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Comments
It does take a little to become accustomed to it because as a DBW system any small twitch or movement sends a signal to the steering actuators to make a movement. There is no 'play' in the system.
OTOH on an open road I've tried driving up to a quarter of a mile with no hands on the wheel to see how the Prius tracks. With no outside intervention it's dead straight.
Mack
But Mackabee makes an excellent point. It did have VSC on the car. I'm handing this down to my daughter so I wanted that feature. You think that's my problem?! It's either that or the Civic EX. I test drove that and it had Electric Steering - no problem, I was waiting for the 2009 to come out with the rumored VSC and Traction control. Now I'm wondering if that will generate the same issues in the Civic
BTW, many cars today have electronic steering. But not all have a problem with steering feel. But it is actually fairly easy to correct, since it is electronic. I remember reading about a review of the then-new 2007 Elantra by the Australian press. They blasted it for lack of steering feel. Some Hyundai engineers flew in and made some adjustments that greatly improved the steering, and they supposedly applied those changes across the board. So if this kind of tweaking is possible on the Corolla, it may not be something a dealer can do, but may be relatively easy for Toyota to make an ongoing change (maybe even apply it retroactively through a TSB) if they get enough complaints about it.
Essentially in an out-of-control situation the EPS limits the ability to turn in the wrong direction exacerbating a skid and assists in turning into the skid to minimize it. It can only be done on vehicles with EPS/VSC/ABS.
Mack
Just picked up an LE w/VSC, pref pack (bumper protector, mats) yest. Test drove it and Prius but decided to use diff for son's college tuition instead :-) Dealer had 4 LEs with VSC, if I remember right, when I chose a red one.
Live in Central NJ and bought from a dealer here who reported they've stopped discounting since I bought (?); and that they are almost sold out of Corollas and 4 cyl. Camrys. I've had two Corollas before, a 2 dr 1980 and a five door hatch (1988 I think).
My impressions after 50 miles on backroads to and from work: I like the pick up--not great but better than I expected; see what people are saying about steering, but feels like it just takes getting used to as others said. Fit and finish seem OK--don't like the center dash (black) texture--while they wipe off, appearance changes w/any contact. Radio seems easy to use though sound on basic stereo (4 spkrs) not so good; better playing my iPod, which has been adjusted, tone wise.
I LOVE how quiet it is; I passed a 98 Camry onto my son, and maybe it's just age of car, but feels much quieter...Mileage, if the seven in one display is believed, was 32 on my first run to work.
Two beefs: why did Toyota get rid of the handy sunglasses holders (my Camry and 02 Sienna had them--2 on the Sienna--and I love them!).
Second, why/when did Toyota drop the visor extenders?
Third nitpick: the hook in the front right for a bag seems too low to the floor to do any good.
Fourth/final: 30 bucks for a spare key? Might be less, salesman said he'd get me one at cost? I know it's got the chip in it for the passive security sys...
So, overall, these nits aside, it seems very nice and comfortable; have to learn the 'pump' for the driver seat, but I have a bad back and the seat is nice so far (we'll see after I take a longer trip...). The quiet and gas mileage made the sale for me.
A neighbor just downgraded from an Explorer to a Subaru Impreza--nice looking, and AWD is nice, but 22 MPG? I'm with my 32plus.
HR
That saturday while I was waiting for him to come in and the car to be inspected another customer asked me about the Prius.; I told him I was waiting for a customer to come by and buy it. After they came in and he saw what was going on I went and told him the car might be sold. He gave me his name and number and asked to be called if the deal fell through. I called him sunday and we met at the store at 12 noon. I went through the whole process with him also only to have the wife in Fl nix the deal. So I wasted 2 hours of my time on Sunday, 3 and a half on Saturday and have nothing to show for it.
?
Mck
A couple of suggies; try adjusting the tone control on the radio to tailor the sound to your liking. Just push the "Tune" button and the bass, treble, balance, and fader adjustments come up. I've found the sound system to sound quite good. The JBL upgrade is even better.
Corolla never had sunglass holders.
The sun visor extenders were dropped on the Camry in 2002 .
The hook on the right side of the front is for ladies purses.
As far as the key is concerned, if you are getting the key with the remote features it will be more than 30 dollars. The non remote with the chip only key is more than 30 dollars as it has to be programmed to the car as the key with remote functions.
Mack
Mack
Here's my notes on the drive:
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.ef16b02/201
Now that I've had it over a week, I really like the car--low noise level, steering is fine for me (seems to be 'sportier' than others describe, but maybe my expectations are lower...?).
