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Honda Odyssey 2005+

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Comments

  • mochisushimochisushi Member Posts: 126
    I should call you a really nasty name purely out of jealousy ;-). However, I know that my EX-L R&N should be here in the next two to three weeks. I guess I have waited this long...a few more weeks of jealousy can be dealt with in a civil manner.

    Congratulations on your new Ody. Keep us informed as you rack up the Smiles 8^)
  • kixokixo Member Posts: 35
    With the 04, Honda was pretty skimpy with providing actual leather in the interior. Only the "seating surfaces" and some door inserts were leather. Not the entire seat. And no leather at all in the third row - just vinyl. For leather, Honda charged a whopping $1500 over the cloth EX, making it a huge profit option. (The EX-L did come with heated seats).

    The difference between an '05 EX and EX-L is now $2300, for which you get leather, moonroof, VCM, ANC, heated seats, and adjustable front seat arm rests. That's a huge jump.

    Does anyone know if Honda has added more leather to the seats and interior, and if the 3rd seat is now leather?
  • dinky100dinky100 Member Posts: 21
    Yes- thank you! It's pretty funny-- watching the people on the interstate as I drive by pointing-- I was the first in CO to purchase! :)
  • anonymouspostsanonymousposts Member Posts: 3,802
    I know a few Toyota owners who switched to Honda because they found them more trouble-free. If you go to the Camry, 4Runner, Sienna, etc room you will find people who have problems just like Ody, Accord, and Civic owners. I have had lots-o-Hondas and have had VERY good luck with them although my 97 RAV4 was bullet-proof as well. As far as the older Toyotas I have owned ..

    1995 GS300 - bought at 135,000 miles. Climate control lights went out, leaked power steering fluid, and the power tilt/telescopic wheel stopped working.
    1991 Toyota MR2 - my husband had this car before he met me but at 20,000 miles or so the turbos failed and he had to have them replaced.
    1987 Toyota Camry - My mother-in-law bought a new one in 87 and had her head gasket fail at 17,000 miles

    None of the above are major problems but it does show that no car is perfect. I wouldn't hesitate to buy a Toyota though nor would I hesitate to buy an Odyssey. Although I do normally like to wait a few months into production before I buy a brand new model. But our 03 Accord coupe bought in December (new model was introduced in September) was perfect in the 16,000 miles we owned it before trading it for a sedan out of necessity.
  • hleftyhlefty Member Posts: 4
    Test drove an '05 Odyssey home last night. My wife and I both loved it. Spent all day today trying to get the best deal in North Atlanta.

    The EX-L RES MSRP lists at 32400. Two dealers would not even talk about reducing their prices which were MSRP plus $1700. Two other dealers did negotiate. I ended up buying one for MSRP, though it wasn't easy.

    Bottom line - be willing to shop around, as you would for any vehicle. I might have even done better if I threatened to buy a SIENNA as a negotiating tactic. (P.S. I don't think the SIENNA comes close to the ODY)
  • heywood1heywood1 Member Posts: 851
    Absolutely untrue. Here in Western PA, interstates are curved and hilly--not to mention the secondary roads. I appreciate the advantage of my Sienna's AWD every time I drive in the rain, not just ice and snow. While it's true that traction control makes a difference on a FWD model, it is no substitute for AWD. My previous Sienna was FWD with traction control, and I had trouble getting up a substantial grade in snowy conditions (even with four snow tires). The traction control would kick in and bog down my momentum. But it never happens with the AWD van. And with the Blizzak's I've ordered, it'll be virtually unstoppable this winter.

    Honda loyalists in this forum are defending the '05 Odyssey's lack of AWD by declaring it's unnecessary. I predict Honda will sell all the AWD's it can make as soon as the company realizes this glaring omission in its product line-up.
  • lumbarlumbar Member Posts: 421
    Thanks a lot for posting those comparative MSRPs--illustrating once and for all that this talk about a "small" increase from '04 was a crock.

    I trust Honda knows their market well enough to know people will pay it, and I certainly hope that those who do enjoy their vehicles, but, at 31K for an EX-L, I can't imagine being one of them. You've saved me a trip to the dealer.
  • blueberrytedblueberryted Member Posts: 4
    Live in Boston suburbs, and drive a '00 ODY EX and have never gotten stuck. Several warm memories of others unable to drive uphill, or just stuck, while I drove by without a glitch. You can see the Traction Control light come on when you drive on snowy, or slippery surfaces, and it works great! Descriptions of it bogging down don't apply.
  • lumbarlumbar Member Posts: 421
    So you would argue against buying a FWD Sienna as well?
  • anonymouspostsanonymousposts Member Posts: 3,802
    Honda sold lots of Odysseys without AWD and Toyota sells plenty of Siennas that are not AWD. Toyota has made AWD vans in the past (Previa anyone) and they made up a small percentage of overall sales. Toyota also attempted to market AWD in it's cars with the Camry and Celica All-trac. Very slow sellers although I'm sure the car mags and the one's who bought them thought they were the best thing since sliced bread.

    Not everyone lives in the snow belt and AWD is all but useless here in the SE where a good set of all-season tires with lots of tread will get you through all four seasons without issue. The driver skill probably makes more difference in the inclement weather than any AWD system ever will.

    hlefty: Which dealer in Atlanta did you purchase from?
  • mochisushimochisushi Member Posts: 126
    Hey...I'm in CO, too...South Suburban Denver. I have my car ordered from Schomp...Where did you go? I was there on Friday night driving the Touring model that they had (Midnight Blue).
  • dinky100dinky100 Member Posts: 21
    I actually went down to Vidmar in Pueblo. Willing to negotiate, and no horrible wait to get into finance! Painless! I got it at 1000K UNDER MSRP for a EXL- RES-- (midnight blue as a matter of fact!) I can't wait to drive it again tomorrow!

    I'm in Colorado Springs-- and I must say that TEAM HONDA hasn't been any help (in a number of issues). I would recommend that EVERYONE go to Vidmar -- such a pleasant buying experience!
  • dinky100dinky100 Member Posts: 21
    I live in CO. I actually like the fact that the Odyssey only has the traction control. I live in CO-- never have needed anything more than the traction control (I figure if the roads are that bad-- I'll stay home) All the AWD seems to do is bring down the gas milage.
  • dinky100dinky100 Member Posts: 21
    Get the Odyssey-- better value for the "standards" like TC-- AWD just eats gas...
  • mochisushimochisushi Member Posts: 126
    Hey...Thanks for the tip. I have purchased most of my Hondas from Schomp (I live in Highlands Ranch). They are always a pleasure to work with, but I have no special attachment to them. I will gladly go down to Pueblo for $1K. I'll have to give them a call.
  • cericceric Member Posts: 1,092
    With the 04, Honda was pretty skimpy with providing actual leather in the interior. Only the "seating surfaces" and some door inserts were leather. Not the entire seat. And no leather at all in the third row - just vinyl.

    I once read an article about the so called "leather interior" in automobiles. Only a few makers use leather for entire seats. Most of them, you guess it, German. Not even Lexus! The so called, "leather trimmed", "leather seating surface", etc. all mean that the portions that your body normally touch while seating on them are leather. Other portions are just color/texture-matched vinyl. Now, the 3rd seat being entirely vinyl... I don't know how to defend that for Honda. They are just trying to cut cost, I guess.
  • kixokixo Member Posts: 35
    I have also read that the mix of leather and vinyl in the seat promotes splitting and wear. Leather and vinyl contract and expand at different rates according to the ambient temperature. This stress on the stitching where the leather and vinyl meet promotes splitting over time.

    Having said that, I have never noticed a torn seat in an Odyssey (although I have with other Hondas), and I think manufacturers have really improved the quality of both the leather and vinyl to prevent this from happening in modern cars.
  • heywood1heywood1 Member Posts: 851
    They apply to me. Believe whatever you want.

    Perhaps roads in Boston suburbs are are better--and more frequently--maintained than here.

    I'm just sharing my experience. Don't tell me I'm wrong, unless you were driving my van in my neighborhood while I was sleeping.
  • heywood1heywood1 Member Posts: 851
    Depends on where you live. But I've been so pleased with the AWD Sienna, that I'd definitely choose it over the FWD again--assuming I still live where I do.
  • heywood1heywood1 Member Posts: 851
    Well, of course AWD is more practical in some parts of the country than others. I agree that FWD with traction control should be enough in the southeast. But tell that to all those driving SUV's in the Atlanta area.

    Sounds like you're defending Honda's lack of AWD availability by declaring it's unnecessary. I can't wait to read all the posts here from loyalists about how wonderful AWD is when Honda offers it on the '06 Ody.
  • andrewtran71andrewtran71 Member Posts: 840
    The more features the merrier IMO.
    Too bad the Sienna doesn't have a lot more chrome grille, fluorescent instrument panel, and the same NAV as the Ody or at least the LS430.
    Also add in a SPARE 8th seat that can be stored under the floor (most of the time).
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    It's not just the Odyssey. The MDX has a vinyl third row seat. You won't see the difference, but if you've sat back there, you will notice it slightly. The vinyl is coarser than the leather in the second row. I'm sure plenty of SUVs with third row seats and leather interiors have vinyl third rows. (I can think of the Explorer and Highlander)
  • heywood1heywood1 Member Posts: 851
    Well, I can't remember the last time I hauled seven people anywhere-- let alone eight. It's six at most for me: wife, two kids and in-laws. So 8th seat doesn't have any value to me.

    And I'm not a techy. NAV systems are a neat gimmick, I guess--assuming the software stays up to date, and you travel to lots of different urban areas. We generally fly to far-away destinations, and I don't need NAV to tell me where I am in my little town. So the whole NAV envy thing doesn't make a difference to me; I wouldn't check that option box on either van.

    But I agree, the more option choices available, the better. I predict Honda will offer AWD in the near future, and catch up to the Sienna in this regard.
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    I can't wait to read all the posts here from loyalists about how wonderful AWD is when Honda offers it on the '06 Ody.

    Has this been confirmed, or is it just wishful thinking?

    Bob
  • heywood1heywood1 Member Posts: 851
    Just a prediction on my part.
  • mickeymickey Member Posts: 3
    because of better control on the wheels. That's a fact. But AWD is more expensive to manufacture than FWD, and consumes more gas. High-end sedans like Acura 2005 RL offers only AWD. Why? Not because most RL buyers live in snow belt, right?

    If the 2005 Ody offers an AWD oiption for an extra $500, will people opt for the AWD? I think the *majority* (not all) of the buyers will opt for the AWD.
  • lumbarlumbar Member Posts: 421
    Not all AWD systems are created equal either. However, the one on the Sienna, while not quite as sophisticated as those made by Subaru AFAIK, is still a good one in that it operates "full-time" and not only when slippage is detected.

    Nevertheless, depending on one's needs, I don't agree that AWD would be chosen by the majority if available. Based on EPA estimates, which are considered OK for comparative purposes, an AWD Sienna will use 16% more fuel (highway) and 11% more fuel (city) than a 05 Odyssey with VCM. That is a substantial difference and would likely be enough to keep those with marginal need for AWD away.

    In addition, it's a bit hard for me to understand judgments being made about the relative differences between an AWD Sienna and an Odyssey with traction/stability control given that no one has actually driven the Odyssey.
  • andrewtran71andrewtran71 Member Posts: 840
    That's precisely why we need an Acura or Lexus minivan.
    Give people the ULTIMATE minivan they desire and everyone deserves:-)
    Throw in HID, Laser Cruise, Woodtrim, Gated shifter, CHROME, more CHROME, and even more chrome:-)

    But seriously, yeah, who would complain about having AWD? Who would complain about having more features as long as it's only $500?
  • heywood1heywood1 Member Posts: 851
    This marginal difference in MPG doesn't matter to me, especially when you consider how much BETTER gas mileage my AWD Sienna gets compared to a big SUV.

    If the small penalty in gas mileage keeps somone from buying AWD, the tail is wagging their dog--and they probably shouldn't be buying a $30,000+ vehicle in the first place.
  • heywood1heywood1 Member Posts: 851
    Have you considered changing your forum name to 'andrewchrome71'?
  • lumbarlumbar Member Posts: 421
    I would not think it would matter to someone who lives in an area of the country where there is a demonstrable use for AWD, particularly given the gas guzzling alternatives. However, that wasn't the issue. The issue was whether a "majority" of people would opt for it were it available at a reasonable price. IMO, the significant difference in gas mileage alone could dissuade many in warmer climates, which, after all, is where lots of people live.
  • rrshinnrrshinn Member Posts: 16
    I'm disappointed that a 38K Minivan doesn't have a power passenger seat and a coin box. Has anyone checked the upper glove box for a coin tray? Anyone seen the Olive interior?
  • bamacarbamacar Member Posts: 749
    Here in northern Alabama, even Explorers and Highlanders are sold about 90-95% with 2WD. Go about 150 miles north and the number is reverse in favor of 4wd. If the Odyssey had an option for AWD, it would not sell very well here at all. I have never even seen a Sienna with AWD here. The local dealer has 47 Siennas on the lot or on the way and not a single one has AWD. When your average annual snowfall in a year is a trace, AWD is not usually worth the many disadvantages.
  • heywood1heywood1 Member Posts: 851
    I didn't say anything about a majority. Someone else brought that up. And I agree, a majority of people wouldn't buy it. Still, I'll bet a significant minority would.
  • heywood1heywood1 Member Posts: 851
    More AWD bashing from the Honda faithful. AWD is useful in rainy conditions, as well--not just snowfall.
  • anonymouspostsanonymousposts Member Posts: 3,802
    With a 300HP engine tuned for performance the RL had to be either RWD or AWD to eliminate torque steer. Since Honda doesn't seem to wanna go to RWD in it's sedans yet that left them with AWD.

    If Honda does offer AWD I will not start saying how awesome they are for doing it nor would I buy an AWD Odyssey. Especially if I am living in the same area at that time. Eventually I am going to have to relocate for my work. If I move into the snow belt I would prefer an AWD vehicle but plenty of people make it up there with FWD and a good set of snow tires. I'm sure there are even Mustangs, Camaros, and other RWD vehicles up there as well.

    I drove home in the remnants of Hurricane Ivan last Thursday in our 03 Civic Si with 17" high-performance tires and I made it home just fine. If you adjust your driving for conditions AWD is still not a necessity. In fact, it probably gives people a false sense of security leading to higher speeds which might lead to more accidents if they are an inexperienced driver.
  • carguy1234carguy1234 Member Posts: 233
    Where AWD really helps is getting up the driveway. If you have an incline, and have to stop part way up, then FWD even with traction control can be a problem since all the weight is below you. Then you need the rear wheels to push.

    Anytime you have to stop on a steep incline that is iced over can be problematic for FWD.

    I'm 'in the snow belt' as anonomous puts it. With my current non-traction control FWD vehicle, I have to get a running start to make it up the driveway half the winter it seems like. With my wifes AWD, I can stop it half way up, and sit there, and then take right off again and finish going up. That's the difference.
  • andrewtran71andrewtran71 Member Posts: 840
    I'm not that creative.
    But I guess if length permits, I would be "AndrewChromeWoodNavGatedshifterLasercruise71".

    But at least it's not as bad as "hansienna", which is really funny since he liked the Ody better than the Sienna, and ended up buying a Chrysler T&C !!!!!
  • tripmomtripmom Member Posts: 5
    I'd like to thank everyone for their input on the AWD/FWD issue. I asked the original question yesterday, and after reading everything, I am going with the Odyssey. I prefered it in every way over the Sienna (have driven both), except for the AWD. From responses, I get the feeling the AWD just makes an incremental difference in a few situations. I will be happier 99% of the time in Odyssey, I believe. I think the traction control will be enough.

    One other question--I am planning on getting the Touring model. Has anyone driven it yet? How are the tires? Just wondering about these Michelin PAX tires. Any difference in feel when driving? Any idea about replacement cost since the car does not come with a spare?
  • kixokixo Member Posts: 35
    From Honda's web site:

    "The 2005 Odyssey is available in four distinct and well-equipped trim levels: LX, EX, EX with Leather, and the new Touring. Additionally, EX with Leather models can be equipped with the Honda DVD Rear Entertainment System (RES) or with RES and Honda's Satellite-Linked Navigation System. Touring models are available with DVD Rear Entertainment System and Navigation System."

    It seems an Odyssey with just NAVI (and no RES) is no longer an option. I wonder if Honda made this decision based on slow sales of the '04 and previous years' EX-L with NAVI.

    It's also maybe why Honda came out with a special '04 model: Honda EX cloth with DVD. It may have had excess inventory of the RES systems.
  • onboost91onboost91 Member Posts: 86
    Can anyone confirm that the small 8th seat does indeed fold into the floor? I stopped by a dealer yesterday and the salesman told me it did not. He said you had to remove it totally which contradicts some of what I have read in here.

    Thanks!
  • tripmomtripmom Member Posts: 5
    The 8th seat has to be removed and can be stored in the floor between the 2 second row seats. It does not fold into the floor.
  • weaselinsuitweaselinsuit Member Posts: 78
    Can't say that I have much experience with toyota but my parents have and their vehicles were always great. We currently have two hondas, a 91 civic (it just won't die dammit0 and a 97 accord, and have been extremely pleased with both. I think, as others have alluded to, there will be problems and pleasures with both makes, you just have to choose the one that fits you best.
  • heywood1heywood1 Member Posts: 851
    IMO, All-wheel-drive makes more than an incremental difference--depending on where you live.

    As I have previously posted here, the PAX system is priorative technology. You will not be able to use any other brand, or--unlike AWD Sienna run-flats--mount conventional tires if you wish to later on. So Honda & Michelin will be shooting fish in a barrel come replacement time, and their dealers will be forcing you to swim up to the gun. Hold onto your wallet.
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    FWD (or RWD) + decent tires + stability control = more than enough.

    And Vehicle Stability Assist is standard in Odysssy (all trims).
  • anonymouspostsanonymousposts Member Posts: 3,802
    Cost for a replacement PAX tire will be within 15% of the cost for a normal tire. Additionally, according to Michelin they have a program in place that provides delivery of a PAX tire to any dealer within 12 hours while providing rental car compensation as well as lodging accomodations if necessary. Only problem is that they do not yet have a snow tire to work with the PAX system. However, they are working on a snow tire that would work with the special wheel design.

    The solution is easy though if you do not like the PAX sytem. You can have the dealer include a normal set of wheels and tires as part of your deal. Or you can probably get a cheap set off of ebay as well.
  • 65times65times Member Posts: 20
    If you use the in floor storage for the 8th seat you must first remove the lazy suasn storage tray. Both items fit into the same space however, there is not enough room for both to be stored at the same time.
  • andrewtran71andrewtran71 Member Posts: 840
    OOH. So the question is, how much are those PAX tires and how long do they normally last?
    40K miles, 60K miles, 80K miles?
  • gee35coupegee35coupe Member Posts: 3,387
    use on the Accord, you can expect up to 60- 80,000 miles if you rotate religously. I know we had a set go 40,000 miles and still looked like new.
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    To be honest, I haven't seen many AWD Town & Countrys, Siennas, Astros or Grand Caravans.
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