Mystery car pix

lostwrench1 · December 2012

I can't see what about the rear fender makes it not a Dart.

texases · December 2012

You need to look at the full sized picture, the rear fender looks a lot different than this '63 Dart:

Instead, it has the dropping trim line like this Polara:

Also, I just noticed the Dart has the gas cap on the side, unlike the Polara (behind the license plate) in both pics.

lostwrench1 · December 2012

Well, I'll still put two chips on its being a Dart.

bhill2 · December 2012

You need to look at the full sized picture, the rear fender looks a lot different than this '63 Dart

That's because '63 was the first year for the car you have pictured. In '62 Dodge used the Dart name on its downsized full-size line; Polara was just the name of the top trim level.

andys120 · December 2012

Fiat Dino 246 (C?) with the targa top.

Nope, the Fiat Dino came as a coupe or spider, the purple car is the "Ferrari" version (branded as a "Dino" but not as a Ferrari) known as a Dino 246 GTS (steel top versions were badged as a 246 GT.)

berri · December 2012

I know the 63 Mopars had cleaner and more conventional lines (and sold better accordingly), but I still kind of like the quirkiness of the 62's. Probably the same reason I liked the 59 GM lineup or the 58 Edsel! But in aircraft I'll take the clean lines of a B707 over a DC8 any day. I know, no consistency whatsoever.

andys120 · December 2012

texases · December 2012

"Well, I'll still put two chips on its being a Dart. "

The second picture? The '63? Nope, no way. No filler cap. CANNOT BE A DART.

grahampeters · December 2012

G'day

Morris Minor 1000 Traveller from about 1960. I have never got the whole Woody thing

Cheers

Graham

andys120 · December 2012

Morris Minor 1000 Traveller from about 1960.

That's right Graham. I think the choice of the name "Traveller" for Minor wagons was curious since Travellers are itinerant Irish nomads with a reputation for stealing and causing trouble around the British isles, the equivalent of naming a US wagon the "Hobo" or "Gypsy".

Woodie versions of the Mini wagon were called Travellers as well.

stever · December 2012

Those old Woodies are great for guys who like sanding and varnishing every year in addition to doing oil changes and all the other constant maintenance cars seem to need.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2012

It's the same allure that intoxicates people who like wooden boats. Wood is "warm" and cozy, steel is cold and heartless!

What I never got is how long the Brits kept wood as part of the *structure* of the car. I can't imagine how many forests were felled to build cars that shook apart and suffered from dry rot. :P

colleen_r · December 2012

Hi there--

I'm trying to determine if the Plymouth Belvedere convertible in my photo is a '57 or '58.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/colleendeluxe/

I only have the driver's side shot. I know that there were slight modifications to the front and rear ends of the '58 model that would distinguish it from the '57, but I can't tell from my photo. Can anyone help out with this?

Much thanks in advance!
Colleen

uplanderguy · December 2012

Colleen, that's definitely a '57 with the tall taillight lens. The '58's had a small round taillight at the bottom of the fin, and from there up had an insert of bright trim.

colleen_r · December 2012

Awesome! Thanks so much--I knew I'd come to the right place! I'm doing a paper on Virgil Exner and this awesome photo is my point of inspiration, so I wanted to be sure I had accurate info.

Really appreciate it!

uplanderguy · December 2012

I sat in on a designer's discussion at the Studebaker National Museum in July of this year and listened to Virgil Exner, Jr.--seemed like a nice, soft-spoken fellow and his Dad also worked for Studebaker (well, Loewy Design) before he went to Chrysler.

Good luck!

andys120 · December 2012

grahampeters · December 2012

G'day

The style says mid fifties Britain and there is something not quite Jaguar about the bumper and driving lights. There were several speciality manufacturers which limped on after the second world war, petering out in the 1960s. Most of them made it through the second world war making parts for aeroplanes, drifted back into motor manufacture, then died. Most of them were around Coventry which was heavily bombed.

The windscreen hints at Triumph, but it isn't.

Any better idea?

Cheers

Graham

magnette · December 2012

Sorry - been away from my computer for a few days, so haven't been catching up.

This one is a Lea Francis - I would guess a 14hp. They made these from about 1948 / 53, and together with their saloon counterparts were just about the last products from this long established Coventry firm. There have been several attempts to revive the name but nothing has come of it.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2012

very awkward looking car. Reminds me of the Triumph 1800 or the MG YA.

Funny, both MG and Triumph took a shot at 4 seaters and failed in the late 40s/early 50s, but then scored big time with 2-seaters at the same time or soon after.

colleen_r · December 2012

Oh, wow, that's cool! Right now I'm reading what seems to be the only biography on Exner, Sr. that's out there, called Virgil Exner: Visioneer, and the author seems to be pretty passionate about detailing some of Exner's other design highlights, besides the tailfin for which he is so well known.

