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Porsche 911

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  • royalfunkroyalfunk Posts: 2
    thanks habitat 1.

    has any one installed a clear bra?
    I did some research, its a 3M product and basically is a clear laminate.

    Let me know how it looks and if you would suggest one for protection of the nose of the car.
  • 1sttimer1sttimer Posts: 4
    I have owned my 997 cab for 9 months, black.. i should have purchased a clear bra the first day i owned it but didn't ... now i have some small chips, i purchased on after 2 months... they look fine, you can tell but i'ts better than a reg bra
  • Guys, I have a 996 with the roof lined in I think suede. How do I clean it and condition it?
  • tomtomtomtomtomtom Posts: 491
    If you really want to get some detail information on them, you may want to check out rennlist
  • blckislandguyblckislandguy Posts: 1,150
    I had a clear polyvinyl bra installed on my '05 Cayenne on day 1 and think it was the best $700 I ever spent. Not only does it cover the front 1/3 of the car but also by the fuel tank fill area , etc.

    I checked out several firms that sell these things and they all were basically one man franchies operated by car detailers. The bras come in stages from simply a roll of plastic to pre cut pieces for various body parts that you could install or have an installer install. I willingly and knowingly paid more to have my Porsche dealer (Porsche of Nashua, NH) arrange to have it done by his local contractor because if anything went wrong I would have some recourse. Nothing went wrong. With their Porsche experience they even counselled me NOT to have the mirrors done because it generates wind noise (?). I think this is one thing you don't want to cheap-out on. Bring it to the right guy, have it done professionally and then enjoy the car.

    Now that I am mentioning money, I think that this might be a good bargaining point in buying a new car. "OK, I'll pay your price, but throw in the clear vinly bra treatment." The sales guy should know that his internal cost is a lot less than "list" so they can call this a $700 concession knowing it only might cost them $450. Habitat1, I think I'll even try this on the Chrono clock and 19" wheels you want this 61 year old guy to buy: "OK, I'll order the clock and the wheels but throw in ..."!
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    Habitat1, I think I'll even try this on the Chrono clock and 19" wheels you want this 61 year old guy to buy: "OK, I'll order the clock and the wheels but throw in ..."!

    Say what? I've been an advocate of the sport-chrono as a cheap way to get the feel of a more responsive quicker car, but I'm not advocating 19" wheels for a base Carerra.

    As a matter of fact, when you start adding xenons, 19" wheels and PASM to a base Carerra, I believe the "S" makes more sense. So keep those 18" wheels with my blessing! ;)
  • padrefanpadrefan Posts: 1
    Hi. I am new to Porsche. I have been a BMW owner for over 12 years but can't stand the "bangle butt" and "flame" designs of the new BMWs. So, my M3 is now 4 years old and I am ready to move on. I am looking at a C2. I was wondering what people's experience is in the real world on discounts on new 911 C2s? Also, are there any pitfalls I should be aware of? I am so familiar with what you need to ask on BMWs that I feel a little exposed walking in to a Porsche dealer not knowing what I need to know (i.e., options I need to make sure the car has, things to avoid, etc.). Any help would be appreciated!!
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,527
    I think you'll be pretty comfortable with the pricing structure if you've owned BMWs, because Porsche uses the same kind of teaser "tier pricing" on options so that you always want to add things :P You need to exercise restrain on the options list or you could end up scaring yourself. My list shows about 170 different options (of course, some conflict with others, some are trivial aesthetic items etc.) My two cents? REALLY do your homework on the options before you sign anything...especially get a look at the various trim packages.

    Gee here's an aerokit for a mere $6,990. And I wonder what that $240 clothes hook looks like?

    MODERATOR

  • kyingkying Posts: 61
    There is a Chinese saying, "different flowers enter different eyes," if you know what I mean. We were Audi owners until we saw Chris Bangle's "new" 5-series. In addition to the Targa and the C4, we have owned a 2004 530i for more than two years now. I love that car, inside and out. When we want some quiet time while driving, we get into the 530i.

