this Problem with the high pressure fuel pump reminds me of the 20k I spent on a John Deere 4 wheel drive tractor that was under warrantee and the company wouldn't cover it. I ended up trading for a newer tractor. Now this problem showing up with the VW diesel makes me wonder why I gave them a chance after driving the worst car I ever owned....1981 VW Diesel Rabbit. What a joke that was and the poor dealer service made me swear to never buy another VW again. Here I am with a new Jetta with 16K on it and I wonder if the fuel system goes out will the company make me pay the $8-10K.
  • eliaselias Member Posts: 2,209
    farmer, if your fuel system does crater then your subsequent experience will probably depend entirely on your local dealership. the dealer may well stand up for you - seems like plenty of dealers are doing so.

    you must have the automatic/DSG transmission to get such low mpg, or maybe drive all "city" miles?
    around here diesel costs less per gallon than premium gas.
    but a 20% price difference is less than the 40% mpg boost!
    if 35 cents wipes out the diesel miles-per-dollar advantage then your gasser vehicle must be very small? a motorcycle! :)

    Also seems like maybe a lubricity additive can be especially helpful in the newest TDIs - some freds people seem to be theorizing that it is the USA fuel which has inadequate lubricity for the HPFP's apparently-weak-design.
  • roadmaster45roadmaster45 Member Posts: 13
    I also have a 2009 TDI, asked about additives also and was told not to add any thing to these new engines by VWofA. Also was thinking about a Touareg TDI but now have 2nd thoughts, maybe going back to an american SUV again
  • farmertullfarmertull Member Posts: 14
    The Jetta Sportswagon is not a large vehicle. I would compare the dimensions to a civic which doesnt burn premium. Yes I do have a DSG but I live in a rural area in South Dakota with long trips. I am 54 and have been driving since 10 (remember I am a farm boy). I give real milage..not the best only. My father was the only person I know who got the mileage he claimed. If you see the Motor trend real mileage it is usually less then EPA claims. If the fuel system goes and it isnt covered because powe rtrain mileage is past warranty I will have to pay no matter what. The poor people who buy the TDI because of the claims will put a stain on the TDI market. I know I can resell this vehicle at this time but if things like this happen it could be GM converted gasoline engines of the 80's all over againand the mentioned Rabbit diesel. A 15% price disadvantage is no better then 30 mpg civic.
    5.5 inches of ground clearance is crazy low for the TDI.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    5.5 inches of ground clearance is crazy low for the TDI.

    That is the precise reason I do not have a VW TDI. Maybe I am lucky if they have not worked out all the bugs yet. I would have jumped on a Tiguan TDI with 4 cylinder. Having to mess with urea has kept me away from the big V6 diesels. Though I like the MB and BMW diesel SUVs.

    Diesel prices here in CA have inched their way past RUG over the last 6 months.
  • eliaselias Member Posts: 2,209
    touareg tdi is an attractive vehicle to me! But for less $ and 800 ft-lbs I think I'd cross shop a 2011 duramax pickup.
    haven't heard of HPFP issues with touareg tdi - probably it uses very/thankfully-different hardware than the 2009-2011 vw-car-tdis.
  • cosanostracosanostra Member Posts: 91
    Are the issues with the fuel pump also showing up on the 2010 Jetta TDIs, or is it too early to tell yet? Hearing about this issue is quickly lessening my desire to consider the TDi as an option.
  • longo2longo2 Member Posts: 347
    My 2 cents worth on your question is this...if you can't live without a VW, be patient until the 2011 larger version of the Jetta shows up later this fall and have a look. Then do some real serious detective work to find out if it has an improved HPFP.

    I think it's nuts to pay a big car price for a Jetta that's about the same size as a Hyundai Elantra but has less than half the warranty.
    When VW meets or beats that warranty I'll know they have finally figured out how to build a car that will last at least as long as the payments.

    There are some great looking 2011 new cars out there now that come pretty close to the TDI's mpg's running on regular grade gas and have a MUCH better reliablity history (J>D Power, Consumers Reports, etc etc) than the VW's.
    My 2006 TDI has a different fuel supply system than the newer models but it has a nasty habit of creating Break the Budget, off warranty, engine repair bills too.

    The expensive VW service shedules (not to mention repairs) more than negate all the $avings on my TDI's 38 mpg.
  • asaasa Member Posts: 359
    edited September 2010
    Yes, there have been HPFP failures in 2010s too. Although failures seem uncommon (60,000 '09 and '10 TDIs have been sold in the U.S.), it's the shocking repair expense and VW's capricious attitute about repairs that make it a headline topic. Our '10 JSW has been excellent in every respect, but we have only 6,300 Miles on it.
  • shriftyshrifty Member Posts: 255
    I just had my car in for its service, and so far no issues with the HPFP, hope it continues to stay that way. That would not be a good repair bill to have.
  • shriftyshrifty Member Posts: 255
    I am currently in the market for a windshield for my vehicle and called the insurance company first to report the claim. When speaking with the dealership, they do not replace however they have a shop that provides the service for them. Everyone seems to be asking me what type of windshield I have on my car, but aren't they all the same? And if they are different, can't they look it up by the VIN to see what was in it originally? The main questions asked where regarding rain sensors and tinting, but I don't believe I have either. Any ideas?
  • alltorquealltorque Member Posts: 535
    Well, the windscreen company won't have any idea unless they physically see the car. VIN identification may well do the trick but a simple visit to your dealer, or the windscreen company, will answer the question.