The multi display thing is REALLY annoying; the clock on the audio display would have been a good idea, or at least a small clock tucked into a niche on the dash by itself (like on my 98 Camry and 03 Sienna).
My MPG is a bit lower than expected, on mostly back road driving with mild stop and go at lights (it's back road NJ after all)--avg of 28. Even after a 40 mile each way trip to Philly for a ballgame, the MPG was only 32! Car still has less than 1000 miles on it, so maybe it'll get better.
Everyone's right about the elbow rest being too hard! All else is good, no complaints.
Re: Prius avail: salesman told me (for what that's worth) 3 mos delivery is now the norm; ALSO told me no more Corolla discounts (I got $1k off my LE with VSC, remote entry).
Anyone know why they switched the remote entry from a fob to the key? Darn key is SO big...
TTFN
HM
You are a wealth of information. Have you driven the 2008 Civic and if so, I wouldn't be interested in your thoughts.
Velde
Your fuel use is perfectly reasonable for this car and a green engine - it will improve at least 10% or more as the miles start to accumulate.
Mack
Mack
Mack
Before I got in the business I knew pretty much what I wanted. I would get brochures, CR, Consumer Guide, and the little Edmund's pocket books. I would narrow my choices to two vehicles and then I would begin my visit to the first dealer to test drive. I usually end up buying from the salesperson that treats us best.
I don't know if you ever read my story when I got back from Desert Storm and we were looking for a second car as the Toyota Van was not enough for two drivers. If things would have been different at the Honda dealer we went to I would be selling Hondas today. We were pretty much ignored when we pulled up. All the salespeople that were staring out of the showroom windows scrammed.
I looked and went around to open the door so the kids could get out and also open the passenger side for my wife. I made a comment to her about what I saw and she saw it too.
We walked to the lot and looked for the Accords. We found one with a manual tranny and we waited for a salesperson to come out. No one did. It was probably one of the hottest day in that summer so I told my wife I would go in and find a salesperson.
When I walked into the showroom there was one guy reading a magazine and another behind a counter that I assumed was a sales manager. I walked up to him and told him I was buying a car today and I had been on the lot for over 20 minutes and no salesperson had come out to assist us. He apologized and looked over to the guy reading a magazine.
"Hey Jack, this gentleman wants to look at a car." The guy got up and folded the magazine and came over. His expression made it seem like I had interrupted his dinner or something.
He came up and said "Which car you want to drive." more of a command than a question. I told him there was a bronze accord I wanted to test drive. "Show me where it is." he said. We walked out to the car and he copied a number and said he would go get the key. We waited another 10 minutes and he shows up with the key and a d-tag.
What happened next I will not forget for as long as I live. He unlocks the car and my three boys get in the back seat and buckle up. As my wife opens the front passenger door and is about to get in the car he stops her. "Oh no, I have to go with you on the test drive." he says. I looked at him and said to him "Where's my wife going to sit?" I asked, and this is what the moron said:
"Just throw her in the back seat with the kids"
:surprise: I could not believe my ears and my wife was so upset she stayed behind as I took this idiot on the ride of his life. Needless to say I didn't buy the Accord. On the was back to the dealer he asked which other cars I was considering. told him a Camry since we had already owned two Toyotas and they were bullet proof. He says to me "It looks like you already had your mind up on the Camry." and I replied: "No. This car was right up there too. Unfortunately the way you treated us makes me not want to come back to this dealership ever, See that woman standing outside the building? She has a pre-approved check in her purse. We are buying a car but not from you"
I got the kids and met my wife at the edge of the building, we got back in our car and I said to her: "Honey, if I ever get into car sales I hope that I don't treat anyone like this guy treated us."
Mack
Thoughts?
Great Story!
My own is similar and how ironic ( see below ).
1989 my former company promotes me and as an officer I'm entitled to choose any vehicle under $20000 which they will buy for me outright. I'm very hot to get an Accord at that time so my wife and I go to the local Accord store ( the three children are left with the oldest as the sitter ) in North Jersey and do the whole process...lambs to the slaughter so to speak. Well the '89 Accord was very very nice and I decided to buy it. We go inside and get everything written up and as we're going over the figures there's a $2500 surcharge in the vehicle price. Huh?
'What's that?' says the neophyte.
'Accords are the hottest vehicle on the market now. It's a market adjustment surcharge.' replies shark.