    Back to Porsche: IMHO, only two options are really needed for us: (1) Xenon is a must; C2 and C4 only come with halogen lamps. (2) Seat package is great if two drivers share the car often.

    Things to avoid will be different for different people/tastes. For example, I always try to avoid the navigation system, because I won't use it. I tried to avoid the Sport Chrono package too, but I might try it next time since habitat1 has highly recommended it.

    I was told by my salesperson in S. Cal a couple months ago that since there are so few C2s around, especially ones with minimal options, he was selling them at sticker price. I think he was really exaggerating, but I also think you won't get as much a discount (%-wise) as you would for a C4S Cab. We got our 2006 C-4 with 7.6% off sticker about a month ago.
  • JingleJillJingleJill Posts: 120
    I need some advice or someone's opinion...

    My husband and I went looking at the Cayman's to decide what options, etc... we would want if we decided to order one, etc...

    Well, the salesman also showed us a CPO 2003 Red 911 Carrera Coupe with only 11k miles. It is 6spd, upgraded wheels (I forget which ones), sport exhaust, heated seats, bose, red stiching on the seats, porsche crests in the headrests. For the most part, minimal on the options. It drove beautifully... They just performed the 15k service and put new tires on the rear. Anyways, they are asking $57,000. ("red tag sale"...)

    Any thoughts or suggestions?

    Thanks,

    Stacy
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,527
    One thing: check on the particulars of the CPO plan, and what happens exactly after factory warranty runs out and the CPO part kicks in. You may be paying a deductible on repairs as well as facing a formidable list of exclusionary items. Read this over carefully. This might be available on the Porche factory website. I know it is on the BMW site. BMWs CPO plan has a $50 deductible, doesn't cover normal maintenance services, and doesn't cover a list of what they call "expendables".

    MODERATOR

  • dweiserdweiser Posts: 288
    I own a 911 and love it but I'm not sure I'd buy a used Porsche. I'd buy new if at all possible but that's just my 2 cents. Many Porsche owners trade or sell their vehicles when facing the end of the 4 year warranty because they know how expensive repairs can be.
  • hotrod88hotrod88 Posts: 17
    Never thought I would wash the inside of the wheels, but during it's first bath, I reached between the spokes of my new 911S and washed the dirt off the inside of the rims. What other crazy places do you guys wash? What about under the engine, transmission, wheel wells? How often do you wash your Porsche, and wax (I haven't waxed a car in 10 years!)
    What do you dry it with - I just use a beach towel.
    rod.... :)
  • dweiserdweiser Posts: 288
    Hi hotrod88,
    Owners of P-cars run the gamut I'm afraid with some nearing what I would call "close to the lunatic fringe" about keeping their vehicles looking nice but it stems from their love of their cars so who can blame them. My first advice, ditch the beach towel, this ain't a 10 year old Chevy you're talking about keeping clean. You really should get some microfiber drying towels for your P-car. You didn't state what color she is but the darker the color, the more you need to protect against self-induced swirls and scratches. Ask 50 P-car owners what they use to wash/wax their cars and you're likely to get 50 different answers. I like this guy's products if I'm allowed to say it here:
    http://www.adamspolishes.com/
    Good luck & enjoy your car,
    Don
    p.s. Some use an electric leaf blower to dry their cars. As Dave Barry says, "I am NOT making this up".
    :)
  • JingleJillJingleJill Posts: 120
    Knock Knock Everyone,

    I've come across a beautiful Guards Red 2003 911 Carerra Coupe. It has 11.5k miles, 6 spd, 18in light carerra alloy wheels, power seat package, xenons, heated seats, bose high end system, sports exhaust system, porsche crest in headrest, red stitching on the seats, and black mats with lettering... Price is $56k. Also is CPO'd until August 2009.

    ALso, they just performed the 15k service and put new rear tires on it...

    Opinions, advice, etc...

    Thanks,

    Stacy
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,527
    Sounds okay, retail price, not a bargain not a rip. Miles are nice.

    MODERATOR

  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    At first, it sounded like a good deal. But a friend of mine just ordered a 2007 911 Coupe, well equiped ($9,000 in options) and he's getting it for $76,000 ($6,000 +/- discount).

    Now $20,000 isn't anything to sneeze at. But neither is the difference between a 4 year old 996 and a brand new 997. If it were me, I'd go with the latter, low mileage and CPO benefit notwithstanding. But I realize others look at it differently.
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,458
    I saw a 997 911 Turbo driving around Pittsburgh this weekend. It is simply drop dead gorgeous!

    JingleJill. I'm givng my advice as someone who dreams about Porsches (among other cars). Normally I'd say that $56K is A LOT of money to be spending on a used car. So the Practical side says go for a Cayman. But from what I've read, 996s are pretty solid cars. You'll have to drive it and see if YOU like it more than the Cayman. Can yuo get a bigger discount than what the red tag says?

    2001 Honda Prelude Type SH/ 2011 BMW 328xi / 2011 Honda Pilot EX-L w/ Navigation

  • chile96chile96 Posts: 330
    I used to have a car very similar to the red one you are considering buying and I traded it in last October for $51,000 so take that what you will. Mine had about 20K miles and was in pristine condition(it was black so i HAD to be obsessive!)

    My local Porsche GM confided in me that the CPO warranty is pretty crappy BUT why I got it with my turbo is that it protects you against the BIG things like trannies, rear main seal oil leaks, blown engines from blown seals, etc. I think there may be a small deductible - not sure. Just keep in mind that all scheduled maintenance MUST be documented and done on time or PCNA will find away to get out of the warranty.

    Even though it's CPO'd, I can't recommend this strong enough - take the car to another Porsche dealership or an independent mechanic with extensive porsche knowlege and get a pre-purchase inspection. It'll cost you $150-200 but it's well worth it. I almost bought a CPO turbo that had some big issues. Yeah, it would have been covered by the mfr's warranty but who wants a car with issues and then having to spend time in service rather than out on the twisties??? Basically their CPO inspection does not mean anything except put new tires on it, oil or brake fluid change and a nice detail job.

    ALSO, very important. Get the VIN and have the service mgr/writer run a warranty repair history on the vehicle. Any warranty repair history done in the US will show up. Don't let them tell you that they can't pull it up because they can. The service guys here are friends of mine and they have done it on several cars that I've purchased/considered purchasing. There is not a charge for that. It will give you a good idea of how "dependable" the car has been and hopefully will be.

    Sorry to not just tell you go buy it but Porsche can be problematic if not taken care of so do your homework up front so you can enjoy it later :blush:

    Happy to answer any other questions.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,527
    The 996 is prone to rear main seal leakage, so by all means have it checked out, CPO or not. Good advice!

    MODERATOR

  • JingleJillJingleJill Posts: 120
    Thank you for the advice everyone...

    I understand having to take care of a Porsche. We have a 1986 911 Carerra Cab.

    We actually went to the dealership looking at Caymans. We drove a Cayman and then drove the Red 911. We decided we should go for a 911. A 911 we would keep, I think the Cayman might get old after a while.

    I agree that $56k is a lot to spend on a used car; I totally agree. But, the 911's are adictive.

    We are still up in the air.

    I'm thinking I should be able to do better on that price of $56k also.

    Then I read where some people think I can get 10-15% off MSRP on a new one if I shop around. That is very tempting also...

    If that darn Cayman had a back seat... ARGGGGHHHHHH
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,527
    One issue to consider is that any high end car will take a further though not major depreciation hit once the NEXT iteration hits the streets in numbers, because then there's the "next new thing" out there. So new models depress the value of the model before, until the old model becomes old enough to be interesting again. Unfortunately, sellers of the last model don't want to be the first to experience this depreciation and they are perhaps priced too close to the new model. Then, people like you start comparing and going, "hmmmmm......"

    MODERATOR

  • blckislandguyblckislandguy Posts: 1,150
    Anyone toying with the idea of picking up a car at the factory should read the long link at Post #16886 (June 30, 2006) on the High End Luxury Marque site here on Edmunds.

    This early adopter picked up a Cayman S with his son at the factory. Very early on they had a problem with the flywheel bolts. This is apparently very common on the early Caymans. The factory personnell were not at all sympathetic, didn't return calls (he spoke to 17 people in 48 hours), and he was as good as stranded for these two days. Unfortunately, no one at the factory took ownership of the problem and would help him get the car fixed. Because the guy speaks German he was able to pick up a strong anti-US bias in factory personnel. Apparently the mid level people at Porsche don't realize that the war is over and we , who work a full 12 months a year, won.

    While I've had a great dealership experience with Porsche here in NA, I do see the above attitude coming thru loud and clear in several ways. Take the option list. While a 911 has a list of 71K, no one in their right mind would want one that way for that kind of money. At 71K you don't get leather, power seats, NAV, a rear wiper---this must be a joke, right?, only four basic colors to choose from, etc. etc. So the stripper gets loaded up with 20K worth of stuff that everyone else throws in for free. (Compare the features on a XK Coupe with a list of 74K if in doubt). These Germans play rough.
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,458
    From what you describe, that guy who picked up his new Cayman S via European Delivery (ED) really got the short end of the stick. I can't speak for the anti-US sentiment in Germany because I've never been there. It shouldn't matter if the guy and his son were from Zimbabway; there was a problem with the car and it should have been fixed. Most of the ED experiences I've read about are BMWs and have never heard one negative comment.

    I think the fact that Porsche essentially lets YOU customize every aspect of your 911 (Cayman, Boxster, Cayenne) is wonderful. I wish more carmakers would do this. Now granted I'm no where near in my right mind :P but I don't want power seats (manual adjustments work just fine for me, & it is one less thing to break down the road), I certainly don't want a NAV system. I'll take leather & a rear wiper. That Sport Chrono Package might come in handy as well as a set of those beautiful 19" Carrera S wheels. A Sunroof is standard (I love sunroofs)! I happen to like Carrera White (standard color), but if I'm spending $70 something thousand dollars on a car, a few extra hundred to get the color I want isn't going to kill me. I'm not going to comment on the 911 vs. XK8 coupe because this isn't the forum for that. The XK8 isn't offered with a manual transmission, so there is no comparison to be made.

    2001 Honda Prelude Type SH/ 2011 BMW 328xi / 2011 Honda Pilot EX-L w/ Navigation

  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    While a 911 has a list of 71K, no one in their right mind would want one that way for that kind of money. At 71K you don't get leather, power seats, NAV, a rear wiper---this must be a joke, right?,

    There are a lot of reasons to talk yourself out of a Porsche. I talked myself out of a Boxster S in 2002 in favor of a $25k less expensive Honda S2000. And I had no regrets.

    But I similarly have no regrets for dishing out nearly three times as much for a 911S Cabriolet in 2005. And, while the S2000 is perhaps the best sports car from Japan and a legitimate competitor to the Boxster, there really is "no substitute" for the 911 - especially if you plan to use those little back seats like I have.

    You can choose to get bent out of shape that Porsche's option list is a mile long. The S2000 had 0 options. But I would respectfully suggest that you avoid comparing a 911 with a XK, AMV8, BMW M6, or any other car before you spend serious seat time in each. I may not have fully appreciated the 911 after my first month and 1,000 miles, but there is no way I could switch to one of those cars now. You might also want to put it in a historical perspective. The 2007 911 Turbo is cheaper than the 1995 Turbo was. And the 2007 911S outperforms the 1995 Turbo. It's a very good time to be in the market for a 911, extra charge rear wiper notwithstanding.
  • designmandesignman Posts: 2,129
    While a 911 has a list of 71K, no one in their right mind would want one that way for that kind of money. At 71K you don't get leather, power seats, NAV, a rear wiper---this must be a joke, right?, only four basic colors to choose from, etc. etc. So the stripper gets loaded up with 20K worth of stuff that everyone else throws in for free.

    The 911, Cayman and Boxster are about steering, handling, suspension and drivetrain. Anyone who buys them for any other reason is wasting their money. People like to project luxury onto them and Porsche obliges. It seems that many Porsche buyers think they are somehow getting shortchanged by not slathering on options. I don’t see it that way. Porsche provides an impeccable sports car without one option added. I don’t care what other manufacturers throw in for free, they are not Porsches. Paying the piper for a Porsche is nothing new.

    I think plenty of people buy Porsches for reason other than what I just mentioned only to find out soon enough that the car is not for them, it’s too feral, as if they weren’t expecting a sports car. I have a friend who has three cars, a Cayenne S, a Mercedes S500 and a 911. He and his wife had to get rid of the 911 because the ride was just too hard and it wore them out. They replaced it with an SL.

    You have to crave the ride, that’s where the value is. The options are no substitute and anyone who looks to them for some kind of solace will not own a Porsche sports car for long. They are so-o-o secondary in this ownership experience IMO.
  • designmandesignman Posts: 2,129
    You might also want to put it in a historical perspective. The 2007 911 Turbo is cheaper than the 1995 Turbo was. And the 2007 911S outperforms the 1995 Turbo. It's a very good time to be in the market for a 911, extra charge rear wiper notwithstanding.

    Excellent point. I would also add that you get more with an 07 Boxster S as compared with a 96 Carrera, and eleven years later it costs approximately $9K less. To put it in further perspective those 993s are still very sought after cars and their resale is tip-top, not that Boxster resale is anything to write home about.
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    The 911, Cayman and Boxster are about steering, handling, suspension and drivetrain. Anyone who buys them for any other reason is wasting their money.

    Amen....

    ...but just in case anyone out there is wondering about gas mileage, I just returned from a trip to our second home (360 miles each way). I averaged 25.6 mpg going (including 15 miles off-highway) and 26.7 on the return trip at an overall average speed of 71 (up to 85-90 on a couple of short stretches). My wife and kids left and returned earlier in our MDX and averaged 20.5 mpg for the same route.

    P.S. I pity somebody that replaces a 911 with a slushbox, slush-chassis SL because they find the ride "too hard". But, to each their own. I also have golfing buddies who buy a new $500 gallon-sized titanium/uranium driver every spring and then shudder when I suggest we actually play a 7,000 yard course from the tips. If I get to that point my wife has instructions to have my life support removed.
  • decisions1decisions1 Posts: 17
    WOW!! I imagine this magnificient 11+ mile stretch of twisting turning road - the Tail of the Dragon - has been a topic of discussion before, but I had never heard of it until I happened to find myself vacationing very close by last week along the southern border of the Smokey Mountains. Fortunately, I had my new C4S handy and had just recently topped 2000 miles on the odometer, so I was able to fully enjoy myself with several runs on a couple of different days. Dweiser, I take it you've had the opportunity to experience this thing? It's difficult for me to imagine a better stretch of road to experience the FULL handling capabilities of a 911, gotta be one of the top 5 best public road stretches in the world to test your porsche, if not THE best.

    Also, the good word is that the car seemed to top everything on the road! It was mostly various motorcycles making the runs (aka, crotch rockets I'm told), and I initially thought there would be no way the 997 could hang with some of those boys. But, I drove behind a couple of different rocket groups, and honestly, I had to hold back 15-20% to keep from running up on them through the turns. :surprise: I was pushing that much harder when I had the road to myself! 2 different beemers were not even close. ;) Fantastic experience, it'll reinforce your original purchase decision (as if); not that I had time to look at myself in the rearview, but I do know I had a wall-to-wall grin on my face during half of each run (I also seem to recall feeling a stretched facial expression of terror the other half of the time!). Do try it if you ever get out that way (just google tail of the dragon); hopefully, will get some cool pictures to share.

    Regards.
  • dweiserdweiser Posts: 288
    Thanks very much for posting your drives on "The Tail of the Dragon" decisions1. I must (sheepishly) confess that although I live in the area (I'm in western NC) I've not made it over to "The Dragon" yet in my C4 Cab BUT I MUST!! Here are some URLs of it including one (last URL) from a Cayman driver.
    http://www.tailofthedragon.com/
    http://www.tailofthedragon.com/dragon.html
    http://www.mensjournal.com/adventure/0608/road_tennessee.html
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