The paper I'm writing is actually for a Digital Imaging class in my Master's of Library and Information Science program--I spent some time in the archives at the Detroit Historical Society and was helping to digitize some of their biographical content. Basically, I got handed a stack of folders of historical figures whose last names all started with E, and Exner was one of them. I chose to focus on him because his folder had the most interesting content--i.e., photos of some of the cars he designed. This photo we're talking about was the most intriguing to me because it was one of only two color photographs, and the only one with a model, and an African-American model at that, which I thought was very interesting considering that it was the late 1950s. That has led me to research more about the history of female car models, and I would be very interested to know how common it was for African-American women to be car models in that time period, but I haven't had much luck finding sources on that. I will probably look into it more for my own interest, because getting into too much detail away on that takes away from the focus on Exner (I'm supposed to be demonstrating why I think his photos should be a permanent part of the DHS' Digital Collection, scheduled to be finished in 2014, and not just accessible internally as a kind of sidenote).

But back to the cars! I've uploaded the other photos I have of Exner-designed cars if you feel like taking a pop quiz.

I haven't looked at them too closely yet or done any research on them, as I'm focusing on the color photo of the Belvedere, but if you know any of them off the top of your head, it would sure be useful to me!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/colleendeluxe/sets/72157632228245019/

andys120 · December 2012

Yep, those were sold under the moniker Lea-Francis 2.5 Litre.

berri · December 2012

You've got some nice shots of primarily his forward look. If you want to focus fully on Exner though, you'll also want to get a few pix of early 60's like the Chrysler where he moved away from upright fins to a more canted look. The 61 Plymouth was particularly weird. And of course the infamous downsized 62 Fury and Polara that led to his exit. Exner also worked for Raymond Loewy in the early 50's and was involved in some of the earlier post war Studebaker designs. Good Luck and have fun!

colleen_r · December 2012

Thanks! I'll be sure to look into the Fury and Polara if that was a source of contention. However, the photos are all I have to work with, because the paper is related more to my experience as an archivist-for-a-semester and my argument for why I think those photos should be a permanent part of their digital collection--but I could also use some of the points you raised to argue for further accession of what they would consider "Series I" photographs that would help to tell his full story.

So, do YOU know the year, make & model on those cars pictured?

andys120 · December 2012

BIGGER

berri · December 2012

The production cars are all Chryslers. The light blue convertible and #7 & 19 with the fins are 57's. #1 & 21 are 55's. #8 & 20 with the smaller fins are 56's. #3 & 16 is a Chrysler Imperial, but I'm not sure if it is a 55 or 56 (if I had to guess I'd probably pick 56). The other sporty models are concept cars from that era, but I'm not good on those names.

Maybe wgrafer, bhill, or andre can tell you for sure. They are very knowledgeable in this.

berri · December 2012

A lot of Mercury's in this one which is a bit unusual. A 63 on the left ahead of the 56 (I think) Chevy wagon and maybe a 62 or 63 Comet ahead of it. A 61 Merc on the other side behind the 60 Ford.

uplanderguy · December 2012

I always liked the rear view of '61 Mercurys, but I never saw many. Too bad they didn't make one like a Ford Starliner hardtop.

andre1969 · December 2012

Here's my stab at them. In the order I'm seeing them...
#021 is a '55 New Yorker
#020 is a '56, and I think the little fake vents on the rear of the fin denote it as a New Yorker as well
#019 is a 1957, and judging from the "Sky-hi" rear window, I think it's a New Yorker hardtop coupe.
#018 is the DeSoto Adventurer I concept car, which I believe is from 1953. IIRC, it was Exner's favorite show car, and he actually drove it as his personal car for a time. I think it was powered by the DeSoto 276.1 Firedome Hemi, and actually came somewhat very close to production. It was a close-coupled 4-seater, and the body was sourced by either Ghia or Pininfarina, I forget now.
#016 is a 1955 Chrysler; I'd guess from the monotone paint it's a Windosr. Can't quite read the script on the side. Maybe a Windsor Deluxe?
#015 is another Chrysler show car. I think it's a 1955 Chrysler Falcon, another Ghia or Pininfarina body.
*008: 1956 New Yorker again
#007 repeat of #019
#006: The DeSoto adventurer concept again
#003: '55 Chrysler repeat
#002: '55 Falcon concept repeat
#001: '55 Chrysler New Yorker again

At least, I think. Don't hold a gun to my head on any of these...memory ain't quite what it used to be.

berri · December 2012

Older computer and "eyes", I thought the ones I identified as Imperials had those target sight tail lights. But looking at them again, I think the picture is just that small hump in the fender encasing the 55 tail lights. Thanks for looking into them for her! I like Mopars, but you "know" them!

andre1969 · December 2012

I'm looking at them on an older computer myself, an old Mac that a friend gave me when he got a new one. At a quick glance, that '55 does look like an Imperial, I think because there's something in the background that lines up with the car and gives the illusion that there's a gunsight taiillight, or something in that spot.