Til now we've been like George Halas as described by Mike Ditka; i.e. we threw around nickels like they were manhole covers. All our prior vehicles were purchased preowned. The only reason that this is a new one is that someone else is buying it for us. $2500 surcharge??? That brings this $18000 Accord to over $20,500 plus NJ taxes and fees.
'I'm not paying that.'
Now the kicker ala Mack's story.
'Well don't expect to go anywhere else and try to negotiate something better. We all talk to each other, ya know.' DING!!!!!!!!! [ thoughts of attacking slimebag scum-sucking shark are somehow repressed]
So I walk out the front door of the store across the parking lot shared with the Toyota store walk in the front door there. 'I want to test drive a Camry' 'Sure'. Cliff Notes: With an $800 discount off MSRP I drive away 2 hours later in my first new Camry at about $17500 +TTF.
Denoument: 10 Toyota's later [ 3 more Camrys, MR2 Spyder, Highlander, Prius, Solara Conv, Tacoma ( son ), Supra ( son ), Celica ( dtr ) ] I am now working in my retirement job on the other side of town from Mack selling Toyota's as he does.
I still haven't purchased my first Honda. I just enjoy keeping them well down in 3rd or 4th place.
Do you (or any other reader) know where I can find a softer console cover? Driving it every day now for two weeks it's a little elbow-numbing.
Again, these are all relatively trivial points; I really like the car. Hope the fellow who responded to me that the mpg will go up is right though...But I would like to be able to find a softer console cushion that doesn't look taped on...and a decent looking I pod holder I can attach too.
thanks everyone.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
This time around I got the Edmunds number on the purchase, but the trade was another matter. I traded down, but my third fill-up was 40mpg, and that was the whole point.
I live just South of Seattle. There are a good number of new Civic 2 and 4 doors on the road. There are TONS of Corollas. The reviews are nuetral at best, yet they are selling like hotcakes. The redesign has used a couple of lines that make the thing look lower and wider, and the nose is better looking, too. I think the Corolla is better looking than the Camry. Lastly, I wanted to buy a Saturn Astra, to support GM. I checked them out a couple times after they arrived. Didn't drive, just looked on the lot. I was impressed, and the 100,000 mi warranty was super. I traded an 18-19 month old Sienna, and went with the best gas mileage I could find, and it was cheaper by a couple thousand, or more, than the Astra. I do feel kinda bad. It was a bad financial deal to start with, and I just couldn't make it worse. Anyway, what I wanted to point out is this; I have seen ONE Astra in a parking lot, a little dirty, and with a lincense plate, so it was purchased by someone. That's it!!! Not a single one driving down the road. Any road, anywhere!
Thanks for the stories!!
I always ask if they like for me to come along in case they have some questions. 99% of the time they tell me to come along.
:shades:
I, like you, went to check out Astras recently because I had looked forward to their arrival eagerly. The EPA rating on the stick is 24/32, which is only a little worse than Civic/Corolla, and the drive was pretty nice. I wasn't moved to trade early, but I will keep them in mind next time I do trade. Also similar to you, I have yet to see ANY Astras on the roads here. It will be a shame for GM if this thing totally flops, as it is a car worthy of consideration. I would argue that it is at least as good a deal, and with a nicer interior and better moves on the road, than the '09 Matrix.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Just got back from a 790 mile road trip. Averaged 42 +, that's with 4 mountain passes, only one of which was on an Interstate. That's for my new home forums, I guess.
Your guess is as good as mine right now. We don't have any new Prius on the lot and there is/are none on our next month's allocation. I figure we might have seen the last of the 08's. The factory in Japan is gearing up (no pun intended) for the 09 which will have a slightly bigger power plant and Hybrid synergy drive system and is rumored to get 80mpg. Stay tuned. I'll post more when I get the scoop.
Mack
None of that is accurate on the Prius. The new 09's which will be here in Sept/Oct will be exactly the same as the 08s. Zero difference. It's the 2010 MY Prius' which will have the changes. These should arrive next summer, i.e. 14 months from now.
They will have a more powerful powerplant but they will get nowhere near 80 mpg. There may be a 10-20% improvement over the 48 mpg of the current Gen2's which would bring the effective fuel economy to 55-60 mpg for most drivers.
Check PriusChat...
Loser? The Corolla is whipping both the Mazda and Civic, and Sentra, and Aveo, Fit, etc.etc.etc....Loser?
:shades:
Mack
Looking for a loser...trying the new Ford truck.