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The Next Acura NSX !

lexi4lifelexi4life Posts: 181
I know Honda presented its HSC concept almost a year ago but we're now without any news since then! I wonder if Honda is currently testing its future supercar to finally present it as a 2006 model next fall? Anyway, I predict it's gonna get a new 3.8 V6 making around 350 hp. Let's hope it finally succeeds after 15 years of failure in its category!
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Comments

  • anythngbutgmanythngbutgm Posts: 4,180
    Huh? It is long overdue for replacement, but even today, it still holds its' own in the handling dept. and is still rock solid reliable, a term not usually associated with high-end supercars...
  • lexi4lifelexi4life Posts: 181
    Well I meant in terms of sales and perception from people... If it had really worked for Honda with the current NSX, I think they would've redone it at least twice since it was launched IN 1990! And at a price of 140000$ CAN it doesn't worth it at all. This car should've have been priced at maximum 80000$ CAN. In probably most of car buyers' heads, at 140000$, you have to get a V8 at least, even if the V6 offered is wonderful...
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    I don't think there will be a replacement at all. There have been many articles speculating that the NSX and even S2000 are done for. Honda doesn't have the money to keep up in this market. Porsche and Ferrari passed the NSX years and years ago.

    M
  • anythngbutgmanythngbutgm Posts: 4,180
    I think the new Lexus supercar will wake up Honda on that one. And with the Solstice/Sky and new Toyota roadster a la Supra (Edmunds future models) and a new Miata, Honda would be foolish to drop the S2K. I'm guessing a new "S" in the future.
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    Honda has been considering a new NSX replacement, but making a business case for it would be very difficult. The market for such a car is very small.

    The NSX more or less introduced us to VTEC. It served as a halo for the VTEC-powered cars that followed. It gave them something to race. But, unless Honda has something completely new up their sleeve, I doubt the next NSX could champion a technology which could also make it into the mass market.

    No, I suspect that Honda would get more bang for the buck by continuing to produce the S2000. It merely champions existing technology, but it comes in a package that is far more accessible. It's tangible. Yet it takes what people already appreciate to admirable extremes.
  • lexi4lifelexi4life Posts: 181
    But if Honda doesn't plan any replacement for the NSX, why did they show people a concept car of it??? Was it only to draw attention? I doubt it very much...
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    Honda has also shown concepts called Bulldog, Spocket, DualNote, Unibox, Kiwammi, and IMAS. None of those have been produced.

    They create concept cars to advance engineering and promote new thinking. These cars also give the brand something to crow about. Some concepts result in feedback that encourages the manufacturer to produce the vehicle. Others do not. The HSC project was one that did not. The project was cancelled after release.
  • chris65amgchris65amg Posts: 372
    Halo car psychology is one thing that automakers are starting to take and run with. For example: I saw this commercial where there is Chevy's new sedan, Cobalt, and the Corvette. Even drawing a connection from a relatively plebeian compact (SS supercharged or not) to a Corvette is definitely rubbing off well on the former.

    I really liked the NSX deep down, because it was a type of car that isn't produced much anymore, vis. an ultra-light car with an engine that isn't a hunk of Detroit iron (or aluminum, or whatever). It was just too expensive.... maybe it would have sold better at 60 grand US. Or 50. Or 25 (I wish)

    I can think of a pretty good example of how automakers (expecially with an expensive car) wait for positive feedback. Example: Bentley Arnage Drophead.... not sure if they're making it or not....
  • anythngbutgmanythngbutgm Posts: 4,180
    The original NSX was lauded for it's ability to be a supercar for its time, yet still make a decent daily driver with the comfort and civility of an Accord. Not something that could be said of other supercars of its time. That was it's selling point, and I agree that isn't enough anymore. I was disappointed to see the HSC project dropped as it would have made a fine predecessor. Way out of my limits as far as $$$ but for the the one's who can afford it, I think I would recapture the praise of the original design.
  • lexi4lifelexi4life Posts: 181
    But did Honda really say officialy they cancelled this expensive project of making an all new NSX or it is just a supposition???? And if yes, are you sure again the same thing will happen to the S? That'd be really sad since these 2 cars are wonderful.
  • anythngbutgmanythngbutgm Posts: 4,180
    Supposedly the idea of the new NSX was shelved so Honda could concentrate on more mainstream cars and highly profitable SUV's. I don't think it was indefinite though. They'll probably revive it if Toyota's next (Supra) supercar takes off in sales. I highly doubt the S2000 is on the chopping block. At worst, I would expect a year or two off to redesign and produce a new "S". Hopefully they'll keep the current one for a couple of more years until I can put an Arctic white/Tan int. in my garage soon...
  • mantagmantag Posts: 47
    Well..good to see some action in this post!
    I think everybody has a valid point. Yes - it always was/is very exclusive, especially because of the price. They only imported so many (maybe1500) into the US a year. Too bad there never was a v8 - but Honda/acura do not beleive in v8's otherwise they would have put one in the new RL. Maybe a supercharged v6 could have gotten hp near 350.
    I love my 1996 NSX-T formula red. Always dreamed of owning one. Sure, there are cars that are cheaper/faster/ more bells and wistles, but add it all up
    low depr.
    curb appeal - cant tell you how many times they asked me - is that a ferrari!?
    handling
    everyday drivability.