And, the '55 does still have that "twin nostril" motif, although it's more complex on the Windsor and New Yorker. The Imperial and C300 had a split grille with large openings that went all the way down to the bumper, whereas the Windsor and New Yorker had smaller "nostrils", and a lower sub-grille the was full-width, and housed the turn signals/parking lights.

lostwrench1 · December 2012

I'll grab the early 50s Rambler wagon making the right turn.
(Burlington, Vt.?)

odie6l · December 2012

I saw one of these running around near me here in Hershey. I thought the back end was going to fall off then I got to see the front. And no cheating by looking at the html link of the picture either.

Odie

explorerx4 · December 2012

There are no cars on Church Street anymore!
You might have to wait for the picture to come around again.

texases · December 2012

Aston Marin Lagonda Shooting Brake? I never heard they make one, is it custom?

Mr_Shiftright · December 2012

I think the Desoto Adventurer 1 was done by Ghia

A 1956 Chrysler Concept, the "Norseman", went down with the Andrea Doria and still sits on the bottom of the sea

fintail · December 2012

You didn't just see one of those, you might have seen the only one. That's quite a sighting. I've never seen a Lagonda that wasn't parked (probably not running).

Mr_Shiftright · December 2012

Wasn't that Lagonda the model with the "electronic dashboard from Hell"?

fintail · December 2012

Yep, extremely bleeding edge technology for ~1976, not something you really want to buy when it wears a "Made in England" label. Later models gained more conventional instruments, but I have to imagine were full of glitches too.

Cool looking car though.

andys120 · December 2012

I'll grab the early 50s Rambler wagon making the right turn.

I think that is a late 1950s or early 60s Rambler American like this 1960 model (it looks too small to be an early 50s model)>

Yes that is Church Street in downtown Burlington VT, now closed to auto traffic.

grahampeters · December 2012

G'day

Sometimes there are jokes that just won't make it out of Australia. Unfortunately, when confronted with a William Towns design, I keep recalling one describing a supremely ugly individual, basically suggesting that even in moonlight, it would not look pretty.

The already ugly William Towns Lagonda was bastardised by a Swiss firm to create a Shooting Brake (or Break). If it was not ugly enough already, this really topped it off.

Fortunately a styling dead end.

Cheers

Graham

grahampeters · December 2012

G'day

I cannot recall the rather pretty 1960 Rambler American, although later Ramblers were assembled in Port Melbourne (same factory as Toyota) and sold moderately well in Australia. Models included the mid to late 60's American, the Matador and Javelin.

Checking out our local on-line car sales site, I see five Ramblers listed including this very low mileage 1967 American

http://www.carsales.com.au/private/details/rambler-american-440-1967-12556533?ba- se=1216&vertical=Car&cr=1&eapi=2&__N=1246+1252+1247+1282+4294963437+1216&num=15&- silo=Stock&sort=default

Cheers

Graham

andys120 · December 2012

stickguy · December 2012

Lincoln Mark LT.

yet again, the answer to a question no one asked.

what did they sell, about 25?

michaellno · December 2012

That LT is like a Subaru Baja for the 1%.

robr2 · December 2012

That's the Lincoln Blackwood - not the MK LT.

IIRC, the bed was lined in wood and carpet with metal accents. It was pretty but you'd never put a bag on concrete back there.

andys120 · December 2012

Lincoln Blackwood is correct (2001-2). The Mk LT was sold in the US from 2005-8 and is still sold in Mexico.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2012

The Ramblers had this nifty gearshift on the column, where you had to pull the gearshift towards you to engage the starter...I loved that.

RE: Lagonda---yep, the "wedge" design craze of the late 70s and 80s went downhill fast, and now along with fins and bustlebacks, is assigned to the glory days of automotive history.

texases · December 2012

"and now along with fins and bustlebacks, is assigned to the ~~glory~~ gory days of automotive history. "

There, I fixed it.

Mr_Shiftright · December 2012

I have been accused of harshness, so I was trying to be a Sensitive New Age Guy for a change...obviously I didn't fool anyone. :P

Mystery car pix

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