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Here is another website of unhappy Toyota owners about the techniques used, or not used, to keep owners informed about problems. It was started November 10, 2009.
http://sites.google.com/site/toyotav6oillinescandal/
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It's getting more and more difficult to find quality products anywhere. Everybody seems to be intent on cutting corners as much as possible.
Why don't we keep stuff like that in that thread, where it belongs?
At least we aren't including the Chrysler twins in the discussion or else we'd not hear about anything but their mechanical problems. Both Toyota and Honda have well earned quality reputations and both, unfortunately, are willing to take some not quite ethical actions to keep those reputations from getting tarnished.
Lots of room for improvement, from every single minivan:
http://www.iihs.org/news/rss/pr111809.html
Chrysler Town & Country
Honda Odyssey
Kia Sedona
Toyota Sienna
you will see the following:
Roof strength test results
No roof strength tests have been conducted for this vehicle.
To get a Top Safety Pick, you must score Good on this (rollover). Since none have been tested, none can get a Top Safety Pick.
Until these tests get "real" about what happens in the real world, you have to take these ratings with a huge grain of salt!
I guess they're different than Consumer Reports.
CR will recommend a vehicle until/unless it fails a test.
I guess IIHS will only name a Top pick after it passes all tests.
I still think it's important, though. A manufacturer can "cheat" and design a safety cage to perform well for a specific test, i.e. at a specific speed, or angle, or height.
This test is new so noone cheated. Those 27 cars have solid pillars/roof structures even before they knew IIHS would be measuring that.
Oops, meant to say "Vehicle Shield Package".
Vehicle Shield Package is probably a dealer package with Scotchguard, paint sealant, VIN etching, etc. Those are cash cows for the dealer and IMHO unnecessary.
Has the price gone up $800? I don't think so. In fact incentives are pretty good right now.
Whether it needs it or not! :P
this is the most uncomfortable car seat i have ever sat in.
i have tried every position i can and i constantly get a pain where my right leg meets my butt cheek.
has anyone else had this experience ???? did anything work to fix your problem?
thanks
Have you played with the cushion angles? I raise the front of the seat to provide extra thigh support.
Also, if you have power seats, check out the power lumbar support to make sure it's not intruding too much.
I live near a large auto auction site and the car detailers just multiplied unbelievably since they support the auction. I was able to get a complete detail, shampooing the carpets, wax, engine steam clean, etc, for $95.00 about a year ago.
just a little research on your part :shades:
If so, kudos to our hosts for having more recent information. :shades:
I currently own an Acura TL so I was favoring the Odyssey but decided to test drive them both and did like the way they both drove. The Odyssey seemed to drive a little tighter but the Sienna seemed to have a little better acceleration. There were things that we liked a little more on each but the Odyssey had the storage bins in the 2nd row but not much around the front area and the console between the driver and passenger seat looks cheap. The Sienna had a lot more storage in the driver and front passenger section but none in the back but did have built in sun shades which is a nice feature with children. I did like that Honda offered the vinyl/plastic covering for the back/trunk area that Toyota doesn't offer.
After looking at prices for comparable models, the Sienna was $3,500 - $4,000 cheaper than the Odyssey (Sienna XLE w/Package #3 vs. Odyssey w/RES) even though it seemed like Honda had a much higher inventory across the board when I last searched on 11/24/09. The only incentive that Honda has released was 1.9 % financing which is still not as good as the zero percent that Toyota is offering. That made the decision a lot easier considering we wouldn't be selling the car in 3 or 4 years but more than likely keeping it 7 or 8 and putting over 100,000 miles on the car. Since we planned on keeping it longer and driving it more than 100k miles, the resale factor on Odyssey was marginalized with keeping it for a while.
We ended up going from the Sienna XLE package #3 to the XLE #4 (Leather, DVD, Navigation, Back-up Camera, Satellite Radio, Wireless Headphones,Sonar/Front Intuitive Parking Assist, Toyoguard Protection plus, 17 Inch 7 spoke alluminum alloy, JBl Synthethis Speakers) and still ended up paying $1,600 less than what we would have paid with an Odyssey RES with no additional upgrades.
In these times, the additional $3.5 - $4k in my pocket on top of paying zero percent from a financing standpoint as opposed to even a low 1.9% offered from Honda makes a big difference.
ALG rates both of these vans as having 3-star residual value, so any difference isn't very significant. A Hyundai Entourage would have been a concern, with just 1-star residuals.
Our 2006 Sienna LE will not pick up stations driving across southern Nevada and Mojave Desert of southern California which our less expensive 2002 Chrysler T&C LX received clearly.
Tonight, our Sienna radio quit working while I was listening to a football game enroute to attend a wedding reception. Tried the FM radio - dead. Same with CD player. No sound system in any previous vehicle quit with less than 32,000 miles on the odometer.
The radio in my sister's 2001 Ody EX with 113,000 miles on the odometer and my daughter's 1999 GC SE with 123,000 miles on the odometer still work. Toyota reliability is a sorry, sick joke.
Your problem is unfortunate, but statistically insignificant.
As you said earlier "the Odyssey is the MOST expensive" (the all caps was your emphasis, not mine) so it's fair to expect a better interior, though not all of us agree with you.
You have an LE model, so why complain about the trim on a model that you didn't get? That makes no sense at all.
If people want to participate in the discussion and add constructive input and even criticism, that's fine.
To pop in and drop bombs out of the blue, especially when they contradict what that same person said earlier, is a shame, and we should not put up with it.
This is OK -> I'm having trouble with my stereo, does someone have the 800 # that I can call, or has someone found a fix?
And by the way that belongs in the appropriate problems thread.
This is not OK -> my single van has a bad stereo therefore Toyota is THE DEVIL and all vans are going to explode and kill all occupants in less than 24 hours so sell your van NOW!!!!111eleven!!
Another thing - this user had the name "hansienna" and changed to "toyojunk", and I believe hiding your identity in such a manner is against Edmunds' rules.
So yes, I am passionate about outing dishonesty like that. :shades:
Just messin with ya Juice... :shades:
It is good to keep refuting him, but try not to get too peeved- I am sure he gets a perverse satisfaction at getting tweaking people.
Now that I've set everyone straight on that issue, been researching vans and came across an interesting option. Chevy/gmc makes an awd full size van with seating for 8 that msrp's in the low 30's. Airbags all around. Lots of space for sure. May check those out in a few years. Mpg is low of course but if you don't drive much like me not much of an issue.
I kid, and should probably let it go...
The full-size "church vans" you're talking about have been around forever. Is there even a discussion for those?
This thread has been informative to shoppers for both of these vans. I didn't know the EX-L got a power tailgate until someone here told me. Too late for me but useful for new shoppers.
Looks good. Butch Sienna meets Venza, with Corolla-ish headlights.
They're going to offer the big 4 banger from the Venza as an engine option. Even though I'd still get the V6, people have been asking for a fuel miser alternative. +1 mpg city, +2 mpg highway.
Still, hauling all that mass, I'd want the V6.
19" rims. Mama-mia. Overkill?
They mention an "ample use of wood" but I wonder if it'll be the real stuff. It does warm up that interior.
2nd row leg rests are to die for. I hope the 8 seat option doesn't disappear.
16" LCD screen is another "wow" option. That'll make my 12" one seem small. Time for an upgrade?
Honda has the upper hand, now. They've seen the new Sienna, and may have enough time to adjust/respond to these upgrades. When is the new Ody due? I wonder if the design is already finalized.
I remember when the latest Civic came out, Toyota went back and made more changes to the new Corolla in response to it.
They'll keep the 8 seat model, phew.
There's a pic of it in there. The middle seat is not as big, but the outer seats get armrests, so hansienna's #1 complaint is addressed.
6 speed automatic for both engines.
Looks nice.