    I love my "poor-mans ferrari"!!
    pretty good company to be considered in the same sentence as a ferrari dont you think?

    tagmanly
  • chris65amgchris65amg Posts: 372
    It does kind of look like a Ferrari
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    I don't think it really looks like a Ferrari, but, since most non-enthusiasts probably don't know what to make of it, that is probably the marque that first comes to mind.

    Honda officially killed the HSC project. That part of the NSX tale is a done deal. Whether or not Honda has another project leading to an NSX replacement is another chapter to the story.

    The rumor mill has been reporting that there will be no new NSX. Given the difficulty in making a financial case for the car, those rumors are "realistic". That's not the same thing as true, but it can pass for "likely".
  • lexi4lifelexi4life Posts: 181
    But this is a really weird decision not to continue with a new NSX! Toyota may come with an all new V10 sports car in a few years and abandoning the project of a new NSX would just show everyone that Honda gave up in that segment. They probably even have more experience than Toyota in those types of cars anyway, that'd help them making an even better car and beat up their old competitor, perhaps preparing itself for the launch of its new supercar! It's sure that if the cancellation of this project is purely a matter of money, I can understand Honda not to spend some on risky projects like that but anyway is Honda that wretched?
  • anythngbutgmanythngbutgm Posts: 4,180
    I believe the program was shelved due to Honda concentrating there efforts on a Boxster type roadster which would penetrate the market a little better with a 50k price tag rather than a 90k pricetag which few can afford. Toyo has deeper pockets to compete in the triple digit $$$ supercars, whereas Honda seems to be concentrating on markets where growth is possible (Ridgeline, 50k highend sedans) I really hope that Honda doesn't pull the plug on the S2k myself, the NSX will always be way out of my budget, so I'm not so disappointed.
  • tiernosetiernose Posts: 1
    an up-end roadster, maybe a hardtop convertible, would be profitable for honda, as long as it could compete favorably against cars like the crossfire srt6, the slk, and the boxster. not having an nsx leaves the honda line-up without a flagship model and reduced confidence in honda as a name in automotive performance, particularly in areas where type-r models aren't marketed, especially the u.s.
  • i35ydi35yd Posts: 2
    People we all must get real. The NSX was bound to face extinction due to Honda's inceptious belief that their vehicles don't need a V-8 to produce power. My case in point....the new RL..... This is literally the only "Flagship" model vehicle with a V-6 in any luxury marquee. (Regardless of its claim to produce 300bhp similar to most V-8's). Tests from different firms have confirmed that displacement does in fact have the upper hand when it comes down to producing power. Look at the RL's low torque (260 ft-lbs is no good when going up against the likes of the LS430, the new M45 and even the S-Class and 745i.)and the 0-60 times (in the low 7's to mid 7's is embarassing when the competition is 0-60 rates between 5-6 secs.) And the current NSX's V-6 is only pumping out 290bhp and 224 ft-lbs on the manual model and 252bhp and 210 ft-lbs for the auto. (Man this sucks). For $80k-100k, one would rather look at the G35, 350z, Corvette, CLK55, M3, Mustang Cobra (or Saleen, Rousch, or Billet), the XKR or even the slept on Crossfire (Hemi variant).

    I wish Honda would take a chance at making a somewhat efficient V-8 myself. The world knows the motor plant would be very good and could dominate all other competitors. But Honda has too much pride and the ego is killing them in the Supercar and sports car market. HONDA PLEASE PRODUCE THE V-8 SOON!!!!!
  • lexi4lifelexi4life Posts: 181
    This just came out from Honda!
    http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=378278

    So Honda confirms there will be another NSX, and supposed to be as groundbreaking as the current one was at its launch in 1991. Also, the production of the current car will be stopped because of the major retooling of the factory needed to meet the new emission regulations of 2006. I say there probably won't have any V8/V10/V12 in the next NSX, but more a kind of high performance 3.8 V6 (375hp) matted to electric motors to make a total of about 420hp? That could be very interesting!
  • raychuang00raychuang00 Posts: 541
    say there probably won't have any V8/V10/V12 in the next NSX, but more a kind of high performance 3.8 V6 (375hp) matted to electric motors to make a total of about 420hp? That could be very interesting!