    Not being rude here but do you really not know if your car has a tinted 'screen and/or rain sensors ? My flabber is truly gasted. :confuse:
  • shriftyshrifty Member Posts: 255
    edited September 2010
    I probably should have been a bit clearer in my original post.

    I was under the impression that having the VIN and knowing that I have an 09 TDI Sedan would have been enough information to know the correct windshield for my vehicle (especially the dealership), why would they need to see it? Also, did they really need to ask about 6 - 8 different questions regarding the windshield? Are there that many options out there for the TDI?

    I am aware that the windshield is not tinted (although they insisted it had to be either blue or green with no other choice), but as for the rain sensors, I'm not 100% certain as I rarely use my wipers in the rain as the water runs off well enough that they are not necessary. I'd definitely say no to this as well.

    Quite honestly, I was amazed at how long the discussion took to determine the correct windshield. I just can't believe it needs to be a complex process to figure it out.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    yeah they probably do need to see it, since the VIN wouldn't list all the possible options. You could, I'd guess, have at least 3 different windshields in that car.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    When we replaced the windshield in my wife's LS400 recently, they just asked for the VIN. However when they got to the house, the guy spotted right off that the color of the tinting was not correct. So they had to order the right tint, and make a second trip. He said with the color of the car and upholstery it would have looked awful. I think the tint is color coordinated in many cars.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Sometime there are mid-year production changes, too, as suppliers drop out or whatever.
  • shriftyshrifty Member Posts: 255
    Interesting, I never would have guessed that. Would it really matter if I didn't have the "correct" windshield? My theory is if it fits, put it in. Doesn't have to be pretty, just keep the elements and rocks out.

    I did notice some type of black shading of some sort above the rear-view mirror, not sure what that is for...
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    That's the antenna probably.
  • shriftyshrifty Member Posts: 255
    Possible. I do have an antenna on top of the car, is it possible one is for the SAT radio, the other is for AM/FM?
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    OHHHH I know what you mean----that dot matrix---that's for shading I believe, if it's near the rear view mirror. If it's along the edge of the windshield, that has something to do with bonding the windshield, I *think*. Maybe others have the entire story straight...I obviously don't. :P
  • shriftyshrifty Member Posts: 255
    Yeah, that thing. Either way, I'd just like to have a windshield on my car that isn't broken. The insurance company said it would be $100 to either repair or replace the windshield, so I'm going with a new one instead :D
  • moparbadmoparbad Member Posts: 3,870
    When I have glass replaced on my vehicles I have bodyshop do the work as opposed to the glass only shop. In my experience the bodyshop does much better work sealing the glass and installing associated trim pieces.
  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    I have had three windshields replaced in the last twelve years and all have been done by window only type companies. They do them day in, day out and warranty them. Never had a leak, wind noise or any problem with trim pieces not reinstalled properly and cleanly. I think they were at least two different companies which did the work. I wouldn't be leary of them.....it's not brain surgery.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    True but I've seen a few screw-ups by these mobile operations. On rare occasion, even hideous butchery. I always choose a good local shop that's been around for a while and works for local dealers. As you say, they know the routine and have it down, and in a well-equipped shop they are ready to deal with whatever comes up.
  • shriftyshrifty Member Posts: 255
    Unfortunately I don't have too much time to shop around back home, I'm out on the road all week this week, and leaving the country next week for the rest of the year and I'd like to have it done before I go. I just picked a place based on the dealership's recommendation, and hoping for the best!
  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    It's possible I've been lucky or my cars/trucks were pretty easy to replace the windshields on. That's what I have insurance for. If they screw it up, they fix it.
  • altair4altair4 Member Posts: 1,469
    I pass several autobody shops on my way to work. Can't tell you the number of times I've seen mobile glass truck guys doing the install of a new windshield at all of them. Not saying all bodyshops farm out that work, but at least some do.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    edited September 2010
    I think it depends a lot on the individual competency of the mobile installer, as well as the type of car he is working on. Some guys get in over their heads.
  • shriftyshrifty Member Posts: 255
    Had the window shop replace the windshield yesterday, everything looks just fine, although the rear view mirror might be slightly lower by a fraction of an inch (no big deal). I'm glad he was able to keep my base sticker intact.
  • f1docf1doc Member Posts: 3
    I have encountered the same complete loss of throttle response in my daughter's 2010 SW TDI w/DSG. It is NOT due to left foot braking, as the dealer claims. This is dangerous. Any ideas?
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    You mean she feels a momentary "dead pedal"?

    Yeah, that has plagued any number of cars with electronic throttles. I've seen various aftermarket fixes, but not yet for a VW TDI. Apparently you can wire in a different sensor to the gas pedal, which must vary the signal to the throttle controls.
  • f1docf1doc Member Posts: 3
    This occurs hot or cold, often on a slight incline, from dead stop. I have encountered it. Various forums and C&D review have blamed turbo lag, throttle by wire, software glitches involving the DSG and prevention of "over-reving" and brake switch preventing throttle up. This is a scary phenomenon! Just enough power is produced to get the car into the middle of the intersection, then idle engine rev only for 2-3 seconds, unaffected by throttle pumping. The dealer is clueless, though he also doesn't admit to knowledge of existing TSB's on this issue. I love the car otherwise but will sell it (back to VW!) if this is not repaired.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    edited October 2010
    That certainly doesn't sound like turbo lag. I couldn't find a TSB on this, only older ones. That doesn't mean there isn't one. Maybe someone can track it down?

    Oh, wait, here's something.

    NHTSA has just opened an investigation (August):

    NHTSA Action Number:
    PE10034

    Summary:
    The Office of Defects Investigation (ODI) has received 7 complaints on 2009 Volkswagen Jetta TDI vehicles alleging that while driving and without warning the engine limped and then stalled almost immediately. A Preliminary Evaluation has been opened to assess the scope, frequency, and potential safety consequences associated with the alleged defect.

    No doubt this will grind very very slowly but ultimately might result in a recall.
  • shriftyshrifty Member Posts: 255
    Glad to hear the NHTSA is looking into this. Not sure if it is really a problem or not, but is quite annoying when it happens. It happened when I first got the car, just assumed it was "normal".
  • shriftyshrifty Member Posts: 255
    Has anyone heard any further details regarding this investigation?
  • dufenschmertzdufenschmertz Member Posts: 1
    This may be a stupid question but does this car have more than one battery?
  • eliaselias Member Posts: 2,209
    06 jetta tdi has just one battery... a big one !
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Diesel cars need stronger batteries. Never cheap out on a diesel car battery.
  • bpeeblesbpeebles Member Posts: 4,085
    edited November 2010
    My wifes 2003 TDI has gone thru 6 Vermont winters on the original battery. A new one from "Interstate Batteries" lists for $245.95. This MTP-H7 battery one of the most powerful batteries in the industry

    Everyone knows that "Interstate Batteries" sells the best batteries on the planet. Most contractors have their rechargable powertools rebuilt at "Interstate Batteries". I also get all my cell-phone batteries from "Interstate Batteries".

    We plug in the TDI block-heater anytime the ambient temp goes below 0F. This adds many years to the batteries life.
  • cosmocosmo Member Posts: 203
    Just replaced the battery on our 2004 Passat TDI wagon after 6 Washington winters (75 months of life). It was noticeably low, but not dead yet. Dealer price for original equipment battery: $110.00 minus $20 discount plus $19 labor.
  • mech79mech79 Member Posts: 1
    Has anybody ran across their TDI using oil. I recently got a 2002 TDI Jetta 198,000 and noticed that the guy carried oil with him. I checked the oil and found he was a 1.5 qts. low. Any suggestions. I am not leaking it out anywhere and filter area is pretty clean just small seepage from changing filter. I called previous owner and found he had 4,000 miles on oil. He uses synthetic oil with the gc-4. Is it true that the service interval is 15,000 mile?
  • lbirunnerlbirunner Member Posts: 8
    You should go here: www.tdiclub.com.
    you will find lot's of info
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    edited November 2010
    It would be perfectly normal for an engine with 198K to be using oil. The engine is somewhat near normal statistical life span at this point (what the engineers aimed for). Some go a lot more, and I hope yours does, some go a lot less, but about 225K is what a passenger car diesel engine can usually provide.

    If I were in your shoes, I'd first calculate how much oil is being used and make a judgment on service intervals based on that.

    These published factory service intervals are for NEW cars---that's not your car anymore. Witha little extra TLC, you can probably push that engine to beyond 225K statistics.
  • bpeeblesbpeebles Member Posts: 4,085
    edited November 2010
    Proper engine oil for 2004 TDI is VW 505.00 (There are some followon specs which may meet requiremens too like 505.01) Personally, I use Pentosin Oil

    OCI (Oil Change Interval) is 10,000 miles. (not 15K as you suggest)

    Try running the CORRECT oil and see if this helps reduce the consumption. These engines are good for about 400,000 miles. so yours is still young.

    Also, do not forget to use FULL THROTTLE ACCELLERATION at least once per tank of fuel. Otherwise, the turbocharger and intercooler will start to choke up. Watch your rearview mirror whilst doing this... once things are clean, you should NOT see any black smoke during full-throttle. As long as you are getting black smoke, you are cleaning the crud out of it. (burning carbon off of turbocharger vanes)

    You may also suspect the turbocharger-seal could be leaking oil. The intercooler may be collecting oil in the bottom of it. Also check the intake-manifold to see if the inside of it is not gettting choked with goopy oil residue.
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