    I think what we'll see is a new, smaller car that uses the very latest in steel structural technologies for very advanced safety. The engine will likely be a modified version of the 3.5-liter V-6 used on the Accord, but with two new features: 1) DOHC i-VTEC (first time Honda has applied i-VTEC on a V-6 engine) and 2) gasoline direct injection with as high as 50:1 air/fuel ratio lean burn (with the universal availability of low-sulfur gasoline by 2008 Honda can do it in its most important markets); expect the output to be around 330-350 bhp but with 15-20% better fuel efficiency compared to the current NSX engine. As for transmission choice, it will be either close-ratio six-speed manual or six-speed clutchless manual with optional full automatic operation. :)
  • lexi4lifelexi4life Posts: 181
    Well I think Honda is finally getting serious about the NSX REALLY competing in the high-end sports cars segment! Honda just said the next NSX was gonna get a V10!!! I'm sure what made them take this decision is Toyota and its LF-A, obviously, they don't want Toyota to steal them some sales. But a V10 is really surprising from Honda! They won't build any V8, but V10 is okay? Weird... Anyway I'm really surprised with these news and I wonder how much power would a Honda V10 engine deliver?
    http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=102830
  • chris65amgchris65amg Posts: 372
    Somewhere over 450 hp. The thing that I really adored about the NSX was its super maneuverability. Hope they don't give that up for extra ponies.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    This time I don't get Honda at all. They're willing to give the V8 luxury car market to Lexus/Infiniti and all the Euros, but will spend the money on a V10 for a limited production car that they won't be able to keep competitive/update as the competition changes....like the NSX.

    I understand the link to F1 by building a V10, but if the proposed Lexus sports car is bothering them, how come the GS430 and M45 isn't? Three to four years is a long time by then 450hp will be "weak", hell 450hp doesn't stand out in NSX's class now.

    Maybe they'll do a V10 RL? Not!

    M
  • lexi4lifelexi4life Posts: 181
    Agree, this seems to be a very silly decision to make an all new V10 for only 1 sports car... Somehow, they're bound to use it somewhere else to lower costs a bit but look at the current NSX: has it shared any of its engine components with other Honda cars yet? From what I know, no! And deciding to go straight up from V6 to V10 is also suspicious... Why isn't Honda building any V8??? It almost seems like they're scared of not doing it well! And I also wonder why they're SO obssessed with building FWD luxury cars and haven't changed yet to RWD or AWD for their whole line-up since they launched Acura in 1987! They've had plenty of time to think about that! Anyway, if this time they manage to reach the number of sales they want, I can only say good job Acura!
  • wale_bate1wale_bate1 Posts: 1,986
    Question (no, really):
    how are TL and RL sales these days (OK, the TL part is rhetorical)? Are these units moving well enough and at enough of a profit that perhaps Acura can distinguish itself without the the V8, or even RWD. They may not make my personal list of wanna-haves, but they seem to make a whole of of other folks.

    I see the NSX successor as merely a halo car, and therefore, given Honda's racing history, the V-10 seems if not obvious then certainly a legitimate inference.
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    Rumors (just rumors) are spreading that Honda has been testing a Ridgeline with a V8 under the hood. However, the rumorists (is that a word?) have it that the engine is actually destined for the Acura RL and the Ridgeline is just a test mule.

    The V10 is very likely to be an F1 inspired design. In fact, it could be the same V10 they've used in the past, just greatly modified for street use. Think Ferrari Enzo only call it the Acura Soichiro.

    Which wheel should they power? The one that makes the car turn. Corporate leaders has announced plans to spread the use of SH-AWD through-out the Acura line. It has already been announced that the RDX will get it. It's very likely the upcoming MDX will get it. And the TL will likely get it with the mid-model change for MY 2007. How far downmarket it goes is anybody's guess.
  • retro12retro12 Posts: 2
    I think Acura won't go anymore with the NSX. I've read several articles indicating that the NSX might be dissappearing soon. Well a car like the NSX that costs $89,000 and only powers 290 hp is not much when buying the new RL, it has a starting price $49,100 and powers 300 hp. In the end they both are Acura and maybe they are different in a couple of features but they are both almost the same. It's just a waste of money for Acura so for their own good they should just end it after some many years of failure....
  • pg48477pg48477 Posts: 309
    The only thing NSX does not have is a name like Porshe, even now it's just as good if not better then Porshe, in the same price range.

    Honda does have V8 in IRL, and V10 in F1, so would not be surprised if they will move both engines to the street. The way Acura's selling, they'll have enof money to build a new sports car and new luxury sedan above RL. Honda also already have a RWD platform used for S2000. If they will manage to put together V10 with SH- AWD and RWD platform, I'll say good for them.
  • xkssxkss Posts: 722
    A V-10?

    Like BMW, Honda might try to market its high-performance car as an F1 car for the road. They might milk all of their success in F1 as benefiting their road car. Perhaps Honda will get serious about international sports car racing and race the next NSX in sports car racing outside their conuntry against Porsche 911s, Panoz Esperante GTLMs, Ferraris, and what not.
  • j2kvaj2kva Posts: 2
    I think Honda is going outside the norm with their V10 announcement to show the world that they are not stuck in their ways. Also, the v10 technology will most likely trickle down to smaller engines, like a V8 for the RL/Legend which consumers have been looking for sometime now, but just hasn't been offered. There has been so much speculation: front engine, mid engine, all wheel drive.... I have a feeling the nsx replacement will be mid-engine and rwd again. As for an SH-AWD car, that sounds more like a 2-door RL sport, seeing as Honda really has nothing in the line-up to compete with say a BMW M6 or Aston Martin.

    I believe the NSX, S2000, and RSX will all be revived in some fashion, but Honda will take its time to get it right, and also it cant get in the way of the release schedules of other bread and butter models like the civic. My 2 cents